WV Exit Polls: 44% of Sanders voters are Trump supporters

[Renew Deal]

Last edited Tue May 10, 2016, 06:34 PM - Edit history (1)

Just heard it on MSNBC. Operation Chaos.

[tonyt53]

1. Yep. That is what it has come to.

[Hortensis]

339. That's WV. What about DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND?

Crowds gathered at DU have turned it into Anti-Hillary Underground.

Out in America the percent of BERNIE voters who, on well designed exit polls, say they won't vote for her is usually in the single digits or teens. Here, almost every conversation on any subject is turned into an astonishingly vicious and unhinged pack attack on the Democrats' nominee-to-be.

DU's fully saturated political environment is far more toxic than WV's. Any guess as to how many current DUers who identify as Bernie supporters will vote for Trump, or not vote at all? I'm thinking it has to be very high.

[UMTerp01]

2. If you are a Bernie supporter who decides to support trump you were bullshitting all along

And sorry...it can't come down to being an "outsider". I know Clinton has some issues but my god 40% of them would vote for Trump?

[LisaM]

6. Other way round, I think.

Because the Republican nominee is decided and because they are open primaries, Trump voters are just crossing over to create mischief.

This is why open primaries suck.

[Fawke Em]

27. Nope. Cruz is still pushing for votes in W. Va. and is calling his delegates to tell them

to remain.

He's hedging on a contested convention, too.

[Baobab]

86. Nothing is what it seems this election - except Bernie.

Cruz is as annoying as a Presidential candidate as could possibly be. He's far worse than both Trump and Hillary.

[synergie]

308. Until you cross reference his rhetoric and his records, and you realize he is not what

He is billed to be. He and Cruz both insist that losing is winning, and that they are both more pure and thus deserve the mom they failed to win.

[Baobab]

310. sorry 'synergie', not buying what your selling.

HRC is a world class pro at deceiving.

[politicaljunkie41910]

40. Agreed. That is the way I interpreted the results as well.

Since Trump has clinched it his supporters are backing the 'socialist' candidate because Trump will have a field day with it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

100. Except that republicans cannot vote in the democratic primary

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

[PeaceNikki]

189. They are semi-closed. Voters are not required to register with a party.

Party Affiliation: For primaries, if you are registered with one of the four recognized political parties (Democratic, Libertarian, Mountain or Republican, you may only vote that party's ballot or the non-partisan ballot. If you are registered with any other party or with no party, you may ask the poll worker for one of the recognized party's ballots [or they will give you the non-partisan ballot. In the General Election, every registered voter receives the same ballot.

https://votesmart.org/elections/voter-registration/WV#.VzJz3qBOnqA

[nadinbrzezinski]

192. Unless you can show Rs did travel back to April 19 after leaniing their race was over

the number of indies in the state is 19 percent. Look at the number, carefully. Do some back of the envelope math. Then consider the lovely implications. Ok, let me help you. CONSERVATIVE DEMOCRATS DID NOT VOTE FOR CLINTON TODAY, NOR WILL THEY VOTE FOR HER IN NOVEMBER

That helps?

[PeaceNikki]

193. Lol, it's Operation Chaos, not a Sanders mandate.

[nadinbrzezinski]

196. So Republicans, and Rush Limbaugh discovered time travel?

I knew El Rushbo was good, but that makes him a candidate for the nobel prize in physics.

The deadline was not at the ballot today, that was April 19.

[PeaceNikki]

197. Lol, that's adorable.

[nadinbrzezinski]

199. I am sure it is

so you are calling Rush to inform him he was nominated for the Nobel in Physics?

Because that is the only way operation chaos, for which there is no shred of evidence in either 2008 or today, that is actually even was implemented. So the other Occam razor is not that they traveled back in time, though there is evidence of a lot of quantum errors here, but that these are indeed CONSERVATIVE DEMOCRATS who under no circumstances will VOTE FOR HILLARY CLINTON.

Alas the WV electorate is one of the most conservative in the nation, with a small c, so that does not surprise me at all.

So yes, your time travel theory is just adorable, I agree with you. Can I use it in a fiction story? Please?

[PeaceNikki]

200. Voters are not required to register with a party and can pick either ballot.

It's not rocket surgery, ffs.

[nadinbrzezinski]

203. Voters are doing the independent registration

at a 19 percent of the total electorate. Some voted in the REPUBLICAN primary, some voted today. So you are left with 21 percent who are Democrats. And I am assuming all 19 percent voted today... realistically you are closer to 25 to 30 percent of the democratic electorate will vote for Trump in November in WV.

Damn, we will have a bunch of conservadems cross over like they did with Reagan and Bush... like this hardly breaks historic precedents. Either that or time travel is very real.

[PeaceNikki]

209. That non D or R registration is closer to 25% now.

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/history/Pages/Voter_Registration.aspx

[nadinbrzezinski]

211. Ok so you are still at least 20 percent

unless you think every indie voted today. I hardly doubt everyone one voted for Sanders today... amirite.

So you will have CONSERVADEMS vote for trump, see how that works? I am betting more than today's statistics reveal.

Lovely isn't it?

[PeaceNikki]

212. I think idiots will vote for Trump. And, honestly, anyone who claims to be a Democrat and won't vote

for the Democratic nominee for POTUS is a narcissistic fucking fool.

[nadinbrzezinski]

215. Well you might have that opinion

but back in reality, people who ignore what this data reveals are not too bright. And I know the Clinton campaign is probably noticing the meaning of this, since some of this translates to the battle grounds of OH, your state, Michigan and probably PA. That is the real world.

And you can do whatever you want as a deep partisan... myself taking notes.

[PeaceNikki]

216. lolok

Your stat on party registrations was off by about 30% when the SOS numbers were easily accessible.

Great research, Ace!

[nadinbrzezinski]

219. Great research Ace

CONSERVADEMS will vote for TRUMP IN NOVEMBER ACE.

[nadinbrzezinski]

240. Oh and ace here are the actual numbers

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/history/Pages/Voter_Registration_History.aspx

Yes from the SOS, and they match what I said ACE

[PeaceNikki]

242. That's four years old. Here are the April 2016 numbers

Do the math.

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/history/Pages/Voter_Registration.aspx


1,242,585 (WV)
577,977 (D)
374,931 (R)
1,646 (M)
3,241 (L)
254,265 (N)
30,525 (O)

[nadinbrzezinski]

246. Whatever ace, they still reveal a large number of fucking CONSERVADEMS

so keep kicking on independent and LW voters. I URGE YOU TO CONTINUE TO DO THAT

And yes I found that, as well. m'kay ace,

44-24=20... try that, not all voted today, so tat least 25 percent of today's voters were fucking DEMOCRATS who will vote for TRUMP, get that though your head, or not. I really could not care if you keep ignoring this. Or calling people names.


I am sure that will inspire NOT people to vote.

Regardless, DEAL WITH IT OR NOT, CONSERVADEMS WILL WALK THOUGH GLASS NOT TO VOTE FOR HILLARY ROTHAM CLINTON.

[PeaceNikki]

247. I think your keyboard is all fucked up.

[nadinbrzezinski]

248. Nope, but talking normally does not work

[PeaceNikki]

251. Protip: you are typing, not talking

[nadinbrzezinski]

252. Pro tip, you still cannot accept that there are democrats who will NOT vote for HRC

who are on the Right side of your party.

That is a really good pro tip. The other pro tip, for our entertainment mostly, keep your head firmly in the sand. Really I need something funny this season. and democrats hiding their head in the sand, along main stream republcians is just hysterical

[Fawke Em]

276. Or actually paying attention.

LIBERALS owe nothing to the current Democratic Party.

[PeaceNikki]

281. No, I stand by my comment. Narcissistic, arrogant, privileged fools.

[Fawke Em]

269. No, they can't. Learn Google, dear.

[PeaceNikki]

283. I'm not your "dear".

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1937379

[Fawke Em]

309. Fine. I'm not your "insane" person coz I think Hillary is as bad as Trump.

[senz]

142. ALL polls show Bernie beats Trump by far greater margins than Hillary.

Trump would rather run against Hillary than Bernie because he can't beat Bernie.

[nadinbrzezinski]

66. Wrong, this is a modified open primary

democrats cannot vote for republicans or the other way around.

[LisaM]

76. But independents can vote for either, so presumably Trump independents are crossing over

and voting Democratic.

[nadinbrzezinski]

80. Or independents who like Sanders

and will no way vote for the establishment candidate in November. I hit the field often, I have found and spoken to those.

In fact I had a few of those at the Cruz rally.

[LisaM]

94. I'm simply talking about this headline, which is being interpreted a few different ways

I am reading it to mean that of the people who are voting for Sanders today, exit polls show that 44% are actually Trump supporters.

Others are taking it to mean that if Sanders doesn't make it, these voters, now die-hard Sanders fans apparently, will switch to Trump.

1) MSNBC needs to make its headline more clear, and 2) my take still is that people who would otherwise have voted for Trump in this primary now aren't bothering because he's got the nomination sewn up and are therefore voting for Sanders today, for whatever reason, but I'd guess the main one would be to keep Hillary from securing the nomination or wining West Virginia.

If they are independents who like Sanders, I personally would not consider them Trump voters.

[nadinbrzezinski]

98. No, they show that they will vote for Trump

because they were not given Sanders as an option.

And that does not surprise me from independents. And your take is wrong. becuase this is not an open primary where REPUBLICANS are voting in the Democratic primary. In this state, about 20 percent of registered of registered voters are decline to state, aka independents. Both parties allow them to participate in their primaries, Neither allows for partisans of the OTHER party to vote in their primary.

Yes, MSNBC sucks in their reporting, so what is new?

