Is the Hillary campaign using BLM to take down Bernie?

[Dawgs]

Last edited Fri Aug 21, 2015, 02:33 PM - Edit history (1)

*** JUST WANT PEOPLE TO BE AWARE THAT WAS POSTED TWO WEEKS AGO***

Because if it's not a political effort, then why go after Bernie and not a candidate that is actually getting attention by the media? To me, it's that simple.

The 'Red state' debacle was taking place in Atlanta the past few days and it was eating up a lot of attention. Atlanta has a very large population of African Americans and BLM did nothing to disrupt the Republican candidates. And, even though Trump wasn't there, it got almost all of the attention from the media.

The answer seems not only simple, but obvious.

[sufrommich]

1. You're accusing a truly grassroots movement of being

paid trolls. Or worse,too stupid to understand that they're trolls. I've seen this accusation from Bernie supporters all over the internet,you're not helping your candidate.

[Scuba]

6. Or a few paid trolls operating under cover of a grassroots movement.

[sufrommich]

8. Except there's all kinds of proof that Marissa Johnson has been involved

with BLM Seattle for awhile.

[Scuba]

11. Doesn't mean she hasn't been co-opted for some other purpose.

[HooptieWagon]

26. Who's paying the bills?

There are costs to run an activist campaign, and it's time consuming. What is the source of her funding?

[sufrommich]

35. How much funding do you think they need?

What do protests cost? I know Jay Z and Beyonce have funded BLM and paid off their legal fees.

[HooptieWagon]

42. $33 million buys a lot of disruption.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913625/Billionaire-George-Soros-spent-33MILLION-bankrolling-Ferguson-demonstrators-create-echo-chamber-drive-national-protests.html

Pretty cheap insurance policy to cover a several hundred million investment in a particular candidate.

[sufrommich]

43. How disgusting that you use a right wing writer from a right

wing source to attack George Soros.Some of you seriously need to get a grip.

[HooptieWagon]

46. Snopes = true.

Soros Foundation is funding BLM type activists...Snopes found that true.

[sufrommich]

50. No,Snopes does not claim it's true.That's a lie.

Soros foundation grants paid for some of the groups who protested at BLM rallies,that's it. The meme that Soros funds BLM was started by right wingers who accused him of "funding race riots",including the writer you linked to at Daily Mail. Nobody on DU should be repeating this nonsense. It's vile,racist bullshit.

[randys1]

77. Using those sources here should cause instant banning, IMO

[bahrbearian]

48. Wow I didn't know that.

But the writer is right wing so the everything he writes about is false.

[riversedge]

55. You still only know half.......

Yes, Soros gave money but it is not what the Daily mail claims:



Claim: George Soros donated $33 million to fund rioting Ferguson protest groups.

Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sorosferguson.asp#hdXFk9vVvKxr4puj.99



Claim: George Soros donated $33 million to fund rioting Ferguson protest groups.

Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sorosferguson.asp#hdXFk9vVvKxr4puj.99




TRUE: A grantmaking network founded by George Soros provided funding to some groups that engaged in Ferguson-related protest activities.


FALSE: George Soros gave money to various groups for the express purpose of promoting Ferguson-related protests and riots.

image:

Examples: [Collected via e-mail, January 2015]
Read more at http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/sorosferguson.asp#hdXFk9vVvKxr4puj.99

[randys1]

78. If Soros is helping US protest, why is that bad?

[aikoaiko]

89. its not necessarily bad, but money can influence a movement to not

hurt an apparent Soros-preferred candidate and instead "shut down" other candidates.

[randys1]

92. If you only knew how much damage you folks are doing with this meme

[aikoaiko]

94. I'm sure you think big money donations only influence conservatives, but money can corrupt...

... even the best people.

I'm not saying it has definitely happened, but I think its possible. There is no evidence of explicit, quid pro quo.

No one is doing damage by talking about these things.

