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BigBearJohn

(11,410 posts)
Fri May 20, 2016, 03:54 PM May 2016

If Hillary is such a great candidate, why isn't she filling

super large venues and stadiums everywhere she goes with thousands upon thousands of her adoring supporters who wait in line sometimes for 8 hours or more just to show their support? It's a legitimate question.

158 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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If Hillary is such a great candidate, why isn't she filling (Original Post) BigBearJohn May 2016 OP
Maybe they noticed that it didn't work for Bernie, so why bother? The_Casual_Observer May 2016 #1
Yup AgerolanAmerican May 2016 #103
who'd want to stand in line mooseprime May 2016 #2
Great question ContinentalOp May 2016 #3
... Maven May 2016 #8
Bieber or Bust!!! YouDig May 2016 #9
Some say he's ineligible ContinentalOp May 2016 #11
The corporatist oligarchs must be desperate. They keep framing him for DUI and reckless driving. YouDig May 2016 #14
I have one word for you ContinentalOp May 2016 #36
Hillary has no fans at all. barrow-wight May 2016 #94
THE BEAVE!!!!!!!!! Dem2 May 2016 #57
I'm with Her itsrobert May 2016 #101
How is it you have been aboard DU since truedelphi May 2016 #107
I have over 5000 posts and only a few hundred maybe are from this year. ContinentalOp May 2016 #108
Why mess with a winning strategy? With smaller, more intimate rallies and meetings Arkansas Granny May 2016 #4
You just keep telling yourself that passiveporcupine May 2016 #46
Well lancer78 Jun 2016 #132
All the excitement of a funeral home viewing... Yurovsky May 2016 #47
Yup ISUGRADIA May 2016 #72
She's gotten way fewer votes than Obama in 2008... Yurovsky May 2016 #85
Not true...she won the popular vote Demsrule86 May 2016 #118
Untrue JFKcrat May 2016 #71
I doubt it - PAMod May 2016 #84
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #130
LOL-Keep telling yourself that-Bernie's winning! redstateblues May 2016 #104
#berniemath metroins May 2016 #126
supposedly, even her supporters don't like her amborin May 2016 #123
Supposedly, you can get high by smoking banana peels. Arkansas Granny May 2016 #124
You can't . TheFarS1de Jun 2016 #139
Lol. Agreed. Arkansas Granny Jun 2016 #140
Not enough cloths pins bahrbearian May 2016 #5
Because that doesn't make one a good candidate Recursion May 2016 #6
Maybe you should ask Obama? jillan May 2016 #21
Maybe you should remember logic 101? Recursion May 2016 #25
Here's the one I like pdsimdars May 2016 #56
Just sayin' what? rock May 2016 #82
There's a duzy, ouch! appalachiablue May 2016 #106
That "more votes" meme has been shown to be deceptive. There's a thorough post on it pdsimdars May 2016 #54
This message was self-deleted by its author Autumn Colors May 2016 #66
Really Recursion May 2016 #92
Here's why 50,000 rally attendees matter. lagomorph777 Jun 2016 #151
OK, but it's not actually translating into votes Recursion Jun 2016 #154
And you have a flux capacitor? lagomorph777 Jun 2016 #155
Give her credit, Fuddnik May 2016 #7
^^THAT^^ onecaliberal May 2016 #64
Not saying he did... but he did. Ino May 2016 #121
Looks like she picked a better strategy hack89 May 2016 #10
In other words, you've got nothing. BigBearJohn May 2016 #12
She didn't do rallies. We all know that hack89 May 2016 #15
I think its more like madokie May 2016 #38
So every state's results are questionable? hack89 May 2016 #48
At this point, Hack89 madokie May 2016 #51
Another bitter dead ender I see.nt hack89 May 2016 #81
Exactly... Yurovsky May 2016 #50
She didn't have to do any work to get the voters she has now passiveporcupine May 2016 #53
Many Bernie supporters are young people and students who have plenty of time on their hands Nye Bevan May 2016 #13
And Obama supporters were not? jillan May 2016 #22
Barack Obama certainly had a lot of young and enthusiastic supporters. Nye Bevan May 2016 #28
What a f*ing racist post. jillan May 2016 #34
Wait..... pointing out that Bernie has not been able to connect with racial minorities, Nye Bevan May 2016 #44
I have been to 2 Bernie rallies. Both of them were a mixture of people, young and old. jillan May 2016 #49
So you consider this NY Times article to be "racist"? Nye Bevan May 2016 #52
They're too busy voting for her TwilightZone May 2016 #16
I wouldn't wait in line to see anyone, and I hate crowds. cwydro May 2016 #17
Because we have...jobs? Family? Other commitments? Tarc May 2016 #18
you find PLENTY of time to play here. nt grasswire May 2016 #27
You don't need to wait 8 hours in line to post on DU (nt) Nye Bevan May 2016 #45
And also, you don't go to your usual computer station truedelphi May 2016 #114
Yea, with this handy-dandy contraption called a "smartphone", my dear silly grasswire Tarc May 2016 #87
It's a different demographic. My parents, for instance (and all of their friends), would never in a anotherproletariat May 2016 #19
The people who go to Bernie rallies are not just young people. That has been documented. pdsimdars May 2016 #58
Hey everybody! Are you listening to all these answers? BigBearJohn May 2016 #20
Oh you calling for backup? n/t asuhornets May 2016 #23
Honestly, I don't see most of them. I started using ignore and have not looked back. pdsimdars May 2016 #59
I wonder if Berners would trade some of his crowds for some of her delegates? CorkySt.Clair May 2016 #24
Oh have no worry Hillaritès. If the establishment could ramrod a moron BigBearJohn May 2016 #29
It was a good try. Bernie just came up a little short. CorkySt.Clair May 2016 #39
If Bernie's such a great candidate why is HRC beating him by 3.5 million popular votes? WI_DEM May 2016 #26
That margin disenfranchises caucus states and independent voters in closed primary states. (nt) w4rma May 2016 #30
Not according to this article: WI_DEM May 2016 #42
blah, blah, blah, excuse, excuse, excuse. . . . . . those vote totals mean almost nothing pdsimdars May 2016 #65
