Dear Hillary Supporters...

[retrowire]

I know you want so desperately Bernie to concede.

I know you want Hillary to win this primary so you can "put all this nonsense behind" you.

I know you want to ignore all the voter disenfranchising, fraud and wrongdoings because Hillary's winning so let's just keep going.

But I've got something to tell you.

Whether Bernie wins or loses this... His supporters won't be going anywhere.

His movement will remain, even after the primaries are done. We still will not like Hillary or Trump or any of the current system. We will still be discontented and we will still be fighting.

There will be Bernie or Bust types. There will be those who hold their nose.

But what will forever remain are those who are fed up with this system.

So stop thinking that Bernie conceding or the primaries being over will end this.

It won't.

This is the year 2016. The nation is sick and tired of the same old crap. Hillary is that.

Independents, Bernie supporters and unfortunately Trump supporters make up the majority of the United States.

These are the real odds. Our nation might actually elect fucking Donald Trump.

Republicans, NOT Democrats have been breaking voter turnout records during the primaries. That's terrifying. And I hate to say that I maybe casting my first vote for president out of FEAR of the opposition, rather than pride in what I'm voting for.

You really think Hillary has a strong chance of winning when it's Bernie who is the only one who bests Trump in the polls?

Buddy, come to reality. Even if Hillary wins... This nation will not be happy about it. 2016 has changed everything.

So don't get tired of hearing us Bernie supporters this soon.

Because win or lose THIS contest, we've still got many more important fights to fight.

I hope you'll join us in those fights, whatever the outcome.

[betsuni]

1. The BM will remain. There will be those who hold their nose ...

The same old crap ... put it behind you. Whatever the outcome.

[seabeyond]

2. The strong majority will vote Clinton. A reality you do not want to see. Don't care. We will mosey

along fine without you and those so filled with anger and hate, just like those on the right. We will keep fighting for progression forward, as others stamp their feet in outrage. Whatever. Nothing new.

[retrowire]

4. we'll see how much has changed in time.

Ignore it at your own peril.

You ever seen an election season like this before?

Both parties tearing themselves apart? Supporters all behaving like rival factions that actually protest one another in the streets? Hundreds of protestors being arrested at Capitol hill for protesting big money in government?

A candidate like Trump actually gaining traction?

Ignore it at your own peril.

Hillary can win, and it won't make any of this change or go away.

Accept that.

[seabeyond]

7. You are awfully demanding in others accepting your view. Sanders could not even get this wave out

to vote for him. Reality. Clinton had a bigger revolution than he did. Ya, they will sit on their couches or on a discussion board tearing every accomplishment down, and continue to create discontent and chaos. That is how they walk and view life and it goes well beyond politics. I personally feel that is a sad way to use up the years of your life, but whatever. Free will.

[retrowire]

9. its not my "view".

It's fact. Shit has changed. It isn't going back.

[seabeyond]

12. It is your view, it is not fact. Polls suggest the strong majority, vast majority are perfectly

comfortable supporting Clinton.

Per votes, suggest Sanders does not have a revolution of voters, just a mass of angry people that do not follow thru.

Previous experience suggests, they will stay angry and the rest of us will progress foward.

[retrowire]

15. polls say all kinds of shit if you havent noticed.

Events and otherwise have shown us how skewed and wrong many of them can be.

I get it. You're happy with polls.

You're not interested in accepting everyone's anger and you believe the majority of the nation is happy about another Clinton in the white house.

That's fine. I don't really care. Carry on. You don't wanna talk about it, whatever.

[seabeyond]

17. You say all kinds of shit, if you have not noticed, lol. Hence, no facts, your view.

[retrowire]

19. still avoiding the point. nt

[seabeyond]

22. I have addressed the point that was significant to me. Gotta tell ya, didn't read all of your

post. I stop once I hit up against the first statement that is not factual. So I can't say I know your point. You always start out your posts with a flawed argument that I feel I need to address.

