History of Feminism
Related: About this forumit is interesting reading the stuebenville threads vs the rape porn threads.
boys and men that really enjoy their rape porn
maybe we will learn not to protect rapists
this has got to stop
all rape porn is consent
cant go after the boys that were viewing the rape
there is such a disconnect in this whole thing
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)violence is lack of consent.
weird interpretation of violence
Blue_Adept
(6,399 posts)We're just asking the question of what people consider violence in sex to be - not everyone sees the world the same. Gathering information and dialogue is good, yes?
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)toward women get them off. and women can get all sorts of fuzzy warm feeling listening to men getting all excited over abusing us. sure.
makes for a very welcoming environment for women
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)conversations to insult women, humiliate them, keep them in their place with their enjoyment of abuse, (rape threats, ect) to feel more like men
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)to constantly tell them what a man is? why is it they need to abuse women and control women to feel like a man?
why is it so hard for men to be men?
lets explore. cause conversation is good, no?
One_Life_To_Give
(6,036 posts)IMO most guys are alot less secure in themselves than they pretend. Craving a validation of themselves and their worth. It sets up an environment that is ripe for some to engage in negative behaviors associated with the unmet need.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"We're just asking the question of what people consider violence in sex to be..."
One need simply look up two words in a contemporary dictionary to find out the answer. "Violence" and "Sex". The logical extrapolation from that (if one is honest with oneself) becomes quite obvious and rather matter of fact...
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)change the definition of violence.
really says where the problem lies.
that we cannot even recognize violence when sexually portrayed against women.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)with the actual definition of violence. violence is not violent UNLESS the person didnt say, do NOT kick my ass, and beat the shit out of me.
wow
no wonder they are clueless and unable to hear in the rape porn threads. this says so much.
let us commence to normalize beating the shit out of the woman. unless she says no of course. but then, women that have been adused. what happens if you say no? i imagine you get the shit beat out of you that much worse.
nothing like normalizing violence toward women cause it is all good and a fuckin turn on.
ya. that violent porn has done nothing to our society or our men. nuthin' at all
Response to seabeyond (Reply #6)
seaglass This message was self-deleted by its author.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)i want the dude..... to answer, why men have such a challenge simply being a man. why a man needs this shit to define who he is as a man.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)When I meant consent, I meant a lot more than just a simple yes/no. Coercion in the porn industry is about a lot more than rape on camera--a lot of it involves exploiting women and men who have no other option than to be in these videos to make ends meet.
If two people in a healthy relationship want to pull out the whips and spankings, more power to them. The porn industry on the other hand is just another aspect of rape culture that keeps both women and men relegated to sex objects for others to enjoy.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)xulamaude
(847 posts)All of this (and no, I haven't seen the thread you refer to... yet) has put a loop of Bill Clinton weaseling around with the definition of "is" during his grand jury testimony back in the day in my head.
Is sex sex? Is oral sex sex? What is sex?
Well, that depends on what the definition of "is" is...
I imagine that one of the best things about being a man is that you can pretty much have everything every which way you want it including arguing the definition of the simplest, historically solid words such as "sex" and "violence" and yes, even "is". ffs.
Heck, while we're at it let's debate the nebulous nature of "yes" and "no"!
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)study in the 80s of college girls. like 39% said they said no but meant yes, sometime in their YOUNG sexual experience.
the post actually argued, so women do not always mean no.
yes. or no. of course.... we have already been there.
xulamaude
(847 posts)'say no but mean yes' is that in my lifetime (raised feminist in the 70s btw) with all of the women and girls I've know and had conversations with about this... phenomenon... is that not one had ever done that or known another female person who had claimed to do that. Not one.
However many, many women have reported that they didn't feel that they had the option to say no at all - my own mom for example.
So I guess we've come a long way baby that we can at least argue the definitions of yes and no...
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)for the girl. she had better damn well learn how to say yes if she wants sex instead of feeling she gotta say no so she wont be a slut.
do without a couple times and maybe it will be a lesson learned
instead of .... men coerce.
xulamaude
(847 posts)coerce. Yes.
