In 2008 and 2012, I might not have voted for the "lesser of two evils"

[democrattotheend]

For the record, I don't actually think Hillary is evil, but pretend I do for the sake of argument.

In 2008 and 2012, the Republicans nominated candidates whom I didn't like, but the prospect of either McCain or Romney as president didn't scare me half as much as the prospect of Trump as president. If Hillary had won in 2008 I might have considered casting a protest vote. But if I lived in a swing state this year, I wouldn't have to think about it for 2 seconds.

So for those who complain of "always being asked to vote for the lesser of two evils", I get it. My grandparents felt that way about pretty much everyone they voted for, except George McGovern and to some extent Obama.

So I am not asking you to vote for the lesser of two evils every time. But I am asking you to do so this time.

[840high]

1. Thanks - NO

I am tired of voting for evil.

[Barack_America]

42. Ditto.

[metroins]

2. I can agree with this sentiment

Romney and McCain weren't nuts.

Trump is fucking nuts.

[democrattotheend]

5. Exactly

Now is not the time to be an ideological purist.

I'm as disappointed as everyone else and I've spent the past 24 hours crying (not to mention the day after NY), but stopping Trump has to be our priority. Like you said, he is fucking nuts.

[HereSince1628]

3. What is it that scares you about Trump?

[democrattotheend]

12. Let's see: he's openly racist, unpresidential, and completely unstable

He's garnering support through a combination of faux populism combined with racism. Way too reminiscent of Hitler.

Not to mention the fact that he's incredibly unpresidential in the way he insults people. If we thought Bush was an embarrassment, Trump will make us the laughingstock of the whole world.

And then there's the fact that he is so mentally unhinged that who knows what he will do if some foreign leader criticizes him. This is not the guy I want having access to the nuclear launch codes.

I don't particularly want Hillary having them either, because she is way too hawkish for my taste. But at least she knows what she's doing and is not completely unstable. I trust her not to launch a nuclear warhead because someone insults her hair.

[HereSince1628]

30. so what racist or unstable thing(s) are you afraid Trump will do?

Do you think a president Trump could do those things within the constitutional powers of the president? Or do you think he will in someway suspend law as we know it, so that he can do those things?

He's spectacularly unprepared...which in many ways makes him unpresidential, but he's also an out in the open huckster, saying things and trying to read the crowd so that he can shift his message to garner more support. His overt inability to stick with one thought seems to largely involve his intentionally being provocative and then shifting to address the negative reactions.

[qdouble]

36. No one knows what Trump would actually do as president

However, I would not like to have my children grow up in a country where we elect people who are openly bigoted to the highest office of the land. Even if for some crazy reason you don't believe there is a big difference between the two policy wise, Trump should get annihilated on election day for being a mean spirited, racist oaf.

[HereSince1628]

39. Everyone is talking about being afraid, I'm trying to understand that

I think Trump is the least capable, least prepared, most bombastically outrageous presumptive nominee across my life.

He -should- be annihilated, but I'm can't presume he will be.

[JimDandy]

4. No. We are asked to do that EVERY time. *This time* is simply a continuation of every time

[democrattotheend]

6. No, it's not

That was the whole point of my post. Maybe you are asked to do so every time, but if there were ever a time to suck it up for the good of the country, it's this time. The alternative is having a president who is so unstable he might launch a nuclear warhead because someone insulted his hair. Not to mention being openly racist.

[JimDandy]

9. Categorically rejected. I am voting FOR who I want for the rest of my life

You compromise yourself all you want...not me.

[woolldog]

40. Quit acting like a spoiled child.

[JimDandy]

41. Quit acting like a jerk.

My vote is my own.

[One of the 99]

44. Yes, you're vote is your own

and I hope you don't live in a swing state so you can make your statement without it having much of an impact. But if you don't and the result is helping Trump win the presidency, will you take responsibility for your actions or just blame everyone else like a petulant child?

[JimDandy]

46. I'm an adult. I have earned the right to vote the way I choose, just like you

LOL, all these authoritarian "vote how I want posts" are hilarious.

[One of the 99]

48. Yes you do.

But adults also take responsibility for their actions. Will you if Trump is elected?

As Robert Reich wrote:

I can’t criticize anyone for voting their conscience, of course. But your conscience should know that a decision not to vote for Hillary, should she become the Democratic nominee, is a de facto decision to help Donald Trump.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-reich/advice-for-divided-democrats_b_10162184.html

[pengu]

13. It's the same argument every election

It's always the most important election ever. No. Enough.

[democrattotheend]

15. If you can't see the difference, you haven't been paying attention

McCain and Romney were conservative Republicans with whom we strongly disagreed. Trump is an openly racist unstable meglomaniac.

[pengu]

17. I've been paying attention a long time

I see the difference - A racist nutjob or a corrupt liar on every side of every issue. Hard pass.

[democrattotheend]

19. I'll take the corrupt liar any day of the week

At least I don't genuinely fear that she will attempt to racially cleanse this country or launch a nuclear missile because someone insulted her hair.

[pengu]

21. Enjoy

If you put a gun to my head and told me to vote for Clinton or Trump I'd just let you shoot me.

[840high]

31. There is nothing Trump can do on his own.

[Garrett78]

7. The pro-Obama but anti-Clinton folks are a mystery to me...sort of.

All I can figure is they vote based on style and personality, as opposed to substance. Because they're cut from the same cloth in terms of policy, in terms of where campaign contributions come/came from, in terms of just being what are considered viable Democratic candidates for POTUS.

