2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumEugene Robinson - "Sanders Is Playing With Fire"
While the Wall Street Journal has been running a series of editorials that have very supportive of Bernie Sanders, folks like Eugene Robinson are arguing that Bernie's attacks on the Democratic party and the election process are not just damaging to the efforts to win the White House, but to Democratic efforts to take back Congress.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2016/05/20/sanders_is_playing_with_fire_130618.html
WASHINGTON -- Bernie Sanders is playing a dangerous game. If he and his campaign continue their scorched-earth attacks against the Democratic Party, they will succeed only in one thing: electing Donald Trump as president.
I say this as someone who shares much of Sanders' political philosophy; I too, for example, see health care as a basic right. He has run a remarkable and historically significant campaign, pulling the party to the left and pumping it full of new progressive vigor. His crowds are almost as big as Trump's and perhaps even more enthusiastic. Most important, he has brought legions of young people into the political process.
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Given this context, Sanders and his campaign are being shamefully irresponsible. Rather than accept defeat, they claim loudly that the party's nominating process was rigged against them. They display a degree of entitlement that they have not earned.
They rail against "unfair" and "undemocratic" party processes -- unless they work in Sanders' favor. So party conventions -- such as the one last weekend in Nevada, at which Sanders tried and failed to win a couple of extra delegates through parliamentary maneuvering -- are bad. But holding caucuses, which have limited participation, instead of primaries is good, because Sanders did very well in caucus states.
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)You know, the news outlet that in twenty-four hours, runs nearly twenty anti-Sanders hit pieces?
TomCADem
(17,387 posts)He used to be an Assistant Editor. Maybe he is back on the editorial staff again.
TomCADem
(17,387 posts)...who are suddenly attacking Bernie while the so-called conservative media, Fox News and the Wall Street Journal, have been defending him from such attacks. Eugene Robinson is a columnist for the WaPo and a frequent guest on Rachel Maddow.
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)I believe Hayes is pro-Bernie but dare not speak his name admiringly or respectfully. I hate MSNBC for turning good people into yellow journalists with no integrity. Watch CNN and Dana Bash instead.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)He seems to be the least biased, plus I like the way he always seems secretly amused by it all.
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)I believe he is pro-Bernie but so mandated to support the MSNBC meme for Clinton that he can't show it. I might be wrong. I just feel that. His close friendship with Sam Seder supports my theory. But he really is annoying when he does do the anti-Bernie stuff. His topics are often more interesting than any other MSNBC host. Given that he does talk about and research other topics makes his show much more informative. His coverage of the water shortage in CA was really good.
DemocraticSocialist8
(396 posts)for Trump becoming President. When in reality it is their flawed candidate and the hubris of the Democratic Party establishment.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Whitehouse to Trump.
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)Slow spoken and sometimes lacks articulation. But an award-winning journalist who sometimes tells the truth. Still, name me one person on MSNBC (aside currently Mika and Joe(who is a republican) that says anything favorable to Sanders? You want to keep your job at MSNBC, follow their meme.
lovemydog
(11,833 posts)I don't mind that he won't concede until after the last primary.
But I think his campaign is irresponsible by now claiming the party's nominating process was rigged against him. Perhaps they'd have a decent argument if they weren't trailing by such a large number of votes and delegates and super delegates.
They agreed on the rules before they started the campaign.
It sounds like a basketball team losing by 20 with two minutes remaining, yelling about the officiating.
Samantha
(9,314 posts)The problem is they were never really good at hiding their maneuvers. THEY ARE NOT VERY SUBTLE.
During the very few months, the media ignored both Sanders and O'Malley. I wrote a piece here called the Big Ignore and I will never forget that time frame. The first states lines up to vote were states that would probably go to Hillary, the southern states where she was well known and had a big support community from African-Americans. During that time frame, voters in those states had never even heard Bernie Sanders' name, and probably were not familiar with O'Malley. But Sanders himself said during that time frame 50 percent of the Country had never heard his name, and it was the mission of the MSM to keep it that way as long as it could. Members of the MSM support the TPP and Sanders was the only politician openly and constantly extremely critical of it. The MSM did not like that....
Once Hillary had a series of wins in those states, immediately we heard she was inevitable. So they stage was set.
She got off to a wonderful start with a big lead with those southern states, and the battlecry was established.
However, throughout the rest of the campaign we recognized the dirty tricks. Many of us were not born yesterday.
