How many women out there whose spouses have cheated on them like being called enablers?

[Jitter65]

I venture to say that about 90% of married women spouses have cheated on them unless they belong to the LSD cult of polygamous marriages. And a fair number of women have cheated also.

None of the spouses I know like being referred to as enablers...even where this might be the case if they are in special arrangement marriages...then it's not "cheating."

And when Bill was in office, i knew plenty of women who would have loved the chance to sleep with Bill.

[apcalc]

1. Oh yeah...that statement by Trump was by a man who himself cheated.

Not his fault ...was the wives' fault.

[Happyhippychick]

2. None but it's the expected response when a woman (wife) has been victimized

For those who have been victimized. It's not surprising.

[ret5hd]

3. 90% of men cheat on their spouses?

Link?

[hobbit709]

4. How many times do you have to be cheated on before you no longer put up with it?

I can't think of anyone I know that would have tolerated more than ONE instance of infidelity.

[seabeyond]

21. I doubt they would be having a conversation with you. I was curious a couple years ago and did a

Poll on DU asking if spouse was cheating would you want to know. About as many women cheat as men. Both men and women said they would not want to know. Just shy of a third. More would want to know. But I found that really interesting because I emphatically would want to know. My husband didn't want to know. I was surprised. So no, in this I cannot assume what another would do.

[Warren DeMontague]

87. That is weird.

I would want to know, but open communication is to my mind like the foundation of a good working marriage.

It is unimaginable to both my spouse and I that either would cheat on the other, but we got together relatively later in our lives and both worked a lot of shit out beforehand. I think that has something to do with it.

[seabeyond]

89. I agree. I was surprised myself. A good friend had said she would not want to know and I couldnt

Imagine. But was clear we walk life differently. And agree but getting married older.

[Warren DeMontague]

85. My armchair opinion is that they have a political and business partnership

I dont believe they have a marriage as, say, I would define it.

But that is their business, i never felt that the behavior of consenting adults, etc should matter to anyone except those directly involved. It points up a level of artifice which seems ridiculous to my mind- like a "keeping up appearances" thing more apropos to my grandparents era- but again, it is their business.

So to speak.

[LWolf]

5. Nobody would call me an enabler,

because I kicked my cheating spouse to the curb.

I'll be clear. I hate cheaters and cheating.

I'll assume someone has called Clinton an "enabler." Well, I can also clearly say that I despised her upon first exposure on tv in the primaries back in the 90s. You know; when they went on 60 minutes to talk about their marital problems and she said she wasn't any Tammy Wynette standing by her man while she did just that.

I knew then I didn't like Bill, because I already knew better than to put my trust in a cheater. And he proved me correct. I watched her, wondering if her supposed liberalism could overcome my distaste; it didn't. I wasn't sure at the time if she was an enabler, if theirs was more of a business marriage and more open, but they didn't want voters to know that so they wouldn't alienate the more conservative, or something else. I didn't really care, because the only thing I felt sure about was that she was not sincere.

Nothing has changed.

[IdaBriggs]

6. Who cares? In this case, her pride/denial subjects them to blackmail.

Private sex scandals are not a big deal for private individuals, but choosing to become a public figure changes the rules.

"Do X or this video of your husband getting down goes viral" is beyond plausible.

But frankly, it doesn't matter because she won't win.

[Exilednight]

7. where the fuck do you get 90%? this thread lost all credibility as soon as you post a bogus

Statistic to help make your argument.

[kcr]

11. So, that means the op is wrong and cheated on spouses DO like being called enablers?

I'm not sure about that.

[Exilednight]

17. murderers don't like being called murderers, but thats

Exactly what they are.

[kcr]

19. So, are you saying spouses who've been cheated on are cheaters?

Are people who've been murdered also murderers?

[seabeyond]

23. Worse than the cheater.... If woman. his is odd krc. Really. I am kinda fascinated here.

[kcr]

24. It is fascinating

He's the one who cheated. Because she doesn't leave the relationship, she's somehow doing something wrong. But she's not the one who chose to cheat. He did. Mind boggling.

