2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumYou think Nevada was ugly? Just wait!
A few years ago, I posted a piece here stating that Revolution was coming to this country in my lifetime. I am up in age. I said that it might be peaceful, or it might be violent, but that it was coming.
People of all political stripes are pissed. They are sick and tired of being stepped on by those we keep electing to office who promise to make things better, but don't.
It is clear that Roberta Lange used voice votes to her advantage in Nevada to ensure that she got her way. She did not do the right thing by refusing to have a standing division. The delegates rightly saw what she was attempting to do, and they were angry that the deck was stacked against them.
DWS is doing the same thing with committee makeup at the DNC later this year. She has appointed three of Bernie's suggestions to a supermajority of Hillary's. She has stacked the rules committee.
Bernie is going to take this campaign to the convention. And if DWS doesn't decide that Bernie supporters get a proportional representation on committees and doesn't chair that meeting fairly, then what you saw in Nevada will look like a love fest compared to what will happen in Philly.
Revolution is coming. One way or the other. The oligarchs better take note.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Isn't a revolution, it's mental illness.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)winter is coming
(11,785 posts)It's certainly ugly, but I'm not sure there's enough "threat" there to actually justify any legal action.
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)The calculated use of violence (or threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimidation or coercion or instilling fear
Maru Kitteh
(28,340 posts)"you should be hung in a public execution" and "I hope you burn" is anything but a THREAT. I'm sure you would be just fine if this were called in to Jane Sanders on her personal phone and left on her voicemail right? No you wouldn't. You would acknowledge it as the criminal act that it is.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)but probably doesn't rise to the level of being a criminal act.
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)Why does bush come to mind
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)That kind of thing is fine with you?
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)That Voice mail is as big a deal as you can Make It .
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)But I'm certainly not okay with that voicemail, and you should be either.
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)The Voice mail is a big as Deal as YOU can make it.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)So... Your point is flawed.
Now do you agree that it's disgusting and it shouldn't have happened. Someone took it too far.
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)Yes people take things too far, later they say they Made a mistake
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017372344
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)....and get it done IMMEDIATELY. Now.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)The calculated use of violence (or threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimidation or coercion or instilling fear
DebDoo
(319 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Ergo it is a federal case. Under the US code, there is something called terroristic threats California uses a different name for the exact same offense.
SheenaR
(2,052 posts)- Paul Revere
- John Brown
- Susan B Anthony
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)Definition is not mine but from a dictionary
SheenaR
(2,052 posts)so I guess they were terrorists by both you and your dictionary
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)uponit7771
(90,335 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)It's mental illness.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)And I don't see an actionable threat in "people like you should be hung in a public execution". It's an ugly sentiment, to be sure, but we'll see whether law enforcement considers it an actual death threat.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Okay, you go with that.
adigal
(7,581 posts)It could be a Trump supporter. It could be a Hillary supporter trying to discredit Bernie. Lots of possibilities.
puffy socks
(1,473 posts)All the nasty phone calls come from Trump supporters what a bunch of bull
Bernie's little revolution will burn up just as quickly as his flash in the pan campaign has. It'll don't know where any revolutionaries will end up. Probably just a lot of fines and court , maybe a little jail time, That's about it ...but the government could use that money to help some other people who need it !
George II
(67,782 posts)winter is coming
(11,785 posts)basselope
(2,565 posts)The person called, made a threat, said he hoped she burned for this and then left a "you can return my call at".
Hmm, smells funny.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)basselope
(2,565 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Faked or not.
basselope
(2,565 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)I note that you appear to be in the "okay" with threats of violence.
See you around DU.
basselope
(2,565 posts)We know someone called and said this. However, it is only an actual threat if the person being threatened doesn't know it is a fake call.
Since this person left their phone number, obviously they will be arrested.
I await the arrest record.
