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Baobab

(4,667 posts)
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 06:42 PM Mar 2016

Hilllary Clinton has a long track record of taking payoffs from Indian firms that exploit the US

visa process to replace US workers who are doing their jobs well with others who are paid far less and it appears the reason this is done is just that. Clinton-signed trade deals have the potential to vastly increase the number of guest workers here and this if it happens would be damage which could have been prevented back in 1995, if they had simply been more honest with the country and allowed a debate to happen, then.

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the following is excerpted from a thread here in 2008

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4836695

The Clintons have reaped significant financial rewards from their relationship with the Indian community, both in their personal finances and Hillary’s campaign fundraising. Hillary Clinton, who is the co-chair of the Senate India Caucus, has drawn criticism from anti-offshoring groups for her vocal support of Indian business and unwillingness to protect American jobs. Bill Clinton has invested tens of thousands of dollars in an Indian bill payment company, while Hillary Clinton has taken tens of thousands from companies that outsource jobs to India. Workers who have been laid off in upstate New York might not think that her recent joke that she could be elected to the Senate seat in Punjab is that funny.

PERSONAL HOLDINGS
2006: Bill Clinton Invested Tens of Thousands In An Indian Bill Payment Company. According to Hillary Clinton’s personal financial disclosure form, as part his ownership of WJC Investments, LP LLC, Bill Clinton held between $15,001 and $50,000 worth of stock in Easy Bill Limited, an Indian company. According to the company’s website, “Functioning as a one-stop bill payment shop, Easy Bill facilitates payment of utility bills as well as recharging of pre-paid mobile connections at a place the consumer is already familiar and comfortable with the neighbourhood store.” In addition to providing terminals throughout India where customers may pay their bills, the company also maintains a call center described as “a dedicated response centre for efficient customer service.”
Hillary Clinton 2006 Financial Disclosure Report, http://www.easybillindia.com /

2006: Bill Clinton Collected $300,000 From Cisco In 2006. Hillary’s personal financial disclosure forms indicate that Bill Clinton gave two speeches to Cisco Systems, each for $150,000 on 5/18/06 and 8/17/06.
(Hillary Clinton 2006 Financial Disclosure Report; 3,4)

CAMPAIGN FUNDRAISING

Hillary Clinton Accepted Almost $60,000 In Contributions From Employees Of Cisco Systems, Which Laid Off American Workers to Hire Indian “Techies.”
Clinton’s Presidential Exploratory Committee took $39,450 from Cisco employees during the first quarter of 2007. Cisco employees have also donated $18,900 to Clinton’s Senate committee between 1999 and 2006. Forbes reported, in a feature called “A Tale of Two Cities” that Cisco was laying off $60,000-a-year “techies,” while hiring new employees in Bangalore, India. “Cisco used only a few Infosys workers in Bangalore six years ago (in 1998); (by 2004, it used) almost 300 contract staff, plus 550 full-fledged employees in its own Bangalore office.” In 2006, Newsweek reported that “for Cisco, India is the new frontier, where it’s investing $1.2 billion to build a gleaming R&D campus that will employ 3,000 people.”
(FEC filings; Forbes, 4/12/04; Newsweek, 3/6/06)

Clinton Donor, Sant Singh Chatwal, Cited Clinton’s India Caucus Work Vowed To Raise $5 Million.
In March 2007, the Economic Times wrote, “(Clinton) has roped in New York-based hotelier Sant Chatwal as co-chair of her recently formed presidential exploratory committee to run for the 2008 White House race. (…) He is also creating an organization called Indian Americans for Hillary 2008.”

In April 2007, Mangalorean reported that Indian Americans for Hillary 2008 (IAFH) had already raised $1 million and “aimed to raise at least five million dollars.”
A major fund raiser on June 24 hosted by Chatwal, the founder of IAFH; steel baron, Lakshmi Mittal, and businessman SP Hindujas, was expected to pull more than 1,000 guests. In June 2007, The New York Times reported that “two Indo-American receptions have a total of $450,000 in commitments.”

