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George II

(67,782 posts)
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:32 PM Jun 2016

NBC News: "In '08, Sanders Endorsed Obama - Before Clinton Formally Exited Race"

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/08-sanders-endorsed-obama-clinton-formally-exited-race-n586556

As Bernie Sanders and his supporters argue that Hillary Clinton can't clinch the Democratic nomination on Tuesday - because superdelegates don't count until the convention - it is worth noting that Sanders endorsed Barack Obama two days after Obama crossed the magic number (pledged + superdelegate), saying he had become Democratic nominee.

And Sanders' endorsement of Obama came before Clinton had officially exited the 2008 presidential race.

"I plan to play a very active role," Sanders said of endorsing Obama, according to an interview in the June 5, 2008 Burlington Free Press. "I will do everything I can to see that he is elected president."

But the newspaper added, "Sanders said he held off supporting either of the Democrats [Obama or Clinton] because he has made it a custom not to support any Democrat for the presidential nomination until the party had chosen its nominee."

Obama clinched the Democratic nomination on June 3, 2008.

Clinton did not formally end her presidential campaign until June 7, 2008.

________________________

So, what is different between 2008 and 2016?
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NBC News: "In '08, Sanders Endorsed Obama - Before Clinton Formally Exited Race" (Original Post) George II Jun 2016 OP
Oh that silly history is being brought up. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #1
I hope the media mentions this. hrmjustin Jun 2016 #2
So now Sanders is evil for supporting the likely Dem nominee in 08? Armstead Jun 2016 #30
Not evil. Just pointing out that he can't even follow his own logic. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #37
That makes zero sense. Sanders was not running AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #84
Got it. He can believe one thing when he's running, another when someone else is. #BernieEthics CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #88
No, he wasnt a candidate AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #98
It doesn't matter if he was a candidate. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #99
Irrelevent AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #100
It's totally relevant. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #109
Bull. If ethics don't apply all the time, they aren't ethics. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #111
So an endorsement of Sanders means you are the nominee? TimPlo Jun 2016 #112
We're asking Bernie to be a man if his word, since we keep being told he is. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #114
I don't think Sanders reads DU TimPlo Jun 2016 #115
It won't, but his fans can demand it of him. If they care about ethics. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #119
Where did I say he was evil? Be specific! hrmjustin Jun 2016 #41
That's the gist of this whole thread Armstead Jun 2016 #49
I don't think he is evil. hrmjustin Jun 2016 #56
Csn't disagree with you there Armstead Jun 2016 #106
You mean like saying Sanders showed of dropped out back in March? TimPlo Jun 2016 #113
Except the supers, of course. okasha Jun 2016 #92
It's about the hypocrisy. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #103
Well, that's inconvenient. n/t Orsino Jun 2016 #3
This is really having sanders look like a hypocritical clown beachbumbob Jun 2016 #4
Newsflash -- Bernie is EVIL because he endorsed the likely Democtrayic nominee in 2008! Armstead Jun 2016 #42
No the problem is how Bernie changed the metric between then and now beachbumbob Jun 2016 #48
He didn't change any metric. Armstead Jun 2016 #54
Lol...he endorsed Obama as soon as he was named presumptive nominee beachbumbob Jun 2016 #58
LOL I'm not embarrassed in the least Armstead Jun 2016 #62
Yes it does. CrowCityDem Jun 2016 #64
Go ahead and obsess over it then Armstead Jun 2016 #75
She hasnt hit the number yet AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #86
Then you're not capable of embarrassment, apparently. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #105