Primary election type
See also: Primary election
West Virginia utilizes a hybrid primary system. Parties decide who may vote. Both the Democratic and Republican parties allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.[10]

Note: Presidential primary and caucus types can differ. See this article for further details about 2016 presidential primaries and caucuses.

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

And yes it is sad when the major media has to be fact checked but those are the times we live in.

And I do enough of this shit to smell exactly how that question was phrased.

[LisaM]

107. I understand that registered Republicans cannot vote in the Democratic primary in WV

I still think the headline is extraordinarily ambiguous, and I still take it to mean that of the people they've polled in the exit polls, 44% of those who voted for Sanders are actually Trump supporters who are causing mischief.

I can't believe anyone who really believes in the Sanders' platform could ever vote for Trump.

[nadinbrzezinski]

118. I have talked to a few and I do get it

they will not, under any circumstances, vote for the establishment candidate. I guess you have to realize that she is going to have a hell of a time with independents, many of whom have adopted Sanders as a first choice, but will vote for Trump as a second choice. That is what that poll really tells. Never mind MSNBC is missing that by a mile.

And a few, more than a few, will vote for either Jill Stein or Gary Johnson. This election is a change election, wether partisans on both sides get it or not.

The other day I had a Hillary Fan locally ask me to make a prediction of who will win. I refuse to, because the dynamics in this election are unlike those of quite a few previous elections. (Though I read it correct and said Trump would be the nominee well before many here would, or the MSM for that matter) And yes, independents will be the king makers. Not women, independent voters and this election will be far closer than people think... that prediction I am willing to make.

[LisaM]

168. They need to upgrade their headline.

It's being interpreted many different ways.

I spend time in the San Juan Island, which is a place that has voted for both Ross Perot and Ralph Nader (and for the caucuses this year, completely predictably went for Sanders). I wouldn't be surprised if they went for John Anderson in 1980, who knows? They love the outsider, too, easy enough for them in their mostly white homogenous bubble.

I find that to be an extraordinary way to approach things and the anti-establishment elected officials from the Tea Party have caused an amazing amount of harm in a short time. But anyone who thinks Sanders or Trump is offering remotely the same worldview just because they're seen as political outsiders (despite Sanders being a career politician) might want to consider taking a more nuanced view of the world.

[nadinbrzezinski]

175. That headline is purposeful

To be honest, talking to local and national reporters, who only cover politics... and have never marched with Occupy. or any of the myriad of protest movements, they really are in a news reporting bubble. Some of it is editorial choice, some of it is the reporters themselves are in a bubble. What is driving this is pure anger.

I have talked to Sanders supporters who were at your local occupy, as well as Trump supporters who were at your local occupy. They disagree fundamentally on a lot of stuff, but they agree the government is corrupt, the establishment will not listen to them, or care for them. Or do anything that will help the 99 percent. They also agree that the system needs a shock to change. And they also believe that if they cannot change the system from within, they will have to take other measures. Some for the record have completely checked out from the political system.

That is why I said, I get it. I have been in the middle of very weird conversations. And no, they don't want free stuff. They just want their taxes to help with things like education, medical care, roads, bridges, what they used to do.

The weirdest was a guy quoting from Ayn Rand, I mean book and everything (Atlas Shrugged, the section was John Galts speech), while arguing with a guy quoting from the Communist manifesto, book and everything in hand. For the record that was not just the strangest conversation ever, but the greatest outlier you have ever seen. What was even funnier was the other people in the conversation called both of them for not even getting what they were reading and quoting. It was funny. It was raining, I was tired... you had to find funny somewhere.

So if she wins. I expect even more fun in the streets. The same will happen if Trump wins, after the euphoria from some sectors goes down to a great WHAT? This is not what we voted for. (What do you want to know about Trump incidentally).

[TwilightZone]

237. CBS has Clinton ahead 51/33 with Independents.

Other polls are similar. Your assertion that Independents will mostly vote Trump if they can't have Sanders has no basis in reality, your anecdotal "I talked to a few so I know" nonsense notwithstanding.

[nadinbrzezinski]

239. I stand by what I said.

And your handle is very appropriate at this point.

[Fawke Em]

278. Then you're living in a bubble.

I won't vote for Trump or Clinton, but I get their consternation. They are FOR anyone who isn't part of the political establishment.

[libdem4life]

114. I so appreciate your even-handed comments and statements of someone

out in the field who is actually not behind a computer all day. I'm sure that's why you don't comment more, but thanks anyway.

[nadinbrzezinski]

122. Well I shouyd be writing candidate quetionaires

so far got one likely interview, will have to finish it and send the rest over email.

Local elections for the record

[puffy socks]

79. Yep.

That would tell us that they want Sanders to win because they believe he is easier to beat than Hillary. Which might well be true. How much support for Bernie is just right wingers causing havoc in all the open primaries?


Or maybe people believe they are true Sanders supporters who suddenly want massive social programs paid for by the federal government?

[-none]

96. Or maybe they want to vote for an honest politician that is not in the pocket of the big money?

Your last sentence is a Republican talking point.

BTY, The reality is, Sanders will be much harder to beat than Hillary, the FBI investigation not withstanding.

[puffy socks]

108. mmm hmmm...

so you've all said again and again.


Sanders is making money from his vote. Talk about a conflict of interest. Nice way to treat poor Latinos.

"The Sanders’ have partially released their 2014 tax return and on the return, Jane Sanders is still drawing a salary as an alternate commissioner for the Texas Low-Level Radioactive Waste Disposal Compact Commission. (TLLRWD Commissioner)

This is the commission that oversaw the Sierra Blanca dump site, that Sanders voted for and also voted to strip out the Wellstone amendment in conference.

The Wellstone amendment would have given legal recourse to this mostly poor Latino community to fight the placement of this waste dump, if they could prove environmental racism. The compact was passed, with vigorous help from Sanders. Later and fortunately the dump was scuttled by the state of Texas.

This is just for 2014. Mrs. Sanders could have been drawing a salary for years and unless they release more tax returns we'll never know for sure."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/4/16/1516075/-Sanders-are-still-profiting-from-Sierra-Blanca-nuclear-waste-dump-per-their-2014-tax-return

[libdem4life]

146. Why should she not? Is she just an extension of her husband resorting

to pillow politics...grow up. She is an accomplished academic and political advisor. I would expect nothing less. Has she some controversial background noise...like most lifetime political spouses...yes. Has she had an affair with an intern? Doubt it. Does she get Secret Service to get her, um, companions? No.

Again, grow up. Facts are what they are. The Clintons set the Political Slime Bar pretty high.

[senz]

155. You sure as hell do not sound like a Democrat to me.

Democrats believe in the federal government and in social programs.

Republicans want everything privatized.

[puffy socks]

165. I want a better healthcare system fazing out the old and providing the new .

Starting with a public option as Hillary has suggested. I don't want everything privatized , I want a mixed economy.

'You apparently don't understand that these Trump supporters arent going and voting for Bernie because they like Bernie, they ae voting for him because they think he's a socialist loser and an easy win for Trump in the fall.

[senz]

174. So why do you laugh at social progams paid for by the federal govt?

[nadinbrzezinski]

179. Social democracy = Mixed economy

I know political education in this country sucks.

[senz]

194. It's incredible that they don't know that. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

249. No, it is not incredible when you learn the poor education in history, politics and

especially political theory. That is also on purpose.

[nadinbrzezinski]

180. You mean DEMOCRATS voting for Sanders who will vote for Trump

in the GE? Yup, HYBRID primary, most of those folks are democrats.

I would not laugh that hard.

[puffy socks]

186. No.

I mean Republicans voting for Sanders in the open primaries.
We have no idea how many of Sanders votes are from Republicans or Conservative leaning Independents wanting an easy win for Trump come the GE.

[puffy socks]

207. Read my post

I said, I wonder how many of Republicans supporters are actually voting for Bernie just to cause havoc in all open primaries across the nation. Since when is WV the nation smart guy?
In WV many of those Independents are Republicans a.k.a. "conservative leaning" Independents and voting for Bernie . do you get it now?
Just because people are repeatedly illiterate isn't my problem.

[puffy socks]

218. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Stop embarrassing yourself.
I asked a simple question and I applied it to the entire nation.
as well as conservative leaning independents and Republicans who are vloting in the primary. You havent any idea how many if these people are conservatives , hence the question.


Yes Independents can vote in primaries, they can either register with any party within 3 weeks of the primary or vote on a non partisan ballot.



WEST VIRGINIA VOTER REGISTRATION

Registration Deadline: You may register at any time. However, to be eligible to vote in a specific election, you must register 21 days before that election.

Party Affiliation: For primaries, if you are registered with one of the four recognized political parties (Democratic, Libertarian, Mountain or Republican, you may only vote that party's ballot or the non-partisan ballot.[b If you are registered with any other party or with no party, you may ask the poll worker for one of the recognized party's ballots or they will give you the non-partisan ballot. In the General Election, every registered voter receives the same ballot.

https://votesmart.org/elections/voter-registration/WV

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/current/Pages/VoterFAQs.aspx#anchor_1404242592222




Ooh , and look who has a campaign out pretending to be Sanders supporters!

The Right Baits the Left to Turn Against Hillary Clinton
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/17/us/politics/the-right-aims-at-democrats-on-social-media-to-hit-clinton.html



you were saying?

[puffy socks]

229. It's literally been explained to you in detail . Its really simple . If you can't grasp

the concept of changing registrations and voting for losers in the oppositions party to muck up the election you cannot be helped. Try some study in political science.
No wonder you still buy into the Bernie can win meme!

nighty night sweetie!

[nadinbrzezinski]

234. So did they invent time travel?

the deadline was April 19. I swear they are in for a nobel prize in physics if they did.