DebDoo
(319 posts)basselope
(2,565 posts)Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Response to Agschmid (Reply #1)
Post removed
cali
(114,904 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)stirring the pot. And gullible Hillary supporters are falling for it.
riversedge
(70,205 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Covering courts I will wait for the police report. That phone was from San Diego.
Chew on that one for a second. And yes, felonies were committed. But I am willing to bet it was not somebody who attended the convention.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Threats of violence are not okay, coming from anyone.
TwilightZone
(25,471 posts)I wouldn't worry about it.
Funny how they're worried about posting the phone number of a neanderthal, but they have no trouble personally posting Lange's contact information.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Amirite
For different reasons by the way
TwilightZone
(25,471 posts)My point was that that ship already sailed.
Since you agree that neither is acceptable, perhaps you should say something about it in the 500 threads about Lange posted by your compatriots. A lot of them clearly have no problem with it. Some are using it in their sig lines.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)But I did tell a poster already to take it down. So go with that ok
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)I just said that having done some of the investigative stuff I am used to doing, and really don't have an interest of going all the way...I have the feeling this was not anybody tied to the campaign, or for that matter the NV convention. If there is a police report...that wicket matters and Ralston should have mentioned if one exists or not...in two years...courts can take that long...we will learn the truth.
And as usual...in two years, none here will care. I am almost willing to bet this particular case won't have reporters on it either, like on 99.9 percent of cases...trust me, I am low balling the number.
zappaman
(20,606 posts)You're an investigative reporter and the number is in San Diego!!!
What are you waiting for???
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Rockyj
(538 posts)DNC!
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Sheepshank
(12,504 posts)sounds like blackmail and a threat.
Not going to give that any legitimacy. Adult trantrums are pathetic.
BeyondGeography
(39,371 posts)Should be entertaining.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)Response to rateyes (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)MineralMan
(146,288 posts)Thanks for the scary warning....
Txbluedog
(1,128 posts)Then we will see how much support he actually has
frylock
(34,825 posts)Please.
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)Showed up yesterday trolling today. . .
frylock
(34,825 posts)Always signing up in the middle of the month. ALWAYS!
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)When the ultimate answer to all inquiries is a conspiracy theory.
Seems rather Godwin to me.
frylock
(34,825 posts)has a paid army of internet trolls that the board is inundated with n00bies all parroting the same talking points.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)Most of those who aren't for real can be ignored, it's what most of us learn in Internet 101.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Kinda hard to ignore when they post as prolifically as they have been. The board is fucking lousy with their nonsense.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)Won't be any fun until it's 99.99%?
frylock
(34,825 posts)Dem2
(8,168 posts)I trash most posts like that without reading them.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Good day to you, sir or madam.
Dem2
(8,168 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)and the only one documented and called out for having to PAY astroturf . . . . Hillary.
You kind of got that ass backwards. . . but that's what I expected.
auntpurl
(4,311 posts)This is a small minority of disaffected thugs who will have absolutely no influence on the outcome of the primary or GE.
Most normal voters are getting on with their lives. They're not even aware of your revolution, and they wouldn't be the least bit interested in it if they were.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)dana_b
(11,546 posts)and if that's what normal mean, then I guess I'd rather be informed and awake.
I think that you and I are definitely on different paths so I will wish you the best in life and say adieu.
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)auntpurl
(4,311 posts)My response was directly in response to the OP's assertion that there would be more violence a la Nevada. He was saying "you ain't seen nothing yet" like Philly is going to be a riot. That was what I was talking about re: revolution, not the larger Sanders campaign. Sorry for not being clear.
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)kstewart33
(6,551 posts)It will most likely spell the demise of Bernie's movement.
As a Hillary supporter, I support Bernie's movement. I want him to turn his focus to organizing the movement into a force that actually gets meaningful results. Like winning races at the local, state and federal level.
However, repeating Nevada in Philadelphia isn't the way to go about it.