Sanders was not a candidate then AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #85
hypocritical clown=EVIL ............ only in the convoluted recesses of your own mind. nt Sheepshank Jun 2016 #91
Also begs the question does sanders act this way because it's a female???? beachbumbob Jun 2016 #5
Definitely does treestar Jun 2016 #10
Sanders is toast beachbumbob Jun 2016 #19
What is there to reconcile? What's the problem? morningfog Jun 2016 #6
Are you serious? Lord Magus Jun 2016 #9
He isn't saying super delegates can't be counted, he is saying that super delegates can change until morningfog Jun 2016 #26
what he said was that he waited until the party had chosen its nominee before endorsing onenote Jun 2016 #38
Wait, was he a super delegate in 2008? Thought he only declared as a Dem this year bigbrother05 Jun 2016 #81
You're right. He wasn't. My mistake. morningfog Jun 2016 #82
Because now Bernie is running and feel entitled to the puffy socks Jun 2016 #7
Even then, he waited until all the primaries were over. (n/t) thesquanderer Jun 2016 #8
He waited until Obama had a majority of PLEDGED delegates, which Clinton will have tomorrow night. George II Jun 2016 #12
yes, but he also waited until everyone in every state had the opportunity to vote. thesquanderer Jun 2016 #21
You can qualify it any way you want, won't change things. But... George II Jun 2016 #24
I'd say then that it will be a more valid criticism after the DC primary on the 14th. (n/t) thesquanderer Jun 2016 #27
Not hardly. It was the same exact circumstances with delegates - supers and pledged. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #13
Except there were no more primaries yet to be held. thesquanderer Jun 2016 #16
No...he has made the argument super delegates don't count beachbumbob Jun 2016 #22
"not hardly"... Mmmmmm. boy. AzDar Jun 2016 #71
Get used to disappointment. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #76
Ahhhh, the irony. Beacool Jun 2016 #11
No surprise. Obama is more "LIBERAL." Herman4747 Jun 2016 #14
Hillary is generally considered slightly to the left of President Obama ismnotwasm Jun 2016 #18
Perhaps by you she is. But not by me. And... Herman4747 Jun 2016 #23
When given the choice between reality and your opinion of Hillary realmirage Jun 2016 #51
So you say, so you say. Herman4747 Jun 2016 #60
By who? the only thing I can think of is she was standing on his left in picture azurnoir Jun 2016 #124
K&R ismnotwasm Jun 2016 #15
Well, Hillary is winning by a lot more than Obama. onehandle Jun 2016 #17
Couldn't find the time? ismnotwasm Jun 2016 #20
I don't recall Bernie demanding that Hillary drop out. aikoaiko Jun 2016 #25
I don't recall Hillary demanding that Bernie drop out. And the debt stuff is just a smokescreen.... George II Jun 2016 #28
Her supporters here certainly have, And since when is debt just a smokescreen? nt Live and Learn Jun 2016 #34
Clinton's debt in 2008 wasn't Sanders' reason for endorsing Obama. George II Jun 2016 #36
Nobody said it was. I am betting it was her lack of inegrity and he should have done it sooner. nt Live and Learn Jun 2016 #39
You asked what was different and why Bernie is still campaigning. aikoaiko Jun 2016 #40
I never asked why Bernie is still campaigning. Surrogates and supporters are NOT the candidate. George II Jun 2016 #45
Ok then the answer to your question is simple. aikoaiko Jun 2016 #55
But once Obama won a majority of pledged delegates, Sanders also said in 2008: George II Jun 2016 #63
Yes, from an standpoint of an independent endorser that was good enough. aikoaiko Jun 2016 #93
She does it through surrogates AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #87
+1 n/t Smarmie Doofus Jun 2016 #29
Wow, he made a mistake. He should have endorsed Obama over Hillary right away. Live and Learn Jun 2016 #31
K&R sheshe2 Jun 2016 #32
Oh -- So now Bernie is BAD for supporting the likely Dem Nominee in 2008? Catch 22, eh? Armstead Jun 2016 #33
I think you miss the point onenote Jun 2016 #46
Sanders is done and he knows it. Cary Jun 2016 #35
K&R brer cat Jun 2016 #43
omg...love the kitty .gif Sheepshank Jun 2016 #50
The original brer cat brer cat Jun 2016 #73
well there's a little bit of irony... Sheepshank Jun 2016 #44
k&r DesertRat Jun 2016 #47
