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DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Retired » Retired Forums » 2016 Postmortem (Forum) » To just write off white w...

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 07:47 AM

RBInMaine (13,570 posts)

 

To just write off white working class folks or ANY group ANYWHERE is STUPID. Here is why:

Last edited Thu Dec 8, 2016, 06:56 PM - Edit history (1)

* In the 60's, so many of these small towns and rural areas were doing SO much better economically than today. Many are now in very dire economic straights, and Trump's message of re-opening factories and attacking bad trade deals definitely resonated. No denying it.

* Obama won MANY of these working class voters that now went for Trump. So MANY do vote primarily on economics. We can't win all white working class voters back, but we can win many back with the right economic arguments and respect of their culture. WE MUST END THE DISCONNECT WITH THESE FOLKS!

* The "either/or" argument is a load of horse shit. We are talking about boosting economic populism and having a strong, compelling, resonating jobs message for EVERYONE, not abandoning social progressivism. And, just because saying you agree with the right of legal and safe gun owners to hunt and target shoot is not abandoning progressive ideals in any way, shape, or form. A bleeding heart liberal can also be an avid hunter.

* We MUST return to our working class roots and stop being the party of corporate-lite!! And we need to be more than a party of liberal social issues. Those issues are important, but people MAINLY vote on ECONOMICS, not social issues. Any survey will tell you that JOBS AND THE ECONOMY is always the number one issue. People want something tangible for their vote.

* If we are to be the "party of the people" that means ALL the people EVERYWHERE, not only certain groups. Yes, we need to embrace all people and value all people, but that sure as heck doesn't mean ABANDONING white working class or ANY voters. Just writing them off is STUPID.

* Writing off working class rural and small town folks is the very kind of thinking which has hollowed us out at the state and local levels and has now led us to being the minority in the national government too.

* Sure we need to go after gerrymandering, but we can't do that without winning state majorities and that means we need a message for small town and rural voters too. We also need to bolster our traditional voting blocks including young people, and we do that with a powerful JOBS message too. We can not just win on identity politics and liberal social issues. We need a strong, compelling, CLEAR, working and middle class economic message too that we put FRONT AND CENTER!!

