The use of the phrase "Hillary-hate" is a blatantly transparant and cynical ploy.

[sibelian]

If you can't answer the case, label it. It's as simple as breathing.

The phrase has a kind of grim, disinterested, middlebrow cleverness, it carries the implication that the "hate" is unreasonable or lacking substance without responding to the content of the text that has been labelled as "hate". Thats the phrase's purpose, not to repel any genuine condition of tendentiousness, but to place certain candidates beyond criticism.

It's just exactly the same lazy gibberish we've all had to come to expect from certain people.

But, sigh, there you go. People without a case of their own are almost reduced to inventing labels with which to construct the nebulous appearance of unwholesomeness in their opponent's case.

"Gay agenda", anyone?

[Control-Z]

1. Yeah, just like

feel the "bern", which is kind of threatening, though I'm sure no one had ever felt it but me.

[Live and Learn]

2. Really? Feeling this threatens you?

"

[Control-Z]

3. It is meant to bully.

Feel it? How you all are just berning - stupid idiots who haven't accepted his message. Feel it? Ooh. You've been berned.
.

Bullying and intimidation is just that.

[Live and Learn]

4. Not at all. The Bern is simply the truth.

If you don't feel it, I just feel bad for you. No threat intended.

The Bern is not a physical threat, by the way, but I guess it could be considered a threat to WIN the primaries fairly (even if others by don't play fairly).

[Control-Z]

10. And I too, feel bad (sic) for you, that you're feeling such a

bern with no good reason. See a doctor, perhaps?

[Live and Learn]

12. Don't you think that is a tad bit patronizing?

Try a search on personality disorders. It might help you to understand why some seem incapable of feeling the 'Bern".

[JackInGreen]

13. There is no search required

when the mirror is less than 50 feet away, it would be quick research.

[Control-Z]

22. Are you freaking serious?

I was trying to add a little levity to the conversation. Like having a berning rash that needed tending or something.

Or are you just joking like I was. It's so hard to tell anymore.

[Live and Learn]

25. Hard to tell? That might indicate something evern more serious.

Really hope you get the help and info you need.

[Control-Z]

65. Your post would be considered a personal attack by most.

I hope that's not the case - inferring I have a mental disorder .

[sibelian]

71. See a DOCTOR?

And you think BERNIE supporters are INTIMIDATING?

My dear Control-Z, I think you misunderstand.

[JackInGreen]

11. I have to wonder

are you threatened by rowing teams shouting 'STROKE, STROKE, STROKE,' or think that someone is trying to express even-bias when they shout 'FOUR!' at a driving range or puttputt...
When someone 'drives the ball' does that mean they're giving the ball a lift to the stadium, or crushing it under heel to force it to work harder? you never can tell.....
what about someone that's 'A knock out'...yes, yes, it's terribly misogynist to state that someone could look good enough to make one lose consciousness, but obviously THIS one is a bullying threat against the person in question...
Maybe it's bias against forests for people to field questions and terrible to poll someone, afterall, what did they do to be driven up there in the first place?

I can't imagine how you reacted when you saw Mrs.C on happy days tell someone to 'SIT ON IT' my GODS, my pearls, oh no...

[hootinholler]

6. LOL

Sure, it is. We couldn't possibly mean feel the energy of his rallies, or express excitement about finally having someone to vote *for* now could we?

We just needed a cudgel to brow beat camp weathervane with, amirite???

[Control-Z]

7. And you couldn't possibly

just hate Hillary. amirite???

[hootinholler]

9. ROFLMAO

Way to make the OP's point!

You are awesome.

In fact I respect Hillary. I also dislike her for a number of reasons, but I do respect her. She's my 3rd choice as a candidate, above Chafee, Webb and Lee Mercer.

[Live and Learn]

14. Above Chafee? See, that is why I need the debates.

I really need to hear more from him and the rest.

[hootinholler]

17. Ok, I'll give you that one

I don't know that much about him maybe he should be third and Hillary fourth.

[Live and Learn]

23. I'll take the win (just cause I so seldom get one) but I really don't know much about him either.

I guess we will have to do our own research on him since debates will be so limited and won't be coming soon. And if we don't know much about him, imagine how ignorant the 'normal' (read, non-political) people are.

[Agschmid]

51. I can tell you IMO Chaffee is worse.

[frylock]

66. All three?

[hootinholler]

68. Hey he's still in it!

IIRC he was the first to officially announce.

[frylock]

69. Jeb! Bush is all up in his house with disease..

and this time, it's personal.

[hootinholler]

70. Oh no

Actually he has some fresh word salad for the new effort. The new phrase is "With power of attorney"

Here's a TV ad on buzzfeed. Sorry for the clickbait link.

[Live and Learn]

5. Does Hillary-hate mean that if I don't support her votes no mattter how insane, and inane

they were, I am guilty of Hillary-hate?