K&R. nt UtahLib Jun 2016 #52
Hypocrite realmirage Jun 2016 #53
Gee, What IS the difference...let me think about that a minute. I'll get back to you. Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #57
There wasn't a white male carpenter running in '08. Nt NCTraveler Jun 2016 #59
The difference is Sanders wasn't a candidate at the time. People can endorse others at any time, as highprincipleswork Jun 2016 #61
He said he at the time he considered Obama "chosen" by the party..... bettyellen Jun 2016 #74
Why don't you just get your own candidate to stay true to her words that really do count? highprincipleswork Jun 2016 #77
Change the subject once you realize Bernie is talking out both sides of his mouth... bettyellen Jun 2016 #95
He's already hoping to get Progressive Democrats elected. Haven't you noticed? highprincipleswork Jun 2016 #96
I'll really be happy when people who support Hillary get their heads out of the gutter and highprincipleswork Jun 2016 #97
K&R FOR TRUTH! eom MohRokTah Jun 2016 #65
"Do as I say, not as I do!" MADem Jun 2016 #66
Now there you go again, George! NastyRiffraff Jun 2016 #67
K&R... BooScout Jun 2016 #68
Kick & highly Recommended! William769 Jun 2016 #69
Bernie is a liar in many ways... Sancho Jun 2016 #70
MSNBC just reported the 2008 timeline, INCLUDING when Sanders endorsed Obama! It's not going... George II Jun 2016 #72
kick rbrnmw Jun 2016 #78
And? 2008 is not 2016; Obama is not Hillary; Obama was not under investigation; an endorsement is merrily Jun 2016 #79
None of which has anything to do with whether superdelegates count before the convention. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #107
Odd. My reply was to the OP, a post about Sanders endorsing Obama in 2008. merrily Jun 2016 #122
That's what the whole thing is about. Whether superdelegates count before the convention or not. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #127
What part of the two situations are not comparable, let alone identical, are you not getting? merrily Jun 2016 #129
disappointing that bernie is showing a lot of hypocrisy MariaThinks Jun 2016 #80
So what? AgingAmerican Jun 2016 #83
I think the situation is a little different mythology Jun 2016 #89
Difference is that he does whatever the hell he wants and tries to sound consistent...... Sheepshank Jun 2016 #90
Hmm, what could be different? mcar Jun 2016 #94
In all fairness, Clinton stayed in until all the states voted UMTerp01 Jun 2016 #101
She stayed on until Obama got more than half the pledged delegates. George II Jun 2016 #102
She stayed in until Obama clinched the nomination. Lord Magus Jun 2016 #108
Good point N/T UMTerp01 Jun 2016 #118
Mahalo, George! Cha Jun 2016 #104
Be lots of questions now..For sanders and his hypocrisy .... beachbumbob Jun 2016 #110
Was he a superdelegate in 2008? democrattotheend Jun 2016 #116
He said the party had chosen its nominee: George II Jun 2016 #117
Sanders wants a separate set of rules to appy to him Gothmog Jun 2016 #120
K&R. Considering Hillary and Obama were neck-in-neck in Pop vote, and way closer than Hillary and lunamagica Jun 2016 #121
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #123
If you can't see that this makes him a YUUGE hypocrite, then there's just no point explaining it. nt BreakfastClub Jun 2016 #125
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #126
His statement said that the party had its nominee. By saying that he included superdelegates. George II Jun 2016 #135
Obama was not under multiple investigations, not an insignificant fact. nt slipslidingaway Jun 2016 #128
It's over, why not just accept it? Unless of course you'd prefer Donald Trump? George II Jun 2016 #132
Remember, that was when Obama was against Costly Trade. grahamhgreen Jun 2016 #130
That makes a difference in the status of superdelegates? George II Jun 2016 #131
Makes a difference for endorsing a candidate. grahamhgreen Jun 2016 #133
I guess you missed the part of his statement in 2008, "the party has its nominee". That is.... George II Jun 2016 #134
I'm sure that Sanders will do the right thing. yardwork Jun 2016 #136
 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
30. So now Sanders is evil for supporting the likely Dem nominee in 08?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:51 PM
Jun 2016

