Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

salinsky

(1,065 posts)
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:17 AM May 2016

The garbage is coming from the top ...

Totally deligitimazed. His legacy is in ashes ....

For months I'd thought and written that Sanders campaign manager Jeff Weaver was the key driver of toxicity in the the Democratic primary race. Weaver has been highly visible on television, far more than campaign managers tend to be. He's also been the one constantly upping the tension, pressing the acrimony and unrealism of the campaign as Sanders actual chances of winning dwindled.

But now I realize I had that wrong.

Actually, I didn't realize it. People who know told me.

Over the last several weeks I've had a series of conversations with multiple highly knowledgable, highly placed people. Perhaps it's coming from Weaver too. The two guys have been together for decades. But the 'burn it down' attitude, the upping the ante, everything we saw in that statement released today by the campaign seems to be coming from Sanders himself. Right from the top.

This should have been obvious to me. The tone and tenor of a campaign always come from the top. It wasn't obvious to me until now.

This might be because he's temperamentally like that. There's some evidence for that. It may also be that, like many other presidential contenders, once you get close it is simply impossible to let go. I don't know which it is. That would only be my speculation. But this is coming from Bernie Sanders. It's not Weaver. It's not driven by people around him. It's right from him. And what I understand from knowledgable sources is that in the last few weeks anyone who was trying to rein it in has basically stopped trying and just decided to let Bernie be Bernie.

Sanders speech tonight was right in line with his statement out this afternoon. He identified the Democratic party as an essentially corrupt, moribund institution which is now on notice that it must let 'the people' in. What about the coalitions Barack Obama built in 2008 and 2012, the biggest and most diverse presidential coalitions ever constructed?

Sanders narrative today has essentially been that he is political legitimacy. The Democratic party needs to realize that. This, as I said earlier, is the problem with lying to your supporters. Sanders is telling his supporters that he can still win, which he can't. He's suggesting that the win is being stolen by a corrupt establishment, an impression which will be validated when his phony prediction turns out not to be true. Lying like this sets you up for stuff like happened over the weekend in Nevada.

As I said, it all comes from the very top.


http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/it-comes-from-the-very-top
35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
The garbage is coming from the top ... (Original Post) salinsky May 2016 OP
I'm becoming less certian that he will endorse Hillary firebrand80 May 2016 #1
Yep. Sanders has an ego that is never satisfied. boston bean May 2016 #2
I've never read a bigger load of crap in my life. kayakjohnny May 2016 #3
Why? Everyone is talking about it all over Tavarious Jackson May 2016 #5
It's becoming common knowledge ... salinsky May 2016 #7
Then I'm in great company. kayakjohnny May 2016 #10
That's an odd term for the hillary camp, but fitting. timmymoff May 2016 #11
What's embarrassing is privileged people throwing good money after a losing cause uponit7771 May 2016 #18
+1 Octafish May 2016 #24
He won't endorse. Tavarious Jackson May 2016 #4
A fish rots from the head down StayFrosty May 2016 #6
it will be soon.. after june 7..like stated countless times timmymoff May 2016 #12
I agree, if you are talking about HRC. sadoldgirl May 2016 #20
He's off the rails. I misread him the same as Josh Marshall did, I bought into the whole YouDig May 2016 #8
Me too ... salinsky May 2016 #9
I knew there was something wrong with Sanders after Cornell West and very few if any dem endorsement uponit7771 May 2016 #19
The guy promised his followers $18 trillion in new entitlements that he knew he couldn't deliver. Trust Buster May 2016 #13
Setting the stage for disqualifying Bernie and his delegates from the convention... reformist2 May 2016 #14
Word farleftlib May 2016 #22
"What about the coalitions Barack Obama built in 2008 and 2012, the biggest and most diverse workinclasszero May 2016 #15
Hillary stayed in until June and campaigned hard in 2008 Armstead May 2016 #17
She didn't implicitly (and borderline explicitly) threaten to burn the whole damn thing down if Zynx May 2016 #21
She came close.... Armstead May 2016 #23
Aaaaa...she drug the winner into the toilet and swirled around with him until she finally let go... peace13 May 2016 #28
Of course it is. A sore loser of epic proportions, watching the spotlight fading away. nt LexVegas May 2016 #16
Bernie has lost all perspective. Alfresco May 2016 #25
Don't forget apcalc May 2016 #26
When you've lost Josh Marshall, you've lost me. randome May 2016 #27
Bernie is like a fire and brimstone preacher Progressive dog May 2016 #29
Always the pragmatism.... Voltaire May 2016 #30
You must have forgotten your matches Progressive dog May 2016 #31
He's 100% wrong. joshcryer May 2016 #32
I still think it's Weaver. NCTraveler May 2016 #33
It would appear that you're not alone in that assessment ... NurseJackie May 2016 #34
Apparently, TPM's John Marshall was unaware of Sanders' perspective on the Democratic Party. aikoaiko May 2016 #35

firebrand80

(2,760 posts)
1. I'm becoming less certian that he will endorse Hillary
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:22 AM
May 2016

I still think he will, but I'm not 100% sure anymore

kayakjohnny

(5,235 posts)
10. Then I'm in great company.
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:32 AM
May 2016

Btw, you don't have a son or daughter old enough to be drafted. Your queen will need them for the next string of wars.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
24. +1
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:22 AM
May 2016

Seems the "national" scribes -- TPM, Mother Jones, The Atlantic -- have received marching orders.

 

Tavarious Jackson

(1,595 posts)
4. He won't endorse.
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:24 AM
May 2016

He said today that he will do everything in his power to stop the "status quo" from continuing...