[nadinbrzezinski]

232. Try reading comp next time

Primary election type
See also: Primary election
West Virginia utilizes a hybrid primary system. Parties decide who may vote. Both the Democratic and Republican parties allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.[10]

Note: Presidential primary and caucus types can differ. See this article for further details about 2016 presidential primaries and caucuses.

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

And as of 2012, latest numbers per the SOS site, 17.6% of voters were unaffiliated

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/history/Pages/Voter_Registration_History.aspx

So try that dreaded math you use against your enemies regularly ok.

[Andy823]

87. Exactly.

Of course don't expect to hear many, if any, Sanders supporters here on DU admit to that!

[CoffeeCat]

190. I would never vote for Trump

But I spent a great deal of time with Bernie activists/delegates last weekend. I was shocked and saddened to hear how many said they would vote for Trump. Lifelong Democrats who don't want to stay home, because they actually want an opportunity to stick it to Clinton and vote against her.

Many of them cited the way her campaign was run--as a big part of their motivation. It's not just her policies, neocon tendencies and dishonesty. It's how she's campaigned, how Sanders and his supporters have been treated and how shady the state primary elections have been.

I am not surprised by these stats at all.

I imagine that many Dems (and Indies also) are exercising their right to vote against Clinton in these primaries. There was a recent article that provided stats about Trump and Hillary supporters--and how aprox half of their voters were voting to keep their opponent out. I think some of this behavior is seeping into our primary elections.

[nadinbrzezinski]

300. That was a Reuters story

and I have heard it from more people than I care to count. The brock propaganda has spread this fantasy that Sanders fans are the devil incarnate. But in reality, even those of us who never jumped on anybody's bandwagon have been treated like shit by Hillary supporters. I am not forgetting that. EVER

[hrmjustin]

3. This is why I am against open primaries.

[LisaM]

5. Exactly.

It's maddening.

[Hekate]

26. You and me both. THIS is what ratfucking is all about.

[Luminous Animal]

33. Republicans cannot vote in the Democratic primary. Only registered Dems and unaffiliated. Only 19%

of registered voters are unaffiliated in West Virgina so most of those who are going for Trump, are registered Democrats.

[Fawke Em]

45. They don't want to understand, Luminous.

There is no Operation Chaos. There may be a handful of Republicans who switched to vote in the Democratic primary, but it's very few. Until last week, most Republicans still had a race.

Hillary supporters really do live in a bubble.

[bvf]

119. The new tinfoil hat fashions: New for Spring 2016!

Re: the so-called "Operation Chaos," there's exactly no evidence that the 2008 version had any effect, either. Just Limbaugh being his ever-diminishing blowhard self.

[kaleckim]

38. Yeah

why allow tax payers that fund the primaries to vote where they want? Democracy sucks, unless when it turns out right. Say, Arlen Specter switched from being a Republican to a Democrat while in office. I'm sure you democratic loving Clinton supporters, because you care about being logically consistent, demanded that he wait to vote or do anything as a Democrat. I guess there is some waiting period? When did Hillary go from being a Goldwater girl to a Democrat? Also, why would Democrats want millions of young Sanders supporters to join their party, it isn't as if the Democratic Party needs them, right?

You want to end open primaries, work to stop tax payers funding the damn primaries. Our system makes a third party run nearly impossible, tax payers fund the damn primaries, and now you all want to force people to join one of the two corrupt parties to have a say in which person runs the country. How "progressive" the modern Democratic Party has become.

[RockaFowler]

103. This taxpayer thing is really moot

I pay taxes for Schools and I don't have any kids
I have to pay them

Oh and the election everyone can vote in is the General Election
This is a Primary for Democrats or Republicans
Maybe the Greens should get their own primary
But they don't

[nadinbrzezinski]

314. Parties are considered private organiztions

schools are public, see the difference?

And yes, I will try to get all close primaries no longer financed by the state.

[Agschmid]

42. Yup.

[politicaljunkie41910]

46. And instead of Bernie spinning it the way that it is, people trying to screw with the Dem Primary

now that Trump has clinched his nomination, Bernie will insist that it means that he's is more electable. When in fact it's just the opposite. Trump can't wait to run against the self-proclaimed socialist who visits Russia for his Honeymoon, and writes rape fantasy stories. The ads will write themselves.

[nadinbrzezinski]

141. HMMM republicans are not voting in this primary

[Armstead]

78. If you make excuses if Bernie wins you, are doing what Bernie supporters get accused of

[kstewart33]

89. Armstead, this isn't an excuse.

It's a fact. Trump supporters voted for Bernie to make trouble for Hillary.

Trump and Bernie have absolutely nothing in common.

So Bernie will have Trump supporters to thank for his victory, which at this point, looks very likely.

Will he work his gratitude into his stump speech?

But a win is a win is a win!

[Armstead]

97. You are making assumptions that are not necessarily true

As others have pointed Cross party switch voting isn't allowed in WV. Independents can, but they have less incentive to cause mischief.

A lot of it boils down to image in working class states. Both Bernie and Trump are seen as supporting workers and opposing bad trade policies. Clinton is not.

Coal is more problematic. But it may be like Vermont where a lot of people don;t share his ideology, but trust him and believe has "has their back."

[nadinbrzezinski]

143. Hmm having talked to a few independent voterss

you really do not understand. By the way, NO REPUBLICAN IS VOTING IN THIS PRIMARY.

[frylock]

241. You can provide evidence of this then?

[AZ Mike]

92. Democrats in WV are a different breed in the first place....

They voted in Joe Manchin, who had a campaign commercial in which he literally fired his rifle through a copy of Obamacare.

I'm a Sanders supporter, but the idea that Sanders voters would later vote for Drumpf is the wrong lens. It's more likely that populist, anti-establishment Democrats will vote for the populist, anti-establishment candidate before a party standard-bearer.

[panader0]

101. It's not an open primary.

[aikoaiko]

116. We've been telling you about this -- some Bernie supporters cant vote for HRC.

[Fresh_Start]

4. Given both Clinton and Sanders want to get rid of coal...

it would make the most sense that they were Trump supporters.

[LisaM]

10. So they should be voting in their own primary.

Except now there is no need to.

[Fresh_Start]

17. exactly...there is no need to vote in the GOP primary nt

nt

[libdem4life]

134. This is how I see it, as well. It's that darn unfavorability rating.

But it doesn't apply in the Clinton Bubble.

I do not think the American people will vote in a president who a majority just plain doesn't like. I could be wrong...this is an election season I've never seen in decades of political watching.

And, it seems to change daily...which really does make apologists for both sides and polls and helter-skelter pundits risk looking pretty silly on any given day.

[Fawke Em]

49. So they knew back on April 19 that the Republican race would be over?

Because that's when they would have had to have changed their party affiliation to vote.

West Virginia is a semi-open state. You have to be either a Democrat or unaffiliated to vote in the Democratic primary. These aren't Republicans. They're Democrats or Independents.

[Luminous Animal]

57. Registered Republicans are not allowed to vote in the Dem primary. Only Dems and unafilliated.

Only 19% of West Virginia voters are unaffiliated.

[PeaceNikki]

198. But the voters are not required to register with a party at all.

[AgingAmerican]

7. MSNBC is in the tank for HIllary

So no surprise here.

Oh, and there is no such thing as 'operation chaos'. You can just delete that email.

[KoKo]

68. No Doubt About It!

The firing of Progressives, the "Turn of Rachel Maddow" and their Constant Support of Donald Trump..24/7.

SICK!

[Lucinda]

8. With that kind of crossover it should be a great night for Bernie

Wont change anything though.

[HooptieWagon]

13. Repeating ignorance doesn't make it wisdom.

[CentralCoaster]

11. Most Hillary supporting superdelegates are gidbits, so you got that.

Kind of balances out.

Trying to remember who won the last primary.

Oh yeah, Sanders. Just saw him in person this morning, really draws a big crowd.

I like him, I think he's going places.

[Renew Deal]

30. He's going to Burlington

[CentralCoaster]

35. Beats prison.

Burlington, ya, I think he lives there.

[Renew Deal]

39. More Bernie supporter fantasies.

The difference between Bernie and Hillary is Hillary might be elected president and Bernie never will be.

[pinebox]

51. No the difference is...

One tends to lie and switch positions in order to pander & one doesn't.

[Armstead]

81. No he's gpoing back to DC one way or the other

But he will also be spending time in Burlington as he always has

[CrowCityDem]

12. Open primaries are so fair, huh?

[Armstead]

82. Awwwww..but cross-party voting not allowed

[Rass]

14. It's all about JOBS

Hillary supports offshoring jobs with disastrous free trade policies. She will deny and lie to the public about it but we all know better. Global trade is extremely important to Hillary even if it means selling out the working class. That is why she is now begging for support from Republicans. Progressives and independents are are not on her side.

Candidates that are against free trade will be popular especially in current economic times.

[Hoyt]

22. Yep, if we quit trading with foreign countries, traded among ourselves, we'd have a few more jobs --

especially a military to fight all the desperate people in the world.

Of course, most things would cost us substantially more than foreign goods. And as we found out in the 1970s, many of the homemade goods would be inferior quality.

I suggest we figure out how to take advantage of the world's demand for jobs and investment, hike taxes, and plow that back for people here.

[Armstead]

90. Please stop oversimplifying -- or at least look at the right simplification

These trade deals we have now suck for Americans, and are not too great for exploited overseas workers, but are great for greedy transnational corporations and investors..

That's why they're negotiated in secret, and if Sanders had not blown the whistle, they would still be hidden slimy typical back-door deals between the power brokers and the politicians they own -- including Clinton.

Trade can be good. Exploitation and gaming of the system is not.

[Hoyt]

125. Depends on what you mean sucks for Americans. All I know is almost every nation begs to be part of

Last edited Tue May 10, 2016, 08:43 PM - Edit history (1)

these agreements. They either want the investment, jobs, growth, and taxes, or they want their corporations to do well in global trade.