Chatwal Owed The City Of New York More Than $2 Million In Back Taxes, Fled Prosecution For Fraud But Was Arrested During Visit to India With Bill Clinton.
Sant Singh Chatwal, who raised more $200,000 for Sen. Clinton in 2000, owed New York City $2.4 million in back property taxes. In addition, during a visit to India with Bill Clinton, in May 2001, Chatwal was arrested by authorities there and charged with defrauding the New York City branch of the Bank of India out of $9 million he borrowed in 1994. He posted bail, then fled India, boarding a flight to Vienna despite an attempt by authorities to detain him. .
(New York Daily News, 11/24/02; New York Daily News, 11/7/00)

FDIC Charged Chatwal With Obtaining Improper Loans.
In a separate 1996 case, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. charged Chatwal with obtaining improper loans from the First New York Bank for Business, causing the bank to lose more than $25 million. Chatwal, who was a director of the bank, arranged more than $14 million in loans to himself and his businesses, often with no collateral, said the FDIC. He didn't repay the loans and the bank failed.
(New York Daily News, 11/24/02; New York Daily News, 11/7/00)

Clinton Co-Founded The Senate India Caucus, A Project Of The U.S. India Political Action Committee.
In 2004, Clinton co-founded and became the co-chair of the Senate India Caucus which was coordinated by the U.S. India Political Action Committee (USINPAC). Roll Call reported, “The goals of the caucus, which already has 31 members, include increasing trade with India and improving security against global terrorism.” Sen. Clinton said, “It is imperative that the Unites States do everything possible to reach out to India. This Caucus is dedicated to expanding areas of agreement with India and engaging in a candid dialogue of differences.” (Roll Call, 4/28/04; PR Newswire, 4/29/04)

2005: Anti-Offshoring Advocacy Group Gave Sen. Clinton A “Weasel Award,” Citing Pro-Outsourcing Comments Clinton Made In India.
The Press Trust of India wrote, “An American anti-offshoring advocacy group has awarded its first ‘Weasel Award of 2005’ to Democrat Senator Hillary Clinton for her recent remarks supporting outsourcing. The Delaware-based IT Professionals Association of America (ITPAA) representing over 1,200 IT professionals nationwide, said on its Web site that it presented this award to business and political leaders that it believes ‘betray the trust of the American people.’

Scott Kirwin, founder of the organization claimed that people were ‘tired of Democrats pretending they care about the problems facing average Americans. Senator Clinton’s actions prove they clearly do not.’ The ITPAA based its award on press reports of Hilary Clinton supporting outsourcing and assuring political and business leaders in India that the US would not attempt to save the jobs lost. ‘

"Outsourcing will continue. There is no way to legislate against reality. We are not in favor of putting up fences."
Hillary had said on Feb 28 in India, according to a report by the Asia Times. Kirwin also cited her position as co-chair of the ‘Friends of India Caucus’ in the Senate, a group of senators that supports issues important to India, including outsourcing and H-1B and L-1 visas, as another reason behind the ITPAA's decision to give the award to the prospective Democrat presidential nominee.”
(Press Trust Of India, 3/5/05; Link To Weasel Award)

2/05: On India Trip, Clinton Allayed India’s Fears That Outsourcing Would End.
The India Review wrote, “Senator Clinton allayed apprehensions in India that there would be a bar on outsourcing. ‘There is no way to legislate against reality. Outsourcing will continue,” she said. (India Review, 4/05, accessed, 6/7/07)

Sen. Clinton (D-Punjab) Joked That She Was Senator From The Punjab Region In India.
“At the fundraiser hosted by Dr Rajwant Singh at his Potomac, Maryland, home, and which raised nearly $50,000 for her re-election campaign, Clinton began by joking that, ‘'I can certainly run for the Senate seat in Punjab and win easily,’ after being introduced by Singh as the Senator not only from New York but also Punjab.”
(India Abroad, 3/17/06)

Clinton Says “Outsourcing Does Work Both Ways.”
Crain’s New York Business wrote, “Mrs. Clinton may be motivated by a desire to uphold the free trade legacy of the Clinton years. (…) In an appearance on CNN’s Lou Dobbs Tonight, she boasted about attracting 10 jobs to New York from India-based Tata Consulting. When Mr. Dobbs inquired if she had understood the degree to which Tata, which helps U.S. companies outsource, was stealing American jobs, Mrs. Clinton rejoined: ‘They’ve actually brought jobs to Buffalo. Outsourcing does work both ways.’” (Crain’s New York Business, 6/21/04; CNN, 3/3/04)

