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BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:12 PM May 2016

Why the recent Comey and Hayden pushback on Hillary's email claims?

This seems very significant. For some time Hillary and her surrogates have been minmizing the situation as nothing unusual or serious, just a "security inquiry". They've offered a fig leaf spin that no laws were "willfully" broken.

Now FBI director Comey has shot that down. This is a criminal investigation. The FBI doesn't do inquiries.

Even more significant, former NSA director Hayden has said in essence that Hillary has almost certainly committed crimes.

Both of these events are somewhat unusual. The timing is what interests me with two top people in the security area nearly simultaneously poking holes in the Clinton depiction of events.

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Why the recent Comey and Hayden pushback on Hillary's email claims? (Original Post) BillZBubb May 2016 OP
Kickin' for the truth! Faux pas May 2016 #1
Maybe when the agents gets the email investigation they will be able to move Thinkingabout May 2016 #2
Oh, that's brilliant! BillZBubb May 2016 #4
They are trying to stick their fingers mindwalker_i May 2016 #6
RW smears like the emails? Really. I can admit hef mistakes, did not deny the investigation Thinkingabout May 2016 #12
Hillary lied again. It is 840high May 2016 #26
LOL! kaleckim May 2016 #27
The FEC sent the letters, David Brock did not send the letters, David Brock did not Thinkingabout May 2016 #31
"it does not correct the campaign fund fraud which" kaleckim May 2016 #32
For your reading: Thinkingabout May 2016 #34
And this happens in most campaigns and the candidate has 60 days to rectify. TheBlackAdder May 2016 #42
Yes and then it happened a second time and they ask for an extension, Thinkingabout May 2016 #45
Honest question TimPlo May 2016 #44
Read post#34. Thinkingabout May 2016 #46
Hillary herself denied the investigation, called it a "security inquiry". FBI shot that shit down Autumn May 2016 #47
Big difference between sternly written letters and felony charges, buddy. leveymg May 2016 #53
An individual can not donate more than $2700 to a campaign fund, Sanders is quiet aware of this. Thinkingabout May 2016 #55
Ya, I know. I used to man a phone at DNC making those calls. leveymg May 2016 #56
Then what is the problem, some donors gave $2700 more than one time, now Thinkingabout May 2016 #57
Unlike HRC, Bernie doesn have a criminal problem. leveymg May 2016 #58
Oh, really, guess thec FEC rules does not apply to him. Thinkingabout May 2016 #60
Sure, the 0.01% of lagging refunds. They'll get right on that. lagomorph777 May 2016 #20
This happens with multitudes of small donors. dchill May 2016 #51
President Obama has had a Scandal-Free Administration... NewImproved Deal May 2016 #3
Depends on what your definition of "Honest" is. ChairmanAgnostic May 2016 #14
Nice! frylock May 2016 #40
Not only that it was the question asked which caused Mills to leave the room. Skwmom May 2016 #5
To completely freak her out? B2G May 2016 #7
Yep, Ms. Abedin could be the key player. BillZBubb May 2016 #18
I thought they ALL had the same lawyer. Link? Skwmom May 2016 #64
And Pagliano. He's also got his own lawyer and immunity. riderinthestorm May 2016 #21
It was Mills that got up and left the room. Skwmom May 2016 #62
Yes, that's who I was referring to. nt B2G May 2016 #63
big purpose grasswire May 2016 #8
They only ask questions they already know the answers to. lagomorph777 May 2016 #22
Hayden is a moron and right wing hack. DURHAM D May 2016 #9
There we go! It's the old right wing conspiracy! BillZBubb May 2016 #15
If his mouth is moving he is showing his ass. DURHAM D May 2016 #29
Comey seems like a surprisingly straight shooter. Hayden's views are worthless RufusTFirefly May 2016 #10
Yeah, Hayden isn't exactly the best witness to call. BillZBubb May 2016 #17
I agree, I think it is absolutely stupid to ignore everything someone says just because pdsimdars May 2016 #35
I think these two interviews coming so close to each other Merryland May 2016 #37
You dare to hope that we still have some fair justice? I hope so too. pdsimdars May 2016 #49
There we have it, folks 6chars May 2016 #52
I wonder if Hillary went in for questioning. Would we even know when that happens/happened? riderinthestorm May 2016 #11
That's what I think too. BillZBubb May 2016 #16
Possibly a warning... Bob41213 May 2016 #13
Or, "Go ahead, make my day." pdsimdars May 2016 #36
That was my thought. Stop the spinning until the investigation jwirr May 2016 #43
Google comey narrowed to the last two months... He's done lots of little press conferences. 4139 May 2016 #19
On this issue? nadinbrzezinski May 2016 #23
Comey answered a couple of questions on their issue, that's it! He also talked about isis and 4139 May 2016 #24
Apparently you are not familiar with how nadinbrzezinski May 2016 #30
k&r 840high May 2016 #25
Sid Blumenthal was everywhere on MSM calling it a "Security Review" KoKo May 2016 #28
I am just trying to surmise SheenaR May 2016 #33
Obama can't be happy about this. He is in a very bad spot. BillZBubb May 2016 #38
DOJ already said a referral (to them for prosecution) is being prepared abt her use of the server. JudyM May 2016 #54
CIA/NSA types absolutely detest leaks and people who promote them HereSince1628 May 2016 #39
It must infuriate the FBI to have the investigatees proclaiming their innocence publicly amborin May 2016 #41
I'm sure they are used to that. BillZBubb May 2016 #50
when you start citing Hayden to make your case bigtree May 2016 #48
I think we are seeing a new internal war between the CIA and the Neo-Cons... Peace Patriot May 2016 #59
Comey likely already answered..."Pressure"... Barack_America May 2016 #61

