What "Message" does a third party vote send?

[MineralMan]

It's simple:

"Look at me! I'm a dumbass with no common sense at all! I'm throwing my vote away because I have not bothered to consider the consequences of it."

[BlueCaliDem]

1. That pretty much sums it up, MineralMan. eom

[EricMaundry]

2. Amen

A vote for Jill is a vote for Donald.

[ismnotwasm]

3. Yup.

[NastyRiffraff]

4. Yep.

True, especially the "Look at me" part.

The weird part is most of these people call themselves liberals (sorry, we're supposed to say "progressives" now for reasons I don't understand). So, progressives. I very much doubt if they know or care what Jill Stein stands for, but they're gonna stomp their tiny feet and vote for her anyway because they're SOOOOO disillusioned and disappointed.

Fuck 'em all.

[MineralMan]

6. Yup. And many seem to want to let people know that

they're doing an ill-considered thing. They want to make sure we "look at them."

[Hortensis]

33. What message do these posts send, MM and others?

A good many of the people in those third parties ran off from the Democratic Party, or at least that direction, and could be wooed back. Ex- KGB Director Putin is far too intelligent and focused on his goals to offer tRump insults instead of shows of respect.

What goals are these threads meant to serve?

[pangaia]

83. Very well said..

[stranger81]

102. To signal that the Democratic Party should strive to be a small, cliquish party of centrists?

If there's some other goal, besides that and virtue signaling, it's not being well-served.

[gademocrat7]

5. I concur.

[uppityperson]

7. It means people don't think either of the D or R candidates are worth voting for

I've been there as a young voter and don't see how calling them dumbasses with no common sense helps anything except to foster the divide or make you feel righteous.

Misguided, yes. Idealistic, yes. Causing harm in the immediate time, yes. But "dumbass with no common sense"? No

[bettyellen]

13. Sorry but with all the sexism racism and naked greed rising, if they can look past that then I am

Going to call them out for being a selfish asshole.
They have divorced themselves from reality and I don't think there's a damn thing that can get them back to earth.

[uppityperson]

15. You are calling me a selfish asshole divorced from reality who can never get back to earth? Huh

I have voted 3rd party so I guess you just let me know your opinion of me, forever.

[bettyellen]

20. No- I was actually specific about what is going on this year.

What is it with this melodramatic bullshit? Your feelings aren't ever going to come before my civil rights- so get over yourself.

[uppityperson]

36. Since I copy pasted your words, I guess the "melodramatic bullshit" started at this post(link)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=2432935

[bettyellen]

39. Loss of civil rights= dramatic changes in society. Hurt feelings= melodrama

Can't believe that would need to be clarified- given the literal life and death matters at stake here.

[uppityperson]

40. As I said, I simply copy pasted your words. Eom

[bettyellen]

41. I'm sorry are you saying you support a third party candidate and your feeling are hurt?

[uppityperson]

45. No. Eom

[bettyellen]

47. How does that reconcile with your complaints about the two parties?

Or is this one of those "some people say" situations?

[uppityperson]

59. Insulting and writing off people doesn't help. As I said which you replied to @ beginning of subthre

Misguided, yes. Idealistic, yes. Causing harm in the immediate time, yes. But "dumbass with no common sense"? No.

I will add in also no to being selfish a asshole who has divorced themselves from reality and can never be brought back to earth.

Going to call them out for being a selfish asshole.
They have divorced themselves from reality and I don't think there's a damn thing that can get them back to earth.

[bettyellen]

74. So you don't reply except to focus on hurt feelings. I'm still going to go with selfish ass then.

[uppityperson]

77. Are you calling me a selfish ass for disliking insulting others, and seeing how insults don't

help? Seriously?

[bettyellen]

85. The discussion was about third party voters this Novemeber....

So you tell me? Hard to understand why you're taking this so personally.

Am I supposed to be worried about these voters feelings or something (here of all places) when they obviously don't give a fuck about my civil rights? I'm thinking nope.

[BobbyDrake]

51. If someone makes a general statement and you think it's about you, that's on you.

At no point were you specifically targeted by the comment you're complaining about.

[uppityperson]

60. If someone replies to my gentle, reasoned comment sharing my 3rd party voting with insults,

well yes. It is about me. I shared and said why insults don't help, I was insulted in return.

Thank you for caring.