The people who are suffering -- and I agree it sucks -- are those who believed they could prepare for one job and keep it for a lifetime. Those jobs just don't exist for most people.

We need to figure out a way to get people displaced into jobs that won't be displaced as easily -- teachers, police, service workers, plumbers, construction, truck drivers, high tech industries, etc. Yeah, some of those can be displaced too, but not many. Then, we help the world grow and tax the heck out of corporations who are involved in that for needs back here. Other countries will do, and are doing, the same.

There's a thread whining about Chinese steel cleaning our clock. Well, folks -- that's exactly what Obama is saying about the TPP, etc. Let China dictate the rules or we can make an effort to unite the world in reasonable trade agreements -- which may force China and a few others to join in the effort.

Trying to shore up a losing situation here, by trading among ourselves, is a losing proposition.

[nadinbrzezinski]

169. You mean the neo liberal elites

there I fixed it for you

[beachbumbob]

15. Sanders is the easiest target in a general election...as right wing media

Have kept silent on him more or less but they will come blasting the socialist pacifist not willing to keep America safe come November and no soccer mom will vote for him

[dubyadiprecession]

16. It doesn't matter...

BS and train wreak trump will both lose.

[Fawke Em]

31. Apparently you haven't seen the latest polling.

Hillary is losing in Ohio and tied with Trump in Pennsylvania and Florida.

We've been telling you so.

Y'all really don't get it, do you?

[okasha]

18. One angry, red-faced shouting old man

running a vanity campaign is pretty much interchangeable with any other. Thank goodness we can tell them apart by the hair.

[boston bean]

32. That me me LOL. Thanks!!!

[wendylaroux]

36. oh brother,wanting to help people is a vanity.I'll be danged.

you should be a little kinder to your elders,sister,didn't your momma teach you anything?

[danimich1]

52. Vanity campaign?

That would be the "I'm with her" campaign. If that slogan isn't "vanity" I don't know what is.

[Renew Deal]

133. Bernie is only still around because of ego.

He has no other reason to remain in the race. He doesn't know how to break the news to his supporters.

[nadinbrzezinski]

139. LMAO

so that is why HRC staid until the last election in the 2008 election? EGO? REALLY? Naiveté on how this shit works is what I read in your post. But your OP was pretty naive too.

[Renew Deal]

144. Hillary should have dropped out for the same reason.

Hillary gained nothing from hanging around and Bernie will gain even less. Let him have his fun with the platform. No one cares about it anyway.

[nadinbrzezinski]

145. She won nothing? really

ok, we do live in different realities... hard to accept, but parallel quantum connections are now at play.

[Renew Deal]

149. What did she win? Respect and admiration?

She already had that.

[nadinbrzezinski]

153. You might have forgotten already, but she did

and it was not respect or admiration. that and ten bucks will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

As I said, the naiveté is gobsmacking but real

[Renew Deal]

157. You're not willing to state your claim.

What did she win in your opinion?

[nadinbrzezinski]

163. The fact that you need to ask is gobsmacking indeed, or a quantum phenomena

but if you think she did not get any influence in the administration you are dead wrong. And the best evidence was she became the Secretary of State. See, if she had gone back to her private life, you might have a point. Alas, she did not... as I said, either she won nothing, and in your reality she became a private citizen, or she did get something.

My cousin is actually a theoretical physicist. He works in String Theory... next time I see him I will have to ask if quantum theory allows for two realities to co-exist at the same time, in the classical world? I know it does at the Quantum Level. Are you cool with a nobel prize in physics? This is the kind of stuff we are talking about.

[Renew Deal]

293. She had a tremendous amount of influence.

And she deserved it. It's hard to say if she "won" the SOS job or earned it, but most Democrats will tell you she was a good SOS.

[nadinbrzezinski]

299. I am not, just responding in kind

and yes, she became the SOS.. and that was no accident.

And that was my point. My further point is that Sanders will have influence, and that is not something people here understand, But this is how politics works. I get it, Why I have voted for my candidates, (rev Sharpton for example) to give them delegate counts. Because you know, what? CALIFORNIA rarely if ever really matters.

I am once again voting for a wage increase, not the fucking primary. (And incidentally who I vote for in the primary, or the GE, is between myself, the conure, my pillow and my husband. It is not business of DU)

[nadinbrzezinski]

58. Well I can say that about the other candidate by the way

at that level, you got to be a narcissist to run. Yes that includes every freaking candidate running. (in case you miss htis, that includes Clinton)

[RobertEarl]

71. One rich, mean, self-entitled lady

running a vanity campaign is pretty much interchangeable with any other rich person.

Thank goodness we have Bernie running.

[frylock]

244. One angry, red-faced shouting old lady.

[Matt_in_STL]

255. Well now I won't be able to sleep tonight

Thanks for that.

[frylock]

256. Sorry 'bout that.

[okasha]

262. There's something I've been wondering about,

and here you are replying to me, so I feel comfortable asking you.

Why do BernieBros post such obviously and incompetently photoshopped pictures of Hillary? Since you've just done this, I do think you should be able to tell me.

[frylock]

264. This is 'shopped? Where's the original?

[okasha]

271. You don't need the original

to see the crudely drawn in lines and the shadows in the wrong places. And just so you know, I've been working with Photoshop since version 5.0

So tell me, why do this when it's an obvious visual lie? Do you think you're actually fooling anyone about either Hillary or yourself, given that this particular brand of misogyny is typically right-wing?

Inquiring minds want to know.

[frylock]

279. I had no idea it had been altered. How about these?

[Haveadream]

323. It is NORMAL for politicians to sometimes be angry

Last edited Wed May 11, 2016, 01:33 PM - Edit history (1)

If a candidate being angry is a negative then Bernie would have difficulty finding any support.

Please use another argument. This one is weak.

[frylock]

330. I wasn't the one making the argument.

[Sheepshank]

19. I figured this would happen since R's no longer need to vote

another reason for a closed Primary where registrants cannot switch parties once the Primary voting has commenced.

[nadinbrzezinski]

223. Except ace they are not voting in your precious primary

[Sheepshank]

265. Rude, condescending and demeaning....typical

[nadinbrzezinski]

266. Alas factual

[Sheepshank]

311. You attacked me without my ever speaking to you on this thread

And as a BS supporter you were vile...and you will be one of the loudest howlers of the innocence of Bernie supporters at the hands of "cruel and mean" Hillary supporters. The very worst of all hypocrites on DU today.

[nadinbrzezinski]

312. Alas I am not a bernie supporter

next piece of your imagination, and that was still factual.

This is not an open primary.

Primary election type
See also: Primary election
West Virginia utilizes a hybrid primary system. Parties decide who may vote. Both the Democratic and Republican parties allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.[10]

Note: Presidential primary and caucus types can differ. See this article for further details about 2016 presidential primaries and caucuses.

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

If telling you facts is a personal attack, I am sorry for pointing to the facts. It's a bad habit of mine.

But this was NOT AN OPEN PRIMARY. So those people who said they will be voting Trump in NOV, are DEMOCRATS who will NOT vote for HRC. That IS a problem. Alas one that was pointed to you people.

[Sheepshank]

315. You start out with an insult....anything you say after that is lost

You didn't use your voice to portray a truth, you used it to insult and demean. Hypocrite.

[nadinbrzezinski]

316. Poor you

given you do this often.. really. I pointed a fact

IT IS NOT AN OPEN PRIMARY. Those are DEMOCRATS who are not going to vote for your candidate!!!! I guess playing victim is much easier than actually understanding an actual issue. If this stays in WV whatever, but if this moves to SWING STATES it will be mightily interesting. In fact, it could be less than amusing to people like you.

I suspect the CAMPAIGN though is getting the DANGER, DANGER WILL ROBINSON message.



Or maybe they will not...

[Sheepshank]

317. Persist in insulting...how noble of you

Not really, your posts suck.

[nadinbrzezinski]

318. Then may i sugest you ignore them?

For the record I will not ignore anybody, but if you are getting that insulted, do ignore me, I BEG OF YOU. In this case you are complaining that information was given to you. I will remember to sugar coat it next time.

[Sheepshank]

324. as if you have any standing whatsoever to tell me what I should do

your insults are ALMOST matched by your vapid attempts at bullying. Both of those poor qualities well espoused by so many members of the BS group.

[Luminous Animal]

20. And most of them are registered Democrats.

Vote in November: In one last notable result, about a third of Democratic voters in preliminary exit poll results say that, given a Clinton-Donald Trump or a Sanders-Trump race, they’d vote for Trump. That’s a high level of support for Trump among Democratic primary voters; one reason is that West Virginia Democratic voters are among least liberal so far this year. Fewer than half say they’re liberals, vs. an average of 62 percent in previous Democratic contests.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/live-democratic-primary-exit-poll-results/story?id=38992745

[floppyboo]

21. You can't be surprised at this knowing the way Trump supporters view Hillary

Those favourability polls might mean something after all.
Bad with republican-lites, bad with independents. Scary.
But hey - she IS getting out the vote!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

23. Is anybody remotely surprised ?

[nadinbrzezinski]

224. Many HRC suppprters are

I am not... especially since these are DEMOCRATS who lean VERY CONSERVATIVES

[Fawke Em]

24. No. That's NOT what that meant.

What the polling says is that these Bernie supporters, given the choice of Trump or Clinton in the general, will go Trump. This is the culmination of anti-establishment preference, not Operation Chaos.

We Bernie supporters have been telling you this would happen.

I live in Appalachia. I see this a lot.