The spinning is amazing.

"Can you say 'Catch 22' Boys and Girls?"

Unless I'm mistaken, Sanders is not fighting to prevent people from being able to endorse whatever candidate they choose at whatever time they choose.

 

CrowCityDem

(2,348 posts)
99. It doesn't matter if he was a candidate.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:30 PM
Jun 2016

In 08 pledged + super delegates was enough for him to declare Obama the winner. It's fittingly be for him to claim those same rules don't apply when he's in the race.

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
109. It's totally relevant.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:00 PM
Jun 2016

He believes one thing when he's not a candidate and he believes something different when he is. That's not being ethical and consistent.

 

TimPlo

(443 posts)
112. So an endorsement of Sanders means you are the nominee?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:05 PM
Jun 2016

Did anyone tell Sanders that all he has to do is endorse himself now and he wins just like 08 where " him to declare Obama the winner." You people and spin are silly, do realize how stupid you look saying he should be endorsing Clinton now even though he is on a ballot tomorrow where people are voting? And you all wonder why people say that her supporters think it is owed to her from the start.

 

CrowCityDem

(2,348 posts)
114. We're asking Bernie to be a man if his word, since we keep being told he is.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:24 PM
Jun 2016

Right now, the arguments he's making show him to be a self-serving, lying hypocrite who will say whatever gets him what he wants. He won't even follow his own standards.

 

TimPlo

(443 posts)
115. I don't think Sanders reads DU
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:27 PM
Jun 2016

It kinda delusional to think that posting her on DU is going to be read by Sanders. Any way nice projection you have.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
49. That's the gist of this whole thread
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:59 PM
Jun 2016

If you atre not implying that Sanders was wrong for doing that, I stand corrected about your post and apologize for my hyperbole.

But if you are implying that Sanders is being a hypocrite for fighting as long as he has a chance, I standby what I said. The timing of his endorsement in 2008 is irrelevant to today. He is not trying to stop anyone from endorsing whomever they choose at whatever time they choose. That's a false equivalence.

 

TimPlo

(443 posts)
113. You mean like saying Sanders showed of dropped out back in March?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:08 PM
Jun 2016

Even though 08 Clinton waited till she was sure the SD where not going to switch back to her and give the nomination to her?

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
103. It's about the hypocrisy.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:42 PM
Jun 2016

In 2008, he held off on endorsing until the nominee was decided. There's nothing wrong with that, lots of prominent figures prefer not to influence the primary outcome and instead wait to endorse the winner. But by the standards Sanders is operating under this year ("superdelegates don't count until the convention&quot , Obama wasn't actually the winner yet when Sanders endorsed him as being the winner. Either announced superdelegate backing counts before the convention or it doesn't. It can't only count sometimes and not other times.

 

beachbumbob

(9,263 posts)
4. This is really having sanders look like a hypocritical clown
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:35 PM
Jun 2016

And his hardcore supporters....sanders support the black guy but turns on the woman???

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
42. Newsflash -- Bernie is EVIL because he endorsed the likely Democtrayic nominee in 2008!
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:56 PM
Jun 2016

This is getting ridiculous.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
54. He didn't change any metric.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:02 PM
Jun 2016

He endorsed Obama at the time he thought was appropriate.

He is not saying now that no one has the right to endorse anyone at the time they think is appropriate.

Big difference between circumstances and his role in 2008, and fighting as hard as he can in 2016.

 

beachbumbob

(9,263 posts)
58. Lol...he endorsed Obama as soon as he was named presumptive nominee
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:04 PM
Jun 2016

Don't embarrass yourself any further

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
62. LOL I'm not embarrassed in the least
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:07 PM
Jun 2016

he might endorse Clinton on Wednesday...or he might not.

Either way it has nothing to do with what he chose to do with his endorsement as a non-candidate in 2008.

 

CrowCityDem

(2,348 posts)
64. Yes it does.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:17 PM
Jun 2016

Eight years ago, he said when Obama hit the number with both pledged delegates AND SUPERDELEGATES that we "have picked our nominee". Now, when Hillary does the exact same thing, she says we won't have picked our nominee until the convention.

That is as blatant as hypocrisy gets.

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
105. Then you're not capable of embarrassment, apparently.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:45 PM
Jun 2016

In 2016 Bernie says that superdelegates don't count until the convention and thus Hillary can't be the presumptive nominee unless she gets a majority of all delegates using pledged delegates alone. But in 08 he considered Obama the presumptive nominee after he reached a majority with the help of superdelegates. That you claim this isn't a change in metrics on Bernie's part is absurd.