[randys1]

96. White people, we are so fucking clueless and privileged. Have a nice day, because

until you figure this part out, we cant go further



Wanna see how privileged we are, I bet this post of mine will be hidden by privileged white people who hate being reminded how privileged they are.



Notice how many African American DU posters are on this thread?



Well, to be fair, most have been silenced or run off anyway

[aikoaiko]

98. Some are clueless. Can't disagree with you there.

So explain to me, my friend in white privilege, how my post is an example of white privilege.

You might have to hurry in case your post gets hidden.

[randys1]

101. Accusing BLM of being used by billionaires? Isnt that what we are talking about?

[aikoaiko]

103. No, I said influenced and perhaps not intentionally.

[Number23]

106. Astonishing that you apparently have no clue how offensive this characterization is and you don't

seem to care in the least.

Really glad this OP got kicked up. Some Sanders supporters have been trying their damndest to pretend that the "Sanders supporters are hurting Sanders" meme was a "Third Way talking point" or done solely by "trolls" and not true, blue (?) Sanders supporters just genuinely showing the world who they truly are.

Glad this got bumped back up.

[aikoaiko]

107. If you're willing to explain, I'm willing the hear how what I wrote was offensive.

[Number23]

110. You are suggesting that a group that appears to be devoted to calling attention to the whole scale

slaughter of black people and the minimization of black people's lives is in fact a group of puppets being lead around by some Caucasian billionaire for reasons other than the ones they've stated.

Surely you don't need to have it spelled out to you why that's offensive?

[aikoaiko]

113. That's not what I said. There is no evidence of BLM being led by Soros.

I don't have any reason to think that Soros' donation to various black liberation groups around the time of the Ferguson protests was anything but simple, straightforward support of a good cause.

I'm sure the members of that group were grateful and appreciative. I think that's only natural.

I also think that its not impossible that such funding support might influence activists to not confront friends of such a large donor as vigorously as others. Money and ingratiation has the effect on almost anyone. Its a human quality.

I'll say this directly -- I don't think Blacklivesmatters is puppet of Soros or that Soros was purposely influencing BLM to do his underhanded dirty tricks by donating to various groups supporting black lives.

On the other hand, I don't like that Blacklivesmatters treated Bernie Sanders like a worthless person who shouldnt be allowed to speak unless the disruptors were satisfied, but then treat HRC with deferential respect. I saw your OP in AA saying that if anyone thought BLM wouldn't disrupt HRC then they were stupid. Disrupting a HRC event still hasn't happened even though it could have. It does appear that BLM is giving HRC preferential treatment for some reason.

[Number23]

115. I really don't know why I even bothered. Certainly won't do it again.

[aikoaiko]

116. Ok. Well, at least we tried to communicate.

Obviously, you think I'm wrong to have wrote what I did. I'll keep reading what you write and conversing with others.

[Hortensis]

44. BLM cofounder Alicia Garza called on Democrats to "stop acting like republicans." Spot on for a

thread that bypasses the obvious and heads straight for conspiracy theory.

1. The publicly demonstrated reality is that various leaders of BLM chapters, which formed like a grass fire with the first series of black-kid murders, disagree on and are fighting over the direction this organization of activists of all political orientations will take.

2. HRC is way out ahead of Bernie Sanders. They are not particularly afraid of him. Their big concern is how to make the excitement he generates carry forward to election day. For now, his success is hers to build on if she can.

3. OTOH, they will, of course, be afraid of failing to rally black voters to come out for her on voting day.
* Dissension and division turn off all but those who thrive on it, i.e., the hard conservative barn-burners.
* The mere suspicion that she was involved in this black fight could cost her very badly.
* If any people were conspiring to turn black voters, they'd be on the right and, in this case, they'd probably be black.

[NorthCarolina]

18. Since when, and by what stretch of the imagination, is the

Hillary campaign a "grassroots movement"? Most ridiculous statement I've seen today; of course it's still early. Grassroots movement...LOL

[sufrommich]

21. Who's talking about the Clinton campaign??

[aquart]

22. The Clinton campaign is not "grassroots."

Neither are her supporters being paid or bribed. We choose her freely and with pride.