[floppyboo]

110. I didn't get it at first, from the wording of the OP, but this is way more dire for the Hills!

Thanks to original poster for editing to add picture. Picture paints a thousand words. Title of OP is a bit misleading, esp. with the operation chaos thrown in.

[Adrahil]

25. Of course. That's what happens with open primaries when the other side isn't contested NT

[nadinbrzezinski]

225. Especially when the primary is NOT open to Repubiicans

[Vinca]

28. That's only an indication of how much they dislike Hillary.

I remember voting in a GOP primary once to try to skew the vote. They're making a statement about Hillary, nothing more.

[nadinbrzezinski]

226. This is not open to republicans

[Vinca]

319. You change your party affiliation, vote, then change it back.

In my state you can do it at the polling place on the same day. I don't know how it is in West Virginia.

[nadinbrzezinski]

338. The deadline was April 19, so unless republicans have invented time travel...

yes, conservadems, more than a few actually, are NOT going to vote for Clinton. That is what this tells me.

Oh and we still have a somewhat competitive democratic primary.

[Vinca]

344. April 19 isn't that long ago. Who knows what their desired result might be.

I think Trump is snowing some Dems in the same way Reagan did. I don't get it at all.

[nadinbrzezinski]

345. When did Cruz suspend?

oh yeah AFTER THE 19th. Time Travel? There is a Nobel prize in physics in there.

[JaneyVee]

34. BECAUSE TRUMP IS THE ALREADY THE NOMINEE.

So they crossover to rat fuck. Closed primaries. All 50 states.

[TSIAS]

43. It's not an open primary

Unaffiliated voters, about 20 %, can choose which election to partake in.

Accept it that West Virginia Democrats are very conservative and a decent percentage will vote for Trump. Joe Manchin is barely a Democrat. Hillary won in 2008 mainly because WV Democrats and Independents didn't like the whole "Hussein thing".

[nadinbrzezinski]

70. Nope, no Republicans are voting today for Sanders

sorry to bust that bubble.

In an age you could use the google it still boggles the mind that people do not.

[Bobbie Jo]

104. Ding Ding Ding

There you have it, folks.

[nadinbrzezinski]

130. Except that republicans are not voting in this primary

have that argument with the google

Primary election type
See also: Primary election
West Virginia utilizes a hybrid primary system. Parties decide who may vote. Both the Democratic and Republican parties allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.[10]

Note: Presidential primary and caucus types can differ. See this article for further details about 2016 presidential primaries and caucuses.

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

[wendylaroux]

37. I don't give a shit if they're Pat Paulson supporters,I'll take em.

[Fawke Em]

41. Here's a visual of the poll. Check out the "neither" part.

This isn't Operation Chaos. This is the anti-establishment vote.

[TSIAS]

47. Question

Didn't Joe Manchin, a Clinton superdelegate, refuse to support Obama in 2012? WV Democrats are very conservative. This graphic shouldn't be a surprise.

[nadinbrzezinski]

59. correct, on both counts

[dchill]

69. Of course, if Sanders were the nominee, they'd vote for him.

That's why they're called "Sanders voters."

[frazzled]

44. Sanders has consistently done best in areas where

voters are registered as Democrats (in W. Virginia, that's vestige of Dixiecrats) but usually vote for Republicans.

That was explained (and proved today) in this article:

Once you get past places in Vermont on the list of the worst counties for Hillary Clinton so far in the primaries, you quickly arrive at Coal County, Okla., where she won just 19 percent of the vote.

Mrs. Clinton’s profound weakness in a county named “Coal” is not because of her comments about shutting down coal mines, as one might expect. Those comments came after the Oklahoma primary.

It’s because Coal County, like much of the traditionally Democratic parts of the South, has a huge number of registered Democrats who now vote Republican in presidential elections. In the states with closed or semi-closed contests — like Oklahoma — these registered Democrats can participate only in the Democratic primary.

When they do, they have tended to vote against Hillary Clinton (and for Bernie Sanders, the senator from Vermont).

Coal County, Okla., is one of the most extreme examples. There, 80 percent of voters are registered Democrats, yet President Obama won just 27 percent of the vote in 2012. Mrs. Clinton has performed very poorly where the share of voters who are registered Democrats is much greater than the share of voters who supported Mr. Obama.

The same phenomenon dogged Mr. Obama in the 2012 presidential primary, when he won just 22 percent of the vote in Coal County, Okla. That’s not a typo: I mean the 2012 Democratic presidential primary, when he had no major opposition, not the 2008 one, when he had a tough contest with Mrs. Clinton.

...

It bodes well for Mr. Sanders’s chances in coal country this month, starting in West Virginia on Tuesday. West Virginia, like Oklahoma, has far more registered Democrats than Obama voters.

Even today, 49 percent of voters are registered Democrats in West Virginia, but Mr. Obama won just 35.5 percent of the vote against Mitt Romney in 2012.

More at: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/10/upshot/where-democrats-like-hillary-clinton-the-least-besides-vermont.html?_r=0

Yes, people who will be voting for Trump in November are voting for Bernie Sanders today in West Virginia. Be proud.

[Nye Bevan]

48. Yep. Open primaries allow Republicans to deliberately vote for the weakest Democrat,

to try to get an easier opponent in November. This explains a lot of the disparity in the results of open versus closed primaries.

[Fawke Em]

53. Except that's not the case in West Virginia.

You have to have been registered as a Democrat or unaffiliated by April 19 in order to vote in the Democratic primary today.

Up until last week, the Republicans still had a race. No way these people could have known.

Accept it. Hillary isn't all that popular with Independents.

[nadinbrzezinski]

60. Except Republicans are not mucking up your election

dear lord, find the google and use it.

[Fawke Em]

72. They simply can't accept that Independents aren't keen on Clinton.

The reason a lot of people left BOTH parties is that NEITHER are looking out for the working class. Independent (unaffiliated in West Virginia) voters who tend to vote Democratic now hate BOTH parties, but seem to really like Bernie. They'll go Trump in the general if they have to because Clinton is still establishment.

[nadinbrzezinski]

74. I know, the same situation in CA

And I also found, anecdotal I know, a conservadem here in CA that confused the living daylights out of me. She had both a Trump and Clinton for President bumper stickers on the old, I mean ancient El Dorado. He and she car? Nope. She will vote for Clinton on June 7, cause the socialist has to be stopped, She is in her 70s so I do get it... but will vote for Trump in November, since well... CLINTON ARRRGGG.... CNN got a clone of her on the mike this morning in WV. I was literally dying.

[-none]

171. And if Hillary was a popular candidate that people actually wanted and open primaries benefited

her, then open primaries would be just hunky dory.
But she isn't and and they don't, so they are bad, huh?

[Tarc]

50. This is why the remaining open primary results will be tainted; Trump ratfuckery

and not at all indicative of Sanders' "strength".

[nadinbrzezinski]

63. Except no republicans are voting in your primary

[Tarc]

77. Except you can't, or chose not to, read the OP

[nadinbrzezinski]

83. Except that the state runs a MODIFIED PRIMARY SYSTEM

where Republcians do not vote on the Democratic Primary or the other way around.

It is a MODIFIED OPEN PRIMARY.

here, to help you a little, how liberal of me, why do I bother I don't know

Primary election type
See also: Primary election
West Virginia utilizes a hybrid primary system. Parties decide who may vote. Both the Democratic and Republican parties allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries.[10]

Note: Presidential primary and caucus types can differ. See this article for further details about 2016 presidential primaries and caucuses.

https://ballotpedia.org/Voting_in_West_Virginia

For the record, CA uses the same system for SOME parties. So do not scream Republicans are voting in the Dem primary on June 7, mkay.

[Tarc]

164. "...allow unaffiliated voters to vote in their primaries"

I'll let you think on that one a bit. You may get there eventually...

[nadinbrzezinski]

166. yes 19 percent of the electorate

and they had to change by April 19. Are you saying Republicans have discovered time travel?

[Tarc]

170. Keep trying...

[nadinbrzezinski]

176. Actually I think you are now trying to bait

after realizing that it was MOSTLY DEMOCRATS who will vote for Trump.

[Tarc]

322. Sorry, I forgot about you last night :)

As you can see here

SANDERS WINS WEST VIRGINIA, BUT DOESN’T CUT INTO HIS DELEGATE DEFICIT - Mollie Reilly: “Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) won Tuesday’s Democratic presidential primary in West Virginia, edging out rival Hillary Clinton for a majority of the state’s 29 delegates. It’s a minor win for Sanders: West Virginia awards delegates proportionately, and while votes are still being counted, he’s unlikely to win by enough percentage points to significantly dent Clinton’s lead in the delegate race. Sanders was expected to do well in West Virginia, where voters are largely white and working class. He also likely benefited from the state’s primary system, which allows independent voters to vote in either the Democratic or Republican election. More than 250,000 West Virginia primary voters were unaffiliated, according to state data.

Ratfuckery abounded last night.

You're welcome.

[Demsrule86]

245. Sanders has lost

He has no strength. you are correct.

[nadinbrzezinski]

54. Ah of course, the most trusted source of news

by the way you realize that in WV you need to be a democrat to vote in the primary? or a decline or a decline to state voter By the way, I heard a woman who voted for Clinton, again registered democrat, who will vote for Trump in November.

Why? Well the same reason I had a lovely lady give me for her Clinton and Trump for president stickers.

[merrily]

55. Ah, for once, exit polls finally matter on DU. LOL! However, one has to wonder

what the point of Operation Chaos would be at this stage of the primary. Who is doing the exit polling? Brock?

[Renew Deal]

121. The point is to prolong the primary and hurt the Democratic Party.

It's the same thing Democrats did to Romney in 2012.

[merrily]

132. Sez you. Sanders has already says he's in it to the end. So again, there's no point to

Operation Chaos.

