Joan Walsh slams Maureen Dowd

[Sliceo]

In reference to a recent report identifying Joe Biden as the person who anonymously told Maureen Dowdy that his son (allegedly) doesn't want the Clintons in the White House, Walsh told Chris Hayes:

You know, I think— My heart goes out to Joe Biden. I love the man. He’s entitled to run. He would be a wonderful candidate. It’s a little late, but the reason it’s late is because his son was sick and died.

So I have a hard time holding that against him. What Democrats will hold against him, if he was the source for that story, is taking it to Maureen Dowd, who then turned around and portrayed it, in the most debilitating way to Hillary Clinton, the notion of Biden values being better than Clinton values.

A woman who has attacked not just the Clintons, but his friend Barack Obama, for years and years and years, in the most personal and vicious terms. Why choose her? Why open your test run that way, that’s going to be depicted not as you would be a great candidate, but that this woman would lower the office? That's wrong.

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[LettuceSea]

1. I tire of her snarky tweets

She has been nailing Joe with them these past few months.

I don't love Maureen either, but this smells like a cat fight rivalry. Shameful that she put Joe in the middle.

[MADem]

2. Maureen Dowd is the opposite bookend of Ann Coulter. Just a vicious, pointless, gossippy human

being.

Not nice.

FWIW, "MO DO" also attacked Biden about the Kinnock business in her salad days. She's been at that screed shit for a while. I don't understand why Biden would call her--unless HE is running a very long con on behalf of the DNC.

She's an awful person. He has to remember how she fucked HIM over, too, as well as his boss. She was one of the three who BROKE that Kinnock story (with some help from a good oppo team working for Dukakis):

Most American political reporters were not so attuned to Britain's politics that they recognized Kinnock's words. But Michael Dukakis' adviser John Sasso had seen the Kinnock tape. Without his boss's knowledge or consent, he prepared a video juxtaposing the two men's speeches and got it into the hands of Dowd at the Times, David Yepsen of the Des Moines Register, and NBC News. When the story broke on Sept. 12, Biden was gearing up to chair the Supreme Court nomination hearings for Robert Bork, Ronald Reagan's far-right nominee. Biden angrily denied having done anything wrong and urged the press to chase after the political rival who had sent out what came to be called the "attack video."

It wasn't really an "attack video." It was the truth, but MO DO relished the attention she got breaking that story at Biden's expense. I mean, come on....!

[LettuceSea]

3. They are both terrible people. Just because Joan is a D doesn't exempt her

What was that Bobby Knight quote? "Journalism is a small step above prostitution."

[MADem]

5. Bobby Knight (and he's hardly a paragon) had it wrong--it's one step BELOW.

Prostitutes are often poorly paid for the work they do, poor things. Journalists are almost extinct, and "pundits" and "commentators" are just gossips, tiresome, vicious people.

I would not discount the "long con" theory. Biden doesn't forget a slight.

Here's MODO's original knifing:

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/12/us/biden-s-debate-finale-an-echo-from-abroad.html

On this side of the Atlantic, many Presidential campaign strategists of both parties greatly admired the way it portrayed Mr. Kinnock, who subsequently lost to Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, as a man of character. Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware, a Democratic hopeful, was particularly taken with it.

So taken, in fact, that he lifted Mr. Kinnock's closing speech with phrases, gestures and lyrical Welsh syntax intact for his own closing speech at a debate at the Iowa State Fair on Aug. 23 - without crediting Mr. Kinnock.

In the commercial, the Briton began, ''Why am I the first Kinnock in a thousand generations to be able to get to university?'' Then pointing to his wife in the audience, he continued: ''Why is Glenys the first woman in her family in a thousand generations to be able to get to university? Was it because all our predecessors were thick?''

Senator Biden began his remarks by saying the ideas had come to him spontaneously on the way to the debate. ''I started thinking as I was coming over here, why is it that Joe Biden is the first in his family ever to go to a university?'' he said. Then, pointing to his wife, he continued: ''Why is it that my wife who is sitting out there in the audience is the first in her family to ever go to college? Is it because our fathers and mothers were not bright? Is it because I'm the first Biden in a thousand generations to get a college and a graduate degree that I was smarter than the rest?''

She basically lays him out as a Big Fat Liar. This is brutal writing.

