2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumDog Whistles- an Anti-Semitism Primer (a timely repost)
Last edited Sat Sep 26, 2015, 01:20 PM - Edit history (1)
There are really four classic anti-Semitic themes that have been for centuries to justify mass murder, mass expulsion, or both. They are that Jews have control the world's media, that Jews have an international conspiracy to control the world's money, that Jews join national governments and undermine them from within for their own purposes, and the "blood libel," a claim that Jews use the blood of Gentiles, usually children, to bake their Passover matzoh. Below I will try to define each of them, discuss their history, and explain why they remain important to this very day.
BLOOD LIBEL
Let me start with the last, the "blood libel." There are a couple of different forms of the blood libel. One is that Jews drink Christian or Muslim blood outright, and the other is that Jews use Christian or Muslim blood in matzoh. This is a slander with a long and inglorious history. The first iteration was the the story of William of Norwich, recorded in the Peterborough Chronicle. This story from 1144 alleged that a boy, William of Norwich, was kidnapped by Jews, tied to a cross, stabbed in the head to stimulate Jesus' crown of thorns, and killed. His blood was drunk and used in matzoh. This story was a rumor and the Jews were vindicated by five different Popes, but the legend lived on. But it was more than a legend. It was an excuse for slaughter and mayhem.
...
Jewish Disloyalty
The most famous example of this theme is the German post-WWI theme of the "stab in the back."
The Stab in the Back myth claimed that the German Army was victorious along the battle lines, but suffered a "stab in the back" from disloyal Jews. I hope I need not go into any detail as to where this led.
At the same time Hitler was exercising his Final Solution, Jews were being sent to Siberia by the Soviets. Jewish disloyalty has been a common theme throughout Russian history, and led to the pogroms of the late 19th century.
...
Jewish Bankers
This one flows from history, and can be seen throughout history. The "Jewish money-lender" is the central figure in The Merchant of Venice, and actually has some historic validity. You see, usury was considered unChristian (remember Jesus and the money-lenders) and was therefore illegal for Christians. That put people trying to pay for wars or put in new crops (which would not generate cash until the harvest was in) in a difficult position, as nobody was willing to lend money without interest. From this came a fairly common theme- Kings and nobles borrowed money from Jews, paid the interest as long as they thought they needed access to more money, then took all the Jews' property, prosecuted them for usery, or expelled them from the country. Another variation was simply declaring the Jews themselves property of the State.
...
Jew control the media
This one seems to come directly from The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. It was enhanced and reprinted by Ford in "The International Jew." Father Charles Coughlin used his enormous radio following to perpetrate these lies.
Claims that Jews run the media are common today. That alone might be a generalization based upon ownership and participation at a rate higher than the percentage of Jewish population. But "Jews control the media" is only the first half of the claim. The other half is "... and they use that control for their own evil ends."
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/01/01/678869/-Dog-Whistles-an-Anti-Semitism-Primer-a-timely-repost
Can we please stop pretending that accusing Bernie Sanders of dual loyalty isn't anti-Semitic?
Diane Rehm made this mistake when she interviewed Bernie for NPR and later apologized for it.
Abe Foxman of ADL has this to say:
Diane Rehms questions were inappropriate, insensitive questioning without any minimal journalistic checking of claims. Such a statement is not only factually incorrect, but has no place in such an interview.
It is deeply troubling to think that a well-respected media outlet like NPR would apparently rely on unsubstantiated information from the Internet in its preparation for a guest.
Ms. Rehms description and follow-up question about whether other Senators have dual citizenship with Israel play into classic anti-Semitic charges of dual loyalty. Such charges have been leveled for centuries and have been a catalyst for scapegoating and vilifying Jews.
Senator Sanders deserves a public apology, as do NPR listeners.
...
Her mistake was to not research it before she even stated it as fact. She shouldnt have asked the question, period. Had she researched it, she wouldnt have raised it at all. Because her question challenges not only his loyalty, but also Jewish loyalties to this country.
djean111
(14,255 posts)And apologizing later doesn't really do a thing to help the first impression made.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)If she was curious she would have asked instead of accusing him.
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)was an attempt to undermine Sanders and it continues to be used, despicably.
When you can't talk about issues, get into the gutter and use whatever low attempted smear you can, is the thinking, it will tie people up in knots trying to respond, and the mission is accomplished.
Best way to undermine this deceivers is to continue to talk about the issues and then USE their Corporate Funded would-be vicious distractions against them.
This was done beautifully when thousands of decent human beings used David Brock's Corporate Funded attempt to use this horrible tactic against Bernie, to benefit Bernie.