[nadinbrzezinski]

158. Not only that, there is no cross over voting in VA

so this is a fantasy concocted out of full cloth.

[ecstatic]

56. lol. And they wonder why some of us prefer closed primaries?

Whether it's chaos or that they genuinely support both Trump and Sanders, they're obviously confused and/or gullible. Both men are making wild promises that they'd never be able to keep.

[nadinbrzezinski]

62. I agree with you, as long as state parties pay for the whole thing

at that point, if you use entrail reading I won't care. And do not bother calling them democratic either.

[basselope]

64. Operation :Clinton Excuses

I am guessing they reading that statistic slightly backward... although there is no link to verify just a "I heard it on".

I am guessing more like 44% of sanders voters would vote for Trump in the GE.. why? because they are voting ANTI-establishment.

This is why Clinton has no path to the presidency.

[Renew Deal]

67. Here you go

[basselope]

85. So EXACTLY what I said it was.

Thanks. Pretty much proves my point.

[Renew Deal]

105. No it isn't

Which part supports your "point"?

[basselope]

109. That it isn't trump supporters crossing the aisle.

It's Sanders supporters who would choose Trump over Clinton.

That's what the poll says.

[Renew Deal]

113. Right they are Trump supporters choosing Bernie

[basselope]

161. No, they are Sanders supporters.

Who would choose Trump as the lesser of two evils.

It's not that hard a case to make.

[Renew Deal]

167. Today they are Sanders supporters

By the way, do you think that some percentage of DUers would choose Trump over Hillary? Or the number is so big in WV, maybe there is something to it.

[basselope]

185. Much more than you think.

I would guess about 25-30% of DUers would choose Trump over Clinton.. maybe higher.

However, people aren't allowed to say it or else they risk expulsion.

[AgerolanAmerican]

178. there are probably two main types

one, Sanders supporters who would go Trump over Clinton
two, independents who support Trump

what I find most interesting however is that 31% say "neither" and only 25% say "Clinton"

so the people who aren't Trump supporters are also saying they'd rather not support anyone than support Clinton!

[nadinbrzezinski]

227. correct

and they have been telling indies and LW dems to pound sand.

[nadinbrzezinski]

236. Because we all need a hobby

[AzDar]

128. ^ This

[Eric J in MN]

65. They weren't asked their first choice.

They were asked what they'll do in November if the nominees are Clinton and Trump.

[anotherproletariat]

73. The guy down the hall (from WV) says that many of his repub friends are trying to

help Sanders win because they think Trump will beat him much easier in the general. And either way, it will lead to more infighting and chaos in the Democratic Party. Smart move for repubs.

[nadinbrzezinski]

75. Well if they are republians they are lying

it is a modified open primary, NOPE, republicans are not voting on a democratic primary.

[anotherproletariat]

84. Good point...I'll ask him! nt

[Bill USA]

88. Why am I not surprised? THe extremes are really populated by the same (type of) people who r quite

different than the pragmatic, realists who compose the moderates in the middle.

[NorthCarolina]

91. I say it's BS. A "setup" for the upcoming push

in the Democratic Party for ALL primaries to be closed primaries. This is so phony and predictable.

[nadinbrzezinski]

95. Amd I will push for the state parties to pay for each and all of them

That is exactly what they are doing.

I mean this is not even an open primary, but a modified one. Where independent votes get a say. It is not CA, where the majority of voters are actually indies, but about 20 percent of all eligible voters.

[Renew Deal]

117. Ahhhh, it's a years long conspiracy to close the primaries

Got it.

[amborin]

93. ominous if HRC is nominee; this reported in other states, by union rank & file

[basselope]

99. Wish the OP was more honest here...

44% of Sanders supporters are NOT Trump supporters.. but 44% of Sanders voters would choose Trump over Clinton.

(They would anti-establishment, over establishment).

[Renew Deal]

111. You just said the same thing I said.

44% of Sanders voters are Trump Supporters.

[basselope]

159. No, that's not what I said...

I said 44% of Sanders voters would choose Trump OVER Clinton.

That doesn't make them "Trump Supporters".

It means in the battle of the lesser of two evils, they see Trump as the lesser evil.

[Renew Deal]

162. People that vote for Trump are Trump supporters.

[basselope]

181. Not according to what most people here say.

People who don't support Hillary are supposed to just vote for her...

"Lesser of two evils" we are told.

[ibegurpard]

102. Oh so now Camp Weathervane

Is putting stock in the exit polls?

[Renew Deal]

106. If you remember, it was always the more conspiratorial types in Sanders camp that had problems

With exit polls

[lumberjack_jeff]

112. No, 100% of them are for Sanders.

This is a problem for democrats only if they nominate Clinton.

I wish y'all would make up your minds:
Sanders supporters are irrelevant, but if we lose in november it's their fault.
Sanders supporters will vote for Clinton because what other choice do they have?... except to vote for Trump who was their secret crush all along, infiltrators that they are!
Closed primaries will allow us to vote for the best democrat, and keeping out indepenents will assure that we nominate the candidate with the most narrow appeal in the general election.
Sanders has a 30% disapproval rate! Support Clinton! She has a 44% approval rate!

[Renew Deal]

115. 44% of Sanders voters in WV are a Trump supporters

Those people would be voting for Trump today if they were republicans or the race was competitive.

[lumberjack_jeff]

120. No. They are independent Sanders supporters who won't vote for Clinton.

Nominating Clinton is a shitty idea. You seem to have it in your heads that nominating her is a smart way to punish them.

[Renew Deal]

126. Punishment has nothing to do with anything

44% of people voting for Sanders today are Trump supporters. That has nothing to do with anyone else.

[bunnies]

123. Only if the choice is Trump v Clinton.

In other words, they're just anti-Hillary regardless.

[Renew Deal]

127. True

The 44% are DINO's and republican sympathizers voting in the Democratic primary.

[lumberjack_jeff]

131. I wish you'd make up your mind.

Either Sanders is a hard core socialist whom Republicans or independents would never support, or we're being infiltrated by right wingers and their stealth candidate Bernie.

[Renew Deal]

138. Neither?

In WV 44% of right wingers are voting for Bernie to hurt the Democratic Party.

[nadinbrzezinski]

253. And at least 20 percent are democrats, if not higher

that is hysterical

[bunnies]

135. Anti-establishment would be my guess.

I see no other parallel between Bernie and trump.

[nadinbrzezinski]

136. And you are correct

[bunnies]

152. I'm not buying the conspiracy theories.

Operation chaos. Am I supposed to believe that's how Obama won.

[nadinbrzezinski]

184. Well that was a lovely Rush Limbaugh theory

for which there is no basis that it actually worked

For the record what Rush suggested was for the Rs to cross the aisle and vote for HRC, because the Republcians nominee would have an easier time. So if I take the theory as stated. the Republcians are getting their wish 8 years later.

Irony, it is not just for republicans anymore.

[bunnies]

187. Was it really to vote for HRC?

Holy shit. I remembered it the opposite way. You're right. The Rs have been wanting HRC in the worst possible way. For years.

[nadinbrzezinski]

191. Yup

Monday on his radio show, conservative talk show host Rush Limbaugh suggested he may “reactivate” his 2008 “operation chaos,” in which he urged his listeners to participate in the Democratic Party’s presidential primary and vote for then-Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY) against the eventual nominee, then-Sen. Barack Obama (D-IL), in order to prolong the Democratic Party’s primary contest.

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2016/01/11/limbaugh-we-may-have-to-reactivate-operation-chaos-but-this-time-for-bernie/

and forgive me for the source, I usually do not quote from Brietbart, but it is not like CNN is going to carry this.

[bunnies]

202. I don't mind the source.

We're talking about RW plots. It requires RW sources.

So now they'd rather face Bernie? lol. Big mistake... But too late to make a difference.

[nadinbrzezinski]

205. Well I doubt it was ever done

[Renew Deal]

140. there are other motivations

The motivation of the 44% is to help their guy and hurt the Democratic party.

[bunnies]

147. I suppose it could be some of that.

I would guess very little though. If that were the case, why wait till Hillary virtually has it in the bag? It doesn't make sense.

[Renew Deal]

150. Because now their race is wrapped up.

They have nothing seriously left to vote for.

[bunnies]

160. All 44% though? nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

228. But unless they got time travel technology, they did not re-register on the 19 of April

[nadinbrzezinski]

151. 19 percent of those voters are independent voters, in the total voter pool

I am willing to bet that not all 19 percent are voting today. Call it a sneaky. So how many of those voters are DEMOCRATS? I mean registered and everything. These is no operation chaos... but there are plenty of conservative democrats who will indeed vote for Trump. There are also independents who will do that.

Them are the breaks.

[Renew Deal]

154. As you know, WV is full of DINO's

KY is too. Democrats are actually the majority in KY.

[nadinbrzezinski]

156. Whatever you call them, they are DEMOCRATS

again, them are the breaks.

[seabeyond]

124. Young white guys and their elders that do not like certain groups, just sayin'. I hear ya. Nt

[baldguy]

129. As of this moment, and from now on, the leader of the "Not Hillary" Party is Donald Trump.

And as long as Sanders continues his campaign, he's acting as one of Trump's minions.

[Renew Deal]

148. There are two people running against Hillary

Both want the same outcome.

[baldguy]

172. Yep.

And it doesn't include having a progressive Democrat in the White House.

[senz]

188. Hillary and Trump are closer to each other than to Bernie.

But when you're wearing Hillary glasses, all you can see is Hillary.

Here, you'll like this ...

[Renew Deal]

195. You guys have to make up your minds on that one

We're being lectured that Sanders supporters will naturally gravitate to Trump and then we're told Hillary is closer to Trump. At least try to make your over the top insults consistent.

