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TheBlackAdder

(28,075 posts)
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 01:55 PM Nov 2016

The Battle Begins As Wisconsin Denies Jill Stein Request For Statewide Hand Recount

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The Wisconsin Elections Commission has denied a request by Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein for a hand recount of all ballots.

The AP reported, “The Wisconsin Elections Commission has voted unanimously to reject a request from Green Party candidate Jill Stein to conduct a hand recount of the presidential vote. Instead, the commission Monday voted to allow local election clerks to determine the method they would use for a recount.”

Stein can appeal, and ask a judge to order the recount by hand, but it appears that the plan is to simply run the same ballots through the voting machines again. Running the ballots through the machines again will accomplish nothing, as Stein is claiming that the election system is not secure and could have been compromised.



More at the jump...


http://www.politicususa.com/2016/11/28/battle-begins-wisconsin-denies-jill-stein-request-statewide-hand-recount.html



What kind of bullshit is this, to let the local clerks decide?

So, the guys padding the tallies get to decide if they are scrutinized? Banana Republic 101.


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48 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Battle Begins As Wisconsin Denies Jill Stein Request For Statewide Hand Recount (Original Post) TheBlackAdder Nov 2016 OP
What are they charging millions for? MattP Nov 2016 #1
It was a Jill Stein fundraiser/Money might get used for a recount fundraiser. Apex812 Nov 2016 #3
Well they cannot say it costs too much. Jill has the money to pay for a hand recount. UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #10
They are always hiding the actual ballots. sfwriter Nov 2016 #27
If I remember right, the Election Commission was recently jiggered by Walker's minions. shraby Nov 2016 #2
The commision chairmain is a Democrat and it's 3 Democrats and 3 Republicans mythology Nov 2016 #21
Why is the fact-free assertion that it's "unlikely to change anything" relevant? bigmonkey Nov 2016 #44
Walker just appointed all his buddies to the election commission womanofthehills Nov 2016 #35
Not true. former9thward Nov 2016 #47
Wonder whose funny little figures are in this dogindia Nov 2016 #4
hey if she is paying for a hand recount why not have a hand recount? UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #5
Exactly. And why was it a unanimous decision by the commission? Not one patriot. TheBlackAdder Nov 2016 #7
Why does the commission decide to do an improper recount? UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #11
The decision makes sense given the concerns are with electronic voting, not paper Amishman Nov 2016 #25
What?? comparing a hand count to a machine count will tell if the machines are accurate. nt TheFrenchRazor Nov 2016 #41
You have this exactly backwards. bigmonkey Nov 2016 #45
So...no plan to appeal and ask a judge to order the recount by hand???? Farmgirl1961 Nov 2016 #6
I think that is still up in the air. TheBlackAdder Nov 2016 #9
Can we put some pressure on this process and on Jill Stein to do this? Farmgirl1961 Nov 2016 #15
I'd guess it's in the works... Ellipsis Nov 2016 #20
Yes, she's going to sue Arazi Nov 2016 #24
Thanks for that link red dog 1 Nov 2016 #29
Praise be... nt TheFrenchRazor Nov 2016 #40
FUCK MY GOVERNOR jodymarie aimee Nov 2016 #8
This is all the Wisconsin recount law provides for frazzled Nov 2016 #12
This is the fault of the WI election committee. WI can perform a full hand recount.Illegality Hidden UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #14
I posted this last week frazzled Nov 2016 #17
Well I say be mad at the WI election commission. They have the money to do a recount by hand. UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #19
The biggest concern is with the dre machines. Tiggeroshii Nov 2016 #18
Well Jill Stein has the money to pay for it so the lack of money is no excuse. UCmeNdc Nov 2016 #16
You don't get to tell us to be mad at Stein. That's YOUR opinion and worth as much KittyWampus Nov 2016 #26
Whoa! frazzled Nov 2016 #28
Not facts, assertions. bigmonkey Nov 2016 #46
Shocked! I am shocked I tell you! tandem5 Nov 2016 #13
better donate more , she is going to need lots of money jmg257 Nov 2016 #22
That is how the law is written forthemiddle Nov 2016 #23
#WHATARETHEYHIDING zonkers Nov 2016 #30
Democrats on the Wisconsin Elections Commission .. red dog 1 Nov 2016 #31
The WI Election Board has 3 Democrats and 3 Repugs deminwi Nov 2016 #32
It's up to each country now to decide on a hand count womanofthehills Nov 2016 #37
There was ONE Programmer for the Wisconsin Machines... cureautismnow Nov 2016 #33
wow. and has *anybody* else looked at that software? doubt it. what a joke. nt TheFrenchRazor Nov 2016 #39
Jill Stein should ask for a "risk-limiting" audit red dog 1 Nov 2016 #34
78 counties - up to each county if they will do a hand count womanofthehills Nov 2016 #36
72 Ellipsis Nov 2016 #43
nothing to see here folks, move along... nt TheFrenchRazor Nov 2016 #38
Always clear that auditing the election would not be easy. NT. andym Nov 2016 #42
Wtf, Wisconsin?!!?!!?!!! AgadorSparticus Nov 2016 #48
 