[BobbyDrake]

61. But you didn't explicitly say you voted third party until after the general statement.

Your original comment speaks about not thinking either of the two-party candidates are worth voting for, not your voting history. Then the reply came with the general statement, which for some reason, I don't know, guilt maybe, you thought applied to you personally. You have your causes and effects backwards, in other words.

So really, what you're trying to do is feign outrage, and badly, I might add.

[uppityperson]

63. I couldn't fit everything in the reply title. I am sorry that having words in the message body makes

it too difficult to follow. Good luck and carry on.

[BobbyDrake]

66. You didn't have those words in the message body either.

Word of advice: When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging. You didn't mention that you voted for third parties until your second comment. It's literally on the record; everyone looking at this thread can see it.

[uppityperson]

67. You are right. I insinuated in the first reply, clarified in the second. I guess you think it's a

good strategy to insult rather than try and influence positively someone who is on the fence about voting. I disagree with that stance. That was my point. I was there when I was younger, understand why they might feel that way and was trying to explain that.

I got insults back, clarified why I took them as insults.

Sometimes I don't understand the point of continuing to be nasty, how this board gets.

[BobbyDrake]

71. You're the only person being "nasty" here. You weren't being honest about the sequence of events

and were using that to malign someone. I'm simply pointing it out. At least you were able to admit it, but then you use that as a springboard for a fresh attack. Now you've escalated by implying that anyone who disagrees with you is being "nasty," an obvious personal insult. So how are you any better than the people you're trying to criticize?

Answer: you're not.

[uppityperson]

72. I disagree with what you write. If that is maligning, you have a problem. I have a life and continui

continuing this turns into nothing productive. Have a good evening.

[BobbyDrake]

73. .....

[pangaia]

84. There is too much logic to your comments.

This message board has changed in the last.oh... several months.
You must mind your manners.

[Demsrule86]

65. You are on Democratic underground, we support Democrats not third party spoilers nt.

[uppityperson]

68. I know, I do. I was trying to explain why someone might feel like not voting, and

insults are the wrong way to go and I was one of those yrs ago who were on the line about voting.

7. It means people don't think either of the D or R candidates are worth voting for

I've been there as a young voter and don't see how calling them dumbasses with no common sense helps anything except to foster the divide or make you feel righteous.

Misguided, yes. Idealistic, yes. Causing harm in the immediate time, yes. But "dumbass with no common sense"? No

[Demsrule86]

78. If they don't stop Trump than they are dumb and will pay a heavy price.

They will live for probably 30 years with the consequences of their actions...heck, we might as well all stay home if Trump gets the courts...because liberalism is over for a generation.

[uppityperson]

80. If they don't stop Trump, they will pay a heavy price. I very much agree with that.eom

[GWC58]

87. It's my hope

the closer the election gets and dumbass, with his daily, nauseating gaffes, many third party "would be" voters will come to the conclusion "holy shit. I may have to hold my nose and vote for Hillary." I won't have to hold my nose. I take a lot of pride voting for her.

[pangaia]

86. I have not reay anything that indicates UPPITY is supporting third party spoilers.

[ismnotwasm]

14. I've been there too

George W Bush was my conversion point. I WAS a dumbass in that I had little understanding of how government really works, why we historically---and I mean back to the beginning-- even have a two party system.

This is the Information Age--one doesn't even have to go to the library to pick up a book on civics to get the 101 version of American government. Basic literacy is required, true.

People aren't bothering to do it.

[bettyellen]

21. The most rabid Hillary hater I know asked me why Obama had not nominated a justice for the USSC yet!

She literally does not understand ANY of the three branches or what has been going on to prevent Obama from being the super president she expects.
Because we are old friends, I was patient. But damn to get past the age of sixty and not know the basics AND be out there advocating is a bit disgraceful.

[anneboleyn]

30. This is what terrifies me about third party voters. The Supreme Court issue is ENOUGH PERIOD

to vote for Hillary. Some of them seem to have very little awareness of the court issue or that Trump appointees would be on the court for decades. How anyone (who isn't a repub) can be okay with that is beyond me.

[tonyt53]

31. Large numbers of people think Obama could make a recess appointment to the SCOTUS

Most of them are younger, but some are older.

[BainsBane]

32. same here

2001 is when I became a true blue Dem.

[BainsBane]

23. I voted 3rd party when I was younger

Including for Nader in 2000--in Florida.

I was a major dumbass.

