True Progressives Are ABANDONING Hillary Clinton In Droves; She WON'T Win Them Back

[Segami]

Hillary Clinton gave an unusually direct interview on her campaign for the Democratic nomination and upcoming battle against GOP presumptive nominee Donald Trump. While Clinton said that she will be the Democratic Party’s nominee and not Bernie Sanders, she also expects Sanders’ help in the general election.

[Segami]

1. Hillary vs. Trump = November GE loss

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

5. This reminds me of Shannon O'Brian vs Mitt Romney.

She pushed Robert Reich out of the way, she wasn't well liked and it lost her the election.

If Reich, on whose campaign I had worked, had been our nominee he would have won.

But let's do it again on a national level.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

12. Based on what?

Which blue States is Trump going to win over? If Hillary doesn't lose any states that Obama won in 2012, the election will be over (and that's assuming that Hillary won't potentially flip any red states). The only "electability" indicator at the moment is national polling, which is virtually meaningless because the PV won't decide the election. Trump has to win 270 electoral votes from a combination of states to become POTUS, which means that he will have to flip a few states that Obama won in 2012. Which previous blue states might he flip? The only real way that I can see a Trump Presidency happening is if a significant number of progressives decide to sit out the Presidential election and/or vote third party, throwing the election to Trump.

[HooptieWagon]

20. Most, or all, of Obamas swing states.

For example, Obama won Florida in 2008 by just over 1%, and in 2012 by just over 0.5%. Not a chance in hell of Clinton getting the voter turnout Obama did, or winning the state. I think you can look at any state Obama won by 5% or less, and call it for the Republicans in Nov. And states Romney lost by 5-10% are probably now in play for the GOP.

[vi5]

29. "Only real way....if progressives decide to sit out"

Right. Already setting that up, I see.

It can't possibly be that she keeps all Obama's progressive and/or Democratic voters, but that independents in swing states that went for Obama in '08 or '12 by small margins won't vote for Hillary. That would be impossible.

Definitely got to be the progressives sitting out. Pretty much the ONLY way she loses. That other option can't possible happen, right?

[Proud Liberal Dem]

44. At the moment

progressives are the only ones really talking about not voting for Hillary if she is the nominee (which is all but certain she will be at this point). I think that most people will be so turned off by Trump that they either won't vote for him and/or won't vote (if they don't vote Hillary). What makes progressives so certain that she is going to lose against Trump? Many progressives speak about her losing to Trump with such fervor and certainty that one would think that they've seen the future in the flames.

[vi5]

47. Again, as per my last post....

Independents don't like her. I come from a family of independents who normally vote Dem and they all loathe her. They aren't going to vote for Trump, but they aren't going to vote for Hillary either. They are the ones sending out "Nobody 2016" memes and pictures and the ones most likely to say "Fuck it" in November. And they are the ones who will decide the swing states. They are the ones that voted for Obama because they wanted a change and who may end up voting for Trump because he represents a different kind of change. Those are the ones who are either going to sit it out or vote for Trump. Not progressives.

I'm not saying "Bernie or Bust" people don't exist because they do and I know plenty of them. But they are no die hard progressives, many didn't even vote for Obama, and have not voted for Dems previously and would not vote for Hillary no matter what anyway. They wouldn't even qualify as independents in previous elections because they didn't care about previous electionsNobody I know saying Bernie or Bust was a reliable Dem vote anyway and probably didn't even vote for Obama in 2008 or 2012.

But as always when it comes to the Democratic party, it's always going to be progressives fault anyway, so I should probably make my decision now to not bother engaging or arguing with people who are already convinced otherwise and have set up their scapegoat now because it absolves them and their candidate from any responsibility whatsoever if things go sideways.

[tularetom]

2. The establishments of both parties and the cable news people should be ashamed of themselves

They have managed to present the American people with a choice between the two worst possible candidates they could dig up

All this storm and fury, money spent, carloads of ink used, hours of idiotic babble on TV, and the best they can do is a buffoon and a crook. It would serve them right if nobody actually voted in the general election as a form of protest.

If they expect people to vote they need to give them better choices.

[Tarc]

3. Even Bernie himself says Clinton can win in the fall, the Busters are a statistical minority

These threads get cuter by the hour.

[highprincipleswork]

54. Keep telling yourself that. Must be a lovely illusion, to have been so convinced by Republican

propaganda since Ronald Reagan that all of a sudden, this nation, founded on REVOLUTION, and markedly successful under FDR, is a center Right nation.

