"Something has changed"

[MelissaB]

This was said by a moderator in a thread discussing the changes at Kos and reasons for locking threads here.

I'm hoping somebody here will let us know exactly what has changed since they apparently have and how it will affect Bernie supporters and people in this group.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511417114#post121

[Kittycat]

1. Word from the mothership?

How to encourage Bernie supporters to not fall in line 101. Censor them.

[Merryland]

2. jackpine radicals is an interesting site

[Autumn Colors]

3. The change is coming

Possibly the last of the primaries and caucuses in states that favor Hillary are coming up in the next week. Predictions are that after March 15th, the primaries and caucuses that remain are going to be favorable to Bernie.

That's probably why the Kos policy is changing on March 15th.

They want to say that Hillary has a lock on the nomination and shut down all campaigning for Bernie after that on Kos.

Don't let that happen here!!!

[cantbeserious]

6. Daily Kos Is A HRC Shop

eom

[Autumn Colors]

9. So is DU (nt)

[MelissaB]

10. Shhh! Not everybody knows the connection.

I don't understand why it's a big secret and why it isn't discussed openly here.

[greiner3]

11. One thread a few weeks ago, I did not bookmark, the same topic was raised;

The OP wrote that Skinner and wife had direct connections to the Hillaries and supported the complete lack of discussions within the Hillary group and was silent when called out in condemning the group's moderator for automatically banning those who tried to post even civil posts within this same group.

I believe the name of this site needs to be changed to something that does not include the word democratic.

[tex-wyo-dem]

32. Or underground for that matter...nt

[Paulie]

18. I know

^R^E^A^L^L^Y
^O^D^D

[MelissaB]

19. I've been here officially since 2004 (lurked a long time) and didn't know until recently.

I'll bet 95% of DUer's have no idea.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

14. Sorry to say, but you're right.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[Trajan]

29. In all fairness ..

Kos did provide a caveat that, if Bernie increases his viability during the time prior to the fifteenth, that the changeover will NOT occur ..

That being said. Bernie's calendar will begin improving most just after the fifteenth ... So it's a bit of a moot point ...

I thought Kos was always in the bag for Hillary, so I'm not seeing the loss so much ... I'll get my news elsewhere ...

[Ivan Kaputski]

4. That host has gone off the chain. No wonder he wasn't accepted as a host here.

[Depaysement]

5. Maybe the Politburo has spoken

Though I don't see a crackdown by this site's owners. The moderators? Well . . . But Skinner has been pretty fair. Sid Dithers on the other hand . . .

[StandingInLeftField]

22. Ol' Sid's been on ignore...

for over three years. Can't say I miss him.

[malletgirl02]

31. Sid Dithers is a moderator?

He should not be one he is completely dismissive of Sander supporters.

[Downwinder]

7. Didn't you get your $70K?

[MelissaB]

8. No, I'm missing out on the $$.

Somebody please pass some my way.

[SoapBox]

12. Repeating... JackPineRadicals.org

Keep the site handy, in the event of a bloody purge.

[MelissaB]

13. Will do! Thanks!

[Autumn Colors]

15. Recently signed up over there

Thanks.

[PFunk1]

16. bookedmarked and already signed up

And ready to move over when/if the purge happens. And this site becomes DU only in name if it does.

[starroute]

17. Even if there's no purge, this site will be increasingly mainstream

And JPR is readying itself to be a carrier of the Bernie Sanders revolution that's coming whether he wins or loses.

[senz]

20. To do that, JPR needs to a MAJOR P.R. campaign for Democratic voters.

My heart's with the JPR people, including banned DUers whom I've missed very much.

However, DU has a tremendous advantage in history, reputation, and familiarity.

I also think the software here is superior.

The whole point is to get eyeballs, first and foremost, and then interaction.

[TM99]

23. Well, given that JPR started in

mid December and it is only the beginning of March AND DU has been around since what? 1999?

I think JPR is doing just fine.

Thanks for your concern.

[senz]

24. Don't do that to me.

I'm not a "concern troll." I'm an old woman who wants very much for Bernie Sanders to win the presidency so that by the time I die, I'll know this country and the world (which I love) are headed in a humane, viable direction. It matters to me that future genertions will have an America as good as the one I grew up in. I've been an admirer of Bernie's for almost 10 years, thanks to the Thom Hartmann show. I've been arguing and fighting the rhetorical battle here and elsewhere for Bernie. The Hill folk hate me, and, to quote my avatar, I welcome their hatred. I've been donating a huge sum of money to the Bernie campaign for months, to the point that I'm having to get rid of other monthly payments/services to keep affording it and I've almost reached the legal contribution limit for an individual.

And I thought, TM99, that you and I were on good terms and on the same side.

I strongly believe (nay, know) that the outcome depends on getting the message out. Right now DU seems to be a fairly central meeting place for Democrats. If it weren't, the Hill folk wouldn't be trying so hard to get rid of us. I do not see enough time to make JPR into what DU is now, vis a vis Democratic voters, before the primaries. Before you say, "Well we don't want Democrats, we want progressives," let me remind you that DEMOCRATS (and Independents who register so that they can vote for Bernie), are going to decide this nomination.

