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JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:16 AM May 2016

Lucia Graves is a pathetic hack who dismisses the votes of desperate, poor WV voters in her column

All to diss Bernie's cause and promote Clinton-style neoliberalism using factually-incorrect identity politics to ignore the issues entirely: exploitation of rural communities, extreme poverty, education access, a broken criminal justice system.

Her latest piece(1) is titled:

Hillary Clinton may have lost West Virginia by a landslide. The truth is, she doesn't need it


In a way, this title is peak establishment politics: it is the candidate who "needs" a state, not the state nor its population which are to be represented by the politician. But let's hear what she has to say first; the subtitle is:

The white, male voters of this coal-mining state left us in no doubt of their support for Bernie Sanders. But among every other demographic, Hillary leads


This headline is factually untrue, as CNN's exit poll confirms:

He also beat Clinton among women 52% to 38% and also among independents, by nearly 40 percentage points.(2)


But amazingly, this isn't the worst part of her column; she does not discuss, and perhaps is unaware of, entrenched poverty in rural West Virginia. That is, labor has not benefited in a fair way from the successes of coal over the past century as compared to the coal industry. The NYT did a story on McDowell County in 2014(3), "50 Years Into the War on Poverty, Hardship Hits Back". This should be required reading for anyone commenting on the West Virginia primary.

TWIN BRANCH, W.Va. — When people visit with friends and neighbors in southern West Virginia, where paved roads give way to dirt before winding steeply up wooded hollows, the talk is often of lives that never got off the ground.

“How’s John boy?” Sabrina Shrader, 30, a former neighbor, asked Marie Bolden one cold winter day at what Ms. Bolden calls her “little shanty by the tracks.”

“He had another seizure the other night,” Ms. Bolden, 50, said of her son, John McCall, a former classmate of Ms. Shrader’s. John got caught up in the dark undertow of drugs that defines life for so many here in McDowell County, almost died of an overdose in 2007, and now lives on disability payments. His brother, Donald, recently released from prison, is unemployed and essentially homeless.

“It’s like he’s in a hole with no way out,” Ms. Bolden said of Donald as she drizzled honey on a homemade biscuit in her tidy kitchen. “The other day he came in and said, ‘Ain’t that a shame: I’m 30 years old and carrying my life around in a backpack.’ It broke my heart.”

McDowell County, the poorest in West Virginia, has been emblematic of entrenched American poverty for more than a half-century. John F. Kennedy campaigned here in 1960 and was so appalled that he promised to send help if elected president. His first executive order created the modern food stamp program, whose first recipients were McDowell County residents. When President Lyndon B. Johnson declared “unconditional war on poverty” in 1964, it was the squalor of Appalachia he had in mind. The federal programs that followed — Medicare, Medicaid, free school lunches and others — lifted tens of thousands above a subsistence standard of living.

But a half-century later, with the poverty rate again on the rise, hardship seems merely to have taken on a new face in McDowell County. The economy is declining along with the coal industry, towns are hollowed out as people flee, and communities are scarred by family dissolution, prescription drug abuse and a high rate of imprisonment.


Sanders' response is to say simply that while his environmental policies may harm the West Virginian economy, the government has an obligation to financially assist these communities and get them back on their feet. It is a LBJ approach to the problem. Clinton's approach includes her now infamous statement about putting coal miners out of work. I think that statement is unfair to her, but still she only commits to 'not wanting to forget' about them. Hardly encouraging!

In short, I do not believe these voters are stupid, or misinformed. When Bernie talks about CEOs receiving a different standard of justice than the neighborhood kid with a drug problem, this resonates. Why?!? Give this a listen (after the Blankenship sentencing[4]):

&feature=youtu.be

What is this voter upset about (and what does the local media miss, and evidently Lucia Graves as well) ? Well, here's what the NYT reports about this sentencing:

Mr. Blankenship, however, was also defiant and told Judge Berger, “It’s important to me that everyone knows that I am not guilty of a crime.” (4)


Now you tell me: which candidate is a person like this going to respond more to?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In conclusion, Lucia Graves is a hack shilling for Clinton using transparently false "data" to pretend as if an entire state with systemic problems didn't just reject Clinton's candidacy. Meanwhile, she ignored a perfect opportunity to detail some of the above problems in West Virginia which may have been on voters' minds. Journalism is supposed to inform, not just provide a horse-race description. I can always look at the scoreboard after the race is over if I wanted that.