Bernie's supporters did themselves no good in Nevada. It would be a shame if it happens again in Philly.
djean111
(14,255 posts)and what comes of that affects everybody's fucking LIFE. This is not a football game on TV. This is our lives, and they believe they should be able to decide for everyone. From their comfortable positions. Ain't gonna fly this time, I think. Too many people aware of how the corruption works.
stillwaiting
(3,795 posts)HumanityExperiment
(1,442 posts)it is curious the amount of posts from HRC supporters that avoid the reality of the situation at hand
it's not just in our party, it's all over this nation, exhibit one... Trump is the GOP nominee, example two, Philippine President-Elect Rodrigo Duterte
It's happening worldwide
The anti-establishment movement is real, we've come full circle, '68 convention was a lesson soon forgotten by party establishment folks.. and here we are in '16....
NV convention is just a glimpse, without the MSM 'reporting' it won't have the same impact like a national convention will have, SDs will HAVE to come into play to push either candidate over the line to earn nomination and that process... will be highly televised, reported on and scrutinized
Just watch the growing number of posts from establishment types here in DU trying to counter this reality.. it will be fun to watch!
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)HumanityExperiment
(1,442 posts)What part of DEM party establishment escaped your attention?
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)HumanityExperiment
(1,442 posts)Did i state that?... nope, point is about party establishment and the national convention
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)Bernie has been part of the government for 30 years what do you mean by not establishment
What part of DEM party establishment escaped your attention?
"
HumanityExperiment
(1,442 posts)I posted...
'The anti-establishment movement is real, we've come full circle, '68 convention was a lesson soon forgotten by party establishment folks.. and here we are in '16....
NV convention is just a glimpse, without the MSM 'reporting' it won't have the same impact like a national convention will have, SDs will HAVE to come into play to push either candidate over the line to earn nomination and that process... will be highly televised, reported on and scrutinized '
Ohioblue22
(1,430 posts)HumanityExperiment
(1,442 posts)Yes, let's discuss the 'labels' behind each candidate shall we, this should be fun...
many folks that believe current DEM leadership aren't backing ideology that defines DEM party are backing Bernie, just to clarify your question and answer in same response...
NV convention is example.... national convention will have a much larger, broader audience and focused light on it, so... the OP and post, getting back to that point and my post linking that NV convention to what I foresee with national convention will have to deal with as it pertains to SDs should be interesting as SDs are party establishment
Do you disagree that SDs are party establishment?
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)depend on the system in place, it will be a fight. Hopefully only political.
However, it is not a political issue. It is a social/cultural/financial Class Division. An old phrase, the Haves and the Have Nots. And it is egregiously fixed. Anyone with age in the double digits knows that.
And we know HRC doesn't plan to do much other than mouth some compromising statements...and will revert to her roots if and when she becomes president. She owes too many people and too many people owe her/them. That is not a secret.
The Clinton Machine has been going for decades. You don't hear about the Sanders Machine. People are just finding out who he is...and many of the Have Nots relate with and like his intent.
It's not about what can you do for me tomorrow, (the unicorns and ponies put down meme) at this stage in the game for us of Boomer age, it's what can you do for my children and grandchildren over time...given the proper focus.
The Wheel of Fortune turns slower as it approaches the apex, then falls faster, which may an appropriate analogy.
Another saying is that the longer someone is held down, the more power they must bring to be let go. Women's Rights, Black Rights, LGBT Rights, all divided over a social purpose.
This one is money...pure and simple. It crosses most of the old boundaries. It also has to go.
ETA: It was surely no Kent State.
dreamnightwind
(4,775 posts)And I hope that they WILL take notice.
I don't see any actual revolution coming, but I do see a major realignment in the works, and a new populist force emerging. The two corporate parties can head this off easily enough, if they want to. Right now, they're still in "the beatings will continue until morale improves" mentality, which is more gas on the fire.
This country's politics, at this point, is total kabuki. The illusion is becoming more apparent to more people. Choosing Thing One or Thing Two that come out of the corporate political pipeline is not bringing about any of the major changes we need, and it has to happen, there's literally no time to wait, climate tipping points are here.