See below BigBearJohn May 2016 #40
She isn't. Go read the post about that vote count. pdsimdars May 2016 #61
You might want to correct that WA has 7.2 million population, not 72 million. PufPuf23 May 2016 #76
And lost the primary handily. mythology Jun 2016 #157
Rich folks have been paying a fortune for years to hear her speak!! Jarqui May 2016 #31
I know, isn't that funny. The anointed one who was supposed to have SO MUCH MONEY pdsimdars May 2016 #69
It confounds me as well. But maybe I'm a hypocrite there because I'm Jarqui May 2016 #91
Here's an interesting graphic. pdsimdars May 2016 #105
that is interesting marions ghost Jun 2016 #141
You don't get to see her for free, and not many people can afford the $2,000 entrance fee n/t arcane1 May 2016 #32
This is reaching. Come on. He loved Big Brother May 2016 #33
Well said! tonyt53 May 2016 #37
And Obama won as I recall. BigBearJohn May 2016 #43
Yes, Obama won, but he didn't start off with big rallies all american girl May 2016 #125
It's not about good or bad candidate, it's about candidates who inspire the voters pdsimdars May 2016 #73
Because she isn't going to only where her cheerleaders can get to without their mothers driving them tonyt53 May 2016 #35
I think she has... Mike Nelson May 2016 #41
Personally .... LenaBaby61 May 2016 #77
We actually go out and vote and show up at state conventions. ;) boston bean May 2016 #55
Her supporters make their voices heard where it counts - in the voting booth. Metric System May 2016 #60
There aren't that many hedge fund managers in the world Depaysement May 2016 #62
even if one hedge fund voter has $10M to donate, they still only have 1 vote Sheepshank May 2016 #68
How's filling those arenas working out for Bernie and the final tally? Sheepshank May 2016 #63
Hillary's campaign focuses on "listening" to individual voters. nt oasis May 2016 #67
You're right. She listens to her big donors and noone else. (nt) w4rma May 2016 #89
She prefers one on one contact with folks from all levels of society. oasis May 2016 #90
Hillary doesn't spend any time whatsoever with anyone who doesn't write a large check to her. (nt) w4rma May 2016 #97
She's been speaking to folks in shops, small businesses oasis May 2016 #98
Back to this again? It must be Friday. NurseJackie May 2016 #70
Sanders is losing because his strategy to talk at people failed KingFlorez May 2016 #74
This message was self-deleted by its author rjsquirrel May 2016 #75
Very true, why isn't Sanders three million more votes than Hillary and he Thinkingabout May 2016 #79
Because Hillary does not campaign that way. apnu May 2016 #78
Monster Truck Jams, wrestling, gun shows, Trump, etc., fill venues with white people too. Hoyt May 2016 #80
She's filling voting booths where the real WhiteTara May 2016 #83
See what last Saturday's Saturday Night Live's opening skit truedelphi May 2016 #109
Okay. Now we are using comedy shows as WhiteTara May 2016 #113
I've supported her twice Codeine May 2016 #86
Why didn't FDR pack 'em in like the Nuremberg rallies? VOX May 2016 #88
Most of her voters wouldn't have time. barrow-wight May 2016 #93
Maybe they should try voting. Demsrule86 May 2016 #95
+1 oasis May 2016 #99
Message auto-removed Name removed May 2016 #96
She's been too busy getting them to actually vote. JoePhilly May 2016 #100
Big rallies cost money, now that Sanders funds is getting low and since Hillary has been on the Thinkingabout May 2016 #102
Expensive fundraisers cost money too democrattotheend May 2016 #111
And these same fund raisers has made its way to Sanders when he was running for Senator, Hillary Thinkingabout May 2016 #112
Because she doesn't excite and inspire that way democrattotheend May 2016 #110
It's called election fraud. 99Forever May 2016 #115
That is what sore losers always say Demsrule86 May 2016 #119
She's not famous for soaring oratory. She's respected for being smart ecstatic May 2016 #116
I guess more people voted... Demsrule86 May 2016 #117
. baldguy May 2016 #120
Simple answer. Her fans aren't interested in what she says, only in her status. JudyM May 2016 #122
She does not need the rah rah stadium filled. She has 3M popular vote advantage, now add WA riversedge May 2016 #127
The better question is if Sanders is a great candidate who has big rallies and he is unable Thinkingabout May 2016 #128
Because they have better things to do? Proud Public Servant May 2016 #129
Because she is a terrible lancer78 Jun 2016 #131
Her campaign strategy has been smaller venues with more one on one connection. Lucinda Jun 2016 #133
yes one on one connections like telling azurnoir Jun 2016 #134
The two things are not in conflict. Common sense changes to gun laws aren't in any way Lucinda Jun 2016 #136
ummmhmmm I'm sure she thoroughly explained that to both crowds azurnoir Jun 2016 #138
Yeah right -- that and the behemoth machine called the democratic ESTABLISHMENT BigBearJohn Jun 2016 #144
If Bernie is such a great candidate, why isn't he filling barrow-wight Jun 2016 #135
He would be if voting wasn't being suppressed BigBearJohn Jun 2016 #145
Lol! barrow-wight Jun 2016 #146
You should be laughing, you got the best candidate money can buy BigBearJohn Jun 2016 #147
Lol barrow-wight Jun 2016 #148
Rich people don't go to political conventions. passiveporcupine Jun 2016 #137
Bingo marions ghost Jun 2016 #142
Its called jimw81 Jun 2016 #143
Here's the stadium Bernie filled in my town last week: ucrdem Jun 2016 #149
Different sort of candidate. Orsino Jun 2016 #150
Hillary voters don't need to hear reassuring talking points. We're more confident than that. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #152
Crowds are not votes: as we have seen: winning elections is very hard work with lewebley3 Jun 2016 #153
super large venues and stadiums cost big bucks to put on BlueStateLib Jun 2016 #156
Because she realized that having huge rallies wasn't an effective tactic in 2008 mythology Jun 2016 #158