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
9. Are you serious?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:39 PM
Jun 2016

In 08 he said that the Democratic Party had selected its nominee even though superdelegates were needed to reach a majority. Now he's saying that superdelegates can't be counted until the convention. The only difference is that this time it's him rather than Hillary who's the 2nd place finisher.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
26. He isn't saying super delegates can't be counted, he is saying that super delegates can change until
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:48 PM
Jun 2016

until they vote at the convention. The same was true in 2008. He, as a super delegate, made his intention public when the state contests had ended.

onenote

(42,374 posts)
38. what he said was that he waited until the party had chosen its nominee before endorsing
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:55 PM
Jun 2016

Back then, he accepted that the party had chosen its nominee long before the convention based on Obama having a combination of pledged delegates and super delegate commitments sufficient to claim the nomination. Now he says that having a combination of pledged delegates and super delegate commitments sufficient to claim the nomination isn't good enough until the convention votes.

Can't reconcile those two views no mater how hard you try.

 

puffy socks

(1,473 posts)
7. Because now Bernie is running and feel entitled to the
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:36 PM
Jun 2016

nomination from the party he's dissed for years.

thesquanderer

(11,954 posts)
21. yes, but he also waited until everyone in every state had the opportunity to vote.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:45 PM
Jun 2016

That hasn't happened yet this year. It won't be until DC votes.

George II

(67,782 posts)
24. You can qualify it any way you want, won't change things. But...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:47 PM
Jun 2016

...how about his statements that he'll "contest" the convention? That will be many weeks after the DC primary.

thesquanderer

(11,954 posts)
16. Except there were no more primaries yet to be held.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:44 PM
Jun 2016

Nor, for that matter, was one of the candidates the subject of an FBI investigation.

So it is not the exact same circumstance.
 

beachbumbob

(9,263 posts)
22. No...he has made the argument super delegates don't count
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:46 PM
Jun 2016

Until the convention and the fact is....they don't count because it's Hillary but they did count because Obama...a black guy

Beacool

(30,244 posts)
11. Ahhhh, the irony.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:39 PM
Jun 2016

It's worth noting that Obama ended the primaries with only a 102 pledged delegate advantage. The popular vote was also quite close. Hillary's delegate advantage is almost triple that of Obama's and she's far ahead in the popular vote.

 

Herman4747

(1,825 posts)
23. Perhaps by you she is. But not by me. And...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:47 PM
Jun 2016

...I suspect that the gentleman below would agree with you:

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
17. Well, Hillary is winning by a lot more than Obama.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:44 PM
Jun 2016

My guess is that he wanted to endorse her months ago.

aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
25. I don't recall Bernie demanding that Hillary drop out.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:48 PM
Jun 2016

And people are free to endorse HRC if they want. Bernie is not stopping that.

So not much is different except that Bernie isn't in debt up to his eyes like HRC was in 2008 and can continue campaigning.

George II

(67,782 posts)
28. I don't recall Hillary demanding that Bernie drop out. And the debt stuff is just a smokescreen....
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:49 PM
Jun 2016

...Sanders didn't qualify his 2008 endorsement with "I support Obama because Clinton is broke". Why even bring that into the discussion?

aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
40. You asked what was different and why Bernie is still campaigning.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:56 PM
Jun 2016

But fair enough, HRC isn't demanding that Bernie drop out, but her surrogates and supporters are.




aikoaiko

(34,127 posts)
55. Ok then the answer to your question is simple.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:03 PM
Jun 2016

Bernie was merely endorsing a candidate in 2008 and in 2016 he is a candidate with responsibilities to his agenda and supporters.

George II

(67,782 posts)
63. But once Obama won a majority of pledged delegates, Sanders also said in 2008:
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:16 PM
Jun 2016
"Sanders said he held off supporting either of the Democrats because he has made it a custom not to support any Democrat for the presidential nomination until the party had chosen its nominee."

Essentially saying that Obama was the Democratic nominee at that time.