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Arrow 45 replies Author Time Post
Reply To just write off white working class folks or ANY group ANYWHERE is STUPID. Here is why: (Original post)
 RBInMaine Dec 2016 OP
LineReply Yup....
 sfwriter Dec 2016 #1
LineReply One of the best post-election opinions posted here so far. Thank you.
 democrank Dec 2016 #2
LineLineReply no, just ignorant
 Afromania Dec 2016 #11
LineReply I don't think Democrats wrote them off. This comes down to the hostile dynamics of the primary.
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #3
LineLineReply Yep, all bernies fault. LOL
 hueymahl Dec 2016 #5
LineLineLineReply LOL, your snide comment shows you aren't too concerned about a Trump
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #8
LineLineLineLineReply It is like people are literally wearing blinders
 hueymahl Dec 2016 #10
LineLineLineLineLineReply Yes you are wearing blinders. The numbered posts showed you attacked me.
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #12
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply There is lots of blame to go around
 hueymahl Dec 2016 #15
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply Okay. Yes, any campaign that doesn't get 100% of the vote can analyze
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #18
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply We agree more than we disagree
 hueymahl Dec 2016 #21
LineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineLineReply This sounds very doable and reasonable.
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #24
LineLineReply I agree. How else to go from Obama to Trump?
 treestar Dec 2016 #7
LineLineLineReply Yup, Trump being a con man, saw a chance to con them even more
 R B Garr Dec 2016 #9
LineReply Great Analysis. Thanks.
 hueymahl Dec 2016 #4
LineReply Strawman, few are writing them off just not go to coddle them with denigrating minorities ...
 uponit7771 Dec 2016 #6
LineLineReply exactly.
 Fast Walker 52 Dec 2016 #30
LineLineReply I refuse to coddle any Trump supporter or voter.
 leftofcool Dec 2016 #32
LineReply Rural and rust belt working class voters are not interested in our realistic jobs plans.
 LonePirate Dec 2016 #13
LineLineReply maybe, maybe not
 sweetapogee Dec 2016 #14
LineLineLineReply No, they will never shut up about their racist resentment of "urbanites" because facts don't matter
 Coventina Dec 2016 #16
LineLineLineReply Baloney, blue states pay red welfare. Except for kids I wish we could stop subsidizing them.
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #20
LineLineLineLineReply well then
 sweetapogee Dec 2016 #28
LineLineLineLineLineReply Just correcting your nonsense about red states not benefiting from our blue taxes....
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #31
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply not worried
 sweetapogee Dec 2016 #35
LineReply Nobody is writing them off, but as the old saying says you can lead a horse to water . . .
 Vinca Dec 2016 #17
LineLineReply Exactly!
 leftofcool Dec 2016 #33
LineReply No, people who cared about economics first went for Hillary. Trump won on terrorism and immigration.
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #19
LineLineReply Misreading the data
 realmirage Dec 2016 #22
LineLineLineReply Trumps racism motivated apathetic voters more than any economic message did...
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #23
LineLineLineLineReply That is exactly correct!
 leftofcool Dec 2016 #34
LineLineLineLineNew Reply yup. it was minorities who were attacked in the campaign
 JI7 Dec 2016 #37
LineLineLineLineLineNew Reply It's so twisted, but the media went out of their way to normalize the hatred and
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #38
LineLineNew Reply I think you're wrong - look at the NACO county map
 Yo_Mama Dec 2016 #40
LineLineLineNew Reply This was links are to a search box. Polls in the rust belt said
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #42
LineLineNew Reply I don't think so. Perhaps in more prosperous areas, yes, but voter
 Yo_Mama Dec 2016 #43
LineLineLineNew Reply So Obama got black voters who never voted before and are not voting again....
 bettyellen Dec 2016 #44
LineReply Let's just promise shit we cannot deliver n/t
 taught_me_patience Dec 2016 #25
LineReply Everything I'd say if I were as articulate as you :)
 jack_krass Dec 2016 #26
LineReply it mystifies me
 MFM008 Dec 2016 #27
LineReply straw man-- no one is writing them off. But check this out:
 Fast Walker 52 Dec 2016 #29
LineNew Reply Write off the white working class? Why? Why even say it?
 jalan48 Dec 2016 #36
LineNew Reply I have to agree. These people were a traditional Dem base, and there's no reason
 Yo_Mama Dec 2016 #39
LineLineNew Reply There's not much evidence that the vote was mostly economic.
 TwilightZone Dec 2016 #41
LineNew Reply K and r
 Dems to Win Dec 2016 #45

Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 07:52 AM

sfwriter (3,032 posts)

1. Yup....

 

Also, many of those areas are not uniformly red. There are roots to grow from.

Economic justice is social justice. There should be no conflict.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:16 AM

Star Member democrank (10,512 posts)

2. One of the best post-election opinions posted here so far. Thank you.

The disconnect between some Democrats and many citizens of the economically disadvantaged working class must end. Many here protest the "elitist" label, but it's use is justified for more than a few of us.

It is untrue that all Trump supporters are ignorant racists. What is true is that many of them are just plain desperate and are willing to overlook a lot in order to have someone with power respond to their devastating economic plight.

The fact that we won the popular vote does not exempt us from criticism for all the House, Senate and governorships we've lost. We have a lot of work to do and we're going to have to gain control of something in order to do it. That means reaching more people, not the same number we have now.

I spend a lot of time talking with poor people in rural areas. Recently I had my septic tank pumped by a farmer who is about to lose his farm. He works seven days a week and must be in his 70's. This is one of a zillion stories I've heard and many of them end in a comment about there being no difference between Democrats and Republicans. I disagree with that belief, but lots of voters think otherwise. We must listen and learn from these folks rather than tell them we already know what's best for them....and we don't really need their vote anyhow.