mooseprime

(474 posts)
2. who'd want to stand in line
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:01 PM
May 2016

when the message is "more of the same"? and, it comes from someone whose words can't be trusted in the first place

ContinentalOp

(5,356 posts)
11. Some say he's ineligible
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:08 PM
May 2016

because he's a Canadian citizen. Of course the establishment has rigged the system against him because they're scared of our Bieber revolution.

Others say he's too young. Fine, throw away the millennial vote and ignore the stadiums full of Beliebers. See how well you do in the GE if you ignore us.

YouDig

(2,280 posts)
14. The corporatist oligarchs must be desperate. They keep framing him for DUI and reckless driving.
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:11 PM
May 2016

It's a conspiracy!

barrow-wight

(744 posts)
94. Hillary has no fans at all.
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:31 PM
May 2016

Nope. They're all Brock Trolls according to some on here.

I guess the phrase should be Brock in a Sock.

ContinentalOp

(5,356 posts)
108. I have over 5000 posts and only a few hundred maybe are from this year.
Tue May 24, 2016, 05:34 PM
May 2016

#berniemath! Thanks for your interest though. Flattering!

Arkansas Granny

(31,483 posts)
4. Why mess with a winning strategy? With smaller, more intimate rallies and meetings
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:01 PM
May 2016

she has managed to get more popular votes, pledged delegates and super delegates than her opponent.

Yurovsky

(2,064 posts)
47. All the excitement of a funeral home viewing...
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:51 PM
May 2016

Most folks would rather stay home. She represents a giant step backwards, gee, I don't know why people aren't excited...

Yurovsky

(2,064 posts)
85. She's gotten way fewer votes than Obama in 2008...
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:05 PM
May 2016

after the SS Goldman Sachs runs aground on election night come back and tell,me about how her peeps got out and voted...

All the money in the world, all the name recognition and ALL of the party machinery behind here and yet she still struggles to win states after the voters have been told she's inevitable...

