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[MohRokTah]

This message was self-deleted by its author (MohRokTah) on Mon Jul 20, 2015, 02:18 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

[cantbeserious]

1. How Does Anyone Change The Twisted Hearts And Minds Of Racists

eom

[Renew Deal]

2. So the strategy is to protest those that agree and ignore those that are less sympathetic?

Seems like a bad strategy. How about positively engage those that agree and protest those that don't?

[msanthrope]

3. How about engaging those that claim to agree and demanding they live up

to their promises?

[haikugal]

62. That would be Obama and his administration

as well as the DOJ...think big!

[MohRokTah]

4. Neither Bernie Sanders nor Martin O'MAlley "agree" with #blacklivesmatter

If they did they would have known this was coming and they would have been prepared for it.

deray mckesson
‏@deray

For too long, presidential candidates have taken the black vote for granted. And we are determined that this will not happen on our watch.

[aspirant]

58. You forgot to include HRC

[MohRokTah]

60. She wasn't there.

Give it time, though, the #blacklivesmatter movement has just begun to protest the Democratic candidates.

If she had been there she would have done as bad as the two who were there, and possibly worse.

[orpupilofnature57]

77. Sorry TOO late for it to be unscripted, Oh yeah she gets a pass, she'll wave it away .

[msanthrope]

5. 27 years on the floors of Congress...produced the answer we saw

Last edited Sun Jul 19, 2015, 09:46 AM - Edit history (2)

yesterday.

[MohRokTah]

7. Yep, progressives have ignored this for too long.

#blacklivesmatter WILL BE HEARD!

[msanthrope]

11. The most Establishment candidate......a long-serving white Senator from a

non-racially diverse state. And this is how he handled dissent.

[winter is coming]

20. Bernie was elected to the Senate in 2006. Are all your other "facts" this accurate? n/t

[msanthrope]

31. I meant "Congress" I'll edit and have my morning coffee.....nt

[TM99]

6. Bullshit!

Sanders addressed it just fine. O'Malley could have done better but he was ambushed.

Sanders speech in front of over 12,600 people included strong words on issues that impact blacks and latinos the most. And the crowd, which was extremely diverse, applauded each and every point.

If #blacklivesmatter is ready for the big time of protest movements, then I expect to see them at numerous campaign stops for ALL Democratic candidates. I also expect them to protest the Democratic Convention.

I applaud their actions, and I want to know that it was not just a one-off aimed at these two progressive candidates.

Here is another stellar example of Sanders speaking the truth about social and economic justice.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=11&v=wQgIbqg7IOU

If you can watch what happened at NN, his speech last night, and interviews like this and still say what you are saying, you are nothing more than a partisan hack spewing divisive lies and smears about a true progressive candidate.

[MohRokTah]

8. Bernie failed miserably.

He never saw it coming. HE dismissed them with a bullshit statement.

[TM99]

10. You are simply wrong.

You answered way to quick to have actually watched his 45 minutes speech or that ten minute interview.

You are pushing an agenda and using other poc as your weapon.

Shame on you!

[MohRokTah]

12. You are now to be ignored.

After making such an accusation, I dismiss anything you ight have to say about anything. I watched the videos of the speeches by both O'Malley and Sanders hours ago.

Good day.

[TM99]

17. Ignore me all you want.

You fling shit. Don't be surprised if others fight back against.

[bravenak]

72. He did terribly!!!

[billymayshere]

45. He's absolutely right.

You're on ignore now mohroktah, this is unnecessary and you're race baiting. Good day.

[Baitball Blogger]

46. The advice may not be welcome, but I would like to use

this as a learning experience for others who think that the term "race-baiting" will advance their cause with minorities members who are trying to express their concerns during this election year.

The post didn't get hidden this time, but I expect the term falls under the category of "you take your chances."

(And by the way, I think Bernie is committed to race issues and I trust he will take the criticism and make that clear in coming speeches.)