Apex812

(45 posts)
3. It was a Jill Stein fundraiser/Money might get used for a recount fundraiser.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:04 PM
Nov 2016

Desperate people donated because it was better than doing nothing and laying down and accepting the results. If only Hillary Clinton had the money to get lawyers to get proper audits....

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
10. Well they cannot say it costs too much. Jill has the money to pay for a hand recount.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:09 PM
Nov 2016

Why not have a hand recount Wisconsin election committee?

This makes no sense.

 

sfwriter

(3,032 posts)
27. They are always hiding the actual ballots.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:59 PM
Nov 2016

Why?

I say mandatory recounts every year. But, I've been saying it since DU started.

-SFWriter

shraby

(21,946 posts)
2. If I remember right, the Election Commission was recently jiggered by Walker's minions.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:01 PM
Nov 2016

Can't remember the details, but it's been tampered with to favor the repubs.

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
21. The commision chairmain is a Democrat and it's 3 Democrats and 3 Republicans
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:10 PM
Nov 2016

The decision was unanimous. It was rejected because it's exceptionally unlikely to change anything.

bigmonkey

(1,798 posts)
44. Why is the fact-free assertion that it's "unlikely to change anything" relevant?
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 08:52 PM
Nov 2016

That's the question.

womanofthehills

(8,584 posts)
35. Walker just appointed all his buddies to the election commission
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 06:32 PM
Nov 2016

The committee keeps raising the amt of money they want

former9thward

(31,803 posts)
47. Not true.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 09:44 PM
Nov 2016

The election commission is 3 Democrats and 3 Republicans. The Governor appoints 2, one R and one D. The other 4 are appointed by the Democrats and Republicans in the legislature. The Chairman, a Democrat, was appointed by the Democratic leader in the Assembly.

http://elections.wi.gov/about/members

dogindia

(1,345 posts)
4. Wonder whose funny little figures are in this
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:05 PM
Nov 2016

Guess I am not surprised.

After the tweet fest and over the top reaction.

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
5. hey if she is paying for a hand recount why not have a hand recount?
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:07 PM
Nov 2016

Why do these election commissions do everything half way? Why not have a complete recount? It is not costing them any money.

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
11. Why does the commission decide to do an improper recount?
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:12 PM
Nov 2016

This isn't really a full transparent recount!

Amishman

(5,541 posts)
25. The decision makes sense given the concerns are with electronic voting, not paper
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:47 PM
Nov 2016

Ask for a hand recount of paper ballots when you claim the electronic voting machines are the problem is like insisting they replace your car stereo when the airbag is recalled.

bigmonkey

(1,798 posts)
45. You have this exactly backwards.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 08:54 PM
Nov 2016

The paper ballots are a corrective to electronic errors. That's why they are kept, because they are a more permanent, much less easily manipulated record.

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
24. Yes, she's going to sue
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:35 PM
Nov 2016
http://www.jsonline.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/11/28/elections-staff-layout-recount-timeline/94539210/


Madison — The Wisconsin Elections Commission set a timetable Monday for a recount of the presidential election but rejected a request to conduct it by hand made by Green Party candidate Jill Stein, who quickly responded that she would sue.

Snip

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
12. This is all the Wisconsin recount law provides for
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:13 PM
Nov 2016

I posted that last week. I felt from the beginning that anyone who donated was being suckered by Stein. It was in black-and-white in the WI recount provisions law. You should be mad at Stein more than Wisconsin: she led you to believe there would be a hand recount by some independent group, when all there ever was was a provision for a county-by-county check by the same election officials who did it the first time.

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
14. This is the fault of the WI election committee. WI can perform a full hand recount.Illegality Hidden
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:29 PM
Nov 2016

The Wisconsin Elections Commission has denied a request by Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein for a hand recount of all ballots.

They do not want a full transparent recount.

