Did Republicans vote for socialists? Apparently they used to! Bernie wants to follow up there...

[cascadiance]

... and bring back the policies of one of them! Maybe those that liked Ike then will want a newer option than what Republicans offer now! Someone that "invested" in America by building out its highway system, and helped returning GIs get college degrees, rather than spend huge money on the military industrial complex that he was prudent about warning on how a corrupt waste that would be!

[Agnosticsherbet]

1. Eisenhower was not a socialist.

[cascadiance]

2. Bernie seems to think so, and he seems to support socialist parts of our government...

... like a strong social security program, etc. as shown here by his own quotes where he calls those that stands against them *stupid*!

[Agnosticsherbet]

5. Sanders is using hyperbole

When he equates socialism with FDR, Eisenhower, or any other historical person.

Social Security is not now and never was socialism. Neither are public schools or highways, both of which predate socialism as a political philosophy. SS is a program that fits in the great liberal tradition, i.e liberalism.

Highway systems go back to Rome and the Incas.

[cascadiance]

6. So when Paul Ryan got money from when his dad died from death benefits, that wasn't socialism?

How did he earn that money? It was GIVEN to him from this program as it is a third of all social security fund payouts to death and disability benefits recipients. The GI bill giving them money to go to college is as much socialism as it is in other northern european countries where they give it to all of their kids when our kids are asked to go in to huge debt instead.

How do YOU define socialism? Do you go to Rush Limbaugh and Michael Savage for their definitions of it and equivalencing it with dictatorial communism, epitomized by Joseph Stalin, which has more ties to the Koch brothers and who gets their money than he is tied to Bernie Sanders.

[Agnosticsherbet]

7. No, that was liberal progam enacted by a liberal president using the concepts of liberalism.

I use The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Politics published by Oxford University Press. In college, I read "The Communist Manifesto" and a lot of Adam Smith's Wealth of nations. (Marx is Very dry reading and Smith is not much better.)

You see, summoning up programs passed by a government as sounding socialist doesn't make them socialist.

However, lumping them all together and calling them socialist makes for a great meme, though not factually accurate.

Her is a link to a newer edition of the dictionary I use. I recommend it highly as a reference book.
http://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/acref/9780199207800.001.0001/acref-9780199207800

[FSogol]

8. +1 n/t

[cascadiance]

9. Then what makes Bernie a "socialist" and Eisenhower not a socialist...

... other than Bernie not rejecting the label and calling himself one.

What tangible things that define socialism in your book separates those two?

[Agnosticsherbet]

10. (1) He self designates as a Democratic Socialist.

I take his word for that.
(2 ) Everything I have heard and read indicates that he operates out of a that socioeconomic and political world view that corresponds to Democratic Socialism.

My problem is taking a program like social security or the highway system or public schools and labeling them as socialist. That is historically and factually inaccurate.

FDR was an avowed liberal. Eisenhower was a moderate conservative from the fifties who would be considered liberal by today's definitions.

[Lucky Luciano]

12. Semantics only.

In this case, Bernie is an avowed liberal. His policies are no more liberal than FDR. The word socialist is really meaningless here.

[Agnosticsherbet]

13. Words have real meanings.

[mhatrw]

33. The explain how Sanders' stances on the issues MEANINGFULLY differ from FDR's. nt

[cascadiance]

14. You weren't answering my question... WHAT makes Bernie a socialist...

... other than he calls himself that label.

Had Eisenhower ever called himself a "socialist", would that have made him one too? Is just calling himself socialist make him a socialist? Did Eisenhower ever call himself "liberal"? If not, then why is he a liberal if he didn't call himself one, any more than he isn't a socialist because he didn't call himself one.

As someone else said here, it is semantics and marketing. Marketing driven by right wing memes of "socialism" = "communism". A meme you seem to want to help them propagate here.

[Agnosticsherbet]

16. Check my answer below this one.

He detested socialism so much that he thought the Tennessee Valley authority was Socialism.

[Agnosticsherbet]

15. Eisenhower's policies, self designation, and his

Successful legislation.

Socislism, Consetvatism, Democratic Socislism, Liberalism, Communism and other political ideologies each have their own set of philosophies and beliefs.

His attitude is best summed up with the following quote.

NUMBER:1712AUTHOR wight David Eisenhower (1890–1969)QUOTATION:I believe that for the past twenty years there has been a creeping socialism spreading in the United States.ATTRIBUTION resident DWIGHT D. EISENHOWER, off-the-cuff speech to Republican leaders, Custer State Park, South Dakota, June 11, 1953.—Robert J. Donovan,Eisenhower: The Inside Story, p. 336 (1956).

  At his press conference in Washington, D.C., June 17, 1953, President Eisenhower was asked what he meant by “creeping socialism.” Donovan writes, “He replied: continued Federal expansion of the T.V.A. He reiterated for what he said was the thousandth time that he would not destroy the T.V.A., but he said that he thought it was socialistic to continue putting money paid by all the taxpayers into a single region which could then attract industry away from other areas” (p. 336). Also seePublic Papers of the Presidents of the United States: Dwight D. Eisenhower, 1953, p. 433.SUBJECTS:Socialism

T.V.A. Tennessee Caley Authority

He opposed building large public for the good of the people with Tax money and considered it Socialist. Eisenhower was no Socialist.