I learned so much from what happened with the Standing Rock Sioux....the leadership, the commitment of purpose, the courage. It's a fine example of what we could accomplish, even facing incredible odds. I' m willing to bet there were many cultural and political differences among the participants at Standing Rock, but they respected one another and made something meaningful happen.

We can find common ground with SOME Trump supporters and with some folks who didn't vote. It's worth a try.


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Response to democrank (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:14 AM

Afromania (2,743 posts)

11. no, just ignorant

The Republicans aren't exactly working class either. They talk a real good game while constantly sucking the life from these people, and that's just alright for their voters. The folks you are talking to in these rural areas have put Republicans in charge of most things out where they are.

You say they feel lie there is no difference between the parties? So why do they overwhelmingly keep Republicans in power? How are you going to get somebody to vote a full Democratic ticket when they so clearly refuse to do so no matter what happens? What do we say to people like that other than we are going to give you every single thing you want irregardless of it's impossibility or economic blowback?

Obama ran on hope and change and got zero help from Republicans and zero help from his own party for a nice chunk of his time in office. If they didn't get the change it's their own damn faults for not putting in people that wouldn't do anything but obstruct, denigrate, propagandize and generally work hard at keeping their voters in the dark and ignorant.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:45 AM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

3. I don't think Democrats wrote them off. This comes down to the hostile dynamics of the primary.

He alienated a large portion of those voters from reality with his false promises and grandstanding. Trump saw that and capitalized on an opportunity to con them even more. Now we have a billionaire appointing billionaires.

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:56 AM

hueymahl (2,057 posts)

5. Yep, all bernies fault. LOL

The seven stages of grief are a long road.

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Response to hueymahl (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:00 AM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

8. LOL, your snide comment shows you aren't too concerned about a Trump

White House. That's the hallmark of Bernie's campaign. If you couldn't have Bernie, then we couldn't have anyone at all.

So maybe you are projecting your bitterness over Bernie's resounding primary loss -- by millions of votes.

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #8)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:09 AM

hueymahl (2,057 posts)

10. It is like people are literally wearing blinders

Not that I need to explain myself to you, but since you have chosen to attack me instead of the message, I voted for Hillary, campaigned for Hillary, donated to Hillary and lost a few friends over Hillary.

The difference is I am not a true believer in any politician. She would have made a great president. But she was a shitty politician. Blaming Bernie for her terribly run campaign is "denial" squared.

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Response to hueymahl (Reply #10)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:18 AM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

12. Yes you are wearing blinders. The numbered posts showed you attacked me.

And you didn't have a message, it was just a snide comment apparently from your own projection.

You don't have to be a "true believer" to understand common sense and common knowledge. Bernie had no path to victory but he continued in the campaign and the end result is that he alienated many voters by overpromising and calling Hillary corrupt and by association, the Democratic party.

And her "terribly run campaign" won the popular vote. It was in the states/areas where Bernie overpromised that Donald was able to peel off gullible voters. Others were Bernie or Busters. Bernie is responsible for his own actions, and maligning Democrats was a really sucky thing to do.

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #12)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:21 PM

hueymahl (2,057 posts)

15. There is lots of blame to go around

Like a plane crashing, there is almost never one event that caused it. It is usually a series of failures and outside events that led to the ultimate crash.

Extending the analogy further, HRC was the pilot. She made mistakes, but she was not the sole reason the plane crashed.

Too many people refuse to acknowledge she made mistakes. To me, that is crazy talk, and leads nowhere but to further losses. This was the origin of the "blinders" comment.

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Response to hueymahl (Reply #15)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:51 PM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

18. Okay. Yes, any campaign that doesn't get 100% of the vote can analyze

the weak areas and should do so. I was talking more about the overall trajectory and tone that was set in the primary by Bernie attacking Hillary and, by association, Democrats. Donald Trump is a con man and he obviously listened and observed how Bernie's divisive rhetoric was catching on without having to substantiate anything he said. Even Kellyanne Conway said Bernie "softened" up Hillary in the context of making her vulnerable. Trump even thanked Bernie for handing him the Clinton smear playbook.