[lunamagica]

56. Agree with you about polls. And yet, Sanders is asking to overthrow the will of the voters, based on

Polls predicting an election that is happening six months from now.

Absurd

[okieinpain]

63. and that is the big elephant in the room, where is the

REVOLUTION.

[seekthetruth]

29. Progression how?

With continued environmental damage? Don't think so....

She doesn't have my vote.

[seabeyond]

46. If you have to ask how our Dems are progressive then you are not paying attention. Why should

anyone waste time seriously answer such a purposely obtuse question.

[seekthetruth]

48. Hillary hasn't ruled out fracking, yes?

Then.....she stands for further harm to the environment. It's that simple.

I must be living in a parallel universe when I hear liberals supporting someone who won't come out against fracking......

[seabeyond]

49. Sanders hasn't ruled out coal or oil has he? Oh, and fracking? Takes the money as he bashes.

[seekthetruth]

51. Huh.....

Regardless, we have one candidate who has publicly come out against the oil companies, and another who has not.

[YouDig]

3. We're not going anywhere either. You can get on board or not, the nomination is Hillary's.

[retrowire]

5. i just ask people to accept that Hillary's possible win

Won't change a thing in the current political atmosphere.

Policies might change sure.

But this nation is different now.

[YouDig]

11. Tell yourself whatever you want.

[retrowire]

20. so do you think Hillary winning will remove all the pressure on the party? nt

[YouDig]

21. The only relevant battle is between the Dems and GOP. Hillary and Bernie already are running on

the same platform. Bernie was about a cult of personality, not about policy.

[retrowire]

34. i see that in completely the opposite way

Which of those two candidates has had the same policies this entire race and who has been running on reputation and changing their policies in real time?

Hillary's is the cult of personality. Hands down.

Go interview supporters of each camp, find out which common voter is more informed.

[YouDig]

36. I've talked to supporters of each camp, and by far Hillary supporters are more informed.

I've yet to find a conspiracy theory that the Bernie camp hasn't fully embraced. Trying to talk economics with them is like discussing algebra with a tree.

And the big thing they don't get is that the people stopping progressive policies are Republicans in congress, not Obama and Clinton. At some point you stop trying to reason with people like that.

[retrowire]

37. tsk tsk tsk... nt

[Fawke Em]

68. More informed?

Hell, up until last week, you thought the FBI did security reviews. And, even when they tell you they don't, many of you still don't believe they don't.

[Fla Dem]

38. Great! As a HRC supporter I hope you and the Bernie movement will continue to be active

and fight for change. Revolutions are won from the ground up. I hope you get involved in local politics, run for city council, state legislature, US Representative. You can see the havoc the RW has caused in state after state where they dominate the local and state governments. You can see how Pres Obama has fought tooth and nail against a Republican congress.

Grass roots Retro, grass roots. That's where real change begins.

[retrowire]

41. im learning it takes more than that. nt

[thereismore]

26. Way to reach out to us. You really are a great ambassador for her. Please proceed. nt

[YouDig]

27. How about you reach out to us? You still think Bernie's going to win, right?

[leftynyc]

28. That you would let

anonymous people posting on a message board sway your vote is entirely your problem.

[mac56]

59. Really?

Then what are you doing here exactly?

[leftynyc]

62. Checking things out

I've been here over a decade and can't remember what originally brought me here but my beliefs have never been so flaccid I let anyone - let alone anonymous posters - sway my thinking. I'm perfectly capable of making up my own mind. Why do you ask?

[Bluenorthwest]

33. And yet the nomination is not the actual prize. Ask Mitt. Ask Al Gore. They won nominations but

lost the actual prize. To elect her as President she needs every possible vote from every Democrat and liberal minded independent that draws breath. It would behoove her ardent supporters to act according to her needs and not according to their own needs.

[YouDig]

35. We can win without the drunken chair-thrower contingent of the Bernie crowd.

I don't do threats, whether it's the death threats that Bernie people in NV have been tossing around, or the threats to help elect Trump by voting third party.