Bah humbug!

[Tarc]

56. So Bernie Sanders is uttering Republican propaganda now?

[highprincipleswork]

57. I'm referring to your "statistical minority" bullshit. What a crock!

[Tarc]

61. The PUMAs thought they were a big deal in 2008; turns out they weren't

It'll be the same with the Busters in 2016.

[highprincipleswork]

63. No, turns out they voted for the other centrist in the race.

[Tarc]

64. I think the problem is that you're so far left, everything looks right-wing by comparison

Obama is not in any way a centrist.

[highprincipleswork]

65. Read the news sometime. Perhaps study history.

http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2016

Have you too bought into the concerted media propaganda since Ronald Reagan that we are a center right nation?

[Tarc]

66. The history book about how extreme leftism has no foothold in American politics?

That's one my favorite bedtime stories, bro, right up there with "Goodnight Moon".

[highprincipleswork]

67. Have you too bought into the concerted media propaganda since Ronald Reagan

that we are a Center Right nation?

The nation founded by Revolution?

When you ask people what they believe in, without giving them the media driven labels, they overwhelmingly vote in favor of Progressive ideas and Progressive policies and "Socialistic" programs like Social Security and Medicare.

I can't help it if the Democratic Party has decided since Ronald Reagan, with the help of people like the Clintons, to drive this country righyward in so many unnecessary ways. The further Right they go, the crazier the Republicans become. Ergo, Trump, and the rest of the clowns. As George W. Bush liked to say, "Heckuva job Brownie."

Now they seem poised to do it again, and that is why we who have been Democrats since the days when FDR and the New Deal actually were the guiding lights for the Democratic Party talk so loudly against taking that rightward position.

But yes, especially in the overall spectrum of Left versus Right, both Obama and Hillary are Centrists, in fact in the scheme of things, Right of Center.

http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2016

[Tal Vez]

4. Voters have until November to decide between Clinton and Trump.

A lot of the people who put their heart and soul into the campaign of Bernie Sanders need time to process their disappointment that his campaign did not succeed. Some of them had little prior experience with politics and thus little experience with experiencing political loss. People need to take a couple of tumbles in politics before they learn to recover quickly. The young folks, the folks who are new to electoral politics, these folks need a little time before they will be ready to make their next serious decision.

Those of us who know what we will do in November should treat with respect the folks who are disappointed by the failure of the Sanders campaign. Give them time to work things out for themselves. If they seem hostile now, it would be a mistake to do anything that might freeze or solidify those hostile feelings. They should be made to understand that the choices that they make in November will be their choices and that, if they prefer Trump to Clinton, then they can make that choice.

I am confident that with time people will find a way to vote in the their own best interests.

[onecaliberal]

13. Yes, we WILL vote our best interests. You'll have plenty of time to process the fact that you all

elected president trump.

[Kentonio]

25. Very nice post, thank you.

[dana_b]

50. Yep! More gen xers are way behind

Their parents. Suicide rates are way up. We will never catch up to them in prosperity.
So not all of Bernie's supporters are youngins who have never been through this before. We are older, jaded and know that neither Trump nor Clinton will be on our side and all of our lives will continue on the down ward slope with them.

[fun n serious]

6. She has done more for progressives than Bernie ever dreamed of.

STOP THE LIES

[Segami]

7. lol!....another dizzy post from the weathervane camp....

carry on.......

[fun n serious]

9. Wow!!!

[JudyM]

59. They must live in a world of funhouse mirrors. Clinton is so progressive.

[Katashi_itto]

36. Good Drugs?

[Duckfan]

58. Oh really?

You mean supporting that NAFTA thing that cost millions of American jobs?

[nolabear]

8. GOD I hate purity tests.

"True Progressives"? Last I looked I've been progressive for at least 45 years, and worked for campaigns political and otherwise that resulted in civil rights and laws that have benefitted millions. I'm sick of being insulted as though that counts for nothing.

[Maedhros]

19. Yet Bernie was insulted in exactly the same way.

His long and consistent record on civil rights was disparaged. "Not good enough, Bernie" was the talking point. Did you stand up for him then?

[nolabear]

39. Yeah, I did, although it's an entirely different point.

I'm perfectly willing to give credit where it's due, and to think about what I agree and disagree with in each candidate. I'd be embarrassed to do otherwise.

[kstewart33]

10. Oh, calm down.

That's ridiculous.

What are the 'true progressives' going to do? Vote for Trump?

Please stop posting this nonsense.