Results of the alert:


On Sun Jul 19, 2015, 10:44 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

He's absolutely right.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=458565

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Accusations of "race baiting" are right wing tactics to shut down real issues regarding minorities.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun Jul 19, 2015, 10:57 AM, and the Jury voted 3-4 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: billysmayhere has not been on DU long enough to understand the struggle that minorities have had to work through in order to stay relevant during an election year. Their opinions generally were dismissed because they were too inconvenient to deal with. Yes, even here on DU. But things are changing and I expect that it will take time for a white candidates to convince minorities that they are here for them too. So I am voting to hide this post for the "race-baiting" accusation to show a change in DU's commitment. I trust MIRT and the admins to sort out and find the real trolls who are here to disrupt.

Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: "Race baiting" is a racist way of saying someone (usually a person of color) is talking about racism. I agree it's a right-wing tactic to shut down discussion from people of color.

Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: I think the OP is out of line but race baiting isn't a term we should be using.

Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Right wing tactics are acceptable here.

Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE

Explanation: I think in this instance it's better to engage the poster than to hide the post.

[think]

22. Exactly. The OP provides no solutions & nothing but divisive rhetoric aimed at bolstering their

candidate by using the issue rather than discussing it.

Otherwise the OP might be talking about programs, laws, and other ideas & actions to actually DO something.

Things like:

1. Civilian Review Panels. Create a federal agency to set up guidelines, tools, and funding so that there is civilian oversight of police shootings and accusations of police brutality.

2. Making sure that the federal government works to create new guidelines and oversight for police action to make sure officers are serving & protecting Americans not killing & brutalizing them.

3. Working to provide information to promote racial unity and respect. Things like TV commercials with celebrities, politicians & other prominent people promoting racial unity, organizing local public workshops to find local solutions to help, creating public events promoting love & mutual respect.

4. Saying the names of the women of color killed by police as the #BlackLivesProtesters were demanding:

Sandra Bland, Tanisha Anderson. Rekia Boyd, Miriam Carey, Michelle Cusseaux, Shelly Fre, Kayla Moore were all women of color killed by officers of the law in the last few years.

5. Promoting the need to work for efforts to improve the economic and educational opportunities for PoC. (YES this is important and a big part of it. Obviously it doesn't end racism but it does go towards improving the lives of people who feel the effects of racism. When people have the means to provide for themselves & their family society as a whole benefits and reduces tension. )

5. Organizing voter registration drives & fighting for voter's rights. (Yes, Hillary has a great job of highlighting and fighting for voter's rights.

Unfortunately the OP chose to be divisive, derisive, and slanderous instead of promoting the points they & their candidate is making.

It seriously pisses me off that the OP chose to make this a political issue rather than choosing to discuss the heart of what can be done to make sure #BlackLivesMatter.

[TM99]

29. Bravo!

Well said, and I bet you breakfast that the OP will not respond or if they do, it will be a deflection or goal post move.

[Renew Deal]

32. He didn't have to see it coming. You're blaming the victim when you say that.

But he did want to stick to his script. I'm not sure that's good or bad. It is what it is. On the one hand he doesn't want to legitimize disruptors like NN did, on the other it's a little tone deaf. Obama is usually able to bridge this when it happens to him, but he's got a lot more experience at it on this level.

[840high]

51. +1

[rogerashton]

9. Sounds like year 2000 is coming again. eom

[MohRokTah]

14. Only if the Democrats fail to address the real issue.

And by address it, I don't mean making some bullshit excuse about economic inequality.

But if it's not addressed, a good portion of the black vote will be sitting 2016 out.

[winter is coming]

21. You mean a bullshit statement like "I want an America where young black men

are not harassed, killed and shot in the streets."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=455509

A speech he likely would have repeated in Phoenix if he'd been given the chance.

[Autumn]

36. A lot of we Democrats have been saying for a long time that if the Democrats continue

to ignore the needs of the people we will no longer vote for them. It looks like that time may be here. Do you think the SC threat and the 'republicans will be worse' canards will work with the Black vote?

[rogerashton]

56. In 2000, the attitude of Greens who voted for Nader was

"For too long, presidential candidates have taken the"

environmentalist

"vote for granted. And we are determined that this will not happen on our watch."

How did that work out for environmental issues? Thanks to the Republican victory in 2000, the environmentalist vote is indeed no longer taken for granted. It is written off, ignored. And environmentalism is less influential than ever.

Angry as hell? Of course. But if you turn that anger against your friends -- who certainly have not done nearly enough, I agree -- you enable your enemies, who will do worse, and you encourage your friends to look around for some new friends. That was what the Greens bought. Learn from them.