[DLCWIdem]

90. Actually if you listen to Dr. Phil he says you have to earn your way out of the marriage

If you have kids, of course.

[phleshdef]

27. I think they are saying cheaters are the same as murderers

[kcr]

29. No. They're saying Hillary is a cheater enabler.

Which is stupid, because to enable, you have to know about what you're enabling to begin with. Cheating, by its very definition, involves deception. Spouses who are cheated on are the victim. Not the perpetrator. It's like saying a murder victim is the perpetrator and not the murderer themselves because reasons.

[riderinthestorm]

35. Bills numerous affairs during their marriage tag Hillary as an enabler

The list of women Bill had fucked around with ends with Monica Lewinsky (theoretically at least - I'm not convinced the Jeff Epstein friendship will be innocuous dammit).

Painting Hillary as some naive shocked wife is pretty silly.

By their own words Bill and Hillary didn't have an open marriage so if she's not an enabler (by not divorcing him for example), then what would you call her?

Enabler works pretty well for me.

[kcr]

37. They do no such thing. Anyone who thinks this way

means they don't know what enabling means, or they have no capacity for empathy.

The concept of enabling has no place in discussing infidelity. In the first place, people who are being cheated on have no idea they're being cheated on, so how can they be enabling it? When they find out, the pain is horrific. They are then victims of something they had absolutely no choice in. Again, no action on their part taking place. Every action has been on the part of the cheater. Choosing to stay in the relationship does not meet the definition of enabling because even in situations when the using the definition is appropriate, such as addiction, merely staying in relationships with the person isn't defined as enabling. So, calling Hillary an enabler because her husband cheated on her is moronic.

[floppyboo]

66. But did she really take no action?

Juanita Broaddrick tells a different story. How would you define enabler?

there's a more recent vid out - too long and painful to watch

[kcr]

70. I stand by my definition of enabler.

Responding to the right wing smear campaign was not enabling.

[floppyboo]

72. I was referring to the video where Clinton basically tells Broaddrick to shut up

that wasn't a response to a right wing smear. Not believing victims however does enable the perpetrator.

[kcr]

73. Except it was

Juanita Broderick is not credible.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

83. Because?

[seabeyond]

39. I do not believe in pointing the finger enabler. They werent Clinton choices. I believe adults own

Their own behavior. Are you telling me different? Now here choice to stay is not something I would do. Different for different reason. This is so basic that I cannot believe we are discussing this. If not pure hypocrisy we do not do this with all people that aren't responsible for other bad choice. Obviously exceptional expectation of Clinton. I do not do that either.

[riderinthestorm]

43. Sea, people stay in relationships for a boatload of reasons.

I'm not even going to try to unpack the Clinton marriage.

FWIW there's a lot of discussion about co-dependency in adult relationships that are toxic, abusive, or where one person is an addict, or has eating disorders etc.

Enabler or co-dependent work equally for me if that makes anyone feel better. I've got enormous sympathy for that situation (and for Hillary FWIW). I struggle with it daily with a drug addicted daughter. The definition of my role in our relationship isn't co-dependent or enabling but I've been to enough group counseling sessions to see the dynamic.

Sometimes its actually healthy to examine our part in a relationship. It takes 2 to tango. I don't buy for one minute that Hillary didn't know Bill cheated on her. I'm astonished anyone thinks that she didn't know.

[seabeyond]

46. I agree with you title. The thing Rider, I have not experience, I have with family addiction like u.

I am heavy into personal Acct with strong boundaries. More so than most. I get not all are willing or capable or think my position is correct. I also know about others trying to give me ownership of anothers behavior. I do not accept that. I wont do it to others.

[riderinthestorm]

58. Hillary owns only her own behavior. I'm not blaming her for Bill's affairs

I'm sorry if it came across that way.

I do hold her accountable for not taking some kind of action after the 3rd, 4th, 5th etc. Obviously we have no idea what their private relationship is but I've never been a fan of the public shame of political wives standing humiliated. And in Hillary's case, many times.