[Demsrule86]

64. The courts are at stake...and the next 30 years...so they are indeed...dumb and selfish too.

Third Party voters and the Republican Party gave us 9-11, United, Hobby Lobby, two wars, the Patriot act, thousands dead after Katrina and an economy on life support...they already have much to answer for. So many have suffered because of their help in electing George Bush.

[CanonRay]

8. I have 3 or 4 friends who are unshakable in this.

Unfortunately, a couple of them are in Colorado, where it might actually matter. If Trump wins there, I will publicly renounce them.

[anneboleyn]

19. I don't know how ANYONE can be so dense about the Supreme Court. Trump could affect DECADES

of court decisions by appointing uber-conservative judges, which he has stated repeatedly he would do. People who think it is edgy or cool to vote third party are living in fantasy-land but unfortunately their votes could seriously harm others.

If Roe v. Wade is severely impacted or overturned by Trump appointees -- and it "goes back to the states?" People who are so shallow w/the voting issue have no idea what kind of damage Trump-appointed justices could do, likely because they have lived in pampered circumstances their entire lives.

[Mz Pip]

9. It's one thing to vote third party in a safe state

If you want to boost up third party credibility fine. But in an election like this it just becomes an exercise in ego gratification.

If you live in a swing state or in a state that might be turning then it's just arrogance.

As Bernie said, "Now is not the time for a protest vote." I some of his supporters would believe him.

[BobbyDrake]

52. This is terrible logic. "Building up third parties in safe states" makes them less safe.

It's even MORE self-defeating in the long run. There's one national party in America that represents liberalism. Building up competing liberal parties just leads to more conservatives getting elected due to split votes. If a third party isn't big enough in a state to win state legislature seats or the governorship, it's nothing by it a useless vanity project. (See: the Green Party)

Even Bernie Sanders understood this, which is why he made his deal with Harry Reid and Chuck Schumer to caucus with Senate Democrats in exchange for the Democratic Party not running competing candidates against him in Vermont. He lost his first Congressional election to a Republican because Sanders and the Democrat split the liberal vote, weakening its collective power. And being a wise fellow, he made sure it only happened once.

[Gothmog]

10. A vote for a third party candidate is a vote for trump

Such a vote says that I want Trump to be POTUS

[democrattotheend]

44. Only if you live in a state where your vote matters

For people who live in decidedly non-swing states, the only thing you can do with your vote is send a message, because you have virtually no say in who gets elected.

[Gothmog]

49. You are wrong

[democrattotheend]

53. How so?

[Gothmog]

57. A protest vote is a wasted vote no matter where it is caste

[democrattotheend]

58. I disagree

If a Green Party candidate gets 10% of the vote in some states, that sends the message to a Democratic president that she ought to watch her left flank as president and be mindful of moving too much to the center.

As much as I can't stand the Green Party, I think the one positive impact they could potentially have if they were smarter about it is forcing Democrats not to take progressive votes for granted.

[Gothmog]

90. Why are you posting on DU if you are not a Democrat?

[democrattotheend]

93. I am a Democrat. I am voting for Hillary

As my signature and many of my other posts should make clear. But I want to hold the Democrats we elect accountable and not enable them to take progressives for granted.

[Gothmog]

95. Then work within the party and don't use third parties as threats

The threats of third parties are not a good way to change things unless the change you are looking for is the last bush administration. Nader tried to change the Democratic party and the result was 8 years of Bush resulting in the Iraq war, Citizens United and the gutting of the Voting Rights Act

[democrattotheend]

97. Bush didn't become president because people in New York and California voted for Nader

He became president because of idiots in states like Florida who voted for Nader.

[Gothmog]

99. Nader became a threat because people in both battleground and non-battleground states voted for him

Claiming that it is okay for people in Blue states to turn on the party is really sad. I am in a deep red state and will be working my butt off to turn my state blue and to support Hillary Clinton. There is no excuse for any true Democrat to vote for a third party unless that so-called Democrat is also willing to admit that they are really supporting trump.

[democrattotheend]

100. Judging from your avatar, you are in a state that may become competitive

Tim Kaine is going there today! I for one am really excited about that, and I don't even live in Texas. I have always been impressed with Texas Democrats...you may be outnumbered, but you are loud and proud, judging from the Texas delegations at YDA conventions I have attended.

[Gothmog]

106. Read the OP

[democrattotheend]

112. For the 85th time, I have no intention of casting a protest vote!

I am voting for Hillary. That should be pretty clear from my signature.