The Clinton campaign is an excellent political campaign with happy volunteers all over the nation. Grassroots? Eh, I pull grass out by its roots every day. In my herb garden, it's just a weed.

[Adrahil]

23. Take off your I Hate Hillary glasses for a moment....

That post was talking about BLM.

[dangerous dan]

24. the question you should be asking - who benefits?

Clinton benefits from the recent BLM actions.

[Adrahil]

31. Does that mean she is behind them?

That sounds a whole lot like the vince Foster conspiracy theorists. They reasoned that the Clintons benefited form his death, so they MUST be respinsible. Silliness.

also, she is 30+ points ahead in every natioonal poll. Black Democrats supprt her with 70+% of the vote. Simply put, the risk of such a strategy would WAY outweigh the benefit... She's already CRUSHING Sanders in that demo.

[tiredtoo]

66. Not sure who is paying these trolls

Or even if they are being paid but, the facts can be found here.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2015/08/blm-activist-who-shut-down-sanders-is-radical-christian-sarah-palin-supporter/

[leftofcool]

71. Excuse me!

Tell me you just didn't say that the Black Lives Matter people are trolls!! That is offensive and most certainly not true!

[randys1]

79. Just look at the absurd accusation in that link LOL man, this place has become

untenable

[HereSince1628]

2. Unknown, maybe H> will step up and say Sanders isn't a white supremacist.

Can she match the honor of McCain when he countered ridiculous statements against Obama?

[HFRN]

4. very conspicuous silence on her part nt

[Duckhunter935]

30. Yep!!

[HooptieWagon]

28. Clinton? Honor?

[HereSince1628]

32. I've heard said she's an opportunist,

Opportunity has knocked.

[GoneFishin]

59. Agreed. That's a most generous interpretation.

[randys1]

80. Have seen that EXACT coupling of words by the most rightwing posters on the internet

[HooptieWagon]

104. If you read it on the Internet, it must be true.

[randys1]

105. Wait, I read it in YOUR POST LOL

Clinton? Honor?

So yes, here and elsewhere I have read people viciously attacking the Clinton's and in ALL Cases I assume an agenda.

Laugh that off

[HooptieWagon]

108. "105. Wait, I read it in YOUR POST LOL"

I just heard Glen Beck say that. Coincidence? I think not...

[randys1]

109. YOU PEOPLE are so funny

and obvious

YOU PEOPLE make me laugh

[TM99]

47. I'll take bets right now

that what will mostly likely happen is that Clinton will make another passive aggressive 'spontaneous' statement to the media in a few days about some people not getting what racism or BLM is really about.

But of course she does and once coronated, oops, I mean inaugurated, she will give as much lip service to racial issues as Obama is doing. His commission on police violence started in December 2014. Why have we heard nothing about it? He is a lame-duck now. He want a legacy? Then get his DOJ on the ball about the continued police violence towards our community. He could be speaking out daily about this. But he is not.

[d_b]

3. I highly doubt it

Not worth the risk. It'd be devastating to her campaign if someone blew the whistle on it. Could very well be that they're Hillary supporters, but that's not her fault.

[onehandle]

5. That was her directive during the conference call.

Being nearly 50 points ahead of Senator Sanders just isn't enough.

'WE WANT IT ALL!,' she screamed.

[HFRN]

7. magic 8 ball says

[Frank Cannon]

9. They're not doing this shit to ANY Republicans.

That right there should tell you something.

[HooptieWagon]

36. Nor Hillary, the for-profit prisons candidate.

Did the Swiftboaters go after Bush?

[Historic NY]

40. Because they don't give a shit anyway....

[d_b]

57. You know?

If they were really so righteous they'd go into the belly of the beast.

[winter is coming]

10. BLM isn't a monolithic entity. There have been protesters who are part

of BLM that seem eager to drive a wedge between the AA community and white progressives. I don't see how encouraging that sort of divisiveness helps BLM, but I can see how it helps HRC.

