How Bernie Sanders would transform the nation - WAPO

[liberal N proud]

In the America that Bernie Sanders wants to create, tuition would be free for every student at every public college.

Which, of course, is another way of saying that the government would pay for it. To do that, the Democratic presidential candidate would spend $750 billion over 10 years, and raise the money with a new tax on Wall Street trades.

And, once government was paying for college, colleges would run by government rules. Sanders’s rules. For one thing, Sanders thinks student centers are a waste of government money. He’d make sure they didn’t get any more of it.

If he becomes president, Sanders would spend an enormous amount of money: $3.27 trillion. At the very, very least. But he is not just a big-spending liberal. And his agenda is not just about money.


Bernie Sanders — a senator from Vermont who describes himself as a “democratic socialist” — will never get everything he wants in Washington.And that still would be true if he became President Sanders. Republicans in the Congress would fight him fiercely. Democrats might not be much help. In fact, Sanders’s most recent Senate bills — legislation that would make college free and provide universal health care — attracted exactly zero Democrats as co-sponsors.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/how-bernie-sanders-would-transform-the-nation/2015/09/30/d3b57b8e-616a-11e5-9757-e49273f05f65_story.html

How are you going to get elected if you are not going to get anyone to work with you? Now granted, this is the media saying this, but that has been on my mind since he started running. He already has fierce resistance in Congress, how is making him President going to improve that?

While he has some good agenda items, the above and several other key things all listed at some point or an other in the article concern me.

Don't jump on my because I have not fully committed to any candidate at this point and probably will not until closer to voting in the primary. So blasting me for this post will not sway me one way or the other at this point.

[portlander23]

1. This is the key issue

“You’re not ‘turning to’ the government. You’re assuming that the government is some kind of foreign entity,” Sanders said in an interview. “The government, in a democratic society, is the people.”

Can we have a government that works for the people? That's the question, not what is the size.

[Uncle Joe]

2. In that Bernie is in agreement with the Preamble to the U.S. Constitution.

The Preamble to the United States Constitution is a brief introductory statement of the Constitution's fundamental purposes and guiding principles. It states in general terms, and courts have referred to it as reliable evidence of, the Founding Fathers' intentions regarding the Constitution's meaning and what they hoped the Constitution would achieve.

Text

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence,[note 1] promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preamble_to_the_United_States_Constitution

[cantbeserious]

3. Ever More Bernie Bashing

eom

[moobu2]

11. You think Hillary should be the only candidate bashed?

[Cleita]

30. I've seen several Hillary hit pieces out in the mainstream media

and chose not to bring them to DU because RW propaganda against any of our candidates does not belong here according to the rules so why is this article here?

[moobu2]

43. Why is anything anti Hillary allowed here?

She's the presumptive nominee and Bernie Sanders isnt even a Democrat anyway.

[LondonReign2]

46. You mean like discussing her policies and stuff?

[AgingAmerican]

4. "Sanders thinks student centers are a waste of government money. He’d make sure they didn’t get any"

He doesn't believe taxpayers should have to pay for non academic buildings, like student centers or stadiums. I have no problem with that.

When Sanders wins, you will see how the bully pulpit works.

[stevenleser]

14. Oh yeah, you would see how the bully pulpit works... to get laughs from GOP Reps.

Who would actually get more cred with their constituents in their gerrymandered districts the more times they vote down his bills.

I know, I know, you all say I sound so mean when I say stuff like that.

The thing is, I stopped believing in fairytales a long time ago. I have a pretty good imagination, but I know the difference between fantasy and reality.

[Armstead]

18. You don't sound mean -- just narrow minded and rigid

[AgingAmerican]

19. Defeatism

Has brought us to this point in history.

[stevenleser]

20. It's not defeatism if I tell you that you shouldn't jump off a tall building and expect to fly

it's reality.

No matter how much you insist you can fly without the aid of a parachute or other device to assist you.

[AgingAmerican]

24. It's cowardice

Defeatism is the acceptance of defeat without struggle. It is closely tied to pessimism and is a keystone of conservative ideology.

[Eric J in MN]

28. State governments would pay for student union bldgs and stadiums

...at public colleges, as they do now.

Under Sanders' federal grant bill, such spending is separate from the federal grants.

The purpose of Sanders' bill is free tuition.