The trajectory of the Primary definitely set the tone for further exploitation by Trump and his staff by their own admission. Now look what we have. A billionaire appointing billionaires.

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #18)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:57 PM

hueymahl (2,057 posts)

21. We agree more than we disagree

I'm just more than a little frustrated with the large number of people refusing to acknowledge that we need to change. Not change our core beliefs, but certainly change our messaging and our tactics.

As a conciliatory gesture, I will acknowledge that Bernie did a great job of identifying her weaknesses, and that helped Trump. Just like we will never know how he would have done if he got the nomination, we will never know how HRC would have done if Bernie had not run in the primary.

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Response to hueymahl (Reply #21)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:15 PM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

24. This sounds very doable and reasonable.

It looked like Hillary had Obama's legacy to run on, as well, so she adopted a lot of that which implied a continuation of policy. And some things Bernie focused on were not really her weaknesses, but more his own version of reality that he hammered and thereby created a weakness to exploit. Trump is a straight up con man, so any little crumb of discord he manipulated to his benefit, and the primary gave him the playbook to hurt her.

I liked your message, though. It sounds very reasonable.

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Response to R B Garr (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:59 AM

Star Member treestar (81,189 posts)

7. I agree. How else to go from Obama to Trump?

I recall BS winning all those states with more white people. Then the Orange Menace took up that anti-establishment theme. Yet no one really wants to lose all that stability we have, so it's silly.

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Response to treestar (Reply #7)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:04 AM

Star Member R B Garr (16,533 posts)

9. Yup, Trump being a con man, saw a chance to con them even more

by aping Bernie's grandstanding and taking it to even another level of crazy.

"Trump campaign uses Sanders' words to knock Clinton..."
http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/04/politics/bernie-sanders-donald-trump-clinton-foundation/

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:52 AM

hueymahl (2,057 posts)

4. Great Analysis. Thanks.

I expect you will get attacked by the usually crowd with the usual cries of bigotry and racism. Always easier to blame someone else than to accept responsibility. Thanks for posting.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:58 AM

Star Member uponit7771 (88,623 posts)

6. Strawman, few are writing them off just not go to coddle them with denigrating minorities ...

.. and losing our soul and a good portion of the dem base in outreach to them the way Fuck Mouth did.

Comey, Voter suppresion and Russia... get them first and we can look internally


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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:40 PM

Fast Walker 52 (7,723 posts)

30. exactly.

 

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Response to uponit7771 (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 06:45 PM

leftofcool (19,460 posts)

32. I refuse to coddle any Trump supporter or voter.

I don't give a shit what part of the country they live in or how much they make or if they lost their jobs or what ever.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:18 AM

Star Member LonePirate (12,892 posts)

13. Rural and rust belt working class voters are not interested in our realistic jobs plans.

They have no interest in training programs or emerging technologies or pragmatic government solutions. They only believe in the fantastical and bogus claims by the new Racist-in-Chief that he can bring back their old jobs which require no new learning or drastic work life (and ideological) changes from them.

Our only hope is they come to their senses and realize his ideas and plans are failures so they need a different path.

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Response to LonePirate (Reply #13)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 10:32 AM

sweetapogee (1,168 posts)

14. maybe, maybe not

but there is a perception among rural peoples that a lot of their tax funds go directly to the cities and urban areas and have no benefit to them. Then when they try to get a little bit of tax funding to finance their volunteer fire department that needs a new truck and they are told no. Not pointing fingers at anyone but some on our side will say if you want to benefit from government grants then move to the city, the implication being that it's their fault or their decision to live where they are not receiving much of anything for their tax dollars.

What we need to do is show them how they are getting benefits from their tax dollars. That will shut them up.

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Response to sweetapogee (Reply #14)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:25 PM

Star Member Coventina (25,310 posts)

16. No, they will never shut up about their racist resentment of "urbanites" because facts don't matter

to them.