In An Interview With Lou Dobbs, Senator Clinton Defended Her Support Of Tata Consulting, A Company That Brought Ten Jobs To Native Buffalo Residents But Destroyed Thousands Of Jobs Over The Years.
Lou Dobbs asked Clinton, “Senator, a number of people pointed out to us, e-mailing us and calling us, saying, ask the senator about her helping Tata Consulting, a well-known outsourcer, open jobs --and office in Buffalo, New York. I’m asking you, did you really understand the degree to which they were involved in outsourcing jobs when you were there?” Clinton replied, “Well, of course I know that they outsource jobs, that they’ve actually brought jobs to Buffalo. They’ve created 10 jobs in Buffalo and have told me and the Buffalo community that they intend to be a source of new jobs in the area, because, you know, outsourcing does work both ways.” (CNN, 3/3/04)

Tata Consultancy Services (TCS) Is Famous For Pioneering The Business Practice Of Off-shoring.
The San Jose Mercury News wrote, “TCS, however, will go down in the annals of offshoring as the original high-tech body shop. Starting in the early 1990s, TCS blanketed the American landscape with legions of itinerant software programmers from India. (…) Tata pioneered an industry that eventually evolved into the dynamo of offshoring, or sending work to cheap labor markets overseas. (…) Tata’s methods have not been popular among U.S. technology workers, however, who complain guest workers suppress local wages and offshoring takes good jobs overseas.”
(San Jose Mercury News, 12/6/04)

Tata’s Buffalo, N.Y. Training Center Caters To The Needs Of The Company’s 8,000 Employees In The United States, 80 Percent Of Whom Are Workers From India.
India Abroad wrote, “At the Chrysalis Center TCS will host new employees in month-long training sessions to make them aware of the company’s history and culture and to hone their core IT skills that will bridge existing knowledge with advanced skills necessary to work on innovative projects for customers.” The center will also cater to the training needs of the more than 8,000 TCS employees across the US, 80 percent of whom are from India, according to Buffalo News.
(India Abroad, 7/30/04; Buffalo News, 7/20/04)

Gupta Said Democrats’ Stand On Outsourcing Was Poll-Year Rhetoric.
The Economic Times wrote, “Vinod ‘Vin’ Gupta (…) also believes that the Democratic Party’s stand on outsourcing is more poll year rhetoric than any serious economic policy statement. ‘We have to compete globally and US has to find the best product and services at the best cost. Tapping global resources will obviously make the US economy stronger,’ says Gupta whose own company InfoUSA outsources both technology support and database work to vendors in India. Gupta, who has helped Hillary Clinton and Al Gore in fund-raising efforts for their campaigns, is now involved in fund raising efforts for Senator Kerry.”
(The Economic Times, 3/29/04)

7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Hilllary Clinton has a long track record of taking payoffs from Indian firms that exploit the US (Original Post) Baobab Mar 2016 OP
Hillary is a one percenter and does the work of one percenters... Human101948 Mar 2016 #1
She said could run for Senator from Punjab at a DC fundraiser and I agree. appalachiablue Mar 2016 #2
I'd prefer a president that represents America TheFarseer Mar 2016 #3
But they would if wages fell a lot here. Baobab Apr 2016 #6
You only confuse Hillary supporters when you use facts and reason in making a point. Impedimentus Mar 2016 #4
I saw this happen at my old company, WorldSpan LongTomH Apr 2016 #5
Explanation of how they justify it Baobab Apr 2016 #7
 

Human101948

(3,457 posts)
1. Hillary is a one percenter and does the work of one percenters...
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 06:48 PM
Mar 2016

The rest of us are there to serve her and the other one percenters.

TheFarseer

(9,317 posts)
3. I'd prefer a president that represents America
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 07:04 PM
Mar 2016

Over one who represents India, China, Saudi Arabia etc. Outsourcing brings jobs to the US?! If you consider the 8 people back in America to consult with the 2,000 people now working in india new jobs. I have not heard of Indian call centers shutting down and moving to Ohio!