[Uncle Joe]

5. If Bernie is elected President against the entrenched powers and big money that he faces, his

mandate will be crystal clear to the Congress, such a victory would also insure long and strong coat tails, the political dynamic in Congress would change dramatically once it was realized that big money and corporate supremacy did not insure victory.

Thanks for the thread, liberal N proud.

[hifiguy]

27. I think you are right, Uncle Joe.

[DianeK]

6. how familiar this all sounds to me..

his freshman year as our Representative in Washington..oh the hand wringing! He will never find a committee willing to have him..he will never be able to work with either republicans or democrats....we all wasted our votes putting him in that office..and on..and on..and on..sheesh!

and then...the leaves started to turn red and then they fell off the trees and then...oh my god!!!! it started to snow!!

[grasswire]

7. who is this columnist? never heard of him.

Obviously this is his opinion.

Who is he?

[Eric J in MN]

26. He's not a columnist.

This article is supposedly straight reporting. It doesn't have the word "Opinion" on top as their columnist-content does.

David A. Fahrenthold covers Congress for the Washington Post. He has been at the Post since 2000, and previously covered (in order) the D.C. police, New England, and the environment.

I don't blame you for thinking this was an opinion piece. The writer uses bogus facts (falsely claiming Sanders wants to prevent public colleges from having student union buildings) to support his rightwing opinions.

[Aerows]

31. Is he related to the pajama wearing

Blake Farenthold?

[Eric J in MN]

32. No, the WaPo writer's Twitter page says they're not related. NT

NT

[restorefreedom]

8. wapo is in for hillary

always has been

just another "bernie sucks because" article

tell that to his throngs of visitors and supporters

[liberal N proud]

9. I realized that WAPO was for Hillary when I posted but as an undecided

I feel there are some valid concerns in the article. Some that I have anyway.

And again, I am undecided.

[restorefreedom]

10. its not a bad article

i just think their point of view is excruciatingly clear.

i would be more inclined to read them if they just came out about it and stopped pretending to "report."

kind of like salon imo.

[Eric J in MN]

39. What are the valid concerns in the article?

State governments already pay for student union buildings at public colleges.

If Bernie Sanders' free-tuition bill passed, they still would.

[moobu2]

12. But Bernie does suck and will never ever be the Democratic party nominee.

[RobertEarl]

15. Wow. Could you be more cruder and ruder, moobu?

You do realize you are a teeny-tiny minority? And one who is obviously just throwing out mean words meant to incite. Isn't there a H> site you might find more to your style?

What Bernie wants, by making education free, is further investment in our future. Of course those who are against free education are also those who basically hate America and want everything just for themselves and their pitiful little existence. Like 'bush's have mores' base of voters.

[moobu2]

16. Do you say that to all the silly immature Hillary bashes on here? no.

It doesn't matter what Bernie Sanders wants because he wont be the nominee but even if he were we would get a republican president then how free would anything be?

[RobertEarl]

17. Free education?

We educate our youth without making them individually pay. It is called socialism, this education system which has made America so wise.

I get you are terribly frustrated that H> is not going to be elected. I feel your pain. But that is no reason for you to be so immature with your postings.

[DanTex]

33. This is a very interesting statement: "You do realize you are a teeny-tiny minority"?

Are you implying that the crude comments against Hillary we see all the time are OK because the majority of people here don't support her?

[restorefreedom]

23. nice to see efforts to elevate the discourse here

[Fawke Em]

47. Not as much as your entitled Queen. eom

[LondonReign2]

48. In what way exactly does Bernie suck? Do tell

[DanTex]

36. Totally. That's why they aren't chasing the bogus email story at all...

[moobu2]

13. Bernie could introduce another bill that has no chance of passing

though.

[Armstead]

21. The author is relying on the Cato Institute, which hates government

And the article noted that IF there were money provided for free tuition, individual schools can opt not to take it.

While government overreach and excessive bureaucracy can be a problem, articles like this could have been written at the times the Civil Rights Act was passed, Social Security was created, the government decided to build an Interstate highway system, the EPA was cteated...and any other policy.

[brooklynite]

22. from the Washington Post? When will the media blackout end!!!!!

[Eric J in MN]

25. This article is bogus.

Last edited Thu Oct 1, 2015, 08:31 PM - Edit history (1)

The purpose of Bernie Sanders' college funding plan is free tuition, not new buildings.

States could still construct whatever buildings they wanted on campuses without that being paid for with federal money, and without it counting as matching funds for federal money.