They flat out don't believe anything that does not fit their existing beliefs.

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Response to sweetapogee (Reply #14)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:55 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

20. Baloney, blue states pay red welfare. Except for kids I wish we could stop subsidizing them.

 

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #20)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:35 PM

sweetapogee (1,168 posts)

28. well then

we shall just write them off and be done with it, problem solved.

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Response to sweetapogee (Reply #28)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:43 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

31. Just correcting your nonsense about red states not benefiting from our blue taxes....

 

Don't worry your head about it, the only cuts congress will allow is benefits for education, and the healthy nad welfare of women and kids in poverty.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #31)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 07:28 PM

sweetapogee (1,168 posts)

35. not worried

Thanks and have a fantastic day!

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:26 PM

Star Member Vinca (49,179 posts)

17. Nobody is writing them off, but as the old saying says you can lead a horse to water . . .

If people are not interested enough in their own futures to read about issues and candidates and only follow their piss poor "gut" instinct, what are Democrats supposed to do? It won't matter if we suddenly become the best friends of the rust belt if they refuse to turn off Alex Jones and Rush Limbaugh and listen.

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Response to Vinca (Reply #17)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 06:46 PM

leftofcool (19,460 posts)

33. Exactly!

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 04:53 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

19. No, people who cared about economics first went for Hillary. Trump won on terrorism and immigration.

 

Anyone can tell you what you want to hear - it's economics. And part of the xenophobia is being phased if "others" do well.

Sorry but that's not who we are.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #19)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:10 PM

realmirage (2,117 posts)

22. Misreading the data

 

The democrats are usually more trusted on economic issues. The question is did ENOUGH people in the rust belt feel we had the right economic message compared to Obama. The answer is no. That's the problem and that's one reason why turnout in the rust belt sucked, and why it flipped red

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Response to realmirage (Reply #22)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:13 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

23. Trumps racism motivated apathetic voters more than any economic message did...

 

I'm sick of people trying to cover that up. The wall and the roundup of muslims were the most important "change" voters wanted.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #23)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 06:46 PM

leftofcool (19,460 posts)

34. That is exactly correct!

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #23)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 08:16 PM

JI7 (87,749 posts)

37. yup. it was minorities who were attacked in the campaign

And a large majority of white men voted for the candidate who did that.

Yet people are acting like white men were the victims in the campaign.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #37)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 08:25 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

38. It's so twisted, but the media went out of their way to normalize the hatred and

 

And now they do with their entitlement. They don't just want jobs, they want the kind of high paying jobs that you need no education for, and plenty of time and a half.
The kind of jobs that were never open to anyone else but them. The kind of jobs Reagan fucked them out of.
Yet they don't want to raise minimum wage because fuck everyone else. And they're the victims, because easy street is gone.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #19)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 08:53 PM

Yo_Mama (8,303 posts)

40. I think you're wrong - look at the NACO county map

Also remember that there's been an industrial slowdown going on, which has adversely affected some of these areas and could have frightened voters.

Try this one (jobs growth since recovery):
http://explorer.naco.org/index.html?dset=County%20Economies&ind=Jobs%20Growth%20Rate%2C%20Recovery#


And this one (GDP growth since recovery):
http://explorer.naco.org/index.html?dset=County%20Economies&ind=GDP%20Growth%20Rate%2C%20Recovery#

It explains why some areas have more economic concerns than others.

It's important to also remember that in some of the areas doing relatively well, fracking has been a very large component, and so the locals may vote strongly against too much more regulation.

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Response to Yo_Mama (Reply #40)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:18 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

42. This was links are to a search box. Polls in the rust belt said

 

That what they preferred about Trump was halting immigration and terrorism- and xenophobes are usually sexist. What he saw at is rallies was a return to a time when white men ruled over women too. Equal pay, reproductive rights are also not too popular there.

When polled about the economy, people prefereee HRC. Lower and middle class voters preferred her too. It want people who were hurting economically as much as those who feared they would hurt.