I know I'm off topic, but I gathered from the OP that you might be pro-Obama but anti-Clinton.

[democrattotheend]

23. It's mostly a matter of "style and personality" (I call it leadership and character)

I don't know if "anti-Clinton" is really the right way to describe me. I am really ambivalent about her.

But in 2008, I supported Obama over Hillary mostly because I thought he had the right temperament and leadership style to be president, and the ability to inspire people even when it felt like this country was falling apart. Ironically, her 3 AM ad in 2008 actually cemented my support for Obama, because when I thought about who I wanted answering that call I realized there was nobody I trust more. And the past 7.5 years have proven me right.

Obama will never be as progressive as I want him to be, but he has shown steady leadership, helped to bring us back from the brink of disaster, and has guided us through crisis after crisis with a steady hand. Hillary just doesn't inspire me or instill confidence in the same way. I don't dispute that she is smart, tough, and well-versed in policy, but I think a big part of being president is being able to keep people calm in a crisis and be an effective manager, and that has never been her strong suit. A big part of me wishes she had stayed in the Senate and risen to the leadership or a top committee chair, which was a much better role for her and better suited to her strengths.

Also, she is significantly to the right of Obama on foreign policy. I think the most telling moment was in 2013, when we were set to engage in Syria and Obama stopped it, despite all the criticism that he made us look weak, because he just didn't feel right about it and his instinct is to lean against intervention. I am pretty sure that in a close call, she would go the opposite way.

[lapfog_1]

28. Obama is pro corporatist

Hillary is even more pro corporatist.

The difference is that Obama is a honest and decent person, Hillary is not honest.

[Maedhros]

8. Too late, sorry.

I'm done being manipulated.

[democrattotheend]

14. Nobody's trying to manipulate you

As you can see from my avatar and post history, I myself am a Bernie supporter who is very disappointed in the process and the outcome of the primaries, and am mad as hell about the way the AP decided to short-circuit the Democratic process. And please don't give me that crap about it being no different from if a candidate obtains 270 before the polls close on the west coast. What the AP did was like calling the election on November 1 based on a Gallup poll.

But as mad as I am I see the bigger picture. If you live in a non-swing state, go ahead and vote your conscience. I may even cast a protest vote if the popular vote nationwide looks to be close (because I want Hillary to lose the popular vote and hopefully create enough of a backlash to finally get bipartisan support for getting rid of the electoral college).

But if you live in a swing state, I urge you to think of what's at stake and realize this is not the election to sit out or vote third party to "send a message" to the party establishment.

[Maedhros]

22. I understand.

But you do realize that

I urge you to think of what's at stake and realize this is not the election to sit out or vote third party to "send a message" to the party establishment.

is what they say every fucking election. It's time the Democratic Party started taking some responsibility for continually foisting corporatists on us.

[840high]

32. Amen.

[Maedhros]

37. And every single time, liberals and progressives bite the bullet and do as they're told,

hoping that maybe this time things will work out differently...then they are betrayed AGAIN.

I've been through this cycle too many times. Watch: everyone will suck it up and (narrowly) elect Hillary, then we'll be right back to "professional left" "retards" that need to "eat our peas" when they chop up Social Security, invade another muslim country, and roll back a few more civil rights "to fight TERROR!" Guaranteed.

[Frances]

10. I was absolutely shocked when McGovern lost

Everyone I knew was voting for McGovern

[democrattotheend]

16. I wasn't alive yet

But I thought everyone knew he was going to lose, as evidenced by two or three VP candidates turning him down (which is almost unheard of now). And I understand that a lot of Democratic downballot candidates distanced themselves. Am I wrong?

[Zynx]

18. The polling had been very clear. It shouldn't have been a shock.

Everyone who was informed expected a Nixon landslide.

[lancer78]

25. And he was Bernie before Bernie

Most Liberal person ever nominated to run for the presidency from a major party and got absolutely "pwned" at the ballot box.

[AzDar]

11. That kind of bullshit is EXACTLY how we got here...

[99Forever]

20. Sorry, Obama used up my last of those.

Yup. Fresh out of "less crappy candidate votes." They stopped making them in my size.

What can I say?

[lancer78]

24. If we "have" to vote

for the lesser of two evils, then we no longer have the freedom to vote.

[ChiciB1]

35. Took The Words Right Out Of My Mouth, I'm SICK Of Having To Do

this over and over and over. Democracy?? We've lost it or we've forgotten that it existed.

OLIGARCHY! Sickening!

[NCTraveler]

26. K&R nt

[yourout]

27. For me it's the opposite. 2008 I had hoped Obama was a closet progressive(boy was I wrong).

2012 I knew he was just another Corporate sell out but was the lesser of two evils.

This year I'm voting Green.
If I had to vote Hillary or Trump I would vote Trump.

[redStateBlueHeart]

34. LOL!

[tallahasseedem]

33. To everyone saying NO, please look back on what happened in 2000.

NO ONE though W would win...and he did.

We don't want that to happen.

[Joe the Revelator]

38. It stops now. Until the party of progressives stops nominating moderate conservatives....

I owe them nothing.

[coyote]

43. Sheep running off a cliff.

Collective insanity.

No thanks.

[One of the 99]

45. President Obama was never the lesser of two evils

nor was Al Gore in 2000, despite the lies told by Nader. And anyone who thinks that they were is clearly delusional.

[Luciferous]

47. I'm in a red state, so I'm just not going to bother voting this time.