PDF of Sanders' "College for All Act:"
http://www.sanders.senate.gov/download/collegeforall/?inline=file

[WillyT]

34. This Article Is A Hit Piece.

[DanTex]

37. Can state colleges currently not use tuition money to build student centers?

I actually don't know the answer. If they can, then Bernie's plan will make a difference in that regard. But if they currently keep tuition money in a separate pile from donations and other revenues, and only build student centers and the like with money from the second pile, then it's basically the same as before.

[Eric J in MN]

40. The way the bill is intended to work

...is that state colleges wouldn't charge tuition, and so that stream wouldn't exist.

State governments would pay for colleges using general taxation. For some state spending, there would be 2-to-1 federal matching, and for other state spending, there wouldn't be federal matching.

[DanTex]

41. Yes, but presumably what is currently the tuition stream will be replaced by the federal

government stream. Maybe not in an exact 1-for-1 way, but basically, if the federal government stream isn't as big as the current tuition stream, then states will have to raise taxes (or somehow come up with money) to pay the difference. Which I don't think is what Bernie wants -- he wants the trading tax to replace the tuition payments.

Which I think makes my question still relevant. If colleges can currently use tuition money to pay for student centers and the like, then changing to the new plan will make it more difficult for them to build such things, because now they can only use the state spending stream (or contributions, or whatever).

More generally, if the new federal government stream comes with more restrictions than the tuition stream currently has, then the author has a point: the federal government will have more say in what kinds of things universities can do or build. Which could be either good or bad (or both or neither). But it is something.

[Eric J in MN]

42. Yes, state colleges would be incentivized to focus on academics.

But the WaPo writer goes way beyond the idea of incentives. He writes:

"Sanders thinks student centers are a waste of government money. He’d make sure they didn’t get any more of it."

[DanTex]

50. I agree, that sentence is wrong and misleading. However, it would be more difficult for colleges

to build student centers. And his larger point that there would be more federal control is correct. And he also has a point about the bureaucratic implications of trying to determine what is and what is not education-related.

I feel that the student center was a positive part of my college experience. Education doesn't just comes from classes, it also comes from other students. And a student center can be education-related if it gives people places to get together and study. In fact, I'm not so sure that they wouldn't be considered as legitimate education-related expenses under the Bernie plan.

[Eric J in MN]

52. Here is the text

===
(3) PROHIBITION.—A State that receives a grant under this section may not use grant funds or matching funds required under this section—

(A) for the construction of non-academic facilities, such as student centers or stadiums;

(B) for merit-based student financial aid; or

(C) to pay the salaries or benefits of school administrators.
===

They may be able to get matching funds under the bill to maintain student centers, but not to construct new ones.

Colleges would still pay administrators, and so the bill assumes that college spending would continue outside of the grant-process it creates.

Text of "College for All Act:"
https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/senate-bill/1373/text

[DanTex]

53. OK, thanks. Overall, I'm for free tuition, and I think the author of the article is

unfair, particularly since it's a news story not an editorial. But there are some legitimate considerations.

[Aerows]

29. If it is your view that everything is fine and dandy in the US

and little needs to be changed, vote to keep things as they are by voting establishment.

If it is your view that a few things need to be changed, but mostly, let's continue on with business as usual, vote establishment.

If you think that our country should be a hell of a lot better for a hell of a lot more people, vote Bernie.

[Armstead]

49. Bingo -- Succincly sums up a lot

[jfern]

35. The Washington Post established themselves as ridiculously anti Bernie

after their recent "article" about how some supposed Bernie supporters were mean to some black guy on twitter.

[DanTex]

38. Curious that Bernie supporters have no problem with WaPo when it comes to email stories.

Why would that be?

[Fawke Em]

45. I'd be more supportive if they left out the gossip from the emails

and concentrated on the fact that the entitled duo thought they couldn't get hacked.

[DanTex]

51. Yes, pointing out that there's no evidence of any hacking that occurred, while during the same

period there were massive breaches of supposedly secure government systems would be something responsible for WaPo to do. It would also be good for them to point out that email is inherently an insecure medium, regardless of whether it's a private server or a .gov address.

Lots of angles here that WaPo misses, instead they go for the "OMG private server" line. And people still think they're in the tank for Hillary. Crazy, right?

[Fawke Em]

44. Well, Hillary got people to work for her.

And, she's... um... not nice.