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
17. I posted this last week
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:33 PM
Nov 2016

when everyone was donating, thinking Stein would get a hand recount. That was before the election commission met:

For state and federal elections, the county boards of canvassers for the counties in which the contested votes are cast conduct the recount. The Wisconsin Elections Commission recommends that the board of canvassers be composed of the same people who initially canvassed the election results.

http://elections.wi.gov/sites/default/files/publication/65/recount_manual_11_2016_pdf_17034.pdf

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
19. Well I say be mad at the WI election commission. They have the money to do a recount by hand.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:36 PM
Nov 2016

Do the recount by hand. If you really want transparency!

 

Tiggeroshii

(11,088 posts)
18. The biggest concern is with the dre machines.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:35 PM
Nov 2016

It would be highly inefficient, and take far too long to turn them on and reprogram them to get the results. Easiest would be to just count the paper recordings, which is what I would assume most precincts will do anyway.

UCmeNdc

(9,589 posts)
16. Well Jill Stein has the money to pay for it so the lack of money is no excuse.
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 02:32 PM
Nov 2016

If she did not have the money they would have claimed a full recount cannot be done because it is too expensive.

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
26. You don't get to tell us to be mad at Stein. That's YOUR opinion and worth as much
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:55 PM
Nov 2016

as anyone offered to pay you for it.

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
28. Whoa!
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 04:03 PM
Nov 2016

Sorry the facts dismay you so much. The accusation in your post is officially alertable--but I'll just take it you're having a bad, bad day and let it go at that. Go take a rest.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
22. better donate more , she is going to need lots of money
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:14 PM
Nov 2016

"Stein is going to need to go to court, and if the 2000 recount is a guide, she will need to raise a great deal of money, because most of the critical battles in the process will play out in court, not at tables in precincts around the state."

"Updated. The Wisconsin Elections Commission has denied a request by Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein to perform a recount of ballots by hand and she is prepared to go to court to challenge the decision, according to media reports. The recount will begin Thursday if payment for the process is received by Tuesday."

forthemiddle

(1,373 posts)
23. That is how the law is written
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 03:20 PM
Nov 2016

It's not BS, it's the clear writing of the law. The commission can rule otherwise, but they are not required to.

And by the way, it was a unanimous ruling by the bipartisan board.

red dog 1

(27,648 posts)
31. Democrats on the Wisconsin Elections Commission ..
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 04:29 PM
Nov 2016

..should be ashamed of themselves, especially the Chairman,
Mark Thomsen.

If the 2012 Recall election is any indication, a statewide hand count is necessary to ensure that there was no tampering.with the machines.

"Recall Election Fraud in Wisconsin? You Betcha!"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101630961

"Meet Command Central: The People in Charge of Wisconsin Voting machines"
http://wcmcoop.com/2012/05/22/meet-command-central-the-people-in-charge-of-wisconsin-voting-machines/

deminwi

(66 posts)
32. The WI Election Board has 3 Democrats and 3 Repugs
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 04:32 PM
Nov 2016

Please stop accusing the good Democrats on the WI Elections Board as being bad people or unethical. As a citizen of WI, I trust them far more than anyone from out of state. They ruled against a hand recount along with the 3 Repugs......it happens and I trust them.

cureautismnow

(1,675 posts)
33. There was ONE Programmer for the Wisconsin Machines...
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 06:02 PM
Nov 2016

...and she REFUSED to take an ethics exam.

https://mn.gov/law-library-stat/archive/ctapun/0701/opa060271-0116.htm

And she works just down the hall from MICHELLE BACHMAN.

The motto for her company is:

"Your partner for successful elections!"

https://www.facebook.com/ccelections/?hc_location=ufi

red dog 1

(27,648 posts)
34. Jill Stein should ask for a "risk-limiting" audit
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 06:28 PM
Nov 2016

A "risk-limiting" audit is an audit that manually examines a random sample of the ballots in a way that has a large chance of detecting and correcting incorrect results.
If the reported winner of a contest really won, a risk-limiting audit generally needs to examine only a small fraction of the ballots.
But if a reported winner actually lost, a risk-limiting audit has a large chance of indicating that a full hand count is needed to set the record straight."
(From..USA Today: Still Time for an Election Audit)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028290706

womanofthehills

(8,584 posts)
36. 78 counties - up to each county if they will do a hand count
Mon Nov 28, 2016, 06:33 PM
Nov 2016

People who live in Wisconsin can pressure their county for a hand count

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