 

JFKcrat

(28 posts)
71. Untrue
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:20 PM
May 2016

If you proportionally adjust caucus wins for a popular vote standard they're basically even. Actually, depending on the chosen methodology, it's either even or Bernie has a lead.

PAMod

(904 posts)
84. I doubt it -
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:02 PM
May 2016

Caucuses, by their nature, are dominated by activists, which tend to be (in our party) more liberal than the voting population. In other words, the numbers can't be extrapolated accurately.

Response to PAMod (Reply #84)

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
6. Because that doesn't make one a good candidate
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:02 PM
May 2016

Seriously. What does the ability to fill stadiums at rallies have to do with winning elections?

His large rallies are in the 20K-30K range. Voting turnout in most primary states is in the hundreds of thousands. (It's lower in the caucus states, which may explain why he's doing better in those.)

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
25. Maybe you should remember logic 101?
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:30 PM
May 2016

I didn't say "good candidates can't fill big arenas". I said "filling big arenas doesn't make one a good candidate", and thus, "not filling big arenas does not make one a bad candidate".

Clinton's campaign is getting people to the polls, which is the one and only test of a campaign. Rallies can be useful in that, sometimes, but they aren't particularly a sign of a candidate's electoral strength.

rock

(13,218 posts)
82. Just sayin' what?
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:57 PM
May 2016

Clinton has 14 million votes. Bernie has 10 million votes. Maybe rather than concentrating on getting attendees to rallies ... Er, never mind. BSers have real problems with counting.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
54. That "more votes" meme has been shown to be deceptive. There's a thorough post on it
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:00 PM
May 2016

But for example in many states where Bernie won by Yuuuuuge margins, he got no votes because they were caucus states. He won Washington by somehting like 72% to 29%. . and for winning by 40% in a state of 72 million people, he got ZERO votes.
So, that should tell you something about those squishy totals. Doesn't take a big brain to figure that out, so I hope you won't be posting that bull sh*t again.

Response to Recursion (Reply #6)

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
92. Really
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:28 PM
May 2016
You would think that at least the parents who support Hillary - especially parents of daughters - would jump at the chance to take their kids to see the candidate who they believe will be the first female president of the U.S.

Why do you think that? She's not a particularly good speaker. Even if I had voted for her I doubt I would have gone to a rally.

Let me turn this question around to you: in a state where 1.5 million people turn out for the Democratic primary, why do you seem so convinced that the ability to get 50 thousand people to show up to a rally matters?

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
151. Here's why 50,000 rally attendees matter.
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:16 PM
Jun 2016

Because:
(1) Bernie fills the stadia over and over again.
(2) The people who attend have friends, who get to be regaled with tales of the big rally.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
154. OK, but it's not actually translating into votes
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:23 PM
Jun 2016

I mean, ultimately that kind of speaks for itself, right?

Fuddnik

(8,846 posts)
7. Give her credit,
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:03 PM
May 2016

She did fill up a couple of Wall Street Corporate Auditoriums. And got paid hundreds of thousands to boot!

Hell, Donald Trump probably paid them to attend his weddings.

Ino

(3,366 posts)
121. Not saying he did... but he did.
Tue May 24, 2016, 09:30 PM
May 2016
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/trump-hillary-clinton-had-no-choice
During the debate, Fox News moderator Chris Wallace asked Trump why he donated to Clinton, who is likely to be the Democrats’ nominee in 2016. Trump, who has said his billions make him independent and immune to influence-peddling, said he wanted to curry favor with the Clintons and received special favors.

“I’ll tell you what, with Hillary Clinton, I said, ‘Be at my wedding,’ and she came to my wedding,” Trump replied. “You know why? She had no choice, because I gave.”

Trump went on to say that he donated money to the Clinton Foundation, but was disappointed by how it was spent. “I didn’t know the money would be used on private jets going all over the world,” he said.

hack89

(39,171 posts)
10. Looks like she picked a better strategy
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:06 PM
May 2016

Are you really second guessing the woman who is kicking Bernie's ass? The better question is why did Bernie do rallies instead of the hard work of retail politics like Hillary.

hack89

(39,171 posts)
15. She didn't do rallies. We all know that
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:14 PM
May 2016

But considering her success I don't understand why it reflects poorly on her. She clearly did the hard work needed to connect with the voters. Bernie didn't.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
38. I think its more like
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:41 PM
May 2016

its not so important of who votes rather who counts those votes

Some shit is going on here and we need to find out what it is

hack89

(39,171 posts)
48. So every state's results are questionable?
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:52 PM
May 2016

Or just the ones Bernie lost? Don't bother - I think I know the answer.