[aspirant]

61. So you want to elect Repubs and forget about SCOTUS nominees?

[MohRokTah]

63. I'll be voting for the Democratic nominee regardless.

The BLM movement, on the other hand, is perfectly prepared to forgo the gauntlet that must be run and the hoops that must be jumped through in order for a person of color to vote in 2016 if their issues are not addressed.

I am quoting a person who is considered amongst the leadership of the BLM movement in my signature. If that does not terrify you as much as it terrifies me, then you aren't paying attention.

[aspirant]

69. Are you part of the BLM movement

but not the part that will forgo voting?

[BeyondGeography]

13. Oh please

Let's see how Hillary does if they take her stage away after interrupting and talking over her.

[MohRokTah]

16. I will be fine with them doing that.

I suspect she's more prepared for it because I suspect there are members on her team paying close attention to this movement. I just don't know how prepared she may be because that is completely dependent upon how seriously her staff are taking the movement.

I would suspect the campaign is taking it more seriously today than they were yesterday.

She cannot simply sit back and take the minority vote for granted in the primaries, though. In fact, the Democratic Party can no longer do that. The real issues must be addressed.

[m-lekktor]

19. ask Ray McGovern what happens to people who do that to Hillary. nt

[cherokeeprogressive]

38. I daresay that has little chance of happening and if it does...

We'll see Hillary Clinton escorted off the stage by her handlers in very short order. They'll say they were afraid for the safety of a former First Lady.

[oasis]

15. Both O'Malley and Sanders showed great patience under the circumstances.

Their level of concern on BLM issues certainly got a boost. Too early to judge how any candidate handles their campaign in regards to what happened least night.

[sufrommich]

18. I thought O'Malleys reaction was fine, after he apologized for his remarks.

He at least met with the activists after the brouhaha. Sanders refusal to meet with them as if he was angry that they weren't giving him enough respect was downright dumb. That being said,I think both of them think that black lives matter.

[LuvLoogie]

40. This is a point I would keep in mind about, Bernie.

Hillary has been in the fire since the 90s with daggers coming at her from the Right and, more recently, the Left. Can Bernie take the heat? He has barely walked into the kitchen to pick up a pan.

[Fred Sanders]

41. Bernie has been taking the heat and coming out cool for 30 years, so the simile is unfit.

Folks are taking their eyes off the GOP ball. Again.

[global1]

23. Congrats!!! - So The Corporate Dems Now Have Something To Slam Fellow Dem Primary Candidates On....

both here and in the MSM. I'm sure that on the Sunday a.m. shows we'll see some videos and hear some sound bytes taken out of context to knick away at O'Malley and Sanders from this BLM outburst.

I'm also sure that somebody will be mis-thinking that it was Sanders not Sandler (Adam) taking down American Indians as well. Cause looking quick at Sandler it could easily be mistaken as Sanders. And we need to take down Sanders a notch - because he's drawing record breaking crowds and is building momentum. Can't let that happen.

It's funny that when one doesn't have any negative issues to use to smear an opponent that they have to create a situation or something to use to make the news against them.

Too bad O'Malley or Sanders aren't more Trump-like so they have some real negative ammo to throw at them - huh?

[MohRokTah]

24. WOW!

Just wow.

[Fred Sanders]

26. That....was incomprehensible. "Sanders" being confused with "Sanders", so that is a problem? Say what?

Although the "out of context" concern mentioned, you got that right.

[RiverLover]

28. Exactly. This is what they accomplished.

They set up headlines about our progressives in MSM like this one on CNN~

Democrats lose control of presidential event
CNN
http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/18/politics/bernie-sanders-netroots-nation-black-lives-matter/

Really helps their cause!

[Fred Sanders]

30. The mass media was going to attack Sanders relentlessly no matter what...and report

constantly on "Democratic Strife" while oblivious to the GOP internal implosion.

Predictable as rain, so this incident, if that is the word, is a tempest in a teapot the mass media have been brewing up all along.

[sufrommich]

33. #BLM is all over the news today,they certainly did help their cause. That's how

movements make themselves known to the outside world that's not paying attention.

[leveymg]

39. I think you confuse notoriety with fame

By the same logic, Black September helped the Palestinian cause by their attack during the '72 Olympics.

movements make themselves known to the outside world that's not paying attention.

