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Playinghardball

(11,665 posts)
Sun May 8, 2016, 10:07 PM May 2016

To those of you liberals who don't understand the Bernie or Bust movement (*Bernie Sanders Group*)

Last edited Mon May 9, 2016, 12:27 AM - Edit history (1)

submitted 8 days ago by Guys_listenx2


To those of you liberals who don't understand the Bernie or Bust movement, allow me to explain it in a way that may be clearer and more detailed than what you are used to hearing.

What you are seeing is a group of people who hit their breaking point -- and some day, you will hit yours too. It may be a month from now, it may be eight years from now. The injustices that have been allowed to thrive in our country have resulted in the death and suffering of millions of people. We have a climate crisis, we have lead in our water, we have massive income and wealth inequality, and we have millions of people in prison for petty "crimes" who are being used as slave laborers. These are just a small fraction of the injustices which permeate through every aspect of our government.

The people of this movement have come to the realization that our current system is broken beyond repair and the time for incremental change is over. This is worth repeating. The system under no circumstances can be fixed with establishment politics; it can only be fixed by a progressive political revolution that sends a message loud and clear that we the people are setting a new standard for our elected representatives.

Bernie Sanders understands the urgency to navigate our way out the whirlpool of injustice and impending disasters that inevitably await us and he has a voting record that proves he has the wisdom required to make the right decisions for the country.

When he saw the candidates running for the democratic nominee, he hit his breaking point. Despite never having any aspirations to be president, he knew he had a moral obligation to run. He knows that a Clinton presidency will only prolong the stagnation of our broken system. He knows if she becomes president, in four to eight years from now, our elected representatives will still be reduced to nothing more than a glorified telemarketer begging for money.

He knows we can not afford to compromise on taking aggressive action to address climate change or other necessary regulations that are needed to prevent the death or suffering of millions or even billions of people.

He knows we don't have time for incremental change, especially when that incremental change is going to be led by a centrist candidate with a history of voting blunders that resulted in a diminished middle class and an unstable middle east -- by a candidate who has amassed her personal wealth from the same special interests who fund her campaign -- and by candidate who is basically campaigning on fixing the damage from the legislation she voted for in the first place -- the same legislations that Bernie Sanders passionately spoke out against to anybody who would listen.

For these reasons, Bernie Sanders stepped up and took on the establishment. Progressives finally had a candidate who was something so much more than the stereotypical politician. Sanders has proven beyond reasonable doubt that he has by far the best judgment and the strongest principles of any candidate to run for office in a very long time.

He built up an unprecedented grassroots moment with a very popular platform among democrats and independents. The progressive movement finally had a leader with a vision and a strategy to wrestle our government back from the wealthy few. He inspired millions of people who have long been disengaged from politics to start caring and participating in the system -- which is exactly what needs to happen for progressives to take control of the house and senate and end the gridlock we see today.

I'm well aware of most of the scandals Hillary Clinton has been involved in -- both the real ones and the fake ones -- but out