Why Bernie will win the GE: Meet The Lifelong Republicans Who Love Bernie Sanders

[99th_Monkey]

BTW, Bernie gets roughly 21-25% of the Republican vote in Vermont, who choose NOT to vote for their GOP candidate.

The Lifelong Republicans Who Love Bernie Sanders
Some conservatives are defying expectation and backing the Vermont senator.
by CLARE FORAN * NOV 24, 2015 * The Atlantic

When Tarie MacMillan switched on her television in August to watch the first Republican presidential debate, she expected to decide which candidate to support.

But MacMillan, a 65-year-old Florida resident, was disappointed. “I looked at the stage and there was nobody out there who I really liked. It just seemed like a showcase for Trump and his ridiculous comments,” she recalled. “It was laughable, and scary, and a real turning point.”

So she decided to back Bernie Sanders, the self-described “Democratic socialist” challenging Hillary Clinton. MacMillan was a lifelong Republican voter until a few weeks ago when she switched her party affiliation to support the Vermont senator in the primary. It will be the first time she’s ever voted for a Democrat.

That story may sound improbable, but MacMillan isn’t the only longtime conservative supporting Sanders. There are Facebook groups and Reddit forums devoted entirely to Republicans who adore the Vermont senator.

These Republicans for Sanders defy neat categorization. Some are fed up with the status quo in Washington, and believe that Sanders, with his fiery populist message, is the presidential contender most likely to disrupt it. Others have voted Republican for years, but feel alarmed by what they see as the sharp right turn the party has taken.

“I have been a conservative Republican my entire life. But the Republican party as a whole has gotten so far out of touch with the American people,” says Bryan Brown, a 47-year-old Oregon resident. “I switched my registration so that I could vote for Sanders in the primary, but the day the primary is over I’m going to register as an Independent.”

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-lifelong-conservatives-who-love-bernie-sanders/417441/?utm_source=SFFB

[JoePhilly]

1. So conservative Republicans, are ok having their taxes raised ...

... to support more social programs.

Ok.

[99th_Monkey]

2. Apparently so. Because their are, believe it or not, many Republicans who still have a conscience.

Who knew? But if the 21-25% of the GOP who vote for Bernie's in his own state of
Vermont are any indication, then the answer is abso-fucking-lutely.

These are Republicans who remember President Eisenhower, and Republicans like
Oregon's US Senators Mark Hatfield and Wayne Morse. Even Reagan supported Social
Security and Medicare as I recall.

[JoePhilly]

4. Republcians who welcome higher taxes ... ok.

But it is fun watching a Bernie supporter talk about how Reagan supported Social Security.

Maybe you do not know that Reagan increased the retirement age ... is that what you call support?

And he spoke out against Medicare.

[JonLeibowitz]

6. Evidently some republicans do welcome higher taxes. As pointed out above,

quite a few of them keep voting for Sanders in Congressional elections. The burden of proof is on you to prove that such a thing is impossible elsewhere. Good luck!

[99th_Monkey]

8. Look, I'm no Reagan fan, but his SS support was about like Obama's

who also toyed around with adjusting the retirement age, if you recall.
But this is irrelevant to the point of the OP and you know it.

The point is, Bernie has a strong cross-over appeal to Republican voters who have not
completely lost their minds or their souls, and want SOMEone to vote for who does not
represent "politics as usual" and who they feel they can trust.

The point is, Bernie gets STRONG Republican support in his own state of Vermont, and
that is significant to this discussion.

[JoePhilly]

12. No, WRONG.

Reagan ACTUALLY raised the age.

Obama DARED the GOP to reach for the SS carrot, and they stepped back. And in the budget that just passed, with a GOP Congress, the CARROT Obama dangled in their faces, was NOT included.

The POINT is that there is no reason for a CONSERVATIVE Republican to support Bernie. If there was an actual policy position of Bernie's that they supported ... you would have been the FIRST to name it.

But you can't. Because there isn't one. You can not claim he has "cross over appeal" and then not name the specific policy positions on which they base that support.

[99th_Monkey]

14. Tell that to Bernie's 25% GOP cross-over voters in Vermont.

HINT: This is not about knit-picking over what 'policies' voter support. It goes much deeper than that.

If you ask Bernie's GOP supporters in Vermont, they will tell you they trust the man to do what he
says, and say what he'll really do <-- a rarity in DC.

They will tell you he works hard to represent ALL of the people of Vermont, and is not a partisan hack.

But you will ignore all this, because it doesn't fit your narrative that "Bernie can't win".

[JoePhilly]

17. Do you honestly think that VERMONT ...

... predicts anything NATIONALLY?

I am not ignoring anything ... but YOU just ignored the rather large part of the US that is NOT like Vermont.

As for the "Bernie can't win thing" ... I disagree with you. He could win. But I do not think he will. Why not?