Btw, where is Brock hiding now I wonder?
cui bono
(19,926 posts)...from what I've read in the Haterville OPs on here.
He's pushing for Hillary now, isn't he?
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)an alliance between Hillary and Brock is enough to blow someone's mind. Airc, after he decided he was not going to make much more money on the Right he made moves to infiltrate the Left. He wrote a 'letter of apology' to the Clintons, I guess as a first, calculated attempt to ingratiate himself with his next 'target'. The Clintons airc, were not impressed and ignored him. I applauded that decision at the time, because once a smear mongering profiteer always a smear mongering profiteer. The only reason I was happy to see him admit to participating in almost bringing down a presidency was because it exposed the entire right wing for what they were.
But I sure never trusted him. I guess since then Hillary decided he is trustworthy enough to run a Super Pac for her. Another sign of bad judgement on her part which now that she has seen him return to his old ways, she must realize. Or at least I would hope so.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)So many of her actions indicate to me that she wants to win at all costs. Being president is what she wants, the policy aspect of it all is just what comes along with it. I think she really wants to make history as the first woman president and also the husband/wife thing. I don't for one minute get any feeling from her that she wants to do it so she can help the country or its people.
And that is exactly what I DO get from Bernie. I feel that he would be happier to remain a senator and keep his life as it is. But he felt compelled to run because he knows the country and its people desperately need help and saw that no one else was stepping up so he had to.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]
hootinholler
(26,449 posts)By their works ye shall know them.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)freebrew
(1,917 posts)against JFK. He was the first practicing Catholic to be elected Pres.
The R's used that for all they could.
They tried to tell us he would bow to the Pope in conflict.
Same ruse, different day.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I had hoped I wouldn't see it used and defended by DUers in the primaries.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)I wanted to vomit every time I saw Schumer referred to as "the Senator from Tel Aviv."
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I had to stay out of the main forums for a while.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)For some reason, all of them were Jewish.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]
6chars
(3,967 posts)for example, if you say it invoking Netanyahu, saying Bibi likes to kill babies, saying Bibi controls the media and saying Bibi controls American Jewish politicians seems to be perfectly acceptable. similarly, saying things similar about the nation of Israel, its Jewish population overall, and its motivations, actions and influence, seems to be perfectly acceptable. this is because criticism of Israel is not anti-Semitism.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Does that qualify?
6chars
(3,967 posts)as we saw with Diane Rehm.
rosesaylavee
(12,126 posts)And no doubt, this will need to be revisited often (here on DU and elsewhere) over the next 14 months and hopefully 8 years!
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I'll repost as often as necessary.
senz
(11,945 posts)PatrickforO
(14,559 posts)All you have to do is google it, and you can see that the Protocols are still out there, as well as the anti-Semitic dog whistles, all alive and well.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Many DUers still refuse to acknowledge this as a form of bigotry.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Fancy that.
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)He would make a fine President. Anyone who says otherwise is wrong. If he is the nominee, he'll have my full support.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)MineralMan
(146,255 posts)like lies directed at other Democratic candidates. That one's especially vile.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)MineralMan
(146,255 posts)weigh in. I haven't seen any such statements on DU. Of course, I don't read every thread on DU. Nobody does. But, give me a link to something that was posted here and I'll go look at it. Don't give me a link to another website, though. DU is my only political forum, and it's far too easy for people to assume someone's screen name on some other website. That has happened to me.
If it didn't happen on DU, I'm not interested, nor am I interested in third party reports on something they saw on some other website.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Gotcha.
Thankfully not everyone feels the same way.
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)I only know someone is a DUer if they post on DU. Anyone can sign up with a DUer's screen name on some other website. It's too hard to tell who is who here, already. I don't do inter-forum following of people, just as I said before. You can do as you please.
Jim Lane
(11,175 posts)MineralMan
(146,255 posts)The second one doesn't seem to have anything with DUers saying such things. I didn't read either thread, though. Not interesting to me.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)And that's saying something since the attacks began the day Bernie announced.
NealK
(1,851 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)i admire your unwavering ability to stay above the ugliness.
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)Bernie is a good man. Hillary is an experienced woman. Joe Biden has a lot of wisdom. O'Malley probably doesn't have a chance, but he'd be fine, too, as President. None of them would be perfect. So it goes.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)i don't think either has gotten more than one percent though.