Notorious presidential philanderers have had spouses deal with it in different ways. Eleanor Roosevelt publicly broke with Franklin and rarely was in the same room with him again for example, channeling herself into numerous social work projects.

Hillary standing by Bill over and over gives him tacit cover for some pretty shitty behavior which he obviously feels makes it ok to cheat again. Lather, rinse, repeat. I do see it as enabling.

[seabeyond]

49. Back spasm. lol. I am flat on back. Typing one finger on kindle.

Trying to tap without too many words, lol. Sorry mess.

[riderinthestorm]

60. Owww!! Lol, I type one fingered on my phone

Cracks my kids up.

[kcr]

40. And also?

All this crap does is make people think it's all about irrational Hillary hatred. Because blaming a woman for her husband cheating on her doesn't get much worse. It's not a good look.

[riderinthestorm]

45. I don't blame Hillary for Bill's cheating. That's simply not true nt

[kcr]

48. It's certainly how you're coming across n/t

[riderinthestorm]

61. I don't think that. I'm sorry I haven't been clear nt

[notadmblnd]

42. The first time, they are a victim

the second, third, fourth and fifth time- makes one an enabler.

[kcr]

44. How do you figure?

I have to think it's not actually understanding the concept of enabling. Because that's not what enabling is. Enabling is covering for a persons actions so it makes those actions easier. Like calling in sick for them so they don't get fired when they've had a bender. Claiming their hangover is a migraine so other friends and loved ones won't press them to get help.

[notadmblnd]

50. If one stays with a spouse who is repeatedly cheating on them- one is allowing it

and enabling them to continue engaging in that behavior.

[kcr]

55. Baloney. Staying with a spouse who cheated does not allow further cheating.

Because cheating is still wrong. It didn't become less wrong after the first time. The cheater knows that cheating is still wrong. It is in no way enabling a cheater to cheat by merely staying with them. That logic does not follow. And you can in no way know what happened in a marriage where cheating happened. You don't know what steps the cheater took to convince the cheated on that it would never happen again. Because the victim chose to have faith it wouldn't happen again, and chose to forgive, did not "enable" further cheating. Such crap.

[notadmblnd]

56. I know it takes two damn people to make a marriage work

And that yes, if one continues to allow their spouse to go outside of the marriage for an intimate relationship with another in order to have their emotional and or sexual needs met, they are giving their permission for their spouse to do so.

[kcr]

59. How are they "allowing" it to happen?

I'm pretty sure that they'd rather their spouse not do that!

[notadmblnd]

63. As I said the first time one is a victim

but if one continues to stay with a spouse knowing they are repeatedly cheating on them- yes, they are enabling it. I don't' know how I can say it any clearer.

[kcr]

64. So no one should ever forgive the people in their lives or ever have trust or hope

One time and your'e out. For everyone. That's it. Man, all of our social support networks would whittle down to nothing really fast if we all conducted ourselves in that manner. People who are lucky enough to have and always have a large group can afford to operate this way, I guess. But most people will give chances. Even for some of the bigger transgressions. And yanking that away on the first strike is hard, especially if that person's been in your network a long time.

And no, I simply do not agree. Failing to invoke that first strike rule does not then make it your fault if they hit you a second time.

[riderinthestorm]

68. There's at least 8 women we know about

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/12/30/a-guide-to-the-allegations-of-bill-clintons-womanizing/

I'm not at all sure Bill Clinton's friendship and multiple plane rides on Jeff Epstein's Lolita Express won't turn up more.

[kcr]

71. Oh. I see.

Never mind. There's no point.

[notadmblnd]

91. Not if they engage in the same behavior over and over and over

How did we go from enabling to not forgiving for one indiscretion? If you are using this thread to gain approval for your own behavior- you're not going to get it from me.

[Exilednight]

28. no. you took a pretty big leap with that one.

[kcr]

31. Oh? Maybe you can explain. n/t

[Exilednight]

54. Just because someone enables someone to use drugs, it doesn't make them a drug pusher. Let's be hone

Hillary was not blind Bill's infidelity, she was complicit in helping hide it on more than one occasion.