[randys1]

82. Oh lord what nonsense

[Starry Messenger]

12. Hahahahaha

No.

[Agschmid]

13. No.

[NCTraveler]

14. Beyond offensive.

No different than people promoting the thought of "the gay agenda." Their agenda is equality, not this conspiracy theory you pose in attempt to falsely label their "agenda," with the intent of dismissal.

You have provided zero connection to Hillary as you attempt to redefine the "agenda" of a group whose community is being shot in the streets and then blamed for it.

[safeinOhio]

15. Right up there with

Chem trails and fake moon landing

[Larkspur]

16. I don't think it is her campaign that is instigating this...

but the Clintons have a network of surrogates that have the temperament to do these kind of dirty tricks.

Sanders drawing huge crowds at his events has got to be unnerving to some of her surrogates, who hope to cash in on a Clinton Admin. It's like Chris Christie and the Bridgegate affair. He has not been directly implicated in planning or ordering that "traffic study" but his appointees and some staff were caught doing the dirty deed.

[aquart]

19. You mean like Bernie supporters immediately putting out rumors that HILLARY DID IT!!! ?

I adore Bernie. His supporters drive me to ginger.

[Larkspur]

27. Hillary who only does scripted events has the most to profit from a shutdown of Bernie events

and since BLM has not done the same thing at Republican events, I can understand why Bernie supporters feel that BLM is Hillary's "brownshirts".

I don't think Hillary ordered or made a deal with BLM or some of their so called leaders to attack Bernie. I think some of her "Lee Atwater" type surrogates have.

[aquart]

37. You are accusing Hillary of dirty tricks.

Without the smallest, tiniest shred of proof or truth.

Bernie's a great guy. I wish he would call his supporters out for their vile and slanderous use of social media.

[Larkspur]

60. False accusation. I accused Hillary surrogates

Surrogates don't have to be official members of her campaign.

The other obvious instigator is Wall Street. Some of Hillary's Wall Street donors contributed both to her and Jebby.
Wall Street is the big loser overall if Sanders wins the primary and general election.

[aquart]

120. You're right.

Only a fool would blame Bernie for the snide slanders of his....is the word "surrogates"?

One of the things I love about the man is his refusal to slime. It would be rotten if he were defeated by the determination of his..."surrogates"...to do it for him.

[Trajan]

84. Sorry aquart ....

You onerous declarations have earned you a place of retirement ...

[sufrommich]

38. Brownshirts and Lee Atwater.

Listen to yourself.

[aquart]

70. I'm sure Bernie would be proud of you.

BTW, you don't think assuming white people managed this confrontation is both contemptuously arrogant and unmistakably racist?

[stevenleser]

72. All of the above. And Sanders not telling his supporters to cut it out undermines the idea he speaks

truth to power. The only true power an elected official or prospective elected official has in a Democracy is from their supporters. If you can't tell your supporters to knock it off when they are going off the rails, you're nothing.

Even McCain told his supporters to knock off the Muslim stuff with Obama. We have to at least be as good as McCain here.

[msanthrope]

75. this post is op worthy.nt

[Cosmocat]

67. It kills me

I think he is great, and to be "fair" there are some reasonable "Bernistas" here ...

But, I find that I want to scratch my eyes out reading the screeching from many of them here.

[aquart]

17. Ah, dragging Hillary into the mess.

Bernie is a Jew. Anti-Semitism is so common in the black community, it feels like Europe. Remember, Tweets whisper, Bernie is a ZIONIST!!!!!!

"Zionist" is a code word these happy days. It's the socially acceptable way to glory in your hatred of Jews, cruel oppressors of the only suffering refugee population on the planet earth.

Hillary didn't have to pay anyone. Anti-Semites will attack Jews for free.

I still oppose blue lynching. Anti-Semitism is too common to condemn in otherwise worthwhile people. But I do feel it should be mentioned.

[BooScout]

20. *sigh*.....I see I need to start buying these in bulk....