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
2. Maybe when the agents gets the email investigation they will be able to move
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:15 PM
May 2016

On and investigate Sanders and his campaign funding violations.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
4. Oh, that's brilliant!
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:21 PM
May 2016

You Hillary fans can never address her mistakes, you simply deflect to some bullshit side issue, rationalize it away, or call it a right wing smear. But, keep your head in the sand, I'm sure it's cool under there.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
12. RW smears like the emails? Really. I can admit hef mistakes, did not deny the investigation
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:40 PM
May 2016

By the FBI. Now can you admit the campaign find raising problems Sanders is having? This is the second letter sent by the FEC, he wants to postpone his response until later, we need the truth now.

kaleckim

(651 posts)
27. LOL!
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:01 PM
May 2016

David Brock, an immoral rat and a Clinton campaign surrogate, is the person behind the group that filed the damn complaint! You people have no shame.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
31. The FEC sent the letters, David Brock did not send the letters, David Brock did not
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:23 PM
May 2016

Accept the donations. You can call David Brock all the names you, it does not correct the campaign fund fraud which has happened in Sanders campaign.

kaleckim

(651 posts)
32. "it does not correct the campaign fund fraud which"
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:28 PM
May 2016

Do you lie first thing in the morning? He hasn't be shown to commit campaign fraud, and if you cared about stuff like that you certainly wouldn't be backing the corrupt candidate you support. Under actual FBI investigation, has gotten more money from Wall Street than all the other candidates combined this election cycle, largest donors are banks over her career, her foundation is swamp, she's used state parties to get around campaign finance laws, etc.

Brock is the person behind the filing and he is a damn rat. Hasn't progressed as a human being from the person that attacked and slimmed Anita Hill.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
34. For your reading:
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:55 PM
May 2016
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/02/26/bernie-sanders-campaign-contributions/80999298/


http://m.dailykos.com/story/2016/05/11/1525428/-FEC-releases-damning-639-pages-of-violations-by-Bernie-Sanders-campaign


Claiming Brock is responsible, the campaign has agreed to pay back money, guess the $27 average donation only happened in certain cases. Campaign finance is one of Sanders issues, he is not following the current rules and he wants more reform.


Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
45. Yes and then it happened a second time and they ask for an extension,
Thu May 12, 2016, 07:12 PM
May 2016

If campaign reform is important then follow the current rules.

 

TimPlo

(443 posts)
44. Honest question
Thu May 12, 2016, 06:52 PM
May 2016

Do you think spreading lies about Sanders when most of his supporters have looked this up and saw that it is common issue due to people over donating for what ever reason. the campaign has already addressed issues like this over past several months and sent the refunds back. It happens in every campaign to some degree. With Sanders not taking money from a few wealthy people that are trying to bribe him but from 1000000 of people the have this issue more each month. So do think your lies are going to influence someone or do you just like to lie about stuff?