You seem to justify just about any attention-getting action that way. Is that what you're really trying to do?

[TM99]

35. When I watched that video

I came away especially at the end that Sanders is firmly committed to battle racism yet again today. He has done so for 50 years. Before my father died, we talked about his life. He marched with King as did my white mother.

As a college professor, he made a comment to me that really came home today with this event. He said that the current generation is angry and aware but they lack motivation and the tools to bring about change. Yelling online and offline is just not enough.

I agree with him. They yelled at the candidates most likely to help them, to be their allies. OK, fine, rage and pain and fear leads to this type of protest. Now what? Was this a one off? Or is it going to be the start of something more?

I want to see these same protesters at more campaign events. at stops for ALL candidates, and yes, even GOP ones as their field narrows to the top few. I want to see these same protesters bring this to the Clinton campaign as well. I want to see them at the Democratic and Republican conventions.

Don't just rage. Don't just shout. Take it to the next step. You got peoples attention. Now dialog with them, organize a national movement beyond the Twitterverse, and form alliances.

[tblue37]

78. Dean scream scenario. nt

[Fred Sanders]

25. My opinion is that the reaction observed of a politician while being ambushed by your own party members means zilch.

(Except for Obama, when the reaction observed is always a lesson learned for everyone, a tough act to follow.)

These are dishonest conclusions about Sanders, based on subjective conclusions derived from an isolated incident which itself is being distorted - not unlike the RW media would do.

The burden of proof is on the accusers. The evidence so far is weak and unconvincing in the extreme.

Not to mention, what difference does it make?

Look at the entire track record - or enjoy your Outrage Juice, whatever, makes no difference.

[JaneyVee]

27. Now we're going to hear from people who...

Constantly scream about "holding Obama's and politicians feet to the fire" tell us how this was wrong.

[MohRokTah]

44. LOL, I have most of them on ignore.

More than half the posts in this thread cannot be read by me.

[Jester Messiah]

34. Remind me again which candidate it was that marched with Dr King?

Oh that's right it was Bernie!

[Sheepshank]

49. And what has Bernie done to fix this social issue in the following 50 years?

Jack shit.

He's talked about economic justice instead...which hasn't solved a thing after his March. Gawd ,how many more times is that going to be brought up as if it was the great fix? How many others in that march have since been imprisoned, beaten up and killed because social injustice is still a huge unresolved issue...50 years later!

And then to presume that only those who attended the March are willing to assess the BLM issue and no one else, no ther candidate cares and has already addressed BLM issues over the last decades..is erroneous.

[frylock]

70. What the fuck has our black president done to fix this social issue?

[bravenak]

73. Why the fuck are you blaming him for this shit? It's been with us since the beginning!

Why the fuck do you expect a black man to fix white societies racism? Black folks ain't did enough free work yet? You all need to fix white racism and stop blaming it on the black man.

[frylock]

80. I'm not blaming him. I'm wondering why #blm is confronting potential candidates for the office..

rather than the man that currently occupies the WH. Someone who has some insight into what the black community has to deal with on a daily basis. I don't know how we go about fixing white racism, or if it ever can be fixed. What policy positions or possible solutions has #blacklivesmatter suggested? I don't know what to say in response to your work comment. White progressives are not your enemy in this fight.

[Jester Messiah]

79. He's done more than all the outrage-ophiles and keyboard warriors combined.

In that he's actually out there in the trenches trying to legislate more just outcomes, and has been for decades.

[MoveIt]

37. You don't believe this

But yet you post it.

[MohRokTah]

42. Goodbye for calling me a liar. eom

[moondust]

43. You're lost.

Welcome to IGNORE! Bye!

[bigtree]

47. this is bullshit

O'Malley wasn't given half a chance to respond, and the comments on that compromised stage don't represent the totality of views of either of the candidates.

I do 'blame' the protesters for stifling what could have been a more complete and comprehensive discussion.

here's O'Malley afterward: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251456820

Nick Kelly ‏@NickKellySays 1h1 hour ago
@MartinOMalley conversation with @ljoywilliams re 'passionate disruption in the townhall' #TWIBNN15 Good interview.

watch:

[MohRokTah]

48. When the powerless have no other recourse, they have to speak truth to power.

And I'm just amazed at how shitty some progressives are about a core value of progressivism.