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
53. She didn't have to do any work to get the voters she has now
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:00 PM
May 2016

She had them from the very beginning. She's had them since Bill ran for POTUS. It's been Bernie's job to take them away from her from day one, and he's been mighty successful. Some people are just not open to getting involved enough in politics to learn anything new, so they still cling to what they know. He's also gotten young people involved in politics and that's something Hillary can't do. She is not inspirational. She thinks somehow she can rally young people to her if she wins the nomination?

I don't think so. This is her last hurrah. If she doesn't win this time, the future is going to the youth vote.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
13. Many Bernie supporters are young people and students who have plenty of time on their hands
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:10 PM
May 2016

to go to fun events like those rallies.

Many Hillary supporters on the other hand are struggling to get by, maybe working two jobs, and have family commitments. These folk don't have the privilege of being able to spare 8 hours to wait on line to get into a political rally.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
28. Barack Obama certainly had a lot of young and enthusiastic supporters.
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:35 PM
May 2016

The contrast with Bernie was that he was actually able to attract significant support from nonwhites.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
44. Wait..... pointing out that Bernie has not been able to connect with racial minorities,
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:46 PM
May 2016

as Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton have been able to do, is somehow "racist"?

jillan

(39,451 posts)
49. I have been to 2 Bernie rallies. Both of them were a mixture of people, young and old.
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:53 PM
May 2016

Every color of the rainbow.

I am a mixed race.

YES your post is very racist.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
52. So you consider this NY Times article to be "racist"?
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:57 PM
May 2016
Why Sanders Trails Clinton Among Minority Voters

Asked during a January debate why he trailed Hillary Clinton so badly among minority voters, Senator Bernie Sanders said he would gain ground once those voters became familiar with his track record and agenda on the economy and criminal justice.

Two months later and on the eve of another important primary voting day, Mr. Sanders remains on the wrong side of a yawning gap among African-Americans even as his performance among whites has been impressive.

One important reason for this may be that African-Americans have experienced somewhat more favorable economic trends in recent years. While still worse off than whites, African-Americans have seen their jobless rate fall a little further than whites have, relative to a prerecession average. Furthermore, the decline has been faster for African-Americans in the last year.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/03/22/business/economy/why-sanders-trails-clinton-among-minority-voters.html?referer=
 

cwydro

(51,308 posts)
17. I wouldn't wait in line to see anyone, and I hate crowds.
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:18 PM
May 2016

Hillary's supporters are showing up where it counts: at their voting precincts.

Tarc

(10,472 posts)
18. Because we have...jobs? Family? Other commitments?
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:20 PM
May 2016

As much as I heart Hillary, standing in a place listening to a speech is not my idea of time well-spent.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
114. And also, you don't go to your usual computer station
Tue May 24, 2016, 08:54 PM
May 2016

To find out that the state voting officials shut it down.

Or that your password has been purged and you cannot use the computer anymore!

But of course, if anything like what has happened to us Progressives happened to the Big Foundation/StateDepartment money laundry expert, we would hear about it 24/7.

Tarc

(10,472 posts)
87. Yea, with this handy-dandy contraption called a "smartphone", my dear silly grasswire
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:10 PM
May 2016

Your Bitter Bettys are sharp today.

 

anotherproletariat

(1,446 posts)
19. It's a different demographic. My parents, for instance (and all of their friends), would never in a
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:21 PM
May 2016

million years wait in line to see anyone at a political rally, even though they are very into politics. However, they would (and did) gladly spend 5K a plate to go see Hillary at a much more civilized fundraiser.

Even for those who don't have the money, many people in the older age groups tend to avoid large crowds and anything involving waiting. I have an uncle (repub...voting for Hillary as the lesser of 2 evils which is good enough for me), who pays me to take his kids to Disney, because he hates lines so much. It's really a demographic thing.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
58. The people who go to Bernie rallies are not just young people. That has been documented.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:05 PM
May 2016

I guess there are older people who can actually still get inspired for the country, and still have hope for seeing the best happen.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
59. Honestly, I don't see most of them. I started using ignore and have not looked back.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:06 PM
May 2016

It makes the place a whole lot nicer. Only the intelligent people who are really looking for answers and have something to contribute show up on my screen. The others . . . . .buh bye!

BigBearJohn

(11,410 posts)
29. Oh have no worry Hillaritès. If the establishment could ramrod a moron
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:35 PM
May 2016

like GWBush into the Oval Office, Hillary is a shoe-in.

Power to the people. Yeah, right.