[LettuceSea]

6. Yeah, thats why I don't believe the politico story

Dowd is rotten, and it's irrational that he would talk to her based on that history.

My beef is with Joan, because she's smart enough to know that Joe didn't talk to Dowd. But she enjoys entertaining her twitter followers with snarky anti-Joe tweets that only benefit HRC, so this does not surprise me.

"Democrats will hold that against Joe." oh Joan, you're just as shitty as Maureen.

[MADem]

7. The only thing that would make sense is if the story came from Biden...TO someone else....and thence

to Dowd; i.e. someone with impeccable bona fides who could decisively (and believably) tell Dowd that he or she got it from Biden was, in fact, the one who dropped the dime.

The only one in Biden's circle who might do that is Hunter, for his own reasons. It wouldn't be his wife--she doesn't want him to run, all reports say. If he does it, she'll tolerate it, but she likes her life as is.

Hunter, though, is hardly a name anyone wants to mention, given his problems (he got special consideration and a pretty significant age waiver to join the Navy during a time when the Navy was downsizing--frankly, someone with a real job had to go home to make room for him, in terms of end strength--and then he got busted almost immediately for cocaine use. Anyone else would have gone to jail--he was a commissioned officer-but instead, he got a quiet admin discharge. Hey, you serve at the pleasure of the POTUS, and some people get breaks even when they screw up--see North, Ollie as an example). If his father was POTUS, Hunter could rehabilitate himself and get more consideration than he might otherwise get as the son of a former VP. And the way things are now, those days--when his dad becomes a FORMER public official-- are coming.

I don't think Joan IS wrong, though--MODO is obviously creating the association, and--key bit, here-- Biden isn't denying it. And I don't think Joan is mistaken (she may be a bit harsh with her verbiage, but she isn't misjudging) about how America will "embrace" Biden. There are some who like him because they perceive him as a continuation of Obama's policies (and some who would quickly hate him for the same reason), there are some who like the idea of him because he's an older, established MALE who is comfortable on a GLOBAL, not local stage (and some who will resent him for the same reason).

But his negatives are historical, and they haven't really been fully vetted--people were so busy beating the shit out of that "Muslim Kenyan Non-Citizen Radical Fist Bump Look-at-his-wife's-thesis" POTUS candidate that he ran with, that no one really re-visited a lot of Biden's issues. Running for the primo slot, though? He'll get a HARD look--and he will be dragged through the mud by the GOP. They won't be as gentle as some of the criticism he's gotten from in-house.

Here's my honest thought--he's tried twice. Full bore, in a big way. He's never gotten his numbers out of the basement. He has too many negatives, not just the one remaining "lesser" son, not just the oft-repeated video gaffes where he bigfooted Obama on health care and equality, but all that shit in the past--it will come up....the "Kinnock," certainly, but worst of all, and not recently discussed .... the "ANITA HILL." That is a big fuckup. No other way to characterize it.

There is a movie in production at HBO right now starring Kerry Washington as Anita, and Greg Kinnear (who is a powerhouse actor who doesn't always get the credit he deserves) as Biden. It's called CONFIRMATION and it's going to come out right smack dab in the middle of 2016. It will not make Biden look good--in fact, it will probably make him look like he did precisely what he did--with the help of Scooter Libby's wife (yes, DC is incestuous), he threw Anita under the bus.

That probably won't resonate too well with a lot of diverse communities.

He's also from the "credit card state" and that won't help him either--Democrats who like Elizabeth Warren (and that meeting with her was bizarre--I mean really, chalk and cheese) shouldn't, if they pay attention to Actual Politics and not "personalities" find that pairing even POSSIBLE,. If Warren didn't tell him "No fucking way, Joe" in an off the record way, I'd be surprised, because I don't think she is a hypocrite.

But I've been surprised before and probably will be again. Who knows what the truth is? The flies on the wall are the only ones with the full story, here!

[LettuceSea]

10. Ahh, thank you for telling me what your true intentions were here

You kinda just did the same thing Joan Walsh did.

[MADem]

12. I happen to like Biden as a personality but I do not think he is at ALL viable.

If you think I am "Joan Walshing" him, what do you think the GOP would do? Say "Ewww, that's not sporting" and invoke their Marquess of Queensberry rules? Please. They will rip into him like a tiger who hasn't had a meal all week.