I can assure everyone that I don't hate Hillary in the least. But I sure don't support some of her foolish and dangerous votes.

So a K&R for your post.

[nichomachus]

64. You've got it nt

[leftofcool]

8. Thank you for reminding us that there is a lot of Hillary hate around here.

There was no real need to do so, however. Her supporters have been seeing it for about 10 years now.

[Live and Learn]

16. By hate, you mean dislike of some of her votes?

Or do you think I just HATE everyone that I wouldn't want as President, in which case, I must HATE an awful lot of people including some that I actually love?

What a silly premise.

[leftofcool]

18. You really should go back and read some things from the archives.

On the other hand, your opinion is just as valid as mine, so believe as you like.

[Live and Learn]

20. The archives? So you are speaking of the past?

Much as I love history, I am too focused on the future (and its importance) right now to dwell upon past election rhetoric for the time being.

[leftofcool]

29. Well, recently, she has been called a "whore", a "cunt" and a few other names

Is that enough hate for you? You do understand that "archives" can go back just a month, yes?

[Live and Learn]

34. I assume the jury system took care of any such posts.

As it would for any candidate accused of DU forbidden terms and rightly so.

I think a few Hillary supporters have a few hidden posts as well, no?

[leftofcool]

35. Nope, it was allowed to stand.

[Live and Learn]

40. Hard to believe. nt

[Agschmid]

54. Some of it was allowed to stand...

You know there is rhetoric on both sides, you are right about that, but the rhetoric directed at women in general always seems a bit more harsh.

God forbid a woman not know her place... She might be considered "testy", or "cold and calculating" even when it was pointed it out that the OP those responses were to was a TOTAL fabrication.

IMO, people should do more to support their candidate rather than try to tear down someone else's.

We'd be better off if we did that more consistently.

[frylock]

67. maybe you can find some former Hillary Haters that are now Hillary Lovers..

while digging through those archives.

[treestar]

31. straw man

quite disingenuous. OK you don't hate her. But don't pretend there are no people who do.

[sibelian]

72. No, there's no "hillary-hate", that's just glib, lazy newspeak.

It trips off the tongue, it says nothing, means nothing and makes anyone using the phrase look and sound slightly petty.

That's about it.

[cyberswede]

74. Most DUers don't hate her.

At least those who voted in this poll:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251541048

[anamnua]

15. It would be disingenuous to assume that there is not such a thing as 'Hillary-hate'. NT.

[Live and Learn]

19. Of course, if you don't idolize and promise to vote for her,

you must hate her, right? Sorry to disappoint you but I don't waste much time on hating anyone, least of all Hillary since I actually admire much of what she has done.

She has let me down though and I reserve my right to vote for someone that hasn't, at least for the primaries.

[Armstead]

27. Some of that....Some "bernie hate"...among some people

Primaries tend to focus antagonistic feelings aboutt candidates and among supporters.

However, that phrase gets tossed around too automatically around here. There's a lot of "Hillary dislike" and "Hillary like but disapprove of her as presidential candidate" etc.

[Bobbie Jo]

21. Yuck

t's just exactly the same lazy gibberish we've all had to come to expect from certain people

Pompous much?

[sufrommich]

24. Of course there are people who hate her here,there's

people who outright admit they hate her. I've seen her called vile,disgusting,a liar,self anointed,the queen,her royal highness,undeserving,unprofessional,a republican,a puppet,a dirty trickster,along with accusations that she slept her way to the top through marriage and that she's too dumb to think for herself and needs advisers to do it for her. Please don't pretend that this place isn't swimming in hatred when it comes to Hillary Clinton,because it most certainly is.

[Live and Learn]

26. Are you sure you aren't mistaking hating her policies or votes for hating the actual person?

I don't hate her but I do feel let down by her votes. I don't even hate her supporters that constantly denigrate my candidate who has always supported progressive candidates.

I have a strong suspicion that you may just be projecting your feelings on others right now.

[sufrommich]

30. No,I'm not projecting anything. There's been a ton of personal

swipes at her that aren't people "disagreeing with her policies",one would have to be willfully blind to say otherwise.

[leftofcool]

33. I think you are wasting precious time here.

The OP isn't worth it.

[Live and Learn]

36. Could be, I haven't really seen it but I can admit it is possible

because I have certainly seen it here in regards to the candidate I support. In fact, it is costing me quite a few dollars.

[sufrommich]

37. No,you haven't. nt

[Live and Learn]

38. Really,? Now you are telling me what I see? nt

[sufrommich]

39. List the names your candidate has been called. nt

[Live and Learn]

42. Again the name game? Not playing. I will not add the fray by repeating them.

But I am sure you are perfectly aware of the utterly unfair accusations hurled at my candidate and to deny that any have been is disingenuous.