Baobab

(4,667 posts)
6. But they would if wages fell a lot here.
Fri Apr 1, 2016, 03:31 PM
Apr 2016

Have you read about India's pending consultation on quotas?

> I have not heard of Indian call centers shutting down and moving to Ohio!

Also, the 'cross border data flows" are in TiSA, so running a company from the US and having all of its staff somewhere else with lower wages working at night is a reality which we will soon see a lot of.

Thats a more traditional kind of services liberalisation than Mode Four - movement of natural persons.

its claimed to be more efficient - maximizing the value in the supply chains. businesses are more profitable if their wages are lower. It could keep the US from having to change its health care system - Mode Four opens up the gatEs to restored profitability.

Impedimentus

(898 posts)
4. You only confuse Hillary supporters when you use facts and reason in making a point.
Thu Mar 31, 2016, 07:40 PM
Mar 2016

The most rabid ones are totally immune to facts and reason. Facts only trigger anger, frustration and irrational lashing out.

FEEL THE BERN - 2016

LongTomH

(8,636 posts)
5. I saw this happen at my old company, WorldSpan
Fri Apr 1, 2016, 03:13 PM
Apr 2016

I saw the company downsized in the early '00s while our Indian-born CEO, Rakesh Gangwal, got the company ready for an IPO. In the process, he reduced headcount, froze pension plans for 'grandfathered' employees (He replaced pensions with 401K's for non-grandfathered.) and made employees take a 5% pay cut - the market rewards ruthlessness. Meanwhile Rakki and his friends were making out like bandits with huge salary increases and bonuses.

When I was laid off in 2005, most of our people were still American. When I was allowed to come back for a year, as a contractor, in 2008, most of the young people were Indian.

By the way, Rakesh Gangwal was a big supporter of Hillary in her 2008 campaign.

Baobab

(4,667 posts)
7. Explanation of how they justify it
Fri Apr 1, 2016, 03:41 PM
Apr 2016

For a deeper understanding of how migration could equalize the price of labour in two trading
countries, consider figure one (from Senior Nello, 2005:145): There are two countries, Home
and Foreign. The total quantity of labour in the two countries is shown by the distance OhOf.
Before a fully free migration is allowed the distribution of labor is OhL in Home and OfL in
Foreign. The marginal product of labour is higher in Home than in foreign because the
capital/labor ratio is higher in Home. This is shown in the figure by the higher position of the
MPLh curve compared to the MPLf curve. Because of this the wage is higher in Home, at Wh
compared with the wage in Foreign at Wf. In short: Home symbolizes a developed country with
high automatization and high wages and Foreign a less developed country with abundant supply
of labour, low automatization and low wages. If migration is fully free between the two
countries and the workers are identical workers will migrate from Foreign to Home in pursuit of
higher wages. The migration will finally result in an equalized capital/labor ratio in the two
countries and thus equal marginal products of labor and equal wages, illustrated in the figure by
the wage level W' which could be seen as the world market price of labor as the world only
consists of the two countries Home and Foreign. The migration is illustrated in the figure by the
distance LL' which is the amount of workers that will move from Foreign to Home so that the
new distribution of labour becomes OhL' in Home and L'Of in Foreign.


Wages will thus decrease in Home and increase in Foreign resulting in a loss for the indigenous
workers in Home illustrated in the figure by the area a but a gain for the capital owners of the
areas a+b. In Foreign the workers get an increased income of areas c+d+e while the capital
6owners lose areas d+e. The result in total is a net gain for the two countries by areas b+c which
is a gain resulting from higher efficiency in the use of the total resources of the two countries.

note that the workers have to be employed before they get transfered in the non-immigrant More Four model. So people cannot just move around, they have to be connected to a corporation that moves them. Also, there seems to be an informal limit of around five years for workers and sevenn for management- but that does not seem to be written down.. the main requirement is that it "be temporary".

Wages are unclear. Conditions however would be the same as for the host country, i think. its important not to confuse conditions with wages. Wages may not be subject to regulation. or they may be the highest common denominator wage. So we likely (more likely than not, I think) wont see PhDs working for below minimum wage, or ours might just be eliminated. (if its seen as a trade barrier)

So everything likely would be legal under the host country's laws.

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