[senz]

183. Because it's all about Hillary! There's nobody else!

If you watched a recent Sanders rally video, you'd have heard long, loud booing at every mention of the word "Trump."

"But but but it's all about Hillary, so anybody who doesn't want her wants Trump!"

Uh-huh.

That's just not very intelligent.

[baldguy]

206. She's being double-teamed by Trump and Sanders - and she's still winning.

And yes, since our govt is **NOT** a parliamentary democracy, but is a representative republic with a winner-take all system, withholding your support from one candidate automatically benefits their opponent. Therefore anyone who doesn't want Clinton gives aid & comfort to the fascist GOP candidate Trump.

Deal with it.

[senz]

214. LIKEWISE, anyone who doesn't want Bernie gives aid to Trump.

Deal. with. that.

[baldguy]

220. Except - Sanders **IS NOT WINNING!**

And he won't win. Anything Sanders does - and anything his supporters do - can only help Trump.

Trump & his army of darkness knows this. That's why 40% of Sanders voters in WV say they'll support The Orange One on Nov.

[Lodestar]

137. BALONEY!

[workinclasszero]

173. Horseshoe theory

The tea party..right and left.

[frylock]

250. Horsecrap theory.

It's obvious through stated policy preference which group of supporters is closer to right-wingers.

[workinclasszero]

267. Yeah the side that gets all its conspiracy theories from The Blaze, freerepublic, redstate, breitbart

Fox "news", Hate radio and the side that has 40% or so "progressives" promising to vote for the fascist Trump in the GE.

Bernouts/Bernvictims/Berniedeadenders.

Own it.

Sanders supporters have been wallowing in right wing filth since day one of the primary.

[frylock]

268. Did you read that on Brock Nation Review?

[workinclasszero]

270. Nope right here on "Democratic" Underground

This place is a right wing dump site.

Freerepublic with better grammar as a witty person put it earlier.

That's what turned me against Sanders from the beginning of his campaign.

The right wing has backed him 100% the whole time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

313. So Sanders is a RW politician? I am sure that will come as a surprise to the Senator

and any competent student of political science.

[workinclasszero]

321. Don't put words in my mouth I never said

Classic straw man argument, good job!


I said the right wing has backed Sander's primary run from the beginning and its true. The latest example of this is...44% or so of WV voters for Bernie are going to vote for Trump in the GE!

[nadinbrzezinski]

334. Nah you said this was also a right wing hate site

so get your talking point straight



By the way, no, the RW has not supported him... voters who trend right (and very much left) have supported a change candidate. In fact two of them. And this is a change election, Learn the meaning of THAT.

But I did not put words in your mouth. And so you know, the horse shoe theory is also not used by anybody competent in political science, except as laughing stock. It is up there with the same theory, brought up by a British political scientists who trends nationalist, RW extreme, who said that Nazis were truly left wingers.

So at this point we are laughing at you, not with you, for trying to peddle shitty theories.

workinclasszero (10,911 posts)
267. Yeah the side that gets all its conspiracy theories from The Blaze, freerepublic, redstate, breitbart

Fox "news", Hate radio and the side that has 40% or so "progressives" promising to vote for the fascist Trump in the GE.

Bernouts/Bernvictims/Berniedeadenders.

Own it.

Sanders supporters have been wallowing in right wing filth since day one of the primary.

And the logical extension from that is that Sanders is a RW pol. Sorry, own what you said. I will add that BNR and a few others on the left wing are indistinguishable at this point from Breitbart, or my good pals at Fox news. Ok, propaganda is propaganda. And there is a media study thesis for a brave graduate college student as well.

I will also add this. CNN is a soft propaganda peddler, and MSNBC has been pushing it hard. Of course CNN-I is fairly competent with the exact same reporters. They just know that foreign audiences recognize this shit a mile away. We don't, in genera;.

And with that, have an excellent day.

[DCBob]

177. Good lord.

This is weird.

[Trust Buster]

182. They want coal production. Aren't open primaries just lovely ?

[nadinbrzezinski]

222. It is not open

and the data reveals that CONSERVADEMS, no surprise to me, will vote for Trump.

[leeroysphitz]

320. +1

[TexasTowelie]

210. Independents are voting in the Democratic primary

because there is a contested race for governor in the Democratic primary. The race for governor in the GOP primary is not being contested.

[Warren DeMontague]

213. What are the excuses gonna be when she loses Oregon?

[nadinbrzezinski]

230. And if she loses CA

I am not putting any stock on any polls yet, they are all over the map.

[frylock]

259. They'll want to shut down the Communist USPS.

[riversedge]

303. Poll: Despite Bernie Sanders' Crowds, Hillary Clinton Ahead In Oregon-48 to 33

Poll: Despite Bernie Sanders' Crowds, Hillary Clinton Ahead In Oregon-48 to 33


http://www.opb.org/news/series/election-2016/bernie-sanders-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-oregon-poll/
Anna Griffin


A new poll shows Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump headed toward primary victories next week in Oregon — and suggests Clinton holds a strong lead over Trump as both pivot toward the November general election.

DHM Research surveyed 901 likely Oregon voters between May 6 and May 9 for OPB and Fox 12. Among Democrats, Clinton led U.S. Sen. Sanders 48 percent to 33 percent. Sanders has attracted adoring crowds at campaign appearances in Portland and Eugene — he’ll speak again Tuesday night in Salem — but the Democratic primary is a closed election. That means only registered Democrats can vote, and may help explain why Clinton leads in the poll.

[Warren DeMontague]

305. We'll see!

Some people here don't acknowledge when they're wrong, or they bail to cricketstown when asked a question they don't want to answer.

Not my style.

If I'm wrong on that- and I've been wrong before - I promise will gracefully acknowledge the same.

[Haveadream]

325. I hope she wins but I'm only cautiously optimistic

Oregon doesn't have enough of a diversity/minority population like the states in which Hillary usually prevails. She would win if it did. As it is, I am not convinced she can if the primary vote pattern continues as it has.

[Warren DeMontague]

347. I think there are other factors beyond diversity and open/closed primaries, myself. Like Geography.

She's lost every state which has legalized marijuana for adult recreational use. I don't think that is a coincidence, and I don't think Oregon will be any different.

[TwilightZone]

217. So, Trump won both primaries.

That should concern us more than it seems to.

[nadinbrzezinski]

231. That, and the number of Conservative Democrats who signaled they will vote Trump in November

I see instead a lot of excuses and heads in sand.

[TwilightZone]

235. Source?

The percentage of Sanders supporters who said they'd vote for Trump vs. Sanders was similar to the number who said they'd vote for Trump vs. Clinton, more than one-third in each case.

If you're assuming that the 44% who voted for Sanders but are Trump supporters are conservative Democrats, I think you're misreading the results. If they're going to vote for Trump regardless of our nominee, they're more than likely crossover voters, not Dems.

[nadinbrzezinski]

238. Quite simple

SOS numbers for decline to state voters is 18 percent, most recent numbers, from 2012

http://www.sos.wv.gov/elections/history/Pages/Voter_Registration_History.aspx

So it is math... 40 percent have signaled that they will cross for Trump, 40-18 gives me 22, and that is assuming every independent voter did a cast today for Sanders. So a more realistically number of conservadems is higher. It is like Florida in 2000 when tens of thousands of Conservative Democrats chose to vote for George Bush. Them are the breaks.

Keep hiding the head in the sand, and kicking on the voters that are obviously needed to win. Myself. this is a nasty signal of what is going to happen in the rust belt. Did I mention these are battleground states? I thought it would be relevant.

Myself, just taking notes.

[Haveadream]

337. I agree with you

While the 40+ percentage may not be representative of Dems alone, it is a very nasty conservative signal and one that is worrisome. The rust belt is critical and it is vital that HRC make her case for jobs there. WV Dems may be a write off but those in Ohio are not.

[TomCADem]

254. Open Primaries Versus Closed Primaries

This the downside of having an open primary. Your party's nominee can be chosen by folks who have no interest in voting for your candidate during the general election.

[Matt_in_STL]

257. It isn't an open primary, but semi-open.

What this says is that independents would vote for Bernie in the GE but they sure as hell won't vote for Hillary and would actively work against her. Republicans aren't allowed to vote in the WV Democratic primary.

[TomCADem]

261. In 2012, Most Independents Were Republican Leaning, Tea Partiers...

...who mostly favored Romney. President Obama won even though Romney did better in the independent vote. My take is that it is more efficient to motivate Democrats to come out and vote, rather to ignore your base, and bank on winning independents.

[polly7]

258. Anybody but Clinton for so many then, right? nt.

[Renew Deal]

273. What about yourself?

[polly7]

274. What about yourself? nt.

[Renew Deal]

275. I prefer Clinton over Trump.

Do you?

[polly7]

277. I don't vote there, but have quite a few family who do - they prefer Sanders. nt.

[Renew Deal]

280. What about you?

You said "anybody but Clinton." Do you mean it?

[polly7]

282. I SAID - the voters there must prefer 'anybody but Clinton'.

Can you read?

[Renew Deal]

284. Ok. I accept that.

What is your opinion? Do you prefer Clinton to Trump or do you agree with the voters there?

[polly7]

285. I prefer Sanders. nt.

[Renew Deal]

288. Is there any reason to believe you prefer Clinton to Trump?

You're not willing to say it.

[polly7]

290. I never mentioned Trump. Wtf are you trying for? nt.

[Renew Deal]

294. You said "Anybody but Clinton"

I'm just asking if you believe it.

[polly7]

295. I'm saying that voters there apparently believe it. Can you not read? nt.

[Renew Deal]

296. And I am asking if you agree with those voters.

[polly7]

297. I don't vote there. Get that??? I have family who do, they support Sanders.

As do I, as someone who cares who the next leader of the nation with the most powerful and well-funded military in the world is. The planet cannot take more war, more environmental destruction, more poverty as the rich get richer.