PassingFair
(22,434 posts)They "can't choose their kinks" you know.
BainsBane
(53,032 posts)were leading results when I entered "rape porn" into Google search.
ismnotwasm
(41,976 posts)I wish we could post links to what we're talking about, best way to call bullshit on it.
BainsBane
(53,032 posts)If you're going to google egregious stuff, you're going to find egregious stuff. I pointed out that was the subject of these threads, rape porn. I seriously doubt there is any rape porn that isn't horrific. The word rape should clue people in to that.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)on their rape too.
further. if we talked about the pain and humiliation of that rape, who is to say they are not jacking off as they read.
that is the point these men do not get.
they have set up a lot of women on du to feel disgust toward them
now, do they really expect women who are raped not to now look at these men and saying.... creep. are you getting off when i talk about my experience?
how are we expected NOT to feel that way
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Been away for the week where my sister's husband has DU blocked on their computer. Nice to see the same old bullshit is still alive and well on DU. :sarcam:
MadrasT
(7,237 posts)It is not an interesting topic of conversation to me, and a lot of these threads seem to be designed to foster intimidation and bullying in the name of sek-shoo-ul FREEEEEEEEEEEdumb!!1!!11!
I get this weird vibe that some "liberals" here are adopting the repukes strategy of CONTINUALLY KEEPING RAPE IN OUR FACES so women don't ever forget that WE MIGHT GET RAPED if we get out of line.
Fuck that noise.
This all-rape-all-the-time version of DU is getting tedious... and I am not intimidated in the least.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)rape and violence. literally.
we have been approaching this all wrong. we were actually using the known defined word. what we need to do is make up the definition when discussing rape and violence. but ONLY when it is sexual
Niceguy1
(2,467 posts)and there won't be agreement.
but in the end it comes down to consent. If the person to give legal consent then there choices should be respected.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Doesn't work that way bro.
Bottom line
nomorenomore08
(13,324 posts)Doesn't mean that what's going on is okay on a larger ethical or societal level.
*Edit: corrected spelling.
Niceguy1
(2,467 posts)Legal to exclude child porn.....if a woman and a man freely give consent to perform an act then it should be respected. End of story. Do we want to be like the rebulicans and tell people what they should amd shouldn't do in the bedroom?
nomorenomore08
(13,324 posts)for mass consumption. Secondly, I didn't say anything about stuff being illegal - in fact, I explicitly said otherwise. But when images of simulated sexual violence that, in many cases, are indistinguishable from the real thing, proliferate the way they have on many websites, one certainly has the right (if not the duty) to be unnerved by it.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)to "respect" something. if someone wants to do something, that is their choice. i get the choice of "respecting" or not. but that is really not the point.
there is so much that is coerced, so much that is rape, so much that is women and children held captive and forced. you and your continually ignore that part of it to wrap it up pretty. and NO, i really do not "respect" that. but, that is not really what this post is about. you totally missed it.
steubenville and rape porn fantasy... the connection to. where do you think these criminals learned this behavior. that would be the parallel. how the boys with the video, getting off on a RAPE, got it dude, a fuckin RAPE, cannot/should not be prosecuted with a criminal act in their possession.
how cavalier you ignore the real painful, criminal behavior to DEMAND people fuckin RESPECT men getting off on rape.
like i said. you want to wrap this up all pretty and plant a bow on it. you choose to ignore the stinky shit. that is YOUR bad. how about you RESPECT the victims. what a thought
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)" it should be respected..."
With both precision and relevance, why exactly should I choose to respect that for which I may already have little to no respect?
Is not respect something to be earned and then engendered? If so, how precisely is my respect being earned, and what is the mechanism used to earn it?
"Do we want to be like the rebulicans (sic) and tell people what they should amd shouldn't do in the bedroom?"
Haven't seen anything to that effect (however, I do understand the need to place a premise in the mouths of others from which to argue an irrelevant point); you will of course, point out to your audience a specific post which states that two consenting adults should be denied the freedom to enjoy the other, yes?
JI7
(89,248 posts)JI7
(89,248 posts)because i don't know any women here who likes or defends that crap.