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)They don't seem to have any traction at all. O'Malley isn't doing much better. It's down to two, or maybe three possible nominees. That's probably enough.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)just curious, and if he does, how do you think it will affect the race? if you already posted about this, i'll be happy to read it. no need to type it all again
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)We'll all know in a couple of weeks, though.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)MineralMan
(146,255 posts)I'm not in any position to know, though. It could even be that he's hinting that he might run to mess with the polls. Then, if he doesn't run, Cinton will get a huge boost. There are multiple possibilities in presidential politics.
At this point, most of us can only watch.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)at least we have
MineralMan
(146,255 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)I wish people would be more resolute in calling them out.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Hopefully people will read this and think before they vote to leave the next post.
DirkGently
(12,151 posts)She freaking said that ON THE AIR, without bothering to even verify it? He was "on a list" she saw?
Her apology was also pretty lackluster. She tries to spin it as "putting a rumor to rest" instead of beginning with the fact she took a crazy accusation from Facebook (!) and just blurted it out on the air as fact.
One of our listeners suggested by Facebook that I ask Senator Sanders about Internet speculation that he has dual citizenship with Israel. But instead of asking it as a question I stated it as fact and that was wrong. He does not have dual citizenship.
Senator Sanders immediately corrected me. I should have explained to him and to you why I thought this was a relevant question and something he might like to address. I do apologize to Senator Sanders and to you for having made an erroneous statement.
However I am glad to play a role in putting this rumor to rest.
http://www.npr.org/sections/ombudsman/2015/06/12/413981429/diane-rehm-and-a-bungled-interview-with-senator-bernie-sanders
I had missed this the first time around somehow. Yuck.
Wow.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)The list she referred to was from a white supremacist on facebook.
Some DUers were even asking why lists of Jews were so offensive.
DirkGently
(12,151 posts)But between this and whatshername blandly remarking that apart from not-even-in-the-race Biden, Hillary Clinton was "running against herself," it's hard not to see some institutional bias here.
Rehm's slander is flat-out shocking. The fact that she swallowed some "disloyal Jews" list from the Internet says things about her I never wanted or expected to hear.
Gross.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)If her apology had been sincere and she had followed it up by explaining in detail why what she did was so offensive I might feel differently.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)DirkGently
(12,151 posts)... when I hear or see it, it's so dissonant, it's like being smacked in the face with a ... with something that would be very jarring to be smacked in the face with.
I remember a local newscaster in Orange County, Florida, a woman named Marla Weech. Good broadcaster in that mild, upbeat way local news personalities often have.
One day there was a story about a religious film flam guy, Benny Hinn, having protestors hauled off to jail by his own brother, who happened to be a volunteer deputy or something.
Weech stopped in the middle of the the reporter's live feed to shout about Hinn's religious freedoms or something. Totally lost her composure. Over a guy who was quite obviously a faith-healer-for-cash. She left the network for years, but now she's popped back up on a smaller independent cable channel. I keep waiting for something else crazy to come flying out of her.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Chitown Kev
(2,197 posts)that's anti-Semitic too.
If I ever see that phrase, it's getting flagged
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)Open references to Shylock, however, that deserves a call-out
mopinko
(70,010 posts)the mods were well aware of these heinous accusations and would regularly remove them.
perhaps if this were pinned somewhere, it could be referred to in alert messages to get the jury up to speed.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Maybe people could link to this in the next alert?
And you're welcome mopinko.
mopinko
(70,010 posts)the loss of institutional memory. some of it was a good thing, old misbehavior that was never forgotten, sometimes personal grudges that were hard to filter out.
but there was a wealth of this sort of history available in that old hot tub.
maybe this can be pinned in the bernie group.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I am not entirely dissatisfied with the jury system and I certainly understand why they switched.
mopinko
(70,010 posts)it was a hard system to maintain. people worked so hard to get it right, put in a brazillion hours, and were hated for it. it sucked.
i wish the juries were more invested in what they are doing. i hate to see a message from a juror that they dont want to "stifle free speech". we dont have free speech here, we all signed an agreement w same. we have to be civil.
some folks just let their inner baby fly.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Some speech needs to be "stifled" here, that's why there's a jury system and TOS agreement.