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
46. Read post#34.
Thu May 12, 2016, 07:15 PM
May 2016

I am not spreading lies about Sanders, I have looked at the list sent to the campaign. BTW, the campaign has ask for an extension on the second letter.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
53. Big difference between sternly written letters and felony charges, buddy.
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:40 PM
May 2016

I think you guys are reaching the end of the rope and have near zero credibility at this point.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
55. An individual can not donate more than $2700 to a campaign fund, Sanders is quiet aware of this.
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:46 PM
May 2016

One of his core issues campaign finance, the FEC has sent two letters, this is appearing to be fraud in for the fact it occurred after the first letter was sent.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
56. Ya, I know. I used to man a phone at DNC making those calls.
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:52 PM
May 2016

Sometimes donors went over their limit and the money had to be returned. Two letters to a candidate does not indicate anything approaching fraud. But you can try to roll with that meme before the FBI report on Hillary if you want.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
57. Then what is the problem, some donors gave $2700 more than one time, now
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:55 PM
May 2016

Sanders wants more time to answer the FEC.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
58. Unlike HRC, Bernie doesn have a criminal problem.
Thu May 12, 2016, 09:02 PM
May 2016

But, please , seize on the meme. Maybe, you'll confuse a few California voters. A few.

dchill

(38,474 posts)
51. This happens with multitudes of small donors.
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:08 PM
May 2016

And the violations are the responsibility of the donors, not the campaign. The moneys will be returned, and no one will face charges.

But you knew that, right?

 

NewImproved Deal

(534 posts)
3. President Obama has had a Scandal-Free Administration...
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:17 PM
May 2016

Why would he want Clinton Sleaze tainting his legacy? Not even the Former First Lady is above the Law...

[link:|

Skwmom

(12,685 posts)
5. Not only that it was the question asked which caused Mills to leave the room.
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:24 PM
May 2016

Last edited Fri May 13, 2016, 12:44 PM - Edit history (1)

He knew she wasn't going to answer so what was the purpose in asking the question?

 

B2G

(9,766 posts)
7. To completely freak her out?
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:29 PM
May 2016

Seems to have worked.

Huma is the real wildcard here. She's the only aid who got her own lawyer. Smart move, IMO. All of the rest are essentially being represented by someone who only has Hillary's interests at heart, not theirs.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
18. Yep, Ms. Abedin could be the key player.
Thu May 12, 2016, 03:04 PM
May 2016

She knows all the State Department details and the Clinton Foundation details and the details of where they intersected. Her lawyer will not advise her to lie to protect Hillary.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
21. And Pagliano. He's also got his own lawyer and immunity.
Thu May 12, 2016, 03:23 PM
May 2016

I think the fact that all of his emails are erased says a lot about his guilt and what he knows.

Between Abedin and Pagliano, I sense there'd be some real cause for alarm.

grasswire

(50,130 posts)
8. big purpose
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:30 PM
May 2016

He wanted to see how strongly she would react. Like a doctor poking your stomach to see where it hurts.

The fact that she left the room means (as leveymg has written here) that this was a very vulnerable area of risk for her.

It was a big tell.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
22. They only ask questions they already know the answers to.
Thu May 12, 2016, 03:23 PM
May 2016

And why would anybody think the FBI will actually agree to put some questions "off limits?"

DURHAM D

(32,609 posts)
9. Hayden is a moron and right wing hack.
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:31 PM
May 2016

Using that idiot to support your theory is embarrassing.

Put another way, it says a lot more about you than it does about Hillary.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
15. There we go! It's the old right wing conspiracy!
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:49 PM
May 2016

The FBI is investigating Hillary, not me. That says a lot more about Hillary than you will ever admit.

Hayden was the director of NSA. He probably knows the security laws inside and out. I understand how an ad hominem attack might make you feel better.

RufusTFirefly

(8,812 posts)
10. Comey seems like a surprisingly straight shooter. Hayden's views are worthless
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:35 PM
May 2016
https://m.


Anyone who repeatedly denies the presence of the phrase "probable cause" in the Fourth Amendment and at the same time has the audacity to brag about his knowledge of the Constitution has zero credibility in my book. He's either stupid, spineless, or deeply deceitful.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
17. Yeah, Hayden isn't exactly the best witness to call.
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:57 PM
May 2016

But I would bet he knows what constitutes a breach of security laws--he was always looking for a way to get around them.