[oasis]

25. Hillary's campaign is too savvy and disciplined to tie in with

a group which has so many loose cannons in it's membership. Besides, Bernie never had a chance in hell of overtaking Hillary's machine.

[SonderWoman]

29. No. Stop it.

[greatauntoftriplets]

33. Oy.

[Triana]

34. I don't think the official campaign itself is doing it. Some of her supporters or surrogates may be

utilizing BLM unofficially to help stop/slow down Sanders' rise.

Politics is dirty and let's face it, BLM is as good a tool as any.

[Sheepshank]

39. No

BLM is not about political maneuvering on behalf of political candidate. They have a Black Lives Matter message that supercedes all else.

Your unfounded, fact free message his hurting Bernie and the perception of his poor messaging with PoC. You are attempting to diminish the BLM message, marginalize the message in order to play politics. Just stop, you and others with this same messaging are hurting Bernie by deliberately missing the real message they have been trying so desperately to get across.

[6chars]

41. evidence? \nt

[bigdarryl]

45. what Bernie supporters don't understand is

Bernie really is no threat to Hillary getting the nomination the media want to make this a horse race for ratings.So she wouldn't have any interest in doing this and to be honest it's a serious charge to make.Some of you people sound like the crazies on the right

[DemocratSinceBirth]

49. +1

eom

[oasis]

52. Exactamundo: Top prize for "Post of the Week"

[Agnosticsherbet]

51. Democrats and liberals need black votes to win, Repubublicans disenfrinchise the black vote

whenever they can.

So, BLM is protesting the party that says, vote for us, because we are the only ones that listens to them.

[mmonk]

53. Using but not directing.

[betterdemsonly]

54. Could be dlc wanting to disrupt a real progressive candidate in favor of their neoliberal fluff

Could be greens or other progressive third parties who fear Bernie will make it harder to attract liberal democrats who otherwise wouldn't vote for Hillary.

Could be revolutionary parties like some Anarchists or Stalinists, who want to block reformists. Could be right wingers sewing division. Could be showboating and egotism.

The actions themselves justify an objection, regardless of motivation.

[FSogol]

58. You do know the DLC disbanded in Feburary 2011, right?

They must of seriously planned ahead.

[betterdemsonly]

61. Their politicians are still around

Their daughter orgs are too. New Democrats, PPI, the Third Way, all are children of the dlc.

[FSogol]

62. ooooohhhh, don't say their name 3x in a mirrror or they'll appear!

[Adrahil]

63. Ignoring the irrelevant DLC bit.....

I would point out that HRC is leading Sanders by 30%+ in national polls. And she is taking something like 70%+ of the AA vote. What would be the point of the "DLC" in doing this? To get black voters to not vote for a guy they are already not supporting? That doesn't make any sense.

[okasha]

117. Or could be Black people

who are sick and tired of being gunned down in the street, are sick and tired of worrying if their kids will get home from school in one piece, are sick and tired of murders being waved away as "necessary force" while the murderers walk away unpunished.

It beggars belief that anyone could brush those issues aside to promote the notion that BLM is a tool of anyone's political campaign. I don't really know whether to attribute that notion to stupidity or paranoia, but whatever it is, it's mind-boggling.

[jberryhill]

56. It's all laid out in her secret emails

"some people say"

[John Poet]

64. I really don't think Hillary has anything to do with it,

and I'm not one of her supporters.

The most recent protest has every appearance of a few people just wanting their fifteen minutes of 'fame'-- and they got it.

[Cosmocat]

68. THANK YOU

sober assessment ...

I have no doubt, after two incidents now, that people who "support" her are driving this, it is politics, that is what people do.

However, it is a BIG stretch to say that she or her campaign are directing it, or even somehow setting it up.

[John Poet]

69. Sure, there's a lot of DU and Facebook traffic in it

from known Hillary supporters, but her campaign is not responsible for what they say--
just as Bernie is not responsible for what his supporters may say.