Sometimes, it's important to know what the oppo work is that's already out there--and Biden has more unresolved baggage than most. Key word--unresolved. There's a lot of not asked/not answered with him.

Do you seriously think that shooting the messenger is helpful?

I guess you do...?

[LettuceSea]

14. When did he announce his candidacy?

[MADem]

15. He told Colbert he was weighing the decision. You should know this if

you know anything about him.

He's been making noise, "exploring"--for weeks now. He doesn't know if he's "there."

Let's not be coy. There's no need for that at all.

[LettuceSea]

19. An unaffiliated PAC has been making noise for him

It's unfortunate that so many assume that noise is attached to what the VP actually wants.

There are many rea$ons to keep that PAC up and running. Benefits many, including the establishment, and assets are created and sold.

[MADem]

20. The words came out of HIS mouth, not out of the press release of an

'unaffiliated PAC.'

I don't know if he's seriously considering this, or it's a long con designed to play a game of distraction for the benefit of the DNC (and he IS, first and foremost, a PARTY guy, which was one of his appealing aspects when Obama picked him) --but no one had their hand up the back of his jacket and was moving his mouth for him.

He said what he said--to Colbert, and others.

[dem in texas]

4. Dowd has been on a witch hunter for the Clintons for years.

Why oh Why does the NYT keep her on their payroll. She is a mean spirited person.

[MADem]

11. Because the New York Times is a closeted right wing rag. They "play at" liberal, and then they

stick the stiletto between the ribs.

Look how they "took out" Grampa McCain with bogus accusations of infidelity, who was the "reasonable" candidate compared to RMoney?

There's no doubt that Gramps and the lobbyist engaged in "banter," probably of the flirtatious sort, but there's no evidence that there was any frigging in the rigging or anywhere else happening with them. Now, I'm not saying McCain is liberal, but compared to RMoney, he wasn't pushing the phony - fundy buttons, he wasn't the Candidate of The One Percent, AND he had a reputation for despising (an overabundance, anyway, of) PORK in Congress. NYT cut him out of the herd because they needed to weaken him to clear the path for RMoney--and it worked. That darn Obama got in the way, though!

They just aren't reporters--they are the National Enquirer, with less veracity. They really do think they can use their front pages to prosecute an agenda--and that's just so wrong. Anytime they say anything--even about a politician I like--I always look for the angle. I don't trust them. They've really hit the skids since their Pentagon Papers glory days.

They -- and other "news" agencies, too -- need to get back to the whole WHO-WHAT-WHEN-WHERE-WHY routine--I am not gonna hold my breath, though.

[restorefreedom]

8. joan is all in for hillary

and her oh so sweet schtick about being sympathetic to joe and her condescending "he would make a great candidate" routine makes me ill.

they are both partisan hacks and now they are fighting.

their true colors will continue to emerge.

[sufrommich]

9. I think Dowd works to damage democrats,period. I don't doubt

that she leaked the Biden story to make him look bad. I don't know what her problem is but she writes with all the emotional maturity of a 16 year old.

[JaneyVee]

13. MoDo is still tripping on edible weed.

[MADem]

17. That was one of the funniest (unintentionally so) columns she has ever

written.

Either she took a bribe from the liquor industry (she does like a cocktail) to write that diss-screed, or she's just an idiot who doesn't follow directions...but that was funny as all get-out.

[Fumesucker]

16. !

[hifiguy]

18. Dowd apparently thinks she's the Dorothy Parker of politics.

All she's lacking is Parker's intelligence, wit, and ability to write. Apart from that, who could tell them apart?

[MADem]

21. Does she have one of those famous throw pillows?

The quote has been ascribed to Alice Roosevelt and a host of others, but Parker gets credited for/accused of saying (if not originating) it, too. The origins are lost in the mists of time:

[hifiguy]

23. I've always seen that attributed to Alice Roosevelt.

But it certainly sounds like Dorothy.

Perhaps my favorite poison bon-bon of Parker's was this one:

Parker was attempting to go through a doorway at a party at the same time as socialite and writer Clare Boothe Luce.

“Age before beauty” said Luce while yielding the way. “And pearls before swine,” replied Parker while gliding through the doorway.

Blammo. Game over.

[Dems to Win]

22. I fully agree with Joan (and I'm a Bernie supporter) nt