The party has the most progressive platform in decades and the "left" can't stand it.

[NCTraveler]

Let's be real, nothing about these little egoist authoritarians is left. The platform has moved to the left, Clinton is running on an excellent and progressive platform, and it's causing people to claim they won't support the nominee and don't support the party.

So many of them were HA HA ratfuckers from the start. It's clear they stand in opposition to progressives.

[Warren DeMontague]

1. I agree, our platform is great. Progressive, forward-thinking advocacy.

Our platform calls for a $15 minimum wage, a reasonable pathway to cannabis legalization, etc.

Their platform is a laundry list of bigotry, incoherent babble and religious far right wishlist items like rolling back lgbt equality and censoring internet porn.

The choice is clear.

[uponit7771]

2. This is ABSOLUTELY turning me off of that side of the left, the lack of diversity the lack of...

... compromise and the overall willingness to burn the village that the don't live in to save it.

[Maru Kitteh]

3. The people calling themselves "left" appear to be Putin acolytes and dipshits of the highest order.

At least where the delegates who are pretending to be for Bernie at this convention are concerned.

FWIW, I don't think they are really Bernie supporters, AT ALL.

[MerryBlooms]

4. Rec & Kick. Well stated.

[kestrel91316]

5. Stop insulting the "left". You sound like a fucking Republican.

<<<<< PROUD left-leaning liberal progressive

[Hortensis]

28. Agree. Liberals ARE left, btw.

Just not all all on the left are liberals. We're talking more extreme types.

[GulfCoast66]

41. If they are not voting for Hillary

I will fucking insult them to my hearts fucking content. Even call them fucking idiots.

[apcalc]

6. The fringe is aggravating the heck outta me.

I've been far left all my life and have
done my share of protesting.

One has to ask, it this protest productive? Is it useful? Does it serve my cause?

I will say that when it's time to move on , you do so.

It's time for the DNC protestors to move on imo. They really don't seem to be helping themselves, Sanders , or their cause.

In fact, from what I read here, they are having a negative effect, putting themselves in a bad light, just ticking lots of people off.

[Warren DeMontague]

8. I actually agree with you.

It's the first day, though. I think these guys are gonna run out of steam.

[JoePhilly]

10. + 100

[DisgustipatedinCA]

7. You're contending that the left is secretly supporting the right?

Great analysis.

[JoePhilly]

9. Or ... the right has created a fake left segment ...

... and some on the left fell for it.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

12. A student of Occam's Cinderblock, I see.

[forjusticethunders]

23. One MAJOR MAJOR MAJOR MAAAAAAAAAAAAJOR reason why the left isn't stronger in America

Is because the American left has often been co-opted for the purposes of national adversaries. I wonder now who's bankrolling a lot of the fringe left. Who's funding outlets like Counterpunch and Common Dreams?

[NCTraveler]

14. No, I did not. You flat out made that up. Nt

[DisgustipatedinCA]

24. If you have an accusation to level, do so now. I responded to your OP and I was on-point.

Find the guts to call me a liar if that's what you're insinuating.

[NCTraveler]

25. My comment was very clear.

Really nothing offensive about it. No need to get worked up. I simply suggest you speak for yourself instead of falsely speaking for me. You claim I said things I never did. Glad I could clear that up for you. No anger here.

[BzaDem]

19. It is a bit more nuanced than that.

Some people care more about their ability to complain about not having what they want, rather than actually getting what they wan't. Achieving their purported goals would remove their ability to complain about not achieving such goals, which is why they are in favor of actions that would prevent the achievement of their goals (but would retain their ability to complain).

So in terms of intentions, it is not quite the same thing as supporting the right. But the outcomes are very similar, and it is ultimately outcomes and actions that matter (rather than words and feelings).

Fortunately, the vast majority of supporters of both Hillary and Bernie actually prefer achieving goals over complaining about not achieving them. Unfortunately, the latter group is massively over-represented on the convention floor at the moment. In the future, the party needs to tighten its rules, to ensure that only delegates with a proven record of acting like an adult are permitted on the floor (which will almost certainly happen).

[NurseJackie]

11. Closed primaries would help to put an end to this hijacking shit.

[NCTraveler]

15. +1

That is something I will be working toward.

[Renew Deal]

13. They won't see any of it enacted if Hillary loses

[DinahMoeHum]

16. The "Nothing But The Best For The Oppressed" syndrome. . .

. . .runs very strong among too many people calling themselves Leftists and Progressives.

[Jim Lane]

17. Why the scare quotes?

You seem to be implying that any position not shared by Hillary Clinton (such as, for example, single-payer health care) isn't really a left position. For that matter, some of Clinton's enunciated positions, such as her comparatively recent opposition to the TPP, can't be considered truly left if Clinton's minions on the Platform Committee decide that it would be politically inconvenient to endorse them.

That's a rather idiosyncratic concept of the difference between "left" and left.

[NCTraveler]

20. I had no intention of scaring you. My bad.

You just claim I said a whole bunch of things I never said. Might want to speak for yourself instead of falsely telling me what I just said.