I go over to JPR once in awhile to say things I can't say here, but I'll be damned if I'm going to willingly abandon DU as a megaphone for my views for the luxury of being more comfortably ensconced with fellow Bernie supporters this close to the primaries. Comfort be damned! We're trying to get the ONLY candidate who represents the people ELECTED. I'll gladly suffer the shit here if I can use this place to reach fellow Democrats who read here, including commentators like Thom Hartmann who quote our posts on the air.

It would make me sick to see our best voices retreat into relative obscurity before the primaries are over. My loyalty is to Bernie, and the first order of the day is get him the nomination.

The point, right now, is not website loyalty. How silly. How peripheral. How "can't see the forest for the trees."

First we get Bernie elected, then we proceed with the revolution.

If we don't get Bernie elected, we still proceed with revolution, and I'll be over at JPR or any other site dedicated to making America work for the common person again.

So do not treat me like that, TM99.

[TM99]

27. I am sorry Senz.

You seem to be disparaging a new site shortly after our launch. Was it necessary? No, I don't think so.

Things are changing this election season. Sites like DU and DKos are not denying how strongly they are behind the establishment candidate. DU is already quietly purging Sanders supporters. Others were not so quietly banned for reasons that others have not been.

No one is asking you personally to abandon DU. We are adding writers daily to the site. Most of us, unless banned or who have willingly left, still post at multiple sites.

JPR will exist as an alternative for both DKOS & DU Sanders supporters and undecided if both decide that the primary is 'over' on March 15th. That is seven months from the election, almost five months out from the convention, and there will be many large delegate states still outstanding. If that happens, then those voices you are prematurely defending will be silenced anyway. Having an alternative is important. But dissing that alternative isn't necessary is it?

I agree with you strongly on getting Sanders elected. I also disagree with you even more strongly that we can't proceed with the revolution until we do.

The revolution is happening across social media and sites like JPR. It is happening with every march and rally for Sanders even when he is not present. It is happening with an ever growing list of traditional progressives running for office this year challenging the establishment New Dems. This revolution is not about him. It is about us.

So I simply ask that you do not treat us like that either? Peace?

[senz]

34. You seem to have misunderstood what I wrote.

1) I did not "disparage" JPR. Why would I do that? Nearly all of my favorite online people are members there, as am I. I joined back in December. I like everything I see there but am not wild about the software, which I find cumbersome and difficult to navigate. (Mind you, I'm old and a late adapter.)

I said that, to compete with DU for Democratic voter attention prior to the election, JPR would need to launch a massive public relations campaign to make sure people are even aware they exist. I don't see how that could happen prior to the end of the Democratic primaries. Therefore, I think people should try to be effective on this platform as long as we possibly can, at least prior to the primaries.

I am aware that Hill fans want to either silence us or get rid of us so they can fool Democratic voters into thinking we're all united behind the corporate DINO ( ). If they do get rid of us prior to the election, then it would behoove our cause to figure out a way to direct Democratic voters to JPR. Somehow. Same situation with Daily Kos.

2) I did not say that Bernie's candidacy is in direct conflict with the political revolution. I said that our immediate effort should be aimed at getting Bernie elected. I also said that we will proceed with the revolution whether or not he gets elected, as I'm sure Bernie himself would agree.

One last thing, very important to me: your comment sets me up as someone opposed to JPR. In case you can't figure it out, this is a highly damaging thing to do to me. It feels, to me, like an attempt to gain points with JPR at my expense. I hope my friends at JPR do not fall for it.

[TM99]

36. Your choice of words then were not ideal.

You are more clear now which I do appreciate.

I would not set you up as someone who is opposed to JPR. I merely responded to the words you chose to first use. As you have clarified them, we do not seem to be in disagreement unless you wish to carry on as such.

You are making a very gross assumption about me as I am also a moderator at JPR. I want only the best for the site and its members. I don't play childish games of 'setting people up' or 'gaining points'. Period.

[bvar22]

33. The Movement WILL continue with or without Bernie.

The Movement is about US, not Bernie. He is an excellent megaphone FOR The Movement, and has my vote and support, but if he doesn't win the nom,
I will still keep fighting for Equal Protections, Equal Opportunity, and Equal Access For Everyone, no exceptions!

[senz]

21. Just recently, DU has been letting people say they won't vote Clinton.

And I've wondered why.

They were probably collecting names and comment URLs to get a whole bunch of good Bernie supporters kicked off.

[blackspade]

25. I won't be surprised.

[Hydra]

26. They said they have a list

Honestly, I don't think they care about who's voting for who. What they are really demanding is message control- Pro-Hill, non-stop, no exceptions or you are banned.

I'm expecting to get the axe just for calling them Team Hill. Seems to hit a nerve on them.

[agracie]

28. Come on over to jackpineradicals.org - So reasonable, so intelligent, so self-monitoring...

Come visit us. You'll be amazed how pleasant and welcoming a site can be. It's what Bernie would want you to do.

[flaval]

30. They have started a group for Bernie on Reddit .

Here is a link to that group if you are interested. https://www.reddit.com/r/Kossacks_for_Sanders/

[Babel_17]

35. It's a tough row to hoe when you're trying to fence in the majority

They failed.