1) Hillary is much stronger than she was in 2007.

2) Hillary knows she (barely) lost to Obama because she ignored the caucus states. She will not make that mistake again.

3) Obama was able to get LOTS and LOTS of folks who would have HAPPILY voted for Hillary to switch. Obama supporters did not vilify Hilary supporters, they reached out to them. Many of Bernie's supporters HATE those who would vote for Hillary, and are happy to go on and on about it. They cost Bernie support. And here on DU they are the same folks who wanted a primary of Obama in 2012. And we know how that worked out.

[99th_Monkey]

18. Yes, Vermont is not Texas.

I never claimed Berne would get as many Texas Republicans to vote for him as he does in Vermont.

However, what a candidates HOME STATE thinks of them is HUGELY important, and often an indicator
of how a candidate will fare nationally.

Writing off Vermont as insignificant is a mistake, but have at it; as I'm sure you will, as you're clearly
convinced Hillary 'has it in the bag" already.

Fine. She thought that in '08 too. We shall see.

[JoePhilly]

19. Why are you babbling about Texas?

Did I mention Texas?? Nope.


And did I say Vermont was "insignificant", nope.

But since you bring it up ... I see no reason to extrapolate Vermont to the rest of the nation.

As for Hillary having it "in the bag" ... you prove that you simply have no idea about how elections are won. Of the two of us, I'm the one looking at the entire country.

You have a rather narrow focus.

I see the importance of many states you seem to be ignoring (but you do seem to care about Texas for some reason).

But hey ... we shall see.

[99th_Monkey]

21. Texas: the home of the Bush Crime Family, Where JFK was murdered, The Fossil Fuel Capital, etc.

I chose Texas because it's ONE of several Southern states I could have chosen -- to juxtapose with
Vermont as an extreme opposite -- to attempt to have something like an intelligent conversation with
you, which you obviously have no interest in having.

Instead you stoop to insult, to deride, and to insinuate that I'm somehow "ignorant" of something
you fancy yourself to have some kind of "expert" knowledge about, the big national picture.

But hey, as you say, we shall see.

[Robbins]

38. so rich

you clinton supporters have called bernie supporters racists and sexists and you go on and on on us.

Clinton is more disliked than she was In 2007.

once again buying into spin obama didn't really win.the flux of caucus system stole it from her

many of the bernie can't win was applied to obama in 2007.let's not rewrite history.And that race got very heated.not just between them but on DU.

[JoePhilly]

43. I have not called anyone either of those names.

I have considered calling some folks assholes or morons, but I have avoided doing so.

Bernie is not going to win. Bernie is not Obama, a fact Bernie supporters usually like to claim as a virtue. Except when it suits them.

The real problem you have is that rather than building up a stronger candidate with more national appeal, the perpetually disgruntled sat around complaining about Obama and hoping Warren would primary Obama in 2012, or run now for 2016. And when she did neither, they ran to Bernie because, well, they had no where else to go I guess.

Obama won in 2007 because he (a) came across as Presidential, and (b) he won the caucus states which Hillary took for granted. And even then, he barely won.

Bernie does not do "a", and Hillary will not make mistake "b" a second time.

And that ends the history lesson.

[cui bono]

30. The taxes will be higher mostly just for the wealthy.

The rest will see returns that will offset the higher taxes - health care, maternity/paternity leave etc... It will be a net gain for most people.

Raising the cap on social security does not affect the vast majority of Americans.

So I'm not sure what you are thinking the amount of this raise in taxes will be and who is will affect. Do you have any statistics?

[JoePhilly]

34. Have you noticed who conservative Republicans have been voting for in recent years?

They are not going to vote for ANY tax increases on anyone.

And that's the point. They are not going to vote for a guy who says "I'm going to raise taxes on the rich, and you'll get more as a result."

They think that is a "redistribution of wealth",

Your response demonstrates that you are confused on this point. I am FOR raising those taxes because I agree that doing away with the cap, and raising other taxes on the wealthy allows the other things you mention.

Conservative Republicans do not.

Perhaps you have some statistics on how many Conservative Republicans support doing any of those things.

[cui bono]

40. So now you're making it "Conservative Republicans". We were talking about Republicans that would

vote for Bernie.

My response had no confusion in it, perhaps you didn't understand it.

And I asked you about statistics because I was trying to see where you were coming from as far as what you thought the tax increase would be and who it would affect. Your reply shows all you want to do is be contrary rather than actually discuss this. So be it.

[JoePhilly]

41. Isn't that what today's Republicans are, conservative?

I do not need statistics to prove that Republicans will not vote for Bernie.

I have YEARS AND YEARS of national election results to draw from.

I'd like you to explain how Bernie wins the far left, loses the moderate left, and then some how jumps over that moderate left, to draw in Republicans of any kind.