[leftofcool]

32. Oh boy!

[treestar]

28. It does seem that people who are against her hate her

with a raging venom that is more than political opposition. Especially right wingers. They come unhinged at the mention of Hillary.

[DanTex]

41. Except that there is a lot of Hillary-hate.

I can chalk up some of Hillary-bashing up to ignorance, some of it to wanting to be part of the "in crowd" at DU, but there's definitely irrational hatred in there too. Particularly among people who proudly claim they won't vote for her in the GE.

[Live and Learn]

43. Really? Can you?

Can you explain her vote to send our kids to die for a war based on lies? Can you explain the thousands of deaths of innocent people in a sovereign nation that lost their lives based on that vote?

Can you seriously not understand why some of us find it hard to accept that Hillary voted for the Bush agenda?

Good gawd, I have tried very hard to not bring up her astonishingly naive, at best, vote but some of you keep forcing it up.

I do not hate her but I will certainly wholeheartedly give my support to someone less naive or smarter, whatever the case may be when given the option. Thank God, Bernie gave me that option.

[DanTex]

45. I'm talking more about, e.g., the obsession with the emails.

I can't explain the Iraq War vote, any more than I can explain why Bernie voted against the Brady Bill or for gun industry immunity. BTW, in terms of American innocent lives lost, guns are a much bigger problem than wars, by more than an order of magnitude. (Yes, I get that the Iraq Ware cost much more than just US lives, it's Iraqi lives, and money, and international law, and the chaos that's still going on.)

My guess is that the Iraq War vote was political. Every Dem with presidential ambitions voted for it. War was gonna happen, and at the time the political winds were blowing in Bush's direction. Miscalculation, of course (in addition to bad policy). Come to think of it, Bernie's pro-gun votes were probably also based on political calculation, coming from Vermont.

What's "naive" is to think that Bernie is going to be able to defeat the GOP. That they're not going to be running non-stop ads saying that he just wants to raise taxes and dismantle the free-enterprise system and all the rest. That somehow an electorate, more than half of whom won't consider voting for a socialist, are going suddenly open their minds to the distinctions between "democratic socialism" and "regular socialism".
That you can go take on the billion dollar Koch Brothers with a tiny war chest and somehow come out ahead.

And the other thing naive is thinking that even 10% of what Bernie proposes is going to get through congress. In fact, the outcome of a Bernie or Hillary presidency isn't going to be that different. Fighting with congress, getting a few things passed. So all this stuff about not voting for Hillary if she is the nominee (I don't mean you, but don't pretend you haven't seen it) or how Hillary is no better than a Republican (ditto) is purely idiotic and, yes, hate-driven.

[sibelian]

73. Rubbish. Her political positions are not universally accepted by the left, that's all.

Silly nonsense about "hate" comes only from people who want so sow further division.

[HFRN]

44. 'I am delighted to be the Senator from Punjab as well as from New York'

'I am delighted to be the Senator from Punjab as well as from New York'


(She really said it. It was a nice 'shout out' to New York, to mention them, even if it was 2nd place behind Punjab)

Washington May 18th - “I am delighted to be the Senator from Punjab as well as from New York” said Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton and the former first lady of the United States of America.

source:

http://www.sikhcouncilusa.org/article.aspx?article=evtdinner

Clinton's free-trade advocacy is hitting labor where it lives
Competition helps both sides, she says. A Buffalo deal yielded a few jobs.
July 30, 2007|Peter Wallsten | Times Staff Writer


BUFFALO, N.Y. — To many labor unions and high-tech workers, the Indian giant Tata Consultancy Services is a serious threat -- a company that has helped move U.S. jobs to India while sending thousands of foreign workers on temporary visas to the United States.

So when Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.) came to this struggling city to announce some good news, her choice of partners was something of a surprise.

Joining Tata Consultancy's chief executive at a downtown hotel, Clinton announced that the company would open a software development office in Buffalo and form a research partnership with a local university. Tata told a newspaper that it might hire as many as 200 people.

The 2003 announcement had clear benefits for the senator and the company: Tata received good press, and Clinton burnished her credentials as a champion for New York's depressed upstate region.

But less noticed was how the event signaled that Clinton, who portrays herself as a fighter for American workers, had aligned herself with Indian American business leaders and Indian companies feared by the labor movement.

http://articles.latimes.com/2007/jul/30/nation/na-buffalo30

gosh - why would there be any hostility to her? she going to introduce herself as 'the President of Punjab as well as the USA too?
you consider 'US Senator' a minor title?