================================================================================

(1):http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/10/hillary-clinton-west-virginia-lost-bernie-sanders-democratic-primary
(2): http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/10/politics/west-virginia-nebraska-primary-highlights/
(3): http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/21/us/50-years-into-the-war-on-poverty-hardship-hits-back.html
(4): http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/07/us/donald-blankenship-sentenced-to-a-year-in-prison-in-mine-safety-case.html
Lucia Graves is a pathetic hack who dismisses the votes of desperate, poor WV voters in her column (Original Post) JonLeibowitz May 2016 OP
And Clintons wins in the south Eko May 2016 #1
You must be lost; it appears your post doesn't address any of the substance of my OP JonLeibowitz May 2016 #2
Please, give me the short. Eko May 2016 #3
Or does Clinton winning Eko May 2016 #4
Obviously your narrative doesnt follow through. Eko May 2016 #5
The data would seem to support your assertion, Eko. DemocratSinceBirth May 2016 #10
I never denied that demographics may play a role. JonLeibowitz May 2016 #15
Well....that was awkward. The first post of the thread kinda blew your point to bits. msanthrope May 2016 #6
White women also voted for Bernie. Nice try at using the horrid "white male" as an excuse. JonLeibowitz May 2016 #13
the only demographic Sanders leads in is white males. msanthrope May 2016 #19
I choose to characterize it as false. Sanders won white women in WV. Epic fail on your part. JonLeibowitz May 2016 #21
So you claim white people, in a poor, racially homogenous state, went for msanthrope May 2016 #22
As I have written ... 1StrongBlackMan May 2016 #26
This place can be an excellent resource... NCTraveler May 2016 #14
Again, white women broke for Bernie. The lede is a monstrous lie. JonLeibowitz May 2016 #18
Recommended. mmonk May 2016 #7
Clinton supporters care only about her majesty. No wonder she reeks of entitlement Doctor_J May 2016 #8
A reminder: Hillary was the first to come out to say that the people who kept our lights on Jitter65 May 2016 #9
'Hack' is right. Octafish May 2016 #11
So, when Sanders himself declares that HRC's wins in the South don't count mcar May 2016 #12
I didn't say HRC was a terrible awful person, nor was that the point of the OP JonLeibowitz May 2016 #16
seeing plenty of this.... amborin May 2016 #17
Bernie wins a state, and suddenly that's the most important state in the US. YouDig May 2016 #20
Have tears in my eyes. I remember those years from watching jwirr May 2016 #23
Hillary lost the whitest state in the nation, doesn't matter one bit Tarc May 2016 #24
The point is that these people are suffering, no matter their skin color JonLeibowitz May 2016 #25
A 20-something privileged Oberlin grad, living in D.C. Waiting For Everyman May 2016 #27
The Twitter response was actually even more revealing. JonLeibowitz May 2016 #28

Eko

(6,597 posts)
4. Or does Clinton winning
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:45 AM
May 2016

with the most votes of the state with the most desperate, poor people not count with you. W VA is bad, Mississippi is worse and Clinton won that by a landslide.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,538 posts)
10. The data would seem to support your assertion, Eko.
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:28 AM
May 2016

Out of the ten states with the highest rates of poverty, nine have already voted and Clinton has won seven of them:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_poverty_rate

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
15. I never denied that demographics may play a role.
Wed May 11, 2016, 09:39 AM
May 2016

I challenged the scary "white male" trope that Graves employs. The point is that Graves is a hack.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
6. Well....that was awkward. The first post of the thread kinda blew your point to bits.
Wed May 11, 2016, 04:38 AM
May 2016

Clinton won MS....greater poverty, but more ethnically diverse.

Bernie does well in racially homogenous states with white men. Nothing that happened in WV disproves that.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
19. the only demographic Sanders leads in is white males.
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:01 PM
May 2016

That's just a fact. How you choose to characterize that particular information is up to you.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
22. So you claim white people, in a poor, racially homogenous state, went for
Wed May 11, 2016, 05:25 PM
May 2016

Bernie. No t sure how that helps you.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
26. As I have written ...
Wed May 11, 2016, 06:23 PM
May 2016

I would say Sanders' W. VA win is more easily, and IMO, more accurately understood as ...

The same voters that preferred the white woman over the Black man (in 2008), prefer the white man over the white female (in 2016).