[Jim Lane]

21. OK, you don't want to answer my question. That's your privilege.

You write, "You just claim I said a whole bunch of things I never said." Wrong. I didn't claim it. I started out by asking you why you used the quotation marks. To elaborate on my question, I wrote, "You seem to be implying...." (emphasis added) and explained what impression you'd left on me, but indicating uncertainty so that you could correct me if I was wrong.

You chose not to answer my question and not to explain what you did mean, so I guess we're done.

Please, however, be reassured that you didn't scare me. You can read up on the phrase "scare quotes" and its idiomatic usage in English. No literal fear was involved, but thanks for your concern.

[NCTraveler]

34. Now you twist your own original post.

"Why the scare quotes?"

You then moved on to black and white thinking as if there is only one option. That is what you did and it's sitting there in your own words. While you simply limit it to one possibility, you completely miss the more realistic option.

Yes, you directly and incorrectly spoke for me.

[Jim Lane]

37. LOL. I quoted my own original post verbatim. That's what MY quotation marks meant.

You assert that I "completely miss the more realistic option" but you still choose not to explain it.

In your response to jberryhill you give two examples, sort of. Gary Johnson, as a Libertarian, is the candidate who least readily fits into the standard left-right spectrum. He's with us on the left who oppose foreign wars, the Patriot Act, and the bloated military budget. On the other hand, instead of the leftist positions of single-payer health care and progressive taxation, he wants to slash Medicare and other social-welfare programs while funding the federal government entirely through a regressive sales tax. But your OP referred to "{t}he party", by which I and probably everyone else thought you meant the Democratic Party. That a different party's nominee doesn't support the Democratic Party platform hardly merited a post.

Your other example is a hypothetical about a "dolt" who says he doesn't know any of Clinton's positions. I personally know many leftists, every single one of whom could tell you several of Clinton's positions. Your OP certainly gave the impression that you thought you were talking about real people, not hypotheticals. Someone who's apolitical, and hence completely ignorant about politics, isn't left -- and, while we're at it, isn't liberal or progressive or right or conservative. So what?

I still see nothing in your scare quotes beyond throwing mud at any Democrat who is one millimeter to the left of Hillary "nice warm purple space" Clinton, who pleaded "guilty" to "being kind of moderate and center."

[jberryhill]

26. Then what is your use of quotes intended to imply?

[NCTraveler]

33. Fear is the only option. Fear. Lol

Or the one that makes more sense. They are not ideologically driven. Example: Let's say MSNBC interviews one of the dolts on the floor and he says he is going to vote for Johnson. You think that fool is a part of the left? Let's say MSNBC interviews one of the dolts and he says he won't vote Clinton but addmittadley says he doesn't know one position of hers. You think he is part of the left? Interview after interview put one thing on display. They weren't left or bright. You see quotes around the word and think fear when there is an answer that makes more sense.

[jberryhill]

39. Excuse me, but where did I use the word "fear"?

You seem to be replying to something I did not say.

[NCTraveler]

40. Ok. The direction of your comment was very clear.

The left has nominated the first woman of a major party. Did you think it would be anyone else? Neither did I. Party time.





I answered your question about the use of the quotes directly. Very directly.

[DanTex]

18. They never cared about policy. The far left are showing their true colors.

[avaistheone1]

22. Please elaborate...

[Blue_Tires]

27. k+r

[LostOne4Ever]

29. I am a leftist and I love all the changes made to the platform! I am happy :D nt

[Warren DeMontague]

30. I encourage everyone to read our platform--- and compare it to the GOP's!

https://www.demconvention.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Democratic-Party-Platform-7.21.16-no-lines.pdf

https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/media/documents/DRAFT_12_FINAL[1]-ben_1468872234.pdf

[Lil Missy]

31. These "purists" are impossible to please. They are NOT Democrats. n/t

[JCanete]

32. Platform is looking pretty good. Maybe some time soon we can hear Hillary say

she's going to fight for these things in her own words, because listening to her since the beginning of this election cycle, I had no idea these were her ideals. Snark aside, I'm personally skeptical but hopeful that we're going to see something we didn't expect from her. So your bullshit diagnosis for why some on the left aren't buying it, was just pulled out of something's ass.

As a Bernie supporter, I've had a few actually constructive conversations with early Hillary supporters, conducted with mutual respect, so I know it can happen. I'm not sure why so many on this board are in love with just piling on vitriol and insults rather than improving empathy and understanding for one another. Just doesn't seem very progressive to me.

[workinclasszero]

35. "many of them were HA HA ratfuckers from the start"

You got that right!

[Recursion]

36. There are people on the left, as on the right, who actively dislike

any changes that actually help people, since it makes a system they consider wrong in theory more bearable.

[forjusticethunders]

38. It's funny because you would think the point of hating a system is BECAUSE it hurts people

So helping people should be the overriding concern even if it doesn't entail burning said system down.

Also people massively misunderstand both history and Marxist societal theory (most "socialists" haven't read a page of Capital). Capitalism didn't overthrow feudalism (most of the anti-feudal revolutions in the 18th and 19th centuries *failed*), it *grew* from feudalism, and even now some elements of the "old society" persist. In a similar matter, socialism will grow from capitalism and will likely retain many elements of capitalism even while the system is "socialist".

The problem is that a lot of privileged white kids see "socialism", "progressivism" "revolution", "etc" as fashion statements and their political "tactics" reflect this.