Anyone heading a spy agency is deceitful by definition.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
35. I agree, I think it is absolutely stupid to ignore everything someone says just because
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:56 PM
May 2016

they said something stupid in the past. In that case, no one should be listened to. Obama told labor he would not negotiate any new trade deals without them being present at the table. Also promised them card check. After the election he never did one thing in that direction. But do I listen to him and his explanation of things? Yes, but I also take it with a grain of salt.
Listening to what Hayden said, it sounds correct to me and right in line with what I have heard other high ranking officials say.

Merryland

(1,134 posts)
37. I think these two interviews coming so close to each other
Thu May 12, 2016, 05:08 PM
May 2016

means indictment is just around the corner...

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
11. I wonder if Hillary went in for questioning. Would we even know when that happens/happened?
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:36 PM
May 2016

She lied @ her aides having even been contacted by the FBI, exposed on that lie within 48 hours iirc.

We certainly didn't know her aides had already been questioned for weeks already. Some several times.

How do we know Hillary hasn't already been questioned and the pushback isn't in response to her continuing to try to re-frame this as just a "security inquiry"? Are they getting irritated at her deliberate efforts to scoff at their work? Because I got the impression Comey in particular was purposefully deliberate in making that point.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
16. That's what I think too.
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:52 PM
May 2016

The security people are not happy having their work characterized as inconsequential. Maybe the two statements are a coincidence, but they may also be a tremor before the earthquake.

Comey went out of his way to say this was a serious investigation when he didn't really have to.

Bob41213

(491 posts)
13. Possibly a warning...
Thu May 12, 2016, 02:42 PM
May 2016

You know, like "Hey, if you guys want to nominate someone under a FBI investigation, be my guest."

4139

(1,893 posts)
19. Google comey narrowed to the last two months... He's done lots of little press conferences.
Thu May 12, 2016, 03:05 PM
May 2016

I would read too much into it.

4139

(1,893 posts)
24. Comey answered a couple of questions on their issue, that's it! He also talked about isis and
Thu May 12, 2016, 03:47 PM
May 2016

iPhones.

The presser was not on 'this issue'... Apparently he does the little pressers
All the time.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
30. Apparently you are not familiar with how
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:09 PM
May 2016

Government works. Departments do pressers all the time. When an issue like this one has to be batted down due to mischaracterization, that is actually important. Like a 6 in a 10 scale. DOJ does hate to adress high profile ongoing investigations. Take a guess if this one is a high profile one?

KoKo

(84,711 posts)
28. Sid Blumenthal was everywhere on MSM calling it a "Security Review"
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:02 PM
May 2016

and, Comey wanted to make sure he "corrected it" and on the CNBC interview Sid, for the first time, said "Investigation."

Michael Haydon is another issue.

SheenaR

(2,052 posts)
33. I am just trying to surmise
Thu May 12, 2016, 04:32 PM
May 2016

But Obama HAS to be working behind the scenes to get resolution on this (positive or negative). If it's post-convention and she, as our nominee, is in trouble, it's his legacy that gets halted fast.

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
38. Obama can't be happy about this. He is in a very bad spot.
Thu May 12, 2016, 05:21 PM
May 2016

As usual, other people are the ones who get caught up in the Clinton schemes.

She's already tarnished his legacy somewhat just for being stupid enough to go with a private server which led to an FBI investigation. It's the typical Clintonian hide everything, deny everything approach. They may not be guilty but their every move screams "I am a crook".

JudyM

(29,233 posts)
54. DOJ already said a referral (to them for prosecution) is being prepared abt her use of the server.
Thu May 12, 2016, 08:45 PM
May 2016

That says it all, right there. That means FBI believes they have ample evidence for prosecution. Only question is whether the AG or POTUS will put on the brakes.

HereSince1628

(36,063 posts)
39. CIA/NSA types absolutely detest leaks and people who promote them
Thu May 12, 2016, 05:25 PM
May 2016

According to recent newspaper accounts that HRC was encouraging Blumenthal to keep working contacts to get leaks from the CIA.