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #19)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:27 PM

Yo_Mama (8,303 posts)

43. I don't think so. Perhaps in more prosperous areas, yes, but voter

turnout in less prosperous areas was either depressed or shifted Trumpwards in some.

It's more than just whites. What about black people not turning out to vote? In some areas there was a big drop in turnout, and as far as I could tell it had something to do with economics!
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/21/us/many-in-milwaukee-neighborhood-didnt-vote-and-dont-regret-it.html?_r=0
The biggest drop was here in District 15, a stretch of fading wooden homes, sandwich shops and fast-food restaurants that is 84 percent black. In this district, voter turnout declined by 19.5 percent from 2012 figures, according to Neil Albrecht, executive director of the City of Milwaukee Election Commission. It is home to some of Milwaukee’s poorest residents and, according to a 2016 documentary, “Milwaukee 53206,” has one of the nation’s highest per-capita incarceration rates.

At Upper Cutz, a bustling barbershop in a green-trimmed wooden house, talk of politics inevitably comes back to one man: Barack Obama. Mr. Obama’s elections infused many here with a feeling of connection to national politics they had never before experienced. But their lives have not gotten appreciably better, and sourness has set in.

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Response to Yo_Mama (Reply #43)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 09:34 PM

bettyellen (47,209 posts)

44. So Obama got black voters who never voted before and are not voting again....

 

That's the other side of the tribalism we have seen all year. Not sure what point you're trying to make.
All the rust belt polling said Hillary won on economics- but Trump left her in the dust- 20 points ahead -on immigration/ terrorism. And that's what swung it.
I'm sorry but everyone is trying to change the narrative to suit their own agenda. They don't give a fuck about the oligarchs- they happily voted one in.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:16 PM

taught_me_patience (5,477 posts)

25. Let's just promise shit we cannot deliver n/t

 

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:25 PM

jack_krass (1,009 posts)

26. Everything I'd say if I were as articulate as you :)

 

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:30 PM

MFM008 (19,698 posts)

27. it mystifies me

any sane person could look at that maggoty pile of orange shit and say to themselves, that's for me, unless fueled by some sort of racism or woman hating. Its just not logical.
I guess they think he will actually do something for them.
He will.
Just not what they expect.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 05:39 PM

Fast Walker 52 (7,723 posts)

29. straw man-- no one is writing them off. But check this out:

 

https://brandnewcongress.org/home

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 07:55 PM

Star Member jalan48 (13,692 posts)

36. Write off the white working class? Why? Why even say it?

Are we intentionally trying to alienate potential voters? Does the Democratic Party hate white working class voters now?

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 08:31 PM

Yo_Mama (8,303 posts)

39. I have to agree. These people were a traditional Dem base, and there's no reason

they can't be for the future.

Attributing all this to racism is just refusing to deal with it. I think this vote was mostly economic, and we'd better listen to the voters.

It is not as if the Dem party hasn't traditionally had a strong economic platform and message, after all. And it's not as if many of these voters didn't support Obama to victory (twice). So claiming that they are somehow so distant from the heart of the party isn't even sensible.

We also have to realize that there was slack voting from some urban/minority pockets with depressed conditions. The economic positions that will appeal to the rural depressed areas will also appeal to urban depressed areas.

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Response to Yo_Mama (Reply #39)

Thu Dec 8, 2016, 08:58 PM

TwilightZone (21,598 posts)

41. There's not much evidence that the vote was mostly economic.

Clinton won 52/42 with people who noted that the economy was their top priority, and she won with them in the rust belt.

Trump won on immigration and terrorism, in the 60/40 range on both. He didn't flip votes en masse in the rust belt. We lost them - many stayed home. Turnout was down for us and up for the GOP in those areas.

Turnout up, largely because of immigration and terrorism? That's not voting on economics.

It can be argued that people stayed home because of economics, but there's probably no way to know.

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Response to RBInMaine (Original post)

Fri Dec 9, 2016, 12:16 AM

Dems to Win (2,161 posts)

45. K and r

 

Thank you for this. I agree.

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