And, when you factor in trump ... they will prefer the "uber-AMERICAN" white male over the Jewish Socialist man AND the white woman.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
14. This place can be an excellent resource...
Wed May 11, 2016, 09:38 AM
May 2016

For people new to the process. It can also fill their heads with garbage.

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
18. Again, white women broke for Bernie. The lede is a monstrous lie.
Wed May 11, 2016, 09:45 AM
May 2016

I never denied that demographics didn't play a role. Certainly Bernie never really broke through with the AA community. That doesn't mean other races can't have legitimate reasons to vote the way they do. Reasons that deserve more attention from our leaders and columnists than "candidate X doesn't need these people, let's ignore all the reasons that may have affected how they voted and move on to the general"

 

Jitter65

(3,089 posts)
9. A reminder: Hillary was the first to come out to say that the people who kept our lights on
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:28 AM
May 2016

should not be forgotten. She honored them and their sacrifices early on and has been proponent for holding mine owners accountable. Her plan to address their issues was drafted in early 2015 an published in Nov of 2015. It was largely ignored by the media and the Sanders camp but her gaffe comments in explaining it were not ignored...they were pumped 24/7 and heralded by BS supporters as proof that Hillary doesn't care about the poor or struggling workers...but Bernie does. Never ending falsehoods about Hillary always win the day and voters predisposed to not liking her because they believe the false hype buy into it.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
11. 'Hack' is right.
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:54 AM
May 2016

Not only Hillary, the entire country needs West Virginia. The Kennedys understood and put into action plans to make life better for ALL Americans.

Your Honor, years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth. I said then, and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free.
-- Eugene V. Debs


mcar

(41,676 posts)
12. So, when Sanders himself declares that HRC's wins in the South don't count
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:06 AM
May 2016

that's a legitimate statement to make. But when some person says something unkind about one state, it's a terrible, awful thing that means that HRC is a terrible, awful person?

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
16. I didn't say HRC was a terrible awful person, nor was that the point of the OP
Wed May 11, 2016, 09:41 AM
May 2016

Nice try at a straw man though!

I suggest you re-read the OP

YouDig

(2,280 posts)
20. Bernie wins a state, and suddenly that's the most important state in the US.
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:05 PM
May 2016

Hillary wins a state, and it doesn't matter because it's too Southern/Northern/red/blue/whatever the excuse is.

Good news is, in the end all the delegates from all the states count, and Hillary has a lot more of them than Bernie.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
23. Have tears in my eyes. I remember those years from watching
Wed May 11, 2016, 05:59 PM
May 2016

the campaigns of those Democrats and more. I also benefited from all those programs that they are trying to get rid of now. And it is particularly heart breaking that it is all happening again.

What is wrong with the greedy people of this nation that they can set back and watch this happen when they could be doing something? But it is not just the greed - it is the elected officials of those states that ignore the problems.

The one hope I see is that the people of this southern state saw fit to reject the establishment and vote for Bernie. I do not know what needs to be done to fix this newest mess but I do not think that status quo is going to be it.

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
25. The point is that these people are suffering, no matter their skin color
Wed May 11, 2016, 06:13 PM
May 2016

Saying she "doesn't need them" is offensive, heartless, and cruel. Democratic politics is supposed to be inclusive.

Waiting For Everyman

(9,385 posts)
27. A 20-something privileged Oberlin grad, living in D.C.
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:58 PM
May 2016

The first job she lists on LinkedIn is in 2010:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/lucia-graves-9355a614

Here's her Twitter:
https://twitter.com/lucia_graves

She also writes for Glamour Magazine.


This is an over-promoted, overpaid nitwit who knows NOTHING about the real world. We have to be careful what we take as legitimate writing. A lot of it is just crap, mechanically spewed out by these fresh out of school know-nothings who are only interested in making connections for their next undeserved rung up the ladder. There is a more famous older writer by the same name, so they might be related.

She should be ashamed of herself, but clearly she isn't. For what it's worth, Twitter did a pretty good job of taking her to task for this article, which I was glad to see. Of course, she brushed it off as comments from "BernieBros".

JonLeibowitz

(6,282 posts)
28. The Twitter response was actually even more revealing.
Wed May 11, 2016, 08:09 PM
May 2016

She said that the "Bernie Bros" attacking her only proved her point about white male anger. Or something.

Shows she has NO idea. The people in West Virginia aren't on Twitter trolling Guardian columnists. They're just fucked. She is so out of touch.

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