It's up to the alerters to make their case and the jurors to listen and seriously consider each and every alert.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)moderators got it right more often than not.
historylovr
(1,557 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)But I haven't in a long time.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Now there is no remaining left of center voice. I wish people understood what that means.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)hard to believe this in 2015
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I've seen the importance of remembering the Holocaust dismissed here because it's not part of "American" history.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)seriously, i had to ask....excluding anything not "us-ian" is so right wing
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Pitting minorities against each other is common behaviour for trolls.
restorefreedom
(12,655 posts)Behind the Aegis
(53,921 posts)This is currently the most common anti-Semitic trope in the Western World, IMO. All other slurs ("stabbing in the back", control of the media, the government) all seem to circle back to "Jews are more loyal to Israel." Prior to the creation of Israel, it was still a popular attack; in the US and other Western nations, Jews were "communists, Bolsheviks, socialists", but in places like Russia, and similar countries, Jews were "capitalists, purveyors of Western propaganda, etc.". It takes on many forms, including tripe like "D-Tel Aviv" behind the names of Jewish politicians who don't vote "the right way"; Jews are responsible for anti-Semitism (usually in the form of blaming Israel/Israeli leaders/random robber barons) in order to gain sympathy for themselves and Israel; and Jews "take advantage of" the Holocaust to further their stronghold on Western countries. Many people ignore anti-Semitism because it doesn't come in the form of epithets or spraying swastikas on things (hell, even that often meets with "but...but...but...won't somebody please think of the history of the swastika!" . They also ignore it because they are ignorant of it and any information they do have is often quite limited.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I was hoping you'd weigh in here, BtA.
You've been singing this song since forever on DU.
I hope everyone sees your post and realizes how common these comments are outside of the I/P forum.
Behind the Aegis
(53,921 posts)Unfortunately, anti-Semitism isn't always easy to see nor understand. Too many, especially those who aren't Jewish, love to lecture Jews what anti-Semitism really is and isn't as if we just don't understand it. They 'scold' us for discussing anti-Semitism, and we are reminded there are "other -isms" and we need to be focused on those. We are reprimanded in reminders that no one on accepts anti-Semitism and people are "horrified" by it. What President Obama said about racism could easily be modified to other bigotries, including anti-Semitism to paraphrase: "Anti-Semitism is not limited to the use of the word of "kike". One cannot ignore a history of hate."
We discussed the anti-Semitism angle and Sanders several weeks back...and here we are. Sadly, we were both right in what would happen, how it would manifest, and, worse IMO, how it would be excused! Frankly, I think this is just the beginning.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)And I think you're absolutely right, we'll have to do this again and again as the primaries progress.
Well done, I think Obama would approve!
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)As you have pointed out here with the Rehm interview.
Thanks, BMUS.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)There are a lot of people who should be making their arguments in this thread but aren't here.
I guess it must be invisible.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)Bigotry of all kinds is undoing this nation and it needs to end. Often people who don't consider themselves prejudiced fall victim to it and need to be enlightened to their latent prejudices. It's these latent prejudices that people like Rush Limbaugh appeal to with dog whistles and code phrases. We need to expose them everytime we see or hear them.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)Going there already? Opposition to BS as nominee is anti-semitism? OMG.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)And you know this because you once posted this about him:
257. Obama had his questioned
Ted Cruz had his questioned.
I could live with it. Just answer.
No they've made it a thing this question is not allowed. I do not want someone who puts Israel first in any office, let alone the Presidency. He could just answer that he is not claiming the dual citizenship and that the US comes first. Why play the victim over something that easy?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6814920
And this:
276. You are simply reinforcing that we can't ask that question
and it should be of anyone right? Like Catholics in earlier eras thought of as putting the Pope first? My family could have been asked that.
I don't see why they could not just answer that the put the US and the constitution first. Why should anyone be unwilling to say that?
This is a "victimhood" very light compared to what other groups of people have put up with.
If you want to be POTUS, state clearly and unequivocally that the US is your first priority. That's not hard.
I don't know why this is made a thing except to intimidate people into supporting all things Israel wants. If you don't support propping Israel you are anti-Semitic. We already know that.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6814962
And you accused Jewish people who were upset by this of playing the "victim" more than once:
273. Not particularly
as it was ridiculous. I don't think Obama would hesitate to answer the question. He would not play the victim. He released his birth certificate rather than complain. Oh how come Bernie is not asked to provide his birth certificate? Interesting.
So why can't anyone have their loyalty questioned? Just answer that you are American first. Or Franch or Polish or whatever. Do you agree with freedom of speech? I can put up with it - why can't Bernie the would-be POTUS?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6814947
265. And play the victim again.
No - those who insist we have to prop Israel due to our interests in the middle east, US evangelicals and whoever attempts to crush debate on the subject.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6814936
OMG indeed.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Who cares who said what? I don't have time to google you to attack you personally. You are disgusting. Making it all personal and out the posters. Really nasty. And about past issues that have nothing to do with this.
Quit trying to make it a "thing" that it is anti-semitic to question Israel or people supporting everything they do.
You want to be called a misogynist for opposing Hillary? Because that's the equivalent of what you are doing.