[Fawke Em]

69. Speaking of uninformed...

No one threw a chair.

Didn't happen.

[MadDAsHell]

53. "the nomination is Hillary's." ----- And always was, right?

That's what this has always been about.

1) The most important thing each election is to make demographic history with your vote.

2) Demographically speaking, she is the the most "historic" candidate this time.

3) So how DARE he try to take that from her???

[Trenzalore]

6. Nobody is asking anyone to go away

Just Bernie's holy war against the Democratic Party for the past 30 years to pause long enough to prevent Donald Trump from being President. If you think that is somehow not something to be concerned with there is really no point to a conversation.

[retrowire]

8. and yet, theres data that says

The Democratic party should stop it's war against Bernie and his supporters so we can stop Trump.

There are clearly two sides to this. We all know of the divide.

[Trenzalore]

10. He lost

He can be gracious and tone down his rhetoric or he can go all in and still lose. Right now it looks like he is planning on Kamikase which I believe were his intentions all along. This is what happens when someone who has bashed the party for 30 years runs to lead it.

[seabeyond]

13. When he starts ranting on air in third person? He has lost it, Imho. Nt

[retrowire]

18. still ignoring my point. haha

It doesn't matter if Bernie wins or loses.

The discontentment of this nation is not going away, that's the point. And Hillary isn't going to cure it.

[themaguffin]

23. not if people don't work on levels to make change.

[Trenzalore]

24. The nation is always discontent

Can't think of a period other than immediately after WW2 for a year that they were content

[themaguffin]

25. That data doesn't tell the whole story. Move on to defeat Trump & make positive change.

[retrowire]

31. oh i will. ill be holding my nose to do it. nt

[NCTraveler]

14. I would like to make a suggestion...

To the disaffected left. Don't disappear after Clinton wins just to reappear in eight years. Take part in the process and work for change. We have a participatory democratic republic. Complaining and voting is the easy part.

I would cheer a stronger movement on the left. They seem to have extreme difficulty organizing under one flag. It's a thought process that shows a lack of understanding about coalition building. Then again, they would probably end up hating themselves because coalitions often give the appearance of being establishment.

[retrowire]

16. Your comment was constructive until the "establishment" dig.

Soo... While you spoke true, I don't necessarily like your tone.

It's corrupt establishments that suck, buddy. Your sarcasm just shows a lack of understanding that difference.

[NCTraveler]

32. There was no "dig".

Just sound advice. Try not to read much into tone. When doing so with the written word the message often becomes clouded by the current state of the reader, not the words of the message itself.

I gave sound advice based in common sense. There are no victims of tone here.

[Bluenorthwest]

39. It's a total dig. The left which you smear fought for LGBT rights while the establishment you cheer

fought against us. You attack the people who worked for equality and progress while praising those who hinder progress. 'Disaffected left'? How about discriminated against, beaten and abused minorities? The level of smug privilege in your rhetoric gets very hard to stomach.
So tired of those of in the Reagan Democrat camp.

[NCTraveler]

40. I have absolutely no clue what you are talking about.

What an extremely poorly placed rant. Can you please show me where any word I have ever stated on this board can be construed as even remotely close to anti-LGBQT. Your post here isn't just a highly inaccurate misrepresentation, it's offensive as hell.

"You attack the people who worked for equality"

Back that up. As it stands it's nothing but dishonest bullshit.

Disaffected left is not an offensive or negative term. It's real. We have a two party system. To think many aren't disaffected in a two party system shows a complete lack of knowledge. It is not an offensive term. It's reality and its respectful to show our system has disaffected people.

[Bluenorthwest]

44. You having no clue will not get an argument from me.

You attack the equality activists as 'disaffected' which means dissatisfied when those activists were in fact discriminated against. Your verbiage indicates that you believe they should have been satisfied with discrimination and injustice. Your focus is on those who stood up against bigotry, whining about them not being content with the established order.