I'll say it again, climate tipping points are here.
Let's move, people, we can't sit back and watch our future be denied by greedy corporate impostors. Passivity is recorded as a vote for consent.
If the Democratic Party won't be our ally in this, if it won't be the vehicle for this change, we will find another way.
99Forever
(14,524 posts)Listen to us or be prepared for what comes next. We will NOT be ignored.
"Freedom is just another word for nothin' left to lose."
Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)necessary to threaten. Most of your so called revolution is made up of college kids that Sanders offered trillions to. When reality hits home, they'll just play out their anger in their violent video games. That's today's revolutionary. All talk and little guts. Please......
Grassy Knoll
(10,118 posts)rateyes
(17,438 posts)there will be chaos. Pandora's box will be opened.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)BootinUp
(47,144 posts)and righteousness, I prefer the democratic process over chaos. And I never said I don't understand the frustration. I do actually.
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)BootinUp
(47,144 posts)pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)It fits the comments all too often. . . . and is so appropriate. Along with the huge dose of smug.
.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)Hope my counterparts in the media remember the running shoes, and the party flavors.
We are seeing this build up
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)Tone deaf.
.
hollowdweller
(4,229 posts)senz
(11,945 posts)eastwestdem
(1,220 posts)Violence can only come about from strong emotion, and the emotion that is most frequently relayed is frustration that they cannot have all of the things they see available to others in society. This really reminds me of the Tea Party-ers...lashing out at "them" because of personal failings. Sure, the Sanders folks have a different set of beliefs (hopefully), but their movements look very similar.
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)I would hazard a guess that entitlement would have to be born out of at least a 'decent economy?' That blows against the wind if they examined it with thought.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)You state:
[font color=red]"the emotion that is most frequently relayed is frustration that they cannot have all of the things they see available to others in society. This really reminds me of the Tea Party-ers...lashing out at "them" because of personal failings."[/font]
I reject your premise.
You are blaming the victims.
Most take a look around them and see a grossly unfair system that is getting WORSE with each passing day. We now have a generation whose parents can no longer promise their children that if you stay in school and work hard, you can do better than me.
Here is some documentation of this growing unfairness that is the source of anger and frustration:
CHARTS: The Amazing Wealth Surge For The Top 0.1 Percent
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/the-amazing-wealth-surge-for-the-top-0-1-percent
Korean Free Trade Deal devastating for US Workers
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/larry-cohen/koreaus-free-trade-agreem_b_4965492.html
Meet the TPP: Crony capitalism on a global scale
https://represent.us/action/tpp/
Study: "Trade" Deal Would Mean a Pay Cut for 90% of U.S. Workers
http://citizen.typepad.com/eyesontrade/2013/09/the-verdict-is-in-the-trans-pacific-partnership-tpp-a-sweeping-free-trade-deal-under-negotiation-with-11-pacific-rim-coun.html
Retirement: A third have less than $1,000 put away
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2014/03/18/retirement-confidence-survey-savings/6432241/
65 percent of working families are living from paycheck to paycheck.