[Demsrule86]

70. I wonder what would have happened in 2008 if Democrats in Virginia had followed your advice about

swing state voting? Obama won Virginia as you may recall for the first time since 1964 in ...big upset. If you are a Democrat you need to vote accordingly, and if you need to protest vote then maybe you are not a Democrat...get busy and change what you don't like about the Dem party at the grass root level but vote in every election for your party and then maybe we can get stuff done.

[democrattotheend]

98. Everyone knew Virginia was a swing state in 2008

The Obama campaign targeted it heavily.

I'm not casting a protest vote. I'm voting for Hillary. My signature should make that clear.

But if other Bernie supporters in New York or Idaho want to vote for Jill Stein I really don't care.

[Demsrule86]

103. No they didn't really...well it had not happened since 52...and Georgia looks about the

same this year. How about Indiana...a reliably red state that went for Obama in 08 or even North Carolina which also went for Obama in 08 but not 12...you never know...it is a selfish act to vote third party if you are a progressive and such voting gave us George Bush and six years of no progressive achievements under President Obama thanks to the debacle of 10...caused by hold his feet to the fire Greens...well we all got burned didn't we?

[democrattotheend]

104. Obama would have won easily without Indiana, as he did in 2012

The thing about states that are on the periphery of being swing states is that a candidate who flips them usually could have won without them. Obama would have won in 2008 without Indiana, or Virginia for that matter. There is no way he would have won Indiana but lost Ohio, and as long as he flipped Ohio and won the Kerry states he would have won. Sure, Indiana and especially Virginia were nice (I was working in Washington DC and I think we cheered almost as loudly when Obama won Virginia as when he won the election. Many of us lived there and some of us had even moved there to help turn it blue), but those states were icing on the cake.

I'm not encouraging anyone to vote 3rd party. I'm just not going to get my panties in a bunch over people in non-swing states who vote 3rd party. I know a couple liberals in NY who are thinking of voting Green or Libertarian and I just don't care enough to try to persuade them otherwise. I've pointed out that they can make a statement by voting for Hillary on the Working Families ticket, but beyond that it's not worth pushing too hard and risking my friendships. If they lived in swing states you can bet I'd be bombarding them with reasons to vote for Hillary. But if Hillary is struggling to hold onto New York, she will not win the election. I did get my friend in Missouri who is planning to vote 3rd party to promise to vote for Hillary if it looks close.

I considered trying to trade votes with someone who lives in a swing state, but I decided against it because I want to vote for Hillary, and the idea of voting for Jill Stein makes me queasy.

[Demsrule86]

105. You can never be sure vote trades are on the up and up...much

bragging on FR that they screwed Democrats this way last election. Yes, I check out FR and see what the enemy is doing...after Obama won, I spent several enjoyable hours watching them melt down when they realized they were going to lose...reading the desperate sad threads...haha.

[thucythucy]

11. It also says: "I'm in such a position of privilege

(or at least think myself to be) that I don't have to worry about the consequences of a Trump presidency. I enjoy watching house fires--let it all burn down."

Must be nice to feel oneself so secure.

[anneboleyn]

16. Exactly. "I don't care about Supreme Court justices"

[Binkie The Clown]

12. With the polls this close, a 3rd party vote is a vote for Trump. n/t

[NobodyHere]

17. It means neither candidate has earned their vote.

Not sure why you need to be insulting.

[MineralMan]

18. Elections are about governance.

The presidential election is about whether a Democrat or Republican will be in the White House for four years.

It is that freaking simple. Third party voters clearly do not care, one way or the other. That's why I'm insulting.

Simple, huh? I'll say it again: Anyone who votes in 2016 for a third party presidential candidate is a dumbass. I don't care what state they're in. I don't care if a state is "certain" to go blue or red. It doesn't matter. Voting for a candidate who cannot possible win the presidency is a chump move. I certainly hope you're not planning to do that. Truly I do.

[NobodyHere]

27. I'll hold my nose but I'll vote for Clinton

But third party voters do care or else they wouldn't vote at all.

Neither candidate has earned their vote, it's that simple. You're also not going to insult them into voting your way.

[MineralMan]

69. Then this thread is not about you.

[bettyellen]

22. And what would someone have to do, aside from being unelectable?

[NobodyHere]

25. I'm sorry

I don't understand your post

[anneboleyn]

26. Always the cry of spoiled children: "they haven't catered to MEEEEEEEEE!"

So I am going to stamp my feet, hold my breath, throw away my vote, and screw the country over by playing a part in the election of Trump!