[ismnotwasm]

65. Yawn.

[John Poet]

73. PLEASE, STOP IT.

#BlackLivesMatter is not under the control of any candidate,
nor is it some chess-piece that candidates can push around against each other.

It's very decentralized nature argues against any such thing even being possible, let alone probable.

Bernie has taken on these issues, and the whole matter is turning out to have been a help to him, IMHO.

His supporters who insist on raising these conspiracy theories and attacks on BLM are NOT helping him at all.

From one Bernie supporter who is getting damned sick of reading this kind of thing on DU.

[ibegurpard]

74. So then why'd you just kick a thread

From 2 weeks ago?

[unapatriciated]

90. I replied below because it showed up

in the latest thread..didn't realize that it was 2 weeks old. So why are you snarking at someone who thinks the op is wrong?

[John Poet]

119. UGH. DAMMIT! 'navigational stupidity'

Somehow I thought this was another current thread, or I certainly wouldn't have done that.

[HFRN]

76. African Americans examine Butter Hillary sculpture at Iowa State Fair

'It was very lifelike, it was almost as though she was there, talking down to us'

[arcane1]

81. .

[randys1]

85. Us? Is that you in the picture?

[sufrommich]

100. This looks like something usually reserved for Free Republic. nt

[WI_DEM]

83. No.

[unapatriciated]

86. Please stop

I'm a Sanders supporter and will be voting for him in the primary. The BLM is their own entity trying to bring attention to a very real problem. Yes they have protested Sanders at two events neither one of those events were Sander's rallies. He was targeted simply because he is more assessable. The other events have more security end of story.

[Dawgs]

102. I did "stop". The OP was created two weeks ago. n/t

[unapatriciated]

114. ok that's good to hear

the op showed up in latest threads...sorry I didn't notice the date.

[nadinbrzezinski]

87. Hmm no

there may be dirty tricks at play... but none are coming from the HRC camp.

And yes, I have a theory, but proving it requires the level of computer forensics that I cannot do... Suffice it to say, nope, not from HRC camp. And if true it involves a very small group of people who I doubt are conscious that they might have been used, BLM has very real demands and concerns, and posts like this are rather unhelpful.

[AgingAmerican]

88. Oh, they won't take Bernie down

They might try, but it will just backfire on her and drive more people to Bernie.

[sufrommich]

91. You literally just made this claim in another thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=536359


And now your claiming that they are trying to "take Bernie down".

[AgingAmerican]

93. No, I said they WONT take him down

Though they will keep throwing turds at the wall trying to make something stick

And, yes, they will believe any cocamamie nonsense about Bernie, as I said in what you linked to.

[sufrommich]

95. The OPs question:

Is the Hillary campaign using BLM to take down Bernie?


Your answer:

They might try, but it will just backfire on her and drive more people to Bernie.


The other thread:

Online And In Person, Bernie Sanders’ White Supporters Advance A Black Lives Matter Conspiracy


Your answer:

Wow Hillary supporters will believe anything

Now they are coming up with half baked conspiracy theories to fill their void.




Is this OP "Is the Hillary campaign using BLM to take down Bernie?" a promotion of a "half baked conspiracy theory" or not?

[AgingAmerican]

99. This is a good example

Of a Hillary supporter throwing turds at the wall trying to make something stick. Hillary supporters make things up to attack him and his supporters with, because in reality his positions are unassailable.

[frazzled]

97. Since there's no way to confront a conspiracy theory except

with another conspiracy theory, I'll propose this one:

Sanders was using BLM himself in order to draw attention to his campaign, and give him a reason to try to attract a few black voters by putting out a list of bullet points.

The answer seems not only simple, but obvious.
(Though the real answer is: get real.)

[okasha]

118. That's got to be it! Brilliant!

And for anyone who needs it:

[olddots]

111. my crystal ball says.......

NO. but the batterys may be dead .

[Cha]

112. So you realized your ignorant question was CT. Good.

[FrenchieCat]

121. This is interesting!