 

w4rma

(31,700 posts)
30. That margin disenfranchises caucus states and independent voters in closed primary states. (nt)
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:36 PM
May 2016

WI_DEM

(33,497 posts)
42. Not according to this article:
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:45 PM
May 2016
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/05/19/yes-hillary-clinton-is-winning-the-popular-vote-by-a-wide-margin/

Besides caucuses are, on the whole, much more undemocratic than primaries. Case in point, in Nebraska Bernie won the caucus but a few months later there was a primary which had a bigger turnout than the caucus and Hillary won. I'd argue that if some of these states had primaries instead of caucuses that Hillary would have won some of them.
 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
65. blah, blah, blah, excuse, excuse, excuse. . . . . . those vote totals mean almost nothing
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:12 PM
May 2016

any rational person who looks at the way they do it knows that.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
61. She isn't. Go read the post about that vote count.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:10 PM
May 2016
They don't give any votes in caucus states. So, Bernie won by 40% in Washington (72% to 29%) and for winning by a 40% margin in a state of 72 million people, he got ZERO votes. And he won a lot of caucus states and got zero votes for them. So that vote count means almost NOTHING. And that is what you base your whole schtick on, almost NOTHING.

PufPuf23

(8,688 posts)
76. You might want to correct that WA has 7.2 million population, not 72 million.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:28 PM
May 2016

Otherwise I support Sanders and agree with most of which you say.

Thanks.

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
157. And lost the primary handily.
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:35 PM
Jun 2016

Sanders has won fewer primaries (open and closed) than Clinton has won just open primaries. Sanders does really well in low turn out caucuses, but does poorly in primaries unless they have a low percentage of black and Hispanic voters.

Jarqui

(10,110 posts)
31. Rich folks have been paying a fortune for years to hear her speak!!
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:36 PM
May 2016

There just aren't enough of them to go around any more.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
69. I know, isn't that funny. The anointed one who was supposed to have SO MUCH MONEY
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:18 PM
May 2016

that everyone else would cower and shake . .. . .has run out of donors because they're all tapped out. She even stole all that money from the states she was supposedly helping them to raise for their candidates. . . she is so low she had to start begging from GOP donors.

Bernie's having no problem though. And since he gets his money from us, that's who he'll work for. And unless you gave Hillary over a Million, she isn't going to be working for you. Period!

I never understand how people can support someone who works against their own self interests --- just like those poor voters in the south who keep voting in Republicans who just make them poorer, the Democrats are doing the same thing and thinking how clever they are for doing it. Talk about mixed up.

Jarqui

(10,110 posts)
91. It confounds me as well. But maybe I'm a hypocrite there because I'm
Fri May 20, 2016, 10:18 PM
May 2016

having a really tough time warming up to Hillary while between Trump and her, I'd like to believe she would make the better president.

I've asked myself: is it the lying, the flip-flops, the dirty tricks, Republican-lite, selling out to the 1% or her making me feel like she'll go to war? Maybe it's all of that stuff. Or maybe it's as simple as: I simply just can't stand her.

Looks like I'll be holding my nose and dry heaving until November.

He loved Big Brother

(1,257 posts)
33. This is reaching. Come on.
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:37 PM
May 2016

Grow up. Trump fills stadiums. Is he now suddenly a good candidate?

People flock to the cult of personality. They did it with Obama, they did it with Dean, they do it with Bernie.

Hillary is not a cult of personality. That doesn't reflect on her ability to run the nation.

all american girl

(1,788 posts)
125. Yes, Obama won, but he didn't start off with big rallies
Wed May 25, 2016, 08:14 AM
May 2016

He started off with meeting people in Iowa, in places like my old junior high school gym, talking and meeting a handful of people like my stepdad and BIL. I don't recall Bernie doing much of that. Sometimes actually listening and talking to people means they will make the effort of go vote for you. It seems to be working for Hillary...why change a formula that's working. Bernie's way doesn't seem to be getting him more votes that Hillary.

I know that all you want to do is show how popular Bernie is with his big rallies, in part trying to show how unpopular Hillary is...and it's nothing but a cheap shot...but when all is said and done, she has far more delegates than he does, so it really doesn't matter in the end.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
73. It's not about good or bad candidate, it's about candidates who inspire the voters
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:20 PM
May 2016

Those who can't inspire the voters means they are not in touch with them. Hillary is WAY out of touch with the people. How can you represent their interests if you don't have a clue about them?

 

tonyt53

(5,737 posts)
35. Because she isn't going to only where her cheerleaders can get to without their mothers driving them
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:38 PM
May 2016

Mike Nelson

(9,903 posts)
41. I think she has...
Fri May 20, 2016, 04:44 PM
May 2016

...just plain supporters - not the "adoring" kind. Not fans. They vote. They aren't the rally type, most of them...