[kcr]

57. Except no one calls enablers drug pushers, so.

And you know she knew about his infidelity before the fact how?

[Exilednight]

74. she would have to be pretty stupid if she didn't know. are you arguing

That Hillary is really that dumb?

[kcr]

75. What?

Seriously, I do not understand. I'm not being snarky, here. Do you think all people who've been cheated on are stupid? Am I supposed to think that people should know if they're being cheated on, therefore Hillary's really dumb if she didn't know? Because, no, I don't think she knew and I don't think that makes her really dumb. Because, see, most people who are cheated on didn't know while it was happening.

[Exilednight]

77. you seriously think she didn't know? have you ever seen a presidential vetting

Process from inside a campaign?

[Waiting For Everyman]

8. How many covered it up for them?

[AgerolanAmerican]

9. How many terrorized the other women while backing the cheater?

That is the very DEFINITION of an enabler.

[frustrated_lefty]

10. Stop making excuses.

[seabeyond]

13. Stop making excuses for Hillary Clinton not having done anything wrong? WTF? Lol. I don't get it.

[obamanut2012]

20. exactly -- wth

[seabeyond]

12. Exactly. Never having experienced that, I especially do not like women having the responsibility of

anothers behaviors and choices. Not how I walk life. I am responsible for my choice. I am not owning anothers... I have no say in it.

[JoePhilly]

14. Hillary caused every bad event in human history.

It used to all be Obama's fault, but those claims failed to stop him.

So all blame for all negative events on human history shifts to Hillary.

[Fumesucker]

15. Who are the women 90% of husbands are cheating with?

[cliffordu]

16. 90%?

Oh, yeah, I forgot.

Men R pigs.

[Skwmom]

18. It's not the consensual affairs that are at issue. It is the other plus the role Clinton herself

played.

Though as an old man in a position of authority the whole Lewinsky think was wrong.

[phleshdef]

26. He was 49. She was 25. That's acceptable.

As a personal preference, I prefer women within 5 years of my age. But there is nothing wrong with 49 and 25. 49 is NOT an old man.

[seabeyond]

30. Acceptable? Well, then you have the whole judging thing going in. Choices of two adults for sure.

Throw in president and her youth, and there is conversation. Not exploring that. It has nothing to do with Hillary Clinton. That is the point.

[phleshdef]

80. I think Bill had permission.

I've always believed they had an open marriage.

[Skwmom]

33. In 95 when it started she was 22.

[riderinthestorm]

47. Yes, in any other workplace that would be sexual harassment

President of the United States and a 22 yr old intern.

The power difference is ugly.

[phleshdef]

79. Which made him 46?

Not an old man.

[Fawke Em]

65. It is when one person is your work superior.

That's like those 22 year old teachers having affairs with their 17 and 18 year old students. No one will argue that a 17 year old is nearly an adult (even if he/she is not legally one) and that an 18 year old might have a lot in common with a 22 year old, but the teacher is in a position of power and shouldn't hold sway over his/her students.

[phleshdef]

78. My college didn't have policies against student/teacher dating

And I've had a few bosses I totally would have dated if they hadn't been out of my league. A policy against that only makes sense to me in the case of high school. Beyond that, I am perfectly ok with any relationship between consenting adults.

[reddread]

81. the party being cheated on was the American people

by someone who put it all at risk, and in fact completely disrupted the last few years of the 20th century.
He should have been fired for that.
He gave the Republicans LOTS of ammo,
and they gave us GWB.

[phleshdef]

22. Where do you get that sexist 90% bs from?

[riderinthestorm]

25. Wow, so much wrong with this post

1. Do you have a link for your stat that 90% of married men cheat on their wives? Anecdotally I only know one cheater - a SIL.

2. Its enabling if a spouse allows it to go on over and over. By Bill and Hillary’s own accounts they did not have an open marriage.

3. I haven't met a single woman who was/is sexually attracted to Bill Clinton. Do you have any kind of objective link that backs up your assertion that multitudes of American women wanted to fuck Bill Clinton? Personally the women I knew were/are pissed at his cheating and the entire debacle that lead to his impeachment.