Understand?

[frylock]

260. ABC

Better get used to it.

[Renew Deal]

272. Do you stand by that?

You prefer Trump to Clinton?

[frylock]

286. ABC is what it is. How I feel has no bearing.

Neither of those choices is appealing to me. Thankfully, I don't live in a swing state.

[Renew Deal]

287. Shame

[frylock]

289. Okay.

[eggplant]

298. AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

From their comment, it looks like Juror #5 meant to vote to leave it. If they had, this would have been 7-0 (as it should have been).

On Tue May 10, 2016, 10:22 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

ABC is what it is. How I feel has no bearing.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1938613

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

ABC means Anybody But Clinton. They prefer Trump to Clinton.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue May 10, 2016, 10:31 PM, and the Jury voted 1-6 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: What's your point? I prefer a ham sandwich to Clinton.
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Being chihldish because their candidate didn't win is not a hide-worthy offense.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: The alerter (presumably the person responding to the alerted) seems to be on a mission to get people banned. Leave it, and ban the alerter. This is fucking bullshit.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: leave it alone so everyone can see how this "DUer" feels toward our nominee

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[polly7]

302. Hmmmmmm ......... you were alerted on.

He's been trying here with me for awhile for the same purpose. Glad the jury saw through it.

[frylock]

304. Better luck next time, eh.

[hollowdweller]

263. Record numbers switched to Republican this year in WV to vote for Trump.

http://www.theintelligencer.net/page/content.detail/id/656621/Some-West-Virginia-Voters-Switching-Party-Affiliation.html?nav=526

[DrDan]

291. no surprise

[Number23]

306. SHOCKING!!111 Im SHOCKeD!111one

[ucrdem]

307. I predict that Hills will not take WV in November.

Just a hunch.


p.s. someone mentioned in another thread, now locked, that Hillary won WV in the 2008 primary so sincere congrats to Bernie Sanders on a not insignificant victory. No doubt there were a few snickers then too but a win is a win.

[Shadowflash]

326. I'm a Sanders supporter who will never vote for Trump,

But I can certainly understand why people would and why this stat is what it is.

People want change. We want to get away from the same ol' same ol', politics as usual, corporate candidate.

Sanders represents that and, to a lesser degree, so does Trump.

This is what's going to happen when a party insists on nominating the ULTIMATE Washington insider in an election people want change.

Clinton has been insulated from that reality, thus far, because progressives have been shut out of most of the primaries and the DNC can run the table.

Unfortunately for Clinton, the progressives can't be shut out of the GE.

All I can say is good luck running the same old, tired, corporate bought, run of the mill candidate. You'll need it.

[apnu]

327. Horse hockey

I know not one real Sanders supporter who'd ever vote for Trump. Every single one says Trump is far worse for us than Clinton. That includes DU.

We also have evidence of conservatives crossing party boundaries in open primaries, or semi-open ones like WV where its easy to lie and get a different ballot, and voting.

This is an operation to sow chaos and delay the Democratic nomination so the Republicans have time to get organized while we squabble.

It is pure fiction that Bernie supporters and Trump supporters are similar in any way.

[Shadowflash]

328. Haha! Yeah.

I guess we'll see when November gets here, won't we?

[apnu]

331. We will indeed.

Young people will be learning the lesson seasoned voters have learned already. That is, figure out what they're going to do come election day. Will they hold their nose? Will they stay home in disgust? Have they been sowing chaos for the other side? Will they write in and make a symbolic, yet pointless, protest?

Everybody who summons the willpower to get off the couch and to the polls face that question.

As for the older Bernie supporters, who've been around, they'll face the same choice too, but their endurance will be tested. Do they show up for Hillary after Bernie loses? How long will they continue to hold their noses and vote for someone other than their choice? Hillary's PUMAs faced that exact situation in 2008, but its not the same. In the end the PUMAs came home to Obama, I suspect the same will happen this year. Trump is that appalling.

This is an American rite-of-passage as old as this country. Given how dissatisfied people are with politics, its no wonder 45% of the electorate stays home on big election years. And that's in a year people are excited or motivated in a historical election as in 2008.

[nadinbrzezinski]

332. They are out there, if this will make you feel better, I actually talked to one who is firmly

in the HRC clamp in the primaries and Trump in the general, And her logic, at her almost 80 years young, was flawless, even if I do not agree with her thinking. It was very internally consistent.. CNN interviewed her counterpart in WV yesterday morning. I was dying from laughter. I mean, it is rare when you see a conversation you had in the wild with a perfect stranger, repeated almost word for word on the tv.

But this is what a change election in the making, and the establishment is not getting it. I won't make any bets, the dynamics are far from normal.

[apnu]

333. Except that Trump is the definition of the establishment.

Anybody who thinks otherwise is a rube.

[nadinbrzezinski]

335. No he is not actually

he is challenging two out of the three legs of the Republcians party and the third one is the anti establishment wing of the party. Yeah he is immensely wealthy, but his ideology is far from establishment thinking, I suspect though that in a board room he is far less shall we say bombastically out there? He is a symbol of a lot of things that are wrong with the country, and in a less star infatuated era he likely would not have gotten this far.

But he is far from establishment. That said, he is very dangerous to the establishment because he knows where a lot of the skeletons are buried and knows exactly how the graft works in the system. That makes him immensely dangerous, and appealing to those who think the system is broken.

For the record, in the GE, he is going to take on that graft and corruption that also infects the democrats. And that will anger many here who believe their party is pure as snow. Myself, will just take notes.

Unlike most folks here, yes I have taken a deep dive into his thinking... but that is my job as a reporter, and I did that with Cruz too,. and with both democrats, HRC and Sanders. This is an outsider, change election... I will not make any bets, Though I did start taking Trump very seriously before the MSM, well they don't really yet.

And Trump is one dangerous critter at multiple levels.

And if you think I am a rube for actually doing the work, let me tell you, you are the one not taking this man seriously and thinking still he is a joke.

[apnu]

340. Sorry you lost me at "ideology"

Trump has no ideology other than to enrich himself and stroke his own ego. That much is plain to everybody who pays half attention to him. He says whatever hits his brain that is annoying to everybody else to get attention. It is impossible to believe he is not up to his ears in graft like every other insanely rich and politically active person. He's for a system that continues to enrich the haves and stuff the have nots. That's the definition of establishment as far as I'm concerned. Hence people who think he's anti-establishment are rubes.

He's a man with nothing to lose. In the financial world, where I travel, we call that "feeding the margin monster" Its a way of saying, one takes their losses and moves on, emotionally unaffected by it all. Risk only what you're willing to risk and keep the rest tucked away. Trump does that and he's a pro at it. He projects confidence at all times and in all situations. And if losses occur, brush them off. No matter what's going on in his head and heart, its the outward projection that's important. Its that confidence that wins deals and gets clients. People like to be near supremely confident men, it gives them shelter from the terrors of the wild world.

He'll expose corruption and when he's shown to be as corrupt, he'll brush it off and feed the margin monster and move on.

If he wants, he can fund this ego project himself. He doesn't need the Republican party, he could just as easily do this in the Democratic party, but he's in the GOP because that system is easier to co-opt and pervert than the Democrats. The Tea Party showed that weakness and he's building on it.

Yes Trump is dangerous, I don't think he's a joke, I never thought he's a joke. I knew he'd have the GOP nomination when I saw him ride down that escalator. Because of what I said above. He's got the cash to fund this and he can do/say whatever he wants and his brand will only increase in value. He can be crushed in a Reagan-esque landslide and still come out richer than before and more valuable than before.

Lies? Outlandish lies? Talking about his prick on national TV? Being an open racist and bigot? Calling for people to be lynched at his rallies? The more shocking he is, the more he increases his market share. At least in the media. Time will tell how the voters feel in November.

Check this out: Trump is now saying he can deliver "four to five Supreme Court justices" who will turn over Roe V Wade in his term. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/05/11/1525408/-Trump-promises-to-deliver-four-or-five-anti-abortion-Supreme-Court-justices

Yes we should take him very seriously. But people who take him at his word are gullible fools.

[nadinbrzezinski]

341. Wrong,he does have a clear ideology

You are underestimating him or his appeal. Thanks for proving my point I shall remove myself from wasting my time.

[apnu]

342. OK then. You brought no analysis to your argument nor sources

But want to ignore others. You're right, this is a waste of time. You've already decided what's right and are excluding other viewpoints. And you call yourself a reporter? Ha!

[nadinbrzezinski]

343. I actually have spent the time doing this

and taken a deep dive. But I really feel that people here are so blind that it is not even funny.

https://reportingsandiego.com/2016/03/25/trumpism-as-political-philosophy/

have an excellent day, I have to finish the rest of it, but yes, there is a clear philosophy.

[apnu]

346. Considering that we agree in some areas yet you insist i'm blind

Shows you're not bothering to read my response. Your skimming it and making assumptions.

But you're in blow off mode, I get that. Have a great day!

[ieoeja]

329. Yes, half of West Virginia Democrats always vote Republican for President.

This is not exactly news.

Half the Democrats who voted for Sen Manchin (D-WV) voted for McCain and Romney.

A quarter of the Democrats who vote for Bates, Blackwell, Boggs, Byrd, Cambell, Caputo, Eldridge, Ferror, Fleischauer, Fluharty, Guthrie, Hartman, Hicks, Longstreth, Lynch, etc as Democrats in the State House are probably going to vote for Trump.

They vote for those candidates in the primary because they want them to win in the general. Then vote for a President they don't much care about while they are at it.

[mhatrw]

336. They are only Trump supporters if Clinton get the nomination. Otherwise, they are Sanders supporters

and reliable Democratic voters.