[treestar]

45. The whole idea is lunacy

from the same quarter telling us the Hillary is too conservative - that makes it especially ironic.

[JoePhilly]

47. I've started to ask them questions about ...

... these Bernie supporting Republicans ... like "What Republican policies do these crossover folks still support?" I mean, if they are Republicans, what makes them "Republican", even though they will supporter Bernie.

I'd like them to describe the political positions this unicorn, ooops, cross over Republican.

Should be interesting.

[Betty Karlson]

33. Actual conservatives would not have a problem with that.

Reactionaries certainly would, but common-sense conservatives would let a skake-up of the status-quo override financial reservations.

Sanders has cross-over appeal, because he is NOT status quo.

[JoePhilly]

35. Those no longer exist.

[Betty Karlson]

36. According to the OP, they do.

And I'd describe myself as one too.

[JoePhilly]

42. Which Republican policies do you support?

[Betty Karlson]

49. None anymore. I went over to the left ahead of the imminent stampede. n/t

[NanceGreggs]

3. Funny that.

Usually when Republicans "love" a (D) candidate, we're told it's because said candidate is too closely aligned with Republican principles and goals.

But when it's Bernie, it means something totally different.

[99th_Monkey]

5. Actually it DOES mean something entirely different. No more politics-as-usual ..

.. but NOT the Clown Car please. <--this is the message, like it or not, about what many GOP voters are feeling.

[Broward]

9. Bernie pulls voters to the left while the conservadems chase them right.

[cui bono]

31. Of course it means something different with Bernie because he stands for something different

than Third Way Dems.

These conclusions are not just made up out of thin air, they are based on the policy stances of the people they are being made about.

[treestar]

46. no standards or rules of any kind apply to Bernie

whatever he does it right - even the rules of physics don't apply - I do believe we will find out that Bernie can fly!

[WillyT]

7. HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!

[Historic NY]

10. Putting the cart before the horse....

he isn't winning nothing or won't be on a ballot unless he wins at least 2117 delegates, during the primaries.

[99th_Monkey]

11. Hint: delegates to the Democratic Convention are ELECTED in Primaries

Did you read how Republicans are changing their registration to DEMOCRAT to vote for Bernie?

Apparently not.

[redstateblues]

13. Extrapolating that to the American electorate

as a whole is a bit of a stretch. Bernie will get crushed in the South come Super Tuesday. I don't hear about any republicans around here that are voting for Bernie.

[99th_Monkey]

16. Time will indeed tell, about Bernie's support in the South. It's a work in progress, admittedly.

But the point of the article and my OP, is that Bernie has an uncanny way of appealing to people
at a heart and soul level that is a rarity, and the Democratic Party will be fools to pass up on this
opportunity to nominate him to run in the GE.

This is the Democratic Socialist who went "into the lion's den" at Liberty University and got
applause and respect and even some tears, "bringing people together" is what his campaign is
about, and it's exactly what this country needs right now, more than ANYthing.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

15. This person doesn't have a fig what they are politically

Another low-info voter.

Maybe they legit like Bernie, or they are being cagey. But they are not a "lifetime Conservative" unless they are completely ignoring his policies.

[sellitman]

20. I have a good friend who is rabid GOP

He hates his choices and feels Bernie is the only HONEST candidate out there. He said he would vote for Burnie if he wins the Primary . I was shocked but I understand his logic.

[99th_Monkey]

22. Can you get him to change his registration, just for the Primary?

every vote counts you know.

[sellitman]

23. Good idea

I'm going to ask.

[99th_Monkey]

24. .

[slipslidingaway]

27. This map gives the deadlines for each state, the NY deadline already passed for changing ...

party affiliation.

http://voteforbernie.org/

Check out the state in which they live and let them know if they need to register as a Dem. When you click on a state it will tell you if they need to register as a Dem and the deadline to register. Each state also has a link so to the state's voter registration site.

I just did this for a family member tonight, good luck and thanks!

[kenn3d]

25. If we can nominate Bernie, he can win.

Anecdotal evidence from numerous sources say that a (perhaps substantial) percentage of disaffected Republicans and many Independents will vote for Bernie Sanders. Some have already re-registered as Democrats or otherwise committed to voting for him in their primary/caucus.

Not all voters are lifetime party members who choose strictly on issues... or even know the candidates' positions on issues necessarily. Indeed, knowing HRC's positions on the issues can be difficult even for the informed voter. Many less-involved citizens will simply recognize the rampant and growing corruption in our government and cast their hope for positive change with Bernie. Like it or not, a large part of the population either doesn't bother to vote, or doesn't take the time to really learn much about the candidates. But many will be exposed to Bernie's message enough to see it as a refreshing incentive to return to the polls on election day. A lot of these voters are not what DUers call Democrats or Republicans. They largely won't be inclined to understand or even listen to historical (or hysterical) arguments for your candidate. And some may not be answering their landline phones anymore (if they even still have one).