[bigtree]

53. you don't stomp all over your allies

...and expect them to be more empowered to help you.

What that group needs is dialogue with these candidates which they effectively drowned out with their protest. Makes no sense at all for you to be dancing all around that fact to highlight their issues and concerns now, after they blew the chance earlier. BOTH of the candidates support their efforts in full. Making a mockery of their allies on stage is counterproductive to that support.

[MohRokTah]

55. You don't take for granted a group is an ally when you do not directly address the issues that...

matter to that group.

The knife cuts both ways.

READ MY SIGNATURE! The BLM movement is perfectly prepared to sit out 2016.

If that doesn't terrify you, you have no clue how politics works.

[bigtree]

64. these candidates aren't 'taking them for granted'

... that's a bogus push off from the disruption at this event.

Sitting out the presidential contest is a sure way for your concerns to be taken for granted. If they don't understand THAT they haven't a clue about our political system.

[MohRokTah]

65. These candidate are most certainly taking them for granted.

Platitudes mean nothing.

Tell me the plan on how systemic racism in the justice system gets addressed and corrected. Give me real solutions that will turn this around NOW.

Don't give me empty words.

I want a plan.

[bigtree]

66. O'Malley is set to present a criminal justice plan in the coming days

...he said so at the event, if you bothered to listen to anything more than the controversy you're leveraging this misleading post off of.

These candidates are allies, not opponents. It's sophistry to describe them as otherwise. Is there more they can do to highlight these issues? Of course, but shouting them down on stage isn't going to accomplish that.

Martin O'Malley @MartinOMalley
#blacklivesmatter. The voices of this impt movement are loud & clear. I'm committed to continuing this conversation.

[frylock]

81. Why are we waiting for the next president to address this issue?

What is our current President doing to address those concerns? What has his AG done?

[aspirant]

67. If HRC has the majority of AA support

and they decide to sit out the primaries HRC loses.

[MohRokTah]

68. ABSOLUTELY!

And she damned well better take this seriously if she wants to be president.

[ljm2002]

50. Nonsense.

Looks to me like you are just trying to frame the situation in a way that makes Sanders and O'Malley as bad as possible.

Yes they could have responded better. I bet they will both do better going forward.

We'll see how Clinton responds when the time comes. Of course she has now been forewarned so she should be better prepared to make a proper response.

What is happening to black people vs. law enforcement is indeed an emergency, and I for one have no objection that BLM has decided to bring it to the forefront by any means necessary.

[MohRokTah]

52. ALL of the Democratic candidates look bad in this.

The only reason Hillary Clinton wasn't a part of this is because she was booed at this forum eight years ago, otherwise she would be right there in the middle with the two candidates who did show up, and she would most likely not have been prepared for it and would have put her foot in her mouth like both Sanders and especially O'Malley did (I've heard her say "all lives matter", too).

The entire party looks bad in this.

POC fear for their lives every time they see flashing blue and red lights. There is a life and death urgency to this issue that the Democratic PArty is failing to address, and it has to change NOW!

Otherwise, we may as well just give up and let the Republicans win, because if these issues are not addressed, people in the BLM movement will not run the gauntlet and jump through the hoops that it now takes for a POC to vote.

[Bobbie Jo]

54. How powerful it would have been

if either candidate would have simply stopped and SAID THEIR NAMES.

[MohRokTah]

59. Yep, and make no mistake about it...

Hillary Clinton would have screwed up just as badly as O'Malley and Sanders.

And all it would have taken is to start reading off the list with no cards in front of them.

[cherokeeprogressive]

57. Go Bernie Sanders!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

71. Bernie has good credentials and is meeting with them....

I suppose we will AGAIN hear that only WHITES support Bernie.

[LiberalAndProud]

74. I think you're relieved your candidate wasn't there.

I also suspect you'll use this incident as a club for the remainder of the primary battles. Of course, that's your prerogative, but what I'm saying is that there appears to be an agenda here beyond social justice concerns.

[bravenak]

75. The op is back to undecided.

Until a candidate addresses the concerns of BLM appropriately. Me too.

[LiberalAndProud]

76. Fair enough.