IMO, Hayden is just making sure people are aware that -people- are aware.

bigtree

(85,991 posts)
48. when you start citing Hayden to make your case
Thu May 12, 2016, 07:27 PM
May 2016

...it's clear that you have absolutely zero idea who you're attacking and why.

Not much of a progressive, are you, taking Hayden at his word?

Peace Patriot

(24,010 posts)
59. I think we are seeing a new internal war between the CIA and the Neo-Cons...
Thu May 12, 2016, 09:29 PM
May 2016

...like the one that occurred circa 2003 thru 2006, over Cheney-Rumsfeld outing of the CIA's worldwide WMD counter-proliferation network, headed by Valerie Plame. A second issue was likely CIA opposition to the invasion of Iraq (or at least to the manufactured WMD issue). A third was likely Cheney-Rumsfeld's intention to nuke Iran. This was very talked about in 2006, and it's my opinion that Bush Sr. intervened with his "Iraq Study Group" (spring '06)--of which Leon Panetta, future CIA Director and then Pentagon Chief under Obama, was a member--to save Jr.'s administration and maybe Jr's ass, from CIA retaliation, and to stop Cheney-Rumsfeld's armageddonish interference in the flow of Iranian oil to China.

Michael Hayden doesn't make idle chitcat about FBI investigations. He was NSA Director '99 to '05 and CIA Director '06 to '09 (after which Panetta took over). Hayden's too deep. He wouldn't fool around with the things he said in the Tech Crunch interview. He was on a mission. His content was the seriousness of what Clinton did. And he said it would be absurd to presume that the Chinese and other foreign governments didn't get into her private server.

His mission may have been to pressure the FBI to threaten Clinton with an indictment recommendation, in order to elicit rock-solid guarantees from her of no private servers in the White House and someone to watch over her (and her Neo-Con pals, and maybe Bill)--like I think Leon Panetta was doing, of Bill, back in the day. Panetta was Bill's chief of staff. I think Panetta was CIA even then, which is why CIA employees welcomed him with open arms and champagne corks popping when he returned as CIA Director in '09, according to reports (that, and relief that Cheney-Rumsfeld were gone).

Or, Hayden's mission may have been to get the word out that Hillary is done. They don't want her as president. And something's holding things up at the FBI. That could be AG Loretta Lynch (a Clinton supporter), the one who would act on an FBI recommendation of indictment, who may be trying to protect Clinton.

I favor the former, that the CIA/NSA want something from Clinton. And what they may want--besides guarantees about sensitive information and maybe about rogue operations (like Blumenthal's in Libya)--goes back to those events in 2006. They fear the Neo-Con influence on Clinton--and they do have reason to. She has Robert Kagan (chief of "The Project for a New American Century"--Cheney-Rumsfeld's blueprint for world domination) as an advisor.

The Clinton supporters in this thread who poo-poo Michael Hayden's remarks (which occurred yesterday) are fools or simply blind partisans. I don't like the man either. I don't like the CIA. I don't like the NSA. I don't like the FBI. But that doesn't mean that I don't pay attention to what they're up to, and try, as well as I can, as an ordinary citizen, to understand what's going on with our government. It's our duty, to my mind. Further, naive Clinton supporters, who are not paid bots, are going to feel crushed if this ton of bricks comes down on their candidate.

It probably won't--because the rule now is "we need to look forward not backward" on the crimes of the rich and the powerful. Clinton is now a player among the rich and the powerful. She's a made woman. Half a billion dollars from Goldman Sachs, et al, into her pocket, in 2 years time. That's some salary. However, if she is caught between more powerful forces--as I've suggested, CIA vs Neo-Cons--she may go down. There is still time for them to do it and not risk President Trump (even more unpredictable), since Bernie Sanders is still viable, is still winning primaries, refuses to quit and demolishes Trump in all polls.

It's hard to believe that any of the powers-behind-the-throne in Washington DC would want Sanders, but, then, he's so honest, why wouldn't they? He would be very straightforward with them. They would know exactly where they stand. Even empirebots are human beings. Even they might find honesty refreshing. Even they--or some of them--might be disgusted by the corruption all around them.

Barack_America

(28,876 posts)
61. Comey likely already answered..."Pressure"...
Thu May 12, 2016, 11:15 PM
May 2016

...to wrap it up and make it go away.

Doesn't sound like he's interested in complying.

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