What libertarians see in Bernie Sanders

[NCTraveler]

KEENE, N.H. – While a trial jury deliberated over his disorderly conduct charges, libertarian activist James Cleaveland sat outside the courtroom and pointed to a laptop screen.
“According to this,” Cleaveland said, pointing to an online political survey on his laptop, “I side with Rand Paul and Bernie Sanders.”
“Rand Paul loses me on immigration, looks like, and then Bernie loses me on economics,” said Cleaveland, who also uses the nickname “Robin Hood of Keene” because he walks the streets to feed expired parking meters before enforcers can write a parking ticket.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/story/news/politics/2015/12/26/what-libertarians-see-bernie-sanders/77718684/

[beam me up scottie]

1. "Freeman often records police activity and encourages others to do the same."

At the courthouse, J.P. Freeman said he likes Sanders because of his views on law enforcement.

“I like his view on police accountability and corruption,” Freeman said. “And I catch a lot of heat in the libertarian community for liking him.”

Freeman often records police activity and encourages others to do the same. The day of Cleaveland's jury verdict, he wore a black long-sleeve T-shirt with the message, "Am I free to go?"

Sanders wants to require the use of police body cameras, establish new federal police training standards, increase civilian oversight of police and remove military equipment from police departments that make officers look like “invading armies.”

Sanders also says in his campaign platform that federal justice grants should be “slashed” for local communities that fail to make progress in police reform.

The proposals are wrapped into Sanders’ overall campaign theme of racial justice.

It's obvious why he attracted those particular libertarians.

I wonder why you left that part out?

Weird.

[NCTraveler]

3. How is it weird that I posted the first four of the article?

Please note, it's his economic message he is opposed to. Interesting you left that out.

I post the first four and you cry foul. There really is a conspiracy under every rock.

[beam me up scottie]

4. Sure, sure.

Just wanted to give the readers more information before a new meme was born.

You're welcome!

[NCTraveler]

5. Then why make it personal?

Conspiracy mode is so full throttle right now that one is seen everywhere. Posting the first four of an article now merits an attack from you.

[beam me up scottie]

6. What personal attack?

If you're trying to get my post hidden you'll have to do better than that.

I'm just wondering out loud.

[NCTraveler]

9. I have zero interest getting your post hidden.

The attack is in your accusation that I left something out on purpose. Very strange considering I posted the first four. I don't think your post is hide worthy and wouldn't alert it. Again, you go the direction of conspiracy theory.

On the other hand:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027476219#post20

[beam me up scottie]

11. Where's the accusation?

If you want to trade war stories I could post dozens of results from failed frivolous alerts on my posts, including one because I posted jury results for another post.

The pattern is clear, someone sets up another poster by claiming there has been a personal attack and then they or someone else alerts hoping the jury won't read the preceding posts.

There was no accusation or personal attack, sorry to disappoint.

[NCTraveler]

19. "I wonder why you left that part out?"

[beam me up scottie]

21. That's a question, try again.

[NCTraveler]

26. Strange question considering the answer is such common sense.

Posting the first four is very common. Thanks for elaborating. I now see your confusion that brought about your need to ask. Appreciate it.

[beam me up scottie]

28. So you agree that wasn't a personal attack, glad we cleared that up.

The alerters will have to find more fertile ground. Not to worry, I'm not going anywhere.

[NCTraveler]

31. Not sure what alerted have to do with...

The op or our discussion. The theories are flying around so fast I'm having a difficult time keeping up. Had you planned on going somewhere? Do you have a litany of hidden posts? Not sure what any of these points you keep bringing up have to do with the op or any beneficial conversation.

[beam me up scottie]

32. Maybe you should reread my posts, and yours. It's fairly easy to follow.

If you still don't understand I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Have a nice day now.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. "Then why make it personal."

"Then why make it personal."

Excellent question which I look forward to your interlocutors(s) answering.

[beam me up scottie]

8. First I'd have to accept the premise, which I don't.

Perhaps you can point out the attack you and your fellow interlocutors see in my post?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

10. I merely asked NCTraveler why some folks want to make everything personal.

I lament the lack of civility on our once great board.

[beam me up scottie]

12. Then why not ask me directly instead of trying to discuss my post with someone else?

That doesn't seem very civil.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. I merely posed a question to NC Traveler.

May we please take your response as an indication that you want to join us in a plea for more comity on our once great board ?

[beam me up scottie]

14. I'll believe it when I see it, actions speak louder than words.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

15. I am sure you want to join NCTraveler and I in agreeing we should be exemplars to other posters.

[beam me up scottie]

16. Lol! You mean if we were starting today, right?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. I have always treated posters the way they treated me.

I have always treated posters the way they treated me. My New Year's resolution is to try to treat them better.


I am sure you and NCTraveler would agree with me that is a laudable goal.

[beam me up scottie]

20. I don't do resolutions, and I give as good as I get.

I tend to judge people based on previous experience, the only thing more common on this board than incivility is hypocrisy.

And given a choice, I prefer rude people who are honest to polite hypocrites.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

23. My goal for the new year is to not poison the well from which we all drink.

I want to be a kinder and gentler poster.