Good grief, how full of hate do you have to be to do things like this?
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)This op is about hatred of Jewish people and the slurs used to perpetuate that hatred.
So, imo the people who are using them are the bigots, not the people calling them out on DU.
Behind the Aegis
(53,921 posts)In doing so, it is considered even more offensive than the actual anti-Semitism. I am always a bit amazed how many people will challenge something as being anti-Semitic despite thousands of experts saying it is, as well as historical references. The reception this piece got is interesting. How does it compare to your last posting of it? How do they stack up?
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)The others who claim this isn't anti-Semitism didn't take me up on my offer to discuss it here.
I think the recent exposure of a certain website has angered a lot of DUers who are now seeing it for the first time.
And that's a win in my book.
I also cross posted it to the Bernie group and asked others to link to it when they alert on posts that make this accusation about any Jewish politician.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,708 posts)I just hope folks aren't selective in their vigilance. Here's a handy definition of anti-semitism used by the United Nations:
Calling for, aiding, or justifying the killing or harming of Jews in the name of a radical ideology or an extremist view of religion.
Making mendacious, dehumanizing, demonizing, or stereotypical allegations about Jews as such or the power of Jews as collective such as, especially but not exclusively, the myth about a world Jewish conspiracy or of Jews controlling the media, economy, government or other societal institutions.
Accusing Jews as a people of being responsible for real or imagined wrongdoing committed by a single Jewish person or group, or even for acts committed by non-Jews.
Denying the fact, scope, mechanisms (e.g. gas chambers) or intentionality of the genocide of the Jewish people at the hands of National Socialist Germany and its supporters and accomplices during World War II (the Holocaust).
Accusing the Jews as a people, or Israel as a state, of inventing or exaggerating the Holocaust.
Accusing Jewish citizens of being more loyal to Israel, or to the alleged priorities of Jews worldwide, than to the interests of their own nations.
Examples of the ways in which antisemitism manifests itself with regard to the state of Israel taking into account the overall context could include:
Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist endeavor.
Applying double standards by requiring of it a behavior not expected or demanded of any other democratic nation.
Using the symbols and images associated with classic antisemitism (e.g., claims of Jews killing Jesus or blood libel) to characterize Israel or Israelis.
Drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis.
Holding Jews collectively responsible for actions of the state of Israel.
http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/356F4F23E66981AE8525705A00722637
truebrit71
(20,805 posts)... from that cesspool when the time-out kids come back...
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Although the site administrator came back once to call us cockroaches for pointing out the anti-Semitism.
truebrit71
(20,805 posts)It's so pathetic it's sad actually....
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)Now if we oppose bernie, we are anti-Semitic.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)And fyi as BtA noted I posted a similar op after Diane Rehm went off the deep end and used a neo-Nazi fb list to accuse Bernie of dual loyalty.
Behind the Aegis
(53,921 posts)Do you know what anti-Semitism is? Seems many bothered by alleged "accusations of anti-Semitism" don't even understand what anti-Semitism is.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Another post was hidden this week for accusing Bernie of being "Israel's #1 shill".
tritsofme
(17,370 posts)against any supporter of Israel, are not exactly the kind of folk that are flocking to Hillary. Quite the opposite actually.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)tritsofme
(17,370 posts)The Diane Rehm interview is a good example of how pervasive anti-Israeli propaganda is through the media, but I don't see how it describes Clinton supporters in any meaningful way.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Last edited Sat Oct 3, 2015, 01:51 PM - Edit history (2)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=627175Plenty more here.
And another claim this week as well as numerous anti-Semitic posts on a seperate site for DU Hillary supporters.
eta to retract snark, it was uncalled for and I apologize.
tritsofme
(17,370 posts)No other words.
I haven't spent much time on DU in the last few months...thanks for reminding me some of the reason why...
Though I would still say I don't think overall this clique of anti-Semitic posters has any special affinity for Hillary or specific hate against Sanders. Rahm Emanuel comes to mind.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)There is too much acrimony on all sides but when it crosses the line into bigotry I'm glad people are willing to stand up for what's right.
Thank you and I'm sorry for the snark.
libodem
(19,288 posts)My eternal gratitude for posting an educational and enlightening piece.
My heart always goes out to the people whom have suffered injustice because of these lies.
Damnation on those liars.
beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)I cannot tolerate bigotry of any kind and religious bigotry is all too easy to excuse because it's based on long accepted beliefs.
There was a poll in GD a few months ago where people actually argued that those who advocate against marriage equality are not bigoted.
historylovr
(1,557 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)But this thread got 74 recs and lots of positive feedback which is incredible.