[Segami]

11. Yes, I agree,...

Please stop posting this nonsense......

[kstewart33]

14. Touche!

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. It might be news to you

But outside of seven states where it might impact stuff...they can vote for third parties with zero guilt whatsoever, but real world consequences regarding federal funds and help build a new movement (well not that new but I digress) outside the Democratic Party

[LondonReign2]

28. Vote for Trump? Of course not

Also, not vote for the Republican running on the other major party's ticket.

[JPnoodleman]

40. Likely, they will not vote. n/t

[forjusticethunders]

15. "True progressives"

I guess only 20% of blacks and 40% of Hispanics and women count then?

[Spacedog1973]

69. 3/5ths

To be accurate

[IdaBriggs]

16. Big Lesson from 2008: Hillary doesn't belong in the White House!

I want to try to like her. I kind of feel sorry for her with the FBI stuff. But then she opens her mouth, and I can't stand her all over again.

[vi5]

30. Ugh. I'm the same way....

Last week I was starting to resign myself to her as our candidate, and trying to look on the bright side and talk myself into doing what I need to do and get on board.

Then I watched her on Meet The Press (more accurately I should say I heard her speak on Meet The Press) and all those old feelings started coming back. I think the only way I'm going to get myself comfortable with what I inevitably will need to do in November is to just make sure I don't watch any TV in the next 5 months.

[Andy823]

18. I always laugh when I hear "TRUE"

When someone is trying to make stupid claims, like "the only TRUE religion", the only TRUE Democrats, the only TRUE Liberals, and of course the only TRUE Progressives. The problem is people come up with their own idea of what "TRUE" really means. Hell we had old Manny running around here for years making the claim that he and his gang of "anti" everything posters were the only TRUE Democrat, then Liberals, Populists, and of course now Progressives. Only problem was they, and they alone thought they could define who was and who was not part to the TRUE groups they laid claim to.

Funny thing, the same crowd, minus Manny who we all know finally got banned, took over the Bernie group and started their bashing and trashing they were so famous for on Obama, the party as a whole, and anyone who disagreed with them, and for some time now have turned their hate on Hillary, or anyone that disagrees with them and Bernie of course.

So you see your view of who is and who isn't a true Progressive is only your opinion. Anyone with half a brain knows that we have to beat Trump, and they will come together to do that, be they Progressives, Liberals, Democrats, or independents. Bernie is NOT the only hope we have, and he is not the only on that can beat Trump, regardless of what you and others may say, Hillary really can beat him, and even Bernie says that.

[randome]

23. .

[hr][font color="blue"][center]Stop looking for heroes. BE one.[/center][/font][hr]

[Thirties Child]

21. I've decided.

I'll vote for Hillary, but with a lot of sadness and with the knowledge I'm voting for a moderate Republican. I've done it before, cast my very first vote for Eisenhower, guess I can do it again. Of course, if I had voted then with today's insight, I'd have voted for Adlai Stevenson.

My hope, prayer, want, desire is that the progressive movement Bernie has exposed will grow and return the Democratic party to its FDR roots. I wonder sometimes if the Hillaryans don't know, don't remember what the party once was. Most of them have been Republicans then.

The self-satisfied, aren't-we-wonderful-for-choosing-the-winner comments on DU hurt a lot, make me wonder if I really want to vote for her. I won't sit this election out, will vote for Hillary, but with such a heavy heart.

[Cosmocat]

26. I have known for a year

that

1) I was voting Bernie in the primary (and I did)
2) I was going to be voting Hillary in the general (and I will)

The progressive movement you speak off will start to fade, quickly, once Bernie concedes. Because it isn't a "movement." It is a candidacy. I don't write that to knock him, he is genuine. But, all this energy behind him didn't really exist until he announced. Might have been there for Elizabeth Warren, maybe one or two other people.

But, that is it. There is no "movement' because there is no centralized element that is going to fight for these particular issues. It just popped during his campaign due to there being a strong voiced and genuine person to rally around in a year when the party was not united against a sitting R president.

Minus Bernie, it will pretty much just go back to what the democratic party has been for my adult life (the last 30 years) - democrats hiding in a corner scared of their own shadows, occasionally showing some spark on social issues, but totally worthless on pocketbook issues.

[Cosmocat]

41. Not if it is her and Trump

Maybe if Bernie could have pulled off the primary win AND won POTUS, there was a CHANCE of an actual movement, though progressives SERIOUSLY underestimate the power of conservatism to turn ANYTHING to shit, and there is no evidence that supports that they would not have turned the country on Bernie like they have any other D in our lives.