[cascadiance]

18. So advocating for a high marginal tax rate of 90%+ isn't socialism then?

Ok, then that's one thing that people can't complain about with Bernie's policies being "socialist" then right?

A few other things I'm sure there would also fit, like making sure we have a decent minimum wage, advocating more assistance for people to go to college isn't socialist then as Eisenhower advocated that through the GI Bill didn't he?

What are the "bad" and definitively *socialist* things that Bernie has done or advocated doing?

Maybe Eisenhower criticizing more the "creeping" access of the "socialism" he's describing here as being something that regionally benefits some and not others.

It would seem that his other socialism (the nation's highway system) that he pushed to have done is equivalent as government spending on infrastructure as spending money on things like the TVA, though in that case, it wasn't focused on one region, which appears to be the focus of his criticism rather than the "socialistic" aspect of it.

And I challenge you to find a definition of socialism that it is only defined by regional preference for government spending and not present in other government spending programs that is more evenly spent.

[Agnosticsherbet]

19. Tax policy is not socialism.

Read my post, his antagonism towards socialism is clear.

And as to that Tax bracket, only a small part of the income of the wealthy was subject to that, and nowhere does it discus deductions, which inoculated the wealthy against taxes.

Eisenhower was no socialist. History is clear on that subject.

[cascadiance]

22. He said he didn't like CREEPING socialism according to your quote...

and was taking issue with disproportionate spending in one area with the TVA project. Now that was government spending on a program. So was his program of ramping up the highway system. WHY is the TVA project socialism, and not the highway program? HUH? You aren't answering the question. As I noted, he wasn't criticizing spending in and of itself, which is what most people think of as socialism (and most socialists want spending on efforts to not favor one group of citizens over another). THAT was what Eisenhower was taking issue with that quote, was it not?

Again, define what you think is SOCIALISM, and not make claims as to what it is not.

[Agnosticsherbet]

29. Read The dictionary I suggested an then Marx

[mhatrw]

34. History is clear that Ike liked Sanders' version of "Democratic Socialism"

Tell me one plank in Sanders' platform that Ike would not have supported.

[Agnosticsherbet]

20. I never said Socialism or Sanders were bad.

Calling Eisenhower a socialist is utterly lacking in fact. You can post 100 memes, but it will not make it true.

[Agnosticsherbet]

21. Socialism, Democratic Socialism, and other forms of Socialism have

Real meanings within Political science.

Unless we understand those meanings we can not have intelligent conversations.

There is no truth 8n the claim that Eisenhower was a socialist . Doing so is intellectual dishonesty.

[cascadiance]

24. Again, if they have real meanings then why don't you say what those meanings are...

... or point to a description to support your notions here of what isn't socialism.

[Agnosticsherbet]

28. I suggest you begin with the dictionary I suggested.

After thst, read the Communism Manifesto, if your interested in learning.

[cascadiance]

30. So then Sweden and other northern European countries aren't socialist because they aren't communist?

I don't have time to go out and read a book just to reply to your message.

Most people here don't think of communism and socialism being synonyms and that the government that was "communist" under Stalin has really nothing in common with what is being done in places like Sweden now, which is more of a democracy practicing socialism, whereas most communist entities in places like the Soviet Unions were dictatorships calling themselves socialist, that were only answerable to a few people in the politburo and the person at the top rather than the people in general.

There are many people in society that share my opinion that entities like social security are a form of socialism that we have within our system, and that like it or not, Eisenhower was a big supporter of that program and many other parts of our government that people would consider socialist components of it, whether he chooses to label himself as such or not.

[Agnosticsherbet]

31. An uneducated opinion is not fact. Eisenhower was not a socialist

Learn what Socialism is, and then we can have intelligent conversation.

[mhatrw]

35. Learn what Sanders' version of Democratic Socialism is.

Then tell us what planks in Sanders' platform would not have been supported by Ike.

[Agnosticsherbet]

36. Learn what Socialism is,

And you will appreciate his vision.

Eisenhower ws not a socialist.

[mhatrw]

37. Then Sanders is not a socialist.

He really isn't.

[WillyT]

3. K & R !!!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. A big, fat K&R!

[Scuba]

11. That was my father's Republican party. Even he would be aghast at what they've become.

[madokie]

17. I used to wonder about my dads republicanism

until I read the 1956 republican platform

[brooklynite]

23. Here's a hint...Ronald Reagan couldn't win the Republican nomination today

[cascadiance]

25. Yep, he would prosecute banksters that gave us the savings and loan crisis...

Unfortunately, we have corporate corruption ruling both parties preventing either of them from prosecuting crimes committed by banksters this time around.

[Bread and Circus]

26. what was the Democratic platform in 1956?

[Bread and Circus]

27. scratch that, it was even more liberal than that

[pinebox]

32. They did

And here you go.