[NobodyHere]

28. How dare voters expect politicians to pay attention to them!

You'd think we live in a democracy or something.

[anneboleyn]

35. They can't of course cater to every single voter. You think Jill Stein or Gary Johnson

is "really listening?" Right. So if I understand your logic, you are willing to throw away your vote on Stein or Johnson because you think she/he "listens to you" in some special way and at the same time enable Trump to win?

I agree with OP on this one. If a person claims to care about any Democratic Party issues, throwing away a vote in this election in a fit of tantrums is not only massively immature but also incredibly selfish. What will happen if Trump appoints two or three Scalia-like Supreme Court justices? How will things go then?

[Demsrule86]

75. Sure...you can vote in such a way that guarantees that nothing progressive will be enacted

into law...this is what happened in 2010 when the protest votes swept a GOP Congress into office. You can essentially vote in such a way that helps Republicans win if you want to...it is indeed a democracy...but is it wise?

[Madam45for2923]

24. 3rd party voter = Nixon & BushW & Trump are A-OK by me! & what the country needs!

"Am just that kind of voter"

Hmmm.....

[sarae]

29. Yup. That's a perfect description.

[Charles Bukowski]

34. If the Young Turks comments section

is anything to go by, the #JillNotHill stupidity is starting to subside a bit. That place is so vehemently anti-Clinton you'd think it was a right-wing channel, but it's not as venomous as it was a few months ago.

I'd like to think that reality of a Trump presidency, and the harm he could inflict on all of us, is starting to dawn on a lot of them. I hope so.

[bettyellen]

43. I've noticed a lot of the Hill haters slowly back out of the room...

Only to emerge as strong Trump haters. I guess hatred gets them some clicks and likes.

[DemocraticWing]

37. The ballots are confusing to read and I marked the wrong candidate.

[Jim Lane]

38. That's a total straw-man argument.

The explanation given by uppityperson in #7 is much closer to the truth.

Underlying many minor-party votes is the belief that neither major-party candidate is significantly better or worse than the other. That was Nader's attitude in 2000. If you want to persuade people to vote for Clinton, you can call them dumbasses or you can make the case (a powerful case, IMO) that Trump is significantly worse than Clinton. Make your own decision about which approach is more likely to succeed.

As an aside to several other posts in this thread, I have always disliked the "A vote for X is a vote for Y" argument. It's a matter of algebra -- X does equal Y. The accurate statement is that, this year for example, a vote for Stein is a missed opportunity to cast an effective vote against Trump. I know it's not as catchy but it has the virtue of being true. If Clinton wins a state by five votes, you'll be glad that those six Stein supporters you know voted for Stein instead of actually voting for Trump.

[democrattotheend]

42. A message that neither of the major party candidates earned your vote

And that you are tired of your vote being taken for granted.

For people who live in swing states, I agree that it is idiotic and selfish to vote third party to send a message. But for those of us who live in very blue or very red states, sending a message is all we can do with our votes, because we have virtually no power to actually influence the presidential election.

If I wanted to vote third party, I would do so knowing that my vote would not jeopardize the Supreme Court, undo the progress of the Obama Administration, or elect a neo-Nazi fascist as president because I feel like I have no meaningful say in who gets elected. I live in a state that voted for Obama by over 60% twice. If Hillary is struggling to win here she will not win the election. I am voting for her because I want to, not because I have to.

[IndyV0te]

46. Those folks...

electing to vote third party are as sincere in their desire as you are in voting for Hillary.

It is their right to do so...so let it go.

[Third Doctor]

48. A lack of common sense

and pragmatism.

[Shandris]

50. Or it could be 'Holy crap, look how angry these entitled people are with MY vote! LOL'.

There are lots of messages, and just because you can identify one or two doesn't mean you have much an idea of a person's motivations.

Another message might be, "I won't donate one scrap of my emotive energy to an effort guaranteed to end in war and corporate malfeasance buttressed by the White House itself", and yet another might be "Why would I spend my effort, my energy, and my irreplaceable time to support someone who's entire platform is to make sure 'more of the same' is what happens when 'more of the same' has, for 20 years, been the destruction of my home area and is AT PRESENT destroying American cities in burning rage?" That might be another message.