A big turn off actually. While I did my dutiful best to defend.him from the stupid impeachment circus, I in no way shape or form found any of it sexy. My perception of Hillary’s deep humiliation had me pretty angry at Bill.

[seabeyond]

32. I especially agree with your last statement. Nt

[bettyellen]

76. As far as 3 goes, all three women who I know have met BC were totally

Blown away by his personality and totally charmed. Said he has a huge amount of magnetism that doesn't come across on TV and yep- they all would have had sex with him. They said it appeared pretty much everyone who met him was enamoured.

[JimDandy]

34. Being an enabler and not liking being called one are not mutually exclusive.

[Bluenorthwest]

36. If they are all cheating at 90% and having arrangements why do the 'Marriage is Sacred and must

be defended for the sake of Jesus' routine? If people want to have open marriages more power to them but they do not then get to claim everyone else has to follow the Bible.

Hypocrites are even worse than off the rack liars.

[imagine2015]

38. "i knew plenty of women who would have loved the chance to sleep with Bill." Most of them did!

That's a joke.

Hope you have a sense of humor.

[jillan]

41. It wasn't the cheating that made me kick my husband out. It was the lying about it after I knew.

I have too much respect for myself to live with someone who lies to my face.

I would have much more respect for Hillary if she showed more respect for herself.
When I look at Hillary, I cannot unsee that weakness.

Either she is weak because she chose to "Stand By Your Man" even tho he was lying to her and their daughter OR she stayed with him for political reasons. And if the latter is the case, that shows even more weakness.

[Fawke Em]

62. I always consider cheating the same as lying, anyway.

And I can't abide liars (which is why I don't like Hillary or Trump, for that matter).

In any case, as I said below, I think sometimes a one-time thing might be as a result of a bad period in the marriage and should be dealt with in counseling, but the spouse has to come clean first.

But serial cheating is an all-together different issue. That's a failure to seek counseling for the part of you that feels the need to conquer others while disrespecting your spouse at the same time.

Not to mention the constant worry about sexually transmitted diseases and unwanted pregnancies.

[99Forever]

52. Once is a mistake.

Twice is a habit.

Multiple times is an enabled lifestyle.

Sorry truth leaves you so fucking pained.

[Fawke Em]

53. A. Don't pull stats out of your ass. The figure is about 50 percent.

And B. I divorced my cheating spouse when I was a stay-at-home Mom with absolutely no money. When you can make the money Hillary can, there is no reason other than political to stay. If I could do it with no money (and an interruption in career, which means you can't just dive back in with a work-gap), then anyone can.

I do think spouses who stay with serial cheaters are enablers.

A one-time thing during a bad period might be forgivable (not to me) since it's usually a symptom, but serial cheating means the spouse has other issues that need to be dealt with.

[840high]

69. I had a newborn daughter and all

it took was one time. Divorced him.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

67. You don't need to "venture." Look it up. You can find percentages for both men and women

[eastwestdem]

82. Spot on. My dad was a serial philanderer, and I never once thought my mother was an "enabler".

She stayed with him until all of the kids had gone to college, then stood up for herself and left him. She is one of the strongest women I know. She knew that her kids would have a better life if she sucked it up and put on a happy face for a few years to give us the security of growing up in a stable home. We are all now highly successful, as is she. And all 5 of us and are families are very pro-Hillary!

Every time Trump brings up any of Bill's affairs, it makes us feel even more empathy for Hillary.

[Warren DeMontague]

84. "LSD Cult"?

i think you meant LDS, champ.

Your OP is weird for a lot of reasons, not the least of which being your last sentence.

[Nonhlanhla]

86. Calling Hillary an enabler is a neo-right wing argument

Conservatives love to say that something is wrong with a woman if her spouse cheats. Why can't she keep her man? That kind of logic. The idea that her decision to stay with Bill, which is none of your fucking business, makes her an enabler, is just the "progressive" version of the same blame-the-victim bullshit.

[karynnj]

88. I'm certainly glad I do not know your circle of friends - you err in thinking they are typical nt