Live and Learn

(12,769 posts)
31. Wow, he made a mistake. He should have endorsed Obama over Hillary right away.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:52 PM
Jun 2016

Obama may not be perfect but he has bucket loads of integrity over Hillary too.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
33. Oh -- So now Bernie is BAD for supporting the likely Dem Nominee in 2008? Catch 22, eh?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:53 PM
Jun 2016

He has not been fighting to prevent anyone from endorsing whomever they choose at any time.

onenote

(42,374 posts)
46. I think you miss the point
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:58 PM
Jun 2016

In 2008, Sanders expressly acknowledged that the party had chosen Obama as its nominee before the convention, before Clinton suspended, and even though Obama did not have a super majority of pledged delegates but needed a combination of pledged delegates and super delegate commitments to reach the nomination threshold.


Now he says it wrong to consider someone in that circumstance to be the nominee before the convention.




Cary

(11,746 posts)
35. Sanders is done and he knows it.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:54 PM
Jun 2016

So the real question is what is trying to do? And then the question is what will Democrats give him?

No amount of debate here at DU will matter but this is great info. Personally I'm not sure what I think should happen to Sanders but stuff like this is making me dislike him as much as I am disliking his supporters.

brer cat

(24,401 posts)
73. The original brer cat
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:05 PM
Jun 2016

would do exactly that! The cat I have now stands on my laptop to get in my face and tell me that I need to pay more attention to him. Whatever...cats will not be ignored!

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
44. well there's a little bit of irony...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 01:58 PM
Jun 2016

or hypocricy...depending on one's current level of disgust with the Bernie camp at this moment in time.

 

highprincipleswork

(3,111 posts)
61. The difference is Sanders wasn't a candidate at the time. People can endorse others at any time, as
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:06 PM
Jun 2016

is clearly shown by the superdelegates, most of whom endorsed before they even knew who was running!!!

That is more clearly an absurd proposition, and a rigged one. Furthermore, they can change their minds right up to the last minute, which is why we can't count them until July 25th.



Sanders is now a candidate in his own right. He is fighting for what is right and good for the Democratic Party and for the country, and we who support him want him to continue right up to the convention, as long as he possibly can. Heck, the other candidate has already been shown to violate important federal guidelines in the performance of her job as Secretary of State. Pro-Hillary newscasters like Chuck Todd have been led to wonder if she could even be confirmed now as Attorney General, others have wondered if she could get security clearance. And in the midst of this kind of scandal you would like Bernie to drop out?

Not likely and not proper.

And he surely can't endorse her if he's not dropping out.

Im subscribing to none of your bad logic on this one. In fact, the more I hear b.s. like this, the more I'm encouraging Bernie to stay in.
 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
74. He said he at the time he considered Obama "chosen" by the party.....
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:20 PM
Jun 2016

Now it appears he has a problem with that same concept.

 

highprincipleswork

(3,111 posts)
77. Why don't you just get your own candidate to stay true to her words that really do count?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:33 PM
Jun 2016

That would really be good for the planet, and a feat beyond believing.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
95. Change the subject once you realize Bernie is talking out both sides of his mouth...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 05:50 PM
Jun 2016

He is a political like any other, after all. I hope he helps us get more down ticket Dems elected.

 

highprincipleswork

(3,111 posts)
97. I'll really be happy when people who support Hillary get their heads out of the gutter and
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 06:21 PM
Jun 2016

concentrate on what really counts.

Sancho

(9,065 posts)
70. Bernie is a liar in many ways...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 02:59 PM
Jun 2016

and this whole "super delegate" crap is just so he can milk more money from the masses.

George II

(67,782 posts)
72. MSNBC just reported the 2008 timeline, INCLUDING when Sanders endorsed Obama! It's not going...
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:03 PM
Jun 2016

...to be hidden or swept under the rug.

Now it's out there, and most likely will be talked about over and over again the next few days.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
79. And? 2008 is not 2016; Obama is not Hillary; Obama was not under investigation; an endorsement is
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:36 PM
Jun 2016

not a nomination.



Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
107. None of which has anything to do with whether superdelegates count before the convention.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:56 PM
Jun 2016

Either they do or they don't, you can't have it both ways.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
122. Odd. My reply was to the OP, a post about Sanders endorsing Obama in 2008.
Tue Jun 7, 2016, 12:28 AM
Jun 2016

And my reply was, in essence, that it's irrelevant because the situations are not the same

I have no idea how you concluded my post was about when to count super delegates.