Privileged rantings of a super smug straight moderate. It gets hard to stomach. You defend those who opposed us, you attempt to butter your toast on both sides then complain when your fingers get greasy.

[NCTraveler]

45. I appreciate your admittance that you cannot back up...

Your false and offensive claim. Stating that our two party system doesn't represent everyone is not offensive as you are desperately trying to make it out to be. It comes from a solid understanding of US politics and common sense. It isn't a negative or decisive term. I do find it interesting that you don't think there are politically disaffected groups. You couldn't be more wrong.

Amazing what you are trying to do after I wrote a very respectful post in reply to the op.

Show me where I have condoned anti-LGBQT behavior. If you can't you should step up to the plate and admit how wrong you are.

It amazes me that you are hung up on a completely non-offensive term that's understanding is very important in society.

I really don't get it. You were and are one of my favorite posters here. You started regularly attacking me as being anti-LGBTQ throughout this primary. You have yet to find one single word of mine to back up your attacks.

I hope after this primary you stop attacking me without merit as you have been doing. As I said, you are one of my favorite posters here.

[Fla Dem]

42. Oh for heavens sake. Read the message, not the tone. Bottom up, that's how it's done.

Got to push by the slights, perceived or otherwise, or you're never going to accomplish anything. Life is tough, politics is tougher. Gonna need a tough skin if you really do want to change the political dynamics. You coming back with a retaliatory strike doesn't show much room for tolerance and patience to do what has to be done to affect the change you desire.

[retrowire]

43. uh i totally agreed with the sentiment.

Just didn't like one part. That doesn't defeat the sentiment for me.

I'm fine really. Lol

[dmosh42]

30. Good post, Retrowire! I agree with your thoughts. I go back to remembering Truman.....

and every so often the Dems have a reformer come along, but the big money always has carried it in the end. I had hoped for Bernie, but it looks like the bankers will be sleeping at the White House again!

[Arugula Latte]

47. I think you've just coined a good slogan: "Hillary 2016. Same Old Crap."

[azurnoir]

52. hey on that thought -this could be her campaign song

[DLCWIdem]

50. she does win against Trump too

Hello I can see maybe your trying to reach out and I have listened. Can you listen also. Myself, I have really no objection to Bernie staying in what many of us find objectionable is the way he is doing it. First of all, he is attacking every win and saying she or the party is rigging in the election. That is simply not the case and this is what is effecting her poll numbers. Believe it or not the Sanders campaign knows these rules and can use them as well. It seems as if rules are only corrupt if he can't use them. Like superdelegates. There corrupt unless he needs them to win. Believe it or not Bernies website had the information about changing registration in New York last year. These rules were made so that the Repugs can't monkey with the democratic party's elections. And they are made by the state dem parties not the national DNC.

Their are election problems evrrywhere that does not mean that there is fraud. These problems, seem to only be publisized when it effects Bernie or mentioned when it is a state Hill won. Arizona was publicisized, which was GOP's disenfranchisement but my state of Wisconsin which also has GOP disenfranchisement barely gets mentioned, because Bernie won that state?

Hilliary has and does also beat Trump in general election polls not that they really mean anything at this point anyway. You remember Sanders stump speech every poll has us beating Trump by more.... When Trump was running in his primary the other candidates would say that too about his losing, but the polls can and will change between now and 6 months from now, and whether you believe it or not general election polls may not be so favorable toward your candidate closer to November. Unlike Sanders Hilliary has not run a single negative ad against Sanders. Furthermore, like those Republican voters, we simply believe the person with the most pledged delegates and the most votes should win. And every time Sanders says that he is trying to overturn our votes, our voices. We are a coalition of women, AA, hispanics and other minorities, and many of us have been silenced before.

We know that Hillary can win because of her coalition but every time Ssanders campaign tries to
delegitamisize her wins, Trump wins. And every time the Sanders campaign tries to
delegitamasize her wins he is trying to silence us our voices. Oh we don't count because we are from the south, she only wins closed primaries, she cheated, election fraud etc....

[1StrongBlackMan]

57. Well put ... But, I fear, a wasted effort.

[lunamagica]

58. Great post

[mac56]

60. If Hillary gets the nomination and loses to Trump

As a Bernie supporter, I will refuse to accept the blame for her loss. We already know Bernie is far more successful against Trump than Hillary is.

[GoneFishin]

54. If she continues to cheat her way to the nomination, when Trump beats her, it will be a bitter

and small consolation, but consolation nonetheless, that her smug arrogant short-sighted big mouthed supporters will have to STFU once and for all.

[Capt. Obvious]

55. .

Why can't she close the deal?

[DLCWIdem]

61. Republican discontent

It is funny when you get past the vague notions of everybody being "discontented" by the parties you find that the discontent is different among all the people. The republicans voters were "discontented" because they believed the person with the most votes/delegates should win and they didn't like it when Cruz was trying to game the system. The establishment voters just didn't want Donald Trump. This is the exact opposite of Nevada, Sanders simply pulled a Ted Cruz but wasn't able to pull it completely off. Thus the rules are corrupt only when they disadvantage him.

Until Hill actually said that she had more votes and more delegates the media kind of implied - through Sanders--that she was only winning with the superdelegates. In fact, Faux news has just kept on repeating that meme. We, as Democrats, knew that that was simply not the case. SHE IS WINNING without super delegates she has about 300, now 280 more than him. Now he has realized that he needs the superdelegates to overturn the vote/delegate count he is touting the superdelegate system.

Have you noticed that Bernies favorable have gone down too. Don't you think it may because he is being seen as part of this "corrupt establishment" also.

[DLCWIdem]

64. voter turnout in primaries

Last edited Wed May 18, 2016, 09:16 PM - Edit history (1)

MSNBC looked at that and looked at the trends. Trump is bringing new voters into the primary who haven't voted before. But they have voted in the general. There not new voters. I was like that I didn't vote in the primaries but always voted in the general.

[freemtnhermit]

65. DWS & Hillary have changed my mind

Yes, first off, I'm a Bernie supporter. In all the time Hillary talks about her experience, I am old enough to say, I have followed her movements and choices. I can't count the many times I yelled at her through my TV, in disagreement. Do I have a high opinion of her...No, however, being a Democrat, I fully expected to vote for which ever one won this years nomination. Anyone except a Republican. This was before all the crap that has happened during these primaries. I now will vote against Hillary Clinton, not necessarily for another person. DWS, Babara Boxer (her grandson is Hillary's nephew), voting fraud, dead media coverage for Sanders, the disrespect for my views from Clinton supporters, and so many other things, makes the thought of Hillary winning turn my stomach. Bernie Sanders at this point could call for all of us to unite, as for me, I have had enough of the 2016 process, as I follow the beating of my own heart, a vote for Hillary Clinton will NOT come from me.

[anotherproletariat]

66. You're right, his supporters won't go anywhere, but...

The media will stop covering them.

Unless they continue the violence, in which case the DNC will be able to mobilize law enforcement with more authority because they will not be acting against one of their own candidates.

We know that ideologues will still be around. Heck, I'm 21 and my parents are holdover ideologues from the 1960s. Fortunately they have realized that in government: idealism = dictatorship and compromise = democracy

[sadoldgirl]

70. You are 21, therefore have no possible view

of history. The pendulum is swinging in both parties.

the "pragmatic and compromising" people in our

government have been playing the people for too
long. When a Trump has even an even poll with
HRC, it tells you that the general population is
fed up with the establishment.

Since when does idealism= dictatorship?????

And btw Bernie is not full of idealism, he looks at
the facts, and tries to find solutions, but you have it
your way.

Just don't call yourself a member of the proletarians,
because that is just a deceiving name in your case.

[JEB]

67. Fed up with status quo for working people, American Empire

and its war economy, corporate lobby calling all the shots, privatization of anything profitable (prisons, education, war machine). I'm done.