http://billmoyers.com/2014/01/10/why-conservatives-old-divide-and-conquer-strategy-%E2%80%94-setting-working-class-against-the-poor-%E2%80%94-is-backfiring/
"Obama Admins TPP Trade Officials Received Hefty Bonuses From Big Banks"
http://billmoyers.com/2014/02/20/obama-admin%E2%80%99s-tpp-trade-officials-received-hefty-bonuses-from-big-banks/
95 percent of the economys gains have gone to the top 1 percent
http://billmoyers.com/2014/01/10/why-conservatives-old-divide-and-conquer-strategy-%E2%80%94-setting-working-class-against-the-poor-%E2%80%94-is-backfiring/
Billionaire wealth doubles since financial crisis
http://www.upi.com/blog/2013/11/12/Billionaire-wealth-doubles-since-financial-crisis/5011384268135/?spt=hts&or=12
The Top .01 Percent Reach New Heights
http://www.demos.org/blog/9/13/13/top-01-percent-reach-new-heights
Rates of unemployment for families earning less than $20,000 - have topped 21 percent
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_JOBS_GAP_RICH_AND_POOR?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-09-16-08-11-23
Obama Appoints Bain Capital Consultant Jeff Ziets to Top Post
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023662209
Obama appoints industry insider to head the FCC
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024521140
Obama selects former Monsanto lobbyist to be his TPP chief agriculture negotiator
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023662210
The Totally Unfair And Bitterly Uneven 'Recovery,' In 12 Charts HuffPo
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023662029
Larry Summers Gets 'Full-Throated Defense' From Obama In Capitol Hill Meeting
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014553343#post1
Wall Street will get away with massive wave of criminality of 2008 - Statute of Limitations
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/business-economy-financial-crisis/untouchables/supreme-court-ruling-a-blow-for-future-financial-crisis-cases/
Income gap widest ever: 95 Percent of Recovery Income Gains Have Gone to the Top 1 Percent
http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/09/10/one_percent_recovery_95_percent_of_gains_have_gone_to_the_top_one_percent.html
Older Workers:.Set Back by Recession, and Shut Out of Rebound
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/27/booming/for-laid-off-older-workers-age-bias-is-pervasive.html?smid=tw-share&_r=3&
40% Of Americans Now Make Less Than 1968 Minimum Wage
http://seeingtheforest.com/40-of-americans-now-make-less-than-1968-minimum-wage/
Right now, forty percent of Americans make less than the minimum wage from 1968.
http://pac.petitions.moveon.org/sign/raise-the-minimum-wage-19/?source=search
Daily CEO Pay Now Exceeds the Average Worker's Annual Salary
http://thecontributor.com/daily-ceo-pay-now-exceeds-us-workers-annual-salary
76% of Americans are living paycheck-to-paycheck
http://money.cnn.com/2013/06/24/pf/emergency-savings/index.html
New Rule (Passed by Congress and signed by President Obama) signals Kiss of Death for Pensions
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100694955
Corporate Profits Have Grown By 171 Percent Under Obama -- Highest Rate Since 1900
http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/corporate-profits-have-grown-171-percent-under-obama-highest-rate-1900
Wealthy win lion's share of major tax breaks
http://www.boston.com/business/news/2013/05/29/wealthy-win-lion-share-major-tax-breaks/Ua0UyYle21EUXub7g1suCI/story.html
Wealth gap widens as labor's share of income falls
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/wealth-gap-widens-labors-share-income-falls-1B6097385
As the Economy Recovers, the Wealth Gap Widens
http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/rick-newman/2013/03/11/as-the-economy-recovers-the-wealth-gap-widens
Corporate Profits Hit Record High While Worker Wages Hit Record Low
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/12/03/1270541/corporate-profits-wages-record/?mobile=nc
THIS ^ does NOT happen by accident.
Anyone who Works for a Living, looks at the above, and does NOT feel righteous anger is lacking an essential component of humanity.
Response to rateyes (Original post)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
Katashi_itto
(10,175 posts)Waiting For Everyman
(9,385 posts)know when we're seeing it again. "You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows".
rateyes
(17,438 posts)Scuba
(53,475 posts)Response to rateyes (Original post)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)in their plan to paint Bernie Delegates as disruptors in preparation of the National Convention coming up.
farleftlib
(2,125 posts)All this pearl clutching by DWS and the rest of the HRC machine is about creating a
disturbance to deflect from the fact that the nomination was won by egregious cheating
and take legitimacy away from the opposition to the coup.
Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)There will be no revolution. Bank on it.
beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)Their ignorance and then incite discourse....if sanders is nothing more than an angry old socialist hellbent on destroying America and his supporters feel the same.... Find another country to destroy because we won't let it happen here...