YouDig

(2,280 posts)
8. He's off the rails. I misread him the same as Josh Marshall did, I bought into the whole
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:28 AM
May 2016

Bernie isn't as bad as his supporters line. But it looks like he actually is as bad. And now more news is coming out about how the chaos in Nevada was actually orchestrated, it wasn't some spontaneous mob.

In effect, Bernie is now campaigning for Trump.

uponit7771

(90,335 posts)
19. I knew there was something wrong with Sanders after Cornell West and very few if any dem endorsement
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:56 AM
May 2016

... which doesn't sway me usually but .... not one!?

They knew and said nothing

 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
13. The guy promised his followers $18 trillion in new entitlements that he knew he couldn't deliver.
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:39 AM
May 2016

It's always been about Sanders' inflated ego. He snookered millions.

 

farleftlib

(2,125 posts)
22. Word
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:10 AM
May 2016

The only garbage is the entire OP. Bernie's entire career in the Senate has been one
of reaching consensus with people who are completely ideologically opposed to him
and doing it without rancor of any sort.

The smell of garbage and shit emanating from the OP is fouling the air in GD-P.

 

workinclasszero

(28,270 posts)
15. "What about the coalitions Barack Obama built in 2008 and 2012, the biggest and most diverse
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:46 AM
May 2016
presidential coalitions ever constructed?"

Sanders wants to destroy it of course.

His democratic candidacy was a con from day one. This man has always hated the democratic party. Its common knowledge. Some people wanted to believe otherwise though and now the party is paying the price for that wishful thinking.

Any actual democratic running against Hillary would have long ago folded the tent and started working for a democratic victory in the fall. Sanders will never do that. He hates the dem party as much as the republican party, maybe more.

The only "victory" he is ever gonna get out of these primaries now, is a Nader victory and he is pursuing it with gusto to the bitter end. I don't see him ever endorsing Hillary either.

90% of his backers would consider that treason and obviously Sanders is no leader, he hasn't got the backbone to stand up to the mob he created.
 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
17. Hillary stayed in until June and campaigned hard in 2008
Wed May 18, 2016, 07:51 AM
May 2016

Does that make her a power hungry charlatan and egomaniac too?

er, wait...nevermind

Zynx

(21,328 posts)
21. She didn't implicitly (and borderline explicitly) threaten to burn the whole damn thing down if
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:09 AM
May 2016

she didn't get her way.

 

peace13

(11,076 posts)
28. Aaaaa...she drug the winner into the toilet and swirled around with him until she finally let go...
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:32 AM
May 2016

....it was an awful campaign that ended with a slow and agonizing death.

Alfresco

(1,698 posts)
25. Bernie has lost all perspective.
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:25 AM
May 2016
Sanders is telling his supporters that he can still win, which he can't. He's suggesting that the win is being stolen by a corrupt establishment, an impression which will be validated when his phony prediction turns out not to be true. Lying like this sets you up for stuff like happened over the weekend in Nevada.

apcalc

(4,463 posts)
26. Don't forget
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:30 AM
May 2016

The part about the super delegates of the corrupt establishment
are going to flip over to him ..

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
27. When you've lost Josh Marshall, you've lost me.
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:31 AM
May 2016

I always thought the attempt to paint Sanders as 'damaged goods' was more a reflection to the insane insults aimed at Clinton. And that's still the case to a large extent. But I'm starting to understand now why Sanders has fewer Congressional endorsements than Ted Cruz.

His message is great but he is a poor messenger.

It takes a certain amount of ego to run for President. Or to be a stand-up comedian. Or to be a doctor. Both Clinton and Sanders have egos. But Clinton's ego still allows her to get things done. Sanders, not so much.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Stop looking for heroes. BE one.[/center][/font][hr]

Progressive dog

(6,900 posts)
29. Bernie is like a fire and brimstone preacher
Wed May 18, 2016, 08:51 AM
May 2016

with Hillary starring as the devil and the establishment as the demons. He is a demagogue. Whether he is enough of a pragmatist to endorse Hillary remains to be seen.

Voltaire

(2,639 posts)
30. Always the pragmatism....
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:25 AM
May 2016

Yawn. You idiot Hillary fans had better start realizing that your house is ablaze instead of hurling insults. She's a bad candidate. She sucked in 2008 and she sucks now. For all the same reasons. But I don't expect your crowd to even try to see that.

Progressive dog

(6,900 posts)
31. You must have forgotten your matches
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:28 AM
May 2016

because you are in a small minority. Count me pleased to be called an idiot by the likes of you.

joshcryer

(62,269 posts)
32. He's 100% wrong.
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:33 AM
May 2016

Weaver has used it throughout the campaign, Sanders is only channeling it now (well, since really the unqualified remark) because he needs the DNC to think he's going to take his ball and go home. He can't risk being weak, so he's not having to embrace the ugliness. There will be careful walkbacks but it will be calculated.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
33. I still think it's Weaver.
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:37 AM
May 2016

Sanders has done little leading throughout his political career. He is now a follower of Weaver. Weaver pulls the strings in their operation. Thats not to say Sanders isn't the voice. He is Weavers front and yes man.

NurseJackie

(42,862 posts)
34. It would appear that you're not alone in that assessment ...
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:42 AM
May 2016

... and based on Bernie's (lack of ) votes and his (lack of) endorsements, it's clear to me that most people and major media outlets do not see him as being presidential or as being a capable leader. He'd absolutely freeze for the first international crisis that came long, or he'd lose his cool (as we've seen so often) and blunder full speed ahead into making diplomatic mistake after mistake.

(Alerter: These are my personal opinions based on my personal observations.)

aikoaiko

(34,165 posts)
35. Apparently, TPM's John Marshall was unaware of Sanders' perspective on the Democratic Party.
Wed May 18, 2016, 10:50 AM
May 2016

What a political idiot.
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»The garbage is coming fro...