LenaBaby61

(6,965 posts)
77. Personally ....
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:30 PM
May 2016

I've never cared for huge crowds, but if there are those who want to attend their favorite pols rallies, it's all good. Hillary Clinton received my California primary ballot vote last week via the US Post Office.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
68. even if one hedge fund voter has $10M to donate, they still only have 1 vote
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:16 PM
May 2016

your statement makes no sense when you consider the Hillary groups are smaller, but the number of votes she has is much, much bigger.

Remember, Hillary has more Primary votes than Trump as well....Republicans are NOT losing hedge fund voters...not by a long shot. So your post makes even less sense.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
63. How's filling those arenas working out for Bernie and the final tally?
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:12 PM
May 2016

I think you think that crowd always = the same number of votes and the crowds?

oasis

(49,151 posts)
90. She prefers one on one contact with folks from all levels of society.
Fri May 20, 2016, 09:38 PM
May 2016

Hill doesn't do speeches in front of stadiums fill with kids who are not much concerned with policy details. Half of them won't make it to the polls anyway. We already know that.

 

w4rma

(31,700 posts)
97. Hillary doesn't spend any time whatsoever with anyone who doesn't write a large check to her. (nt)
Sat May 21, 2016, 05:45 AM
May 2016

oasis

(49,151 posts)
98. She's been speaking to folks in shops, small businesses
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:05 AM
May 2016

and installations across the country for this entire primary season. There's plenty of tv footage of Hillary engaging with with average citizens and factory workers.

KingFlorez

(12,689 posts)
74. Sanders is losing because his strategy to talk at people failed
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:22 PM
May 2016

Clinton talks to people, Sanders talks at them. He deliberately avoided a retail strategy and opted to go with a less up close approach.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/hillary-clinton-gambles-choosing-small-events-over-huge-rallies-n575311

Take the New York primary, for example. In the week leading up to the vote, Sanders held three huge events in Manhattan, Brooklyn and the Bronx.

Clinton instead focused on retail stops and smaller rallies. On the night of Sanders' Washington Square Park mega-event, Clinton spoke to about 1,000 people at a public housing community center in the Bronx.

Ironically enough, Sanders did not win any of the boroughs in which he held his largest gatherings.

Response to BigBearJohn (Original post)

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
79. Very true, why isn't Sanders three million more votes than Hillary and he
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:34 PM
May 2016

Doesn't have as many delegates, big crowds did not work for him.

apnu

(8,722 posts)
78. Because Hillary does not campaign that way.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:30 PM
May 2016

Its not her M.O. it is Bernies to a certain degree. In politics if one wants to throw big rallies to show support, they always book venues smaller than the expected crowd size. you can tell Bernie does this because every single one of his rallies has overflow people. This is campaigning 101 stuff.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
80. Monster Truck Jams, wrestling, gun shows, Trump, etc., fill venues with white people too.
Fri May 20, 2016, 05:34 PM
May 2016

Not sure that's good.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
109. See what last Saturday's Saturday Night Live's opening skit
Tue May 24, 2016, 05:39 PM
May 2016

Says about Hillary and her "Wins"

Oh and the skit is funny as well.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
86. I've supported her twice
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:07 PM
May 2016

and I have absolutely ZERO interest in attending a rally for her or any other politician.

Seriously -- why? Why on earth would I want to go queue up to see a politician make a speech in a stadium? The whole thing seems dumb.

VOX

(22,976 posts)
88. Why didn't FDR pack 'em in like the Nuremberg rallies?
Fri May 20, 2016, 06:17 PM
May 2016

I mean, what a loser. The other guys put on such a great show, which is why they really went places.

Response to BigBearJohn (Original post)

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
102. Big rallies cost money, now that Sanders funds is getting low and since Hillary has been on the
Sat May 21, 2016, 10:15 AM
May 2016

campaign trail and they know how to conserve money to fight on to another day.

democrattotheend

(11,605 posts)
111. Expensive fundraisers cost money too
Tue May 24, 2016, 07:19 PM
May 2016

People who pay $100,000 to attend a fundraiser probably expect decent food and premium liquor to go with it. That ain't cheap.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
112. And these same fund raisers has made its way to Sanders when he was running for Senator, Hillary
Tue May 24, 2016, 07:22 PM
May 2016

donated $10,000 to Sanders, campaigns cost money.

democrattotheend

(11,605 posts)
110. Because she doesn't excite and inspire that way
Tue May 24, 2016, 07:17 PM
May 2016

I had a dream a couple weeks ago that she won, and in it I felt relieved but not excited. At least, not excited the same way I was in 2008 or 2012. And I probably won't be. To be fair, I knew the night I stood in Times Square watching Obama's victory speech in 2012 that it would be a long time before I felt that way again, because politicians like Obama just don't come along that often.