Also, many Democrats who decided to vote for Obama instead of Hillary last time, may make a similar decision this time when the time comes, despite what the traditional pollsters are telling us now.
Hillary was not inevitable in 2008, and she's still evitable now. If we can nominate Bernie, he can win.

[99th_Monkey]

28. Yes. nt

[slipslidingaway]

26. Some family members are changing their party affiliation so they can vote for Sanders ...

they believe the Repub candidates are a bunch of idiots and most of what they say is not true, but they also do not trust Hillary.

Sanders seems to be the best fit for them as he has remained constant in his beliefs. Who am I to try and change their minds

[99th_Monkey]

29. All I can say is, yes. Bernie is fast becoming 'a thing' .. across the board.

his appeal runs deep and wide, but don't try to tell Hillary people that, or you will be
derided as 'naive' .. 'ignorant about real politics' .. etc.

I guess I can't blame them, they have a 'hard sell' on their hands the more people wake
the fuck up about what's really going on in this country.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

32. The plural of anecdote is not data. n.T.

[99th_Monkey]

39. 21-24% of Republican voters in Vermont is data.

Last edited Thu Nov 26, 2015, 02:58 PM - Edit history (1)

As discussed up-string, it's not unreasonable to extrapolate some lesser percentage to other
states, where Bernie isn't as well known and loved, depending on how close to Vermont they
are, how similar demographically, etc.

Obviously Bernie won't get 21-25% cross-over GOP votes everywhere, but he WILL get some %,
AND it will be a much greater % than would ever cross-over to vote for Hillary.

[mythology]

44. Except Vermont's electorate doesn't resemble the national electorate

Winning in a small homogeneous state is very different than winning in heterogeneous states with large populations.

You can't make a valid conclusion that anything similar would occur.

[99th_Monkey]

48. That's what I said, so we agree. Vermont is not Texas, et. al.

I never claimed that the 21-25% GOP support could be extrapolated to the entire nation.
I acknowledge that Vermont is something of an anomalous NE rural outlier, however
it's STILL not unreasonable to extrapolate some lesser percentage of GOP
support in other states, depending on their demoragphics, red/blue, etc.

I would love to see a poll of Republicans state-to-state, so check this out .. but if Vermont is
any indication, Bernie would have a MUCH greater cross-over appeal than Clinton, who is
notoriously despised by pretty much all Republicans.

[moobu2]

37. lol

[Hiraeth]

50. Bernie -IS- a Game Changer. I -SO- hope that we are NOT here 25 yrs from now saying: IF ONLY ...

[CoffeeCat]

51. Bernie has attracted large crowds in Iowa Republican strongholds

Last edited Fri Nov 27, 2015, 03:09 PM - Edit history (1)

During the summer, I thought it was incredibly curious that Bernie Sanders was campaigning in NW Iowa. If you're not from Iowa, let me introduce you to this parallel dimension. It's Steve King territory (the crazy congressman whose politics are somewhere to the right of Rush Limbaugh). It's crazy arch-conservative and very religious. My husband drove through there and said that most of the AM radio channels were "religious-talk" channels.

Bernie chose to campaign there and build a coalition, which was curious. However, even more interesting is that he was drawing some crowds. This was in July!

Here is a quote from a NW Iowa newspaper:

"During a three-day swing through Iowa's rural, western reaches, he turned out sizable crowds at every stop. Thursday night in Sioux City, he drew more than 400 people to Morningside College. Friday afternoon in tiny Storm Lake, he packed the Better Times Café. That evening, 2,500 showed up to hear him speak in Council Bluffs at the Mid-America Center, a convention center across the Missouri River from Omaha, Neb."

I think many Republicans like Bernie. I also think he is crazy-like-a-fox smart for galvanizing supporters in this crazy part of our state because of our Iowa caucuses. Looks like he's building a coalition of support across all of Iowa, not just in the Democratic strongholds. When the Iowa caucuses happen, he'll have supporters in those very-red caucuses supporting him (Dems and some Republicans). It's actually a brilliant strategy.

[99th_Monkey]

52. Yep. 'crazy like a fox'

I like that, because it kind of describes Bernie to a tee.

Thank you for taking time to illumine for me how Bernie's is operating on the ground in Iowa,
going into GOP strongholds, etc.. It seems to be a peculiarly unique gift of Bernie's, like going to
Liberty University, and still drawing respectful applause for his 'socialist' ideas. Un-heard-of.

He has this way of galvanizing people at a much deeper level than politics as usual, which is
EXACTLY what is so desperately needed in the WH right now.

Thanks again for your post.