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
127. That's what the whole thing is about. Whether superdelegates count before the convention or not.
Tue Jun 7, 2016, 01:10 AM
Jun 2016

Bernie thought they counted before the convention in 2008. He endorsed Obama because Obama was the nominee, specifically saying that he only endorses after the nominee is decided. But Obama was only the presumptive nominee because of superdelegates, so obviously in 08 Sanders thought it made sense to count supers before they officially vote at the convention.

But now in 2016 Bernie insists that supers absolutely must not be counted prior to the convention vote. The only difference is that he's a candidate this year and wasn't in 08, which makes this shift in position totally self-serving as well as hypocritical.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
129. What part of the two situations are not comparable, let alone identical, are you not getting?
Tue Jun 7, 2016, 01:14 AM
Jun 2016


That was the point of Reply 79.

MariaThinks

(2,495 posts)
80. disappointing that bernie is showing a lot of hypocrisy
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 03:45 PM
Jun 2016

he could have been a good symbol of purity - fighting the good fight and refusing to corrupt a system for a means to an end.

He seems to have trouble keeping his own principles intact.

It is totally unacceptable to say:

1. superdelegates should not corrupt democracy and then to turn around and ask them to do just that by voting against the candidate with the most pledged delegates

2. saying someone else was a Democratic nominee before the convention where the votes are counted, but saying it doesn't apply to Hillary in this case.

this is so disappointing.

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
89. I think the situation is a little different
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 04:27 PM
Jun 2016

There are still contests left to go. The race in 2008 was over before the final contests but Sanders didn't endorse until after they were done. We're not there yet. Especially as a candidate nobody says they are dropping out before they do. Clinton was talking about the convention in 2008, but then conceded after the final primaries (and a couple of days to let it sink in). I predict Sanders will do the same.

Running for president requires a certain amount of ego and the process is so all-consuming that it's got to be hard accepting losing.

If a week or more after the DC primary he's still talking about turning super delegates, then he'd be a hypocrite.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
90. Difference is that he does whatever the hell he wants and tries to sound consistent......
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 04:32 PM
Jun 2016

....when the truth and reality are almost always something else.

 

UMTerp01

(1,048 posts)
101. In all fairness, Clinton stayed in until all the states voted
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:38 PM
Jun 2016

My view of Sanders will be what he does after tomorrow night. Does he continue to fight this all the way to the convention or does he suspend and accept Hillary as the nominee and work for unity with Hillary and co?

Lord Magus

(1,999 posts)
108. She stayed in until Obama clinched the nomination.
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 07:58 PM
Jun 2016

That didn't happen until the final day of voting. But this time it will happen a week before the final day of voting.

democrattotheend

(11,605 posts)
116. Was he a superdelegate in 2008?
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:31 PM
Jun 2016

Either way, I don't think he has ever said that elected officials should not endorse candidates in the primary. What he is saying is that the superdelegates have not voted yet, and that many of them endorsed Hillary before he even declared his candidacy. That is very different from endorsing after the last primary.

George II

(67,782 posts)
117. He said the party had chosen its nominee:
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 08:33 PM
Jun 2016

"Sanders said he held off supporting either of the Democrats because he has made it a custom not to support any Democrat for the presidential nomination until the party had chosen its nominee."

lunamagica

(9,967 posts)
121. K&R. Considering Hillary and Obama were neck-in-neck in Pop vote, and way closer than Hillary and
Mon Jun 6, 2016, 11:31 PM
Jun 2016

Sanders are now in PDs, But I really expect this from Sanders.

Response to George II (Original post)

Response to BreakfastClub (Reply #125)

George II

(67,782 posts)
134. I guess you missed the part of his statement in 2008, "the party has its nominee". That is....
Tue Jun 7, 2016, 09:05 AM
Jun 2016

....180 degrees from what he's saying this year.

yardwork

(61,417 posts)
136. I'm sure that Sanders will do the right thing.
Tue Jun 7, 2016, 12:53 PM
Jun 2016

It's difficult to lose a hard-fought campaign. Sanders has done well - better than most predicted - and that makes it even more difficult to concede.

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