The debate schedule was contested even though everyone but Hillary' campaign and DWS thought it was ridiculous. And it was.
There has been just too many things that have happened during this campaign (most of which I assume Brock and Penn initiated) that have been appalling.
Eugene Robinson is a wonderful columnist but he adheres to the establishment rules. Afterall, he needs to work too. He is being critical of Bernie Sanders for not dropping out before California votes and Hillary in 2008 refused to do the same thing. California was the state that turned things around for Bill Clinton when he thought he was losing, and Hillary refused to drop out before California voted. Now Bernie is doing what both Clintons did, but he is wrecking the Democratic. Right.
Sam
snowy owl
(2,145 posts)He didn't expect such an overwhelming reception by the American people. He was caught off guard and he's going for the gold. Unlikely he'll get it, but with every primary reinforcing the fact that half the people want change is enough. Let it proceed. Unity comes fast. Americans have short memories. All will be well. The more he brings Americans into elections, the better chance Hillary has of winning the ge. We can't be impatient She needs every single voter she can get. Bernie will help at the end but we have to let him finish the race.
Totally agree with your comment about Robinson. Sometimes I think he's tolerated by Matthews more than listened to. I really despise Matthews.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)You know, that Facebook thing all the kids are doing.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)In fact, from way before the beginning.
THAT is Bernie's argument - not so much that it is rigged against him. He just happens to be 'the other.' candidate.
Sky Masterson
(5,240 posts)Another bag of shit shill.
Justice
(7,185 posts)Why such vitriol?
Sky Masterson
(5,240 posts)Instead of letting this primary run its course he is adding his voice to the Bubble group-think of the MSM.
This is the same mass group think that conned us all into invading Iraq because of 9/11.
I would be okay with it if he stated that he was "With Her".
So yes, He is a shill
WhiteTara
(29,703 posts)Sky Masterson
(5,240 posts)and a bus runs one over then its nobody's fault but ER.
TomCADem
(17,387 posts)Is it possible that you just disagree with Eugene and that he is not some paid shill?
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/03/04/an-ode-to-my-berniebro-trolls.html
Sanderss many, many vocal fans on the Internet need to get it through their heads that people can disagree with them and not be monsters or corporate shills.
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But look. People feel passionately about Sanders. Fine. I can appreciate that. What I cannot appreciate is the imputing of foul and malevolent motives to those of us who dont feel passionately about him. And I just dont. I dont have anything against him, and Im glad he jumped in. But to me, his politics are much more gestural than concrete. He doesnt get his hands dirty.
News flash: There are people in this country, of whom I am one, who think Hillary Clinton has plenty of flaws but also just honestly think shes a more electable candidate than Sanders. And even more heretically, heres news flash number two: There are people in this country, of whom I am again one, who just honestly think that Hillary Clinton would be a better president than Bernie Sanders would be!
Sky Masterson
(5,240 posts)Douchebaggery seems to always follow it.
You can't berate a person and expect to change them.
Somehow I doubt that this article was meant to change anyone's mind because Clinton is NOT more electable than Bernie.
No one can produce any evidence of this "There are people in this country, of whom I am one, who think Hillary Clinton has plenty of flaws but also just honestly think shes a more electable candidate than Sanders."
I highly disagree with that assumption.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)" He doesnt get his hands dirty. "
If you mean he doesn't lie and cheat and arm twist, fine.
But, if you mean he doesn't walk the walk.....well,, then we will have to disagree..
DCBob
(24,689 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)DCBob
(24,689 posts)Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)pangaia
(24,324 posts)but his comments sure do.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)Interpretations differ.
PJMcK
(22,031 posts)At the beginning of his column, Eugene Robinson recounts how the pundits were wrong about the 2016 presidential candidates' campaigns and that conventional wisdom hasn't applied. But he then opines that Donald Trump is going to win the election if Senator Sanders doesn't stop expressing his views.
If Mr. Robinson says that the pundits have been wrong, then why should I listen to his point of view?
kcjohn1
(751 posts)No one from Sanders campaign has said the process was rigged against them. If anything they went out of their to point out NV was the exception and they have being treated to be by other state parties.
What Sanders has said they will look for ways to make the process more open to grow the party in the future
basselope
(2,565 posts)Bernie has been using, at worst, kid gloves.
He COULD attack the DNC and Clinton in many areas and he has CHOSEN not to.
SFnomad
(3,473 posts)nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)The ground work for why a weak candidate might lose in November.
Got it