[DanTex]

46. Nice. Hillary-bashing with a side of xenophobia.

[HFRN]

47. you've outed yourself as pro-h-1b on other threads - so, nice try

trying to smear concerns as 'Xenophobia'. And that's pretty much what we'com come to expect from your camp - pushing labels on anyone who points out troubling aspects of her track record

a Senator should NEVER, EVER introduce themselves as ANYTHING but as 'the Senator from (US state that elected them)'

THAT's the issue

so, while we're at it, here's another one

"Outsourcing will continue. There is no way to legislate against reality. We are not in favor of putting up fences."
Hillary had said on Feb 28 in India, according to a report by the Asia Times. Kirwin also cited her position as co-chair of the ‘Friends of India Caucus’ in the Senate, a group of senators that supports issues important to India, including outsourcing and H-1B and L-1 visas, as another reason behind the ITPAA's decision to give the award to the prospective Democrat presidential nominee.”
(Press Trust Of India, 3/5/05)

[DanTex]

48. So I guess you also objected to "Ich bin ein Berliner."

Kennedy the disloyal traitor!


Yes, your post is a perfect example of Hillary-hate.

[HFRN]

49. he didnt say he was 'The President of Berlin, as well as the USA'

to say 'Ich bin ien Berliner' (translated by some as 'I am a jelly donut'), is like saying 'I am Irish' or 'I am Catholic', a personal attribute, which is far different from what she did, directly ascribing the office to the place, and putting the state that elected her SECOND

[DanTex]

50. Sigh. You know, she wasn't actually claiming to rule over the people of Punjab.

It was the same thing what Kennedy did: showing solidarity with people from a different country. It's a good thing. Diplomacy.

Again, your post is a perfect example of Hillary-hate.

[HFRN]

52. no, it was an introduction of herself with her title

total breach of etiquette - the title belongs to NEW YORK

New York ONLY

[DanTex]

53. "Breach of etiquette," huh. Like I said, Hillary-hate.

I live in NY. Doesn't bother me one bit.

[HFRN]

55. a single resident of an entity, does not waive breaches of etiquette for all

you can choose to not be offended by it yourself, but that doesn't make it any less a breach

[DanTex]

56. Actually, nobody except for Hillary-haters care the slightest bit about this "breach of etiquette".

This might be worse than "Obama bowed to foreign leaders" right-wing meme. But, again, thanks for bringing this up as a shining example of the silly Hillary-hate that pervades.

"Breach of etiquette".

[HFRN]

57. you realize you just called the current President a 'Hillary-hater(tm)'?

(maybe YOU just don't like African Americans - LOL 2 can play your game)

Obama apologizes over 'Hillary Clinton (D-Punjab)' memo
Published: Tuesday, June 19, 2007



NEWTON, Iowa — The Democratic presidential contender Barack Obama said his campaign made a "dumb mistake" when it circulated a memo criticizing Hillary Rodham Clinton's financial ties to India.

Obama on Monday disavowed the memo, which was headlined, "Hillary Clinton (D-Punjab)," a play on the standard reference to a candidate's party and constituency. The memo referred to investments in India by former President Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton; her fund-raising among Indian-Americans; and the former president's $300,000 in speech fees from Cisco, a company that has moved U.S. jobs to India.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/19/world/americas/19iht-obama.1.6203898.html?_r=0

[DanTex]

59. LOL. You realize that Obama disavowed the very argument you are now making, right?

Someone on his campaign staff sent out the memo and he apologized for it and said it was a dumb mistake. Apparently you didn't even read the article.

[djean111]

58. Yes, because we would have been overjoyed at losing jobs to Germans or Dutch or whatever. Not.

Your entire post is so sad - labeling any criticism of Hillary as "bashing", and flinging the false and reeking "xenophobia" accusation. I repeat - no one would have been happy to lose jobs to ANY country.
Fail and fail.

[HFRN]

60. when trying to defend her track record

facts aren't going to get them very far

labels are all they've got

[DanTex]

61. Interesting that you bring up German jobs. We have a much bigger trade deficit with Germany than

India, but nobody seems to complain much about that. Why do you think that is?

The xenophobia and Hillary-bashing is bringing up Hillary's "senator from Punjab" statement as being a "breach of etiquette." This is on the level of "Obama bows to foreign" leaders in its stupidity.

[djean111]

62. You sure love to beat that xenophobia drum, don't you.

Germany was a random pick. And, trade deficit or no trade deficit, NO ONE likes losing their job to anyone from any country. Trade deficit has nothing to do with that.

I hope you are not in IT, because your logic skills seem lacking. Especially if you really hope to sell the bullshit that we would be fine with losing IT jobs to Germany and hearing Hillary announce she is the senator from Berlin.

[DanTex]

63. I actually used to work for a tech company. Alongside some H1-B holders in fact.

They were all great people and highly qualified. It didn't threaten me one bit, because I was also highly qualified.

I'm sure there were some xenophobes somewhere that didn't like working with people from other countries, and would freak out at a harmless statement like "senator from Punjab", but I wasn't one of them.