Or, you know, they could be racists. There are some of them, no doubt.

Messages, how do they work?

(EDIT: It occurs to me some might read this and for some inexplicable reason think that I was voting third party. I can assure you, in no way am I voting third party or for Trump.)

[tonyt53]

54. Simple. I care about "me" more than than the country.

[TonyPDX]

55. It means "I'm not responsible for paying my bills so if the economy tanks, no problem."

It means "Poor people? I don't know Americans who are struggling now and would suffer severely under a republican President."

It means "There aren't women in my life who should control their own bodies."

It means "I don't give a damn about the balance of the Supreme Court"

It means "I've got my college degree already. Who cares about anyone else?"

It means "If you get sick, go to an emergency room."

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

56. I am superior.

I drink fine wines, or micro-brewery beer. Better yet, I make my own wine and beer, and have photoshopped my own label.

I prefer foreign films, without subtitles, pretending to understand the deeper meaning.

I vote third-party, mostly because you don't.

[zonkers]

62. That I have facial hair and play hacky sack? Just kidding!

[joshcryer]

76. Privilege.

[Rex]

79. Whatever it is, it must be one that is purely symbolic.

Voting third party won't cure anything, but some folks think it will.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

81. No. But this is not a normal year. Normally votes equal power, even third party votes.

It's simple:

"Look at me! I'm a dumbass with no common sense at all! I'm throwing my vote away because I have not bothered to consider the consequences of it."

In a normal year, a vote is power, even for a third party. They represent people who have influence and can sway policy or sway the opposition to greater or lesser opposition.

This is not a normal year.

This is a dangerous year.

A vote for a third party this year may help elect Trump and then third parties will represent very little power. It will be Trump versus Democrats and rump GOP in a titanic struggle both before and potentially after the election (if Trump wins).

Can't mess around this year with third party "protest" votes.

[we can do it]

82. Actually it sends no message.

No one really knows who a person votes for. So their little tantrum impresses no one but themselves.

[BlueMTexpat]

92. Bingo!

But if enough are like this to affect the election so that Hillary does not win, those who voted third-party will see that their entitled narcissistic selfish a**holeishness will literally be in-part responsible for a plethora of evils. Even if Hillary does win without their votes (as I believe that she will), I hope that they will have the guts to own up to voting third party and to their general egotistic and selfish a**holeishness. But I won't hold my breath.

I personally believe that Hillary is in much better shape than even the good polls show. And my voting residence is in MD, which is reliably blue.

But I will be very proudly casting my own vote for Hillary Clinton, the best candidate bar none!

[quickesst]

88. you are absolutely right

It's that simple.

[Charles Bukowski]

89. It exposes the phoniness of these so-called

Liberal Puritans.

Four years of Trump would he disastrous for the progressive agenda, not to mention women and minorities, yet frauds like Susan Sarandon are running around acting like Clinton is worse. That's right folks: the Bernie Bros are easily more anti-Hillary than anti-Trump.

The Far Left and the Far Right live in a fantasy world of lies, conspiracy theories, and general nuttiness. I never noticed the similarities before this election, but they're there and they're frustrating.

We have a wannabe fascist running for president and THIS is the year they want to protest vote? Piss off.

[Orsino]

94. Not quite that simple.

This year, dumbassery is certainly implied, given the presence of a candidate Trump, but we can also acknowledge the corruption of the media as a factor in miseducating us.

[Demsrule86]

96. It sends a...

Fuck you to women (no say over your body and no rights at all), people who need health insurance, people who need a safety net, LGBTQ, minority folks, kids who need student loans and such, Immigrants, the poor, the middle class and people who are not Christians (all other religions). It is a giant FU to most of America and only an entitled clueless voter would vote third party... voters such as Green traitors. Check your privilege Greens and consider someone else besides your precious selves for a change.

[rock]

101. Actually, I was going to be as unemotional as I could be

And say, "No message at all. It is as silent as no vote at all."

[FrenchieCat]

107. It says...I don't really give a fuck

Last edited Sun Sep 25, 2016, 12:15 AM - Edit history (1)

About anybody but my Conscience?

[grossproffit]

108. That some people are so open minded that their brains have fallen out.

[Lil Missy]

109. Stupidity n/t

[LeftRant]

111. That we live in a democracy and we have the freedom to vote for whoever we want.

Stop vote-shaming. It not only doesn't work, it breeds resentment.