[beam me up scottie]

29. That's nice.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

30. Thank you.

It is going to be difficult but if I fall short of my pledge I trust the fellow denizens of this board will remind me.

[The Golden One]

41. Be a Bernie supporter.

You'll get our viewpoints.

That would make you a kinder and gentler poster.

From a dispassionate observer.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

46. I couldn't be a kinder and gentler person in real life if I tried.

IRL they call me Hoss because I am as big and kind as he was.

[NCTraveler]

24. They take issue with me posting the first four.

And you for simply being nice. Really getting tough to post around here. Literally, they pondered as to why I posted the first four.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

27. Yes, you were being diligent, as always.

[cali]

17. Oh please.

[NCTraveler]

22. Yes. What would you like? Nt

[artislife]

39. Notice how none of the voters are thinking of crossing to hillary?

heh.

[The Golden One]

42. More ex-Hillary supporters are crossing over to Bernie's side

Most of them are sick with the DNC and DWS' bullshit.

[NCTraveler]

43. I don't believe that to be fully accurate.

And she clearly has the support of the left.

[artislife]

44. Links to crossover appeal, please. nt

[The Golden One]

47. I guess we will never get the answer

[artislife]

49. And that becomes the answer!

[treestar]

38. Because the rule is to post only four paragraphs at DU.

Anyone can follow the link to read the full piece. Thus your suggestion of nefarious "leaving out" is ridiculous.

[beam me up scottie]

40. Except most don't. So by providing a more complete picture I'm helping the op.

Otherwise this thread would have been a whole other ball game, wouldn't it?

Why people would be going on and on about how libertarians just love them some Bernie.

Boy it's a good thing that didn't happen.

[Scuba]

2. Bernie's not chasing libertarians. He's rousing the sleeping giant.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout_in_the_United_States_presidential_elections

Note: While final exact figures for 2012 are yet to be calculated, the Bipartisan Research Center has stated that turnout for 2012 was 57.5 percent of the eligible voters, which they claim was a decline from 2008. They estimate that as a percent of eligible voters, turn out was: 2000, 54.2%; in 2004 60.4%; 2008 62.3%; and 2012 57.5%.[3] These were the same figures as given by the Center for the Study of the American Electorate.

[ms liberty]

33. This. n/t

[Live and Learn]

45. +1000 nt

[mmonk]

25. Because drowning government in a bath tub and expanding government services are so close

to the same thing.

[Gormy Cuss]

34. LOL.

"Libertarians for Bernie" is an oxymoron.

[Rebkeh]

35. It seems contradictory at first but

then I realize that we all can count on Bernie to protect Liberty. But that doesn't mean he will protect privilege.

Granted I've put about ten minutes of thought into this over my first cup of morning coffee, but that seems to be the contradiction.

[Doctor_J]

36. You left out a few things

Sen. Rand Paul, the Republican presidential candidate who is admired by some libertarians, dismisses Sanders as a socialist in the vein of the Soviet Union.

Some voters will support Sanders for speaking out against a “rigged economy.”

Heaven forbid!

“He’s also said that you don’t need 23 different types of deodorant to choose from,” said Darryl W. Perry, who moved from Texas to New Hampshire for the Free State Project in 2012. “I really like having choice.”

Melanie Johnson, who came to the Keene courthouse about a month after moving to New Hampshire and connecting with the Free State Project, is resolutely opposed to Sanders on economics.

“The stuff he wants to do is both immoral and won’t work,” Johnson said, although she seemed unclear on some of Sanders' positions. “I think it was 90 percent he said he wanted to have the highest tax bracket at," she said.

“Secretary Clinton is too much into regime change and a little bit too aggressive without knowing what the unintended consequences might be,” said Sanders, who argued that the United States should not be expected to intervene in every international crisis.

That position could appeal to some libertarians. Just don’t expect Sanders to tailor his message to the libertarian voting bloc any time soon.

At some point I think Hillary and her supporters will need to start telling the truth. This constant lying will only get you so far.

[Vinca]

48. The "Free Staters" are living a fantasy in their own heads.

They came to NH because we don't have a state income tax or a state sales tax. Sounds great until you go to register your car and find out it costs quadruple what it costs in Vermont next door. You need to pay a fee for a permit to do just about anything and they don't come cheap. New Hampshire has bills to pay like every other state - nothing is free. They just go about collecting the loot in a more subversive way.

[Bluenorthwest]

37. Primary 08 retrospective: List Of Republicans Supporting Obama (and why)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x7518726


When it was Obama, lots of people thought winning those votes might be a wise move. Were they wrong? One Obama super booster on DU told me that 'Obamacans' and the faith community were replacing the LGBT cohort, which was no longer needed by the Party and if we still wanted to be Democrats, we'd have to get used to playing along with hate preachers and Rick Warren and all that, we'd been made redundant by all the Republicans supporting Obama so strongly.
So double standards. They suck.

[ismnotwasm]

50. Sanders should be everything libertarians hate, just about.

THAT particular fatal attraction is the strangest one in politics