That said ... Hillary losing the general won't do anything for the progressive "movement."

There are endless stream of gutless puke dems to replace her, and again, you can count on one hand at best the number of fire brand progressives in the party now. The party is what it is - professional politicians, most of which are bought and sold.

Trump as POTUS is bad on all levels, his being a deranged meglomaniac, the supreme court ... Hillary is what she is, but that which she is is infinitely better than that.

[Thirties Child]

43. I so want the Democratic Party to return to its progressive roots

I agree that the elected Dems are spineless. During the Bush years I felt, yes, the Republicans are horrible, but the Dems aren't much better, the way they cave and go along. And that certainly includes HRC, who not only voted for IWR, but spoke in favor of it.

We no longer have a Democratic party, at least the party I remember back in my day. We now have a vacuum on the left, a vacuum I hoped the progressives could fill.

I'm afraid Philadelphia is going to be a disaster, lots of dissent, very possibly Chicago 1968. So hope that doesn't elect Trump, as Chicago elected Nixon. If that happens, the DNC can only blame themselves, although they won't.

[Cosmocat]

45. I fear it is over

the spine of the party in great part was the labor movement.

Rs and the general transition of our economy from one that makes things to one that pushes money, has taken the guts out of the party.

Honestly, thought it overwhelming debt based, the country simply is too affluent now. Not enough real jeopardy to properly focus the country.

THIS more than anything is why Trump is where he is - its fucking reality TV masticated into our politics, and one step away from our Government ...

[Thirties Child]

62. You are so wise.

I'm so sad. I'm an octogenarian, don't have that many elections left, hate to see the death of the party. Younger people --including late Boomers--haven't experienced what once was, so have no idea what we've lost.

[Cosmocat]

68. Yeah

I am pretty sure I will go to the next place with things about where they are now, like you.

That said, I do hold out hope for the current generation.

I know it runs counter to the prevailing view of them, and they absolutely don't have the same work ethic, etc.

But, I do think the young people today are in some ways a bit more grounded, a bit more level headed and in some ways more mature.

It won't look the same, but I am hopeful that possibly they can make a better way.

[Cosmocat]

22. I guess I am not "true"

I voted Bernie a month ago, and will vote Hillary the first Tuesday in November ...

[taught_me_patience]

24. The "True Progressive" purity test is in full force again...

[Skwmom]

27. People are tired of the BIG CON and young voters caught on to it a heck of a lot sooner than we ever

did.

[fasttense]

31. I wont be helping her like I did with Obama

The time for an economic conservative Democrat was 8 years ago. Another conservative Democrat will destroy this country.

The lesser of 2 evils is still evil.

[Buzz cook]

35. "No true Scotsman"

Great way to dehumanize people that don't agree with you. Keep up the good work.

[AtomicKitten]

37. Bernie doesn't owe Hillary or the Democratic Party a damn thing.

They have cock-blocked him at every turn, culminating in Hillary reneging on a final California debate.

She is an irretrievably compromised candidate, and she and they are on their own.

[Yurovsky]

46. I'm still wondering if the FBI will recommend an indictment...

Gen. Patreus was ruined by a much smaller security breach. But then again, the Clintons are not subjected to the same rules as lesser beings...

[JaneyVee]

42. 2 way street. Bye.

[MineralMan]

48. TRUE PROGRESSIVES™, eh?

OK, then. They're nae True Scots, laddy.

[hrmjustin]

49. True progressives huh.

What balderdash!

[beachbumbob]

51. True progressives won't allow a trump in the whitehouse

The other so called progressives hate America...they put ego over what is best for our country...

[emulatorloo]

52. Blah Blah BLAH Blah. True progressives won't enable Trump

And of course Bernie will campaign for her if she wins the nomination. Trump represents everything that Bernie rails against.

[chillfactor]

53. oh good grief!

do you have a link or are you just posting a nonsensical post....again!

[Duckfan]

55. No balderdash at all.

I'm a progressive and I left her(or Bill for that fact) lonnggggggg ago. And that's reality for millions of voters-not a manufactured theory of some kind.

[seabeyond]

60. Nu uh. You are a trip. Declare, if you don't vote Sanders not a "true" progressive. Fuck that.

Plain and simple, just fuck that. Not only is Clinton a progress but us voters who choose to vote for her are progressive, damn straight and you just simply do not get to define who we are. The obnoxiousness and arrogance of the Sanders supporter, I shake my head.