Hillary is a very intelligent, competent, and tenacious leader who shares many though not all of my progressive ideals, and concerns about her hawkishness aside, I think she will do a good job as president. But she just doesn't inspire me or make me feel what is possible, and I think that's how a lot of people feel. There are a lot of things I admire about her and I have no problem supporting her if she is the nominee. If I could afford the hefty cost of admission, I would be happy to have the chance to meet her in person. But I just don't think I would sit through 2 hours of traffic to drive 20 miles and then stand in a 3-4 hour line to hear her speak like I did the night before the 2008 election.

Demsrule86

(68,351 posts)
119. That is what sore losers always say
Tue May 24, 2016, 09:23 PM
May 2016

There has been no fraud...Bernie simply lost to Hillary Clinton. Oh well.

ecstatic

(32,566 posts)
116. She's not famous for soaring oratory. She's respected for being smart
Tue May 24, 2016, 09:10 PM
May 2016

strong, and knowledgeable. She's not a natural politician with the charisma and everything else that comes naturally for her husband, president Obama, and even Sanders.

I think she'll fill stadiums once she's president, but not until then. For now, she's won the most important metric: the popular vote.

riversedge

(69,722 posts)
127. She does not need the rah rah stadium filled. She has 3M popular vote advantage, now add WA
Wed May 25, 2016, 08:23 AM
May 2016

state to those millions. Why waste money like Bernie does?? Fills Bernie's ego is what is does.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
128. The better question is if Sanders is a great candidate who has big rallies and he is unable
Wed May 25, 2016, 08:28 AM
May 2016

To turn those big rallies into votes? What is the problem, his campaign has spent lots of money and has not gotten the results.

Proud Public Servant

(2,097 posts)
129. Because they have better things to do?
Wed May 25, 2016, 08:39 AM
May 2016

I am in many ways the right demographic for Hillary, although i'm a Bernie supporter (50-something, lifelong Dem, upper-middle class). My friends and family are in a similar demographic, and indeed are Hillary supporters, some quite passionately so.

But there's no way I'm going to a rally for Bernie, and there's no way they're going to a rally for Hillary. We're busy people with plenty of access to information (and YouTube), and we've all been around long enough to know that political change doesn't come from filling stadiums full of people (Nuremberg notwithstanding). Rallies mean nothing, change nothing, and are generally a huge pain in the ass to attend (hell, I won't even go see my favorite bands in arenas, and I love music way more than I love politics).

Long story short: I'm too old for that shit. And "too old for that shit" seems to describe the Hillary demographic to a T.

 

lancer78

(1,495 posts)
131. Because she is a terrible
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 03:04 AM
Jun 2016

campaigner. And pragmatic people ( HRC Voters) are usually not driven by emotion but rather logic. BS supporters are much more emotional and fired up, which can be a good thing.

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
133. Her campaign strategy has been smaller venues with more one on one connection.
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 03:06 AM
Jun 2016

Seems to have worked brilliantly.

azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
134. yes one on one connections like telling
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 03:31 AM
Jun 2016

Black urban voters how she's all for gun control and then mere days later telling rural white voters how she's all about 2nd amendment rights

Pretty gosh darn hard to make connections like that in a large arena

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
136. The two things are not in conflict. Common sense changes to gun laws aren't in any way
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 04:13 AM
Jun 2016

contradictory to 2nd amendment support. But I'm sure you already know that...

BigBearJohn

(11,410 posts)
144. Yeah right -- that and the behemoth machine called the democratic ESTABLISHMENT
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 05:17 AM
Jun 2016

using all of its power and wealth to manipulate the whole process. Brilliant? No, crooked is more like it.

passiveporcupine

(8,175 posts)
137. Rich people don't go to political conventions.
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 04:16 AM
Jun 2016

But they will sometimes attend those high dollar fund raiser dinners, like the one Clooney held for her.

Orsino

(37,428 posts)
150. Different sort of candidate.
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:10 PM
Jun 2016

Sanders' campaign is a bit more people-powered, and his progressive message is new to many people who would want to see it in person.

 

lewebley3

(3,412 posts)
153. Crowds are not votes: as we have seen: winning elections is very hard work with
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:19 PM
Jun 2016

a good plan: as Obama said in his speech: Hillary won the nomination
with experience and good planning. She went after the supper delegates
long before the Primaries started. Hillary and Dem party know how to win
elections.


The people at Sander rallies are lazy, and do not show up to vote, they
don't go to Dem party events, because they cannot be counted on:

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
158. Because she realized that having huge rallies wasn't an effective tactic in 2008
Thu Jun 2, 2016, 12:38 PM
Jun 2016

She changed to an approach more suited (pantsuited?) to her personality. And given that she's easily winning the race, it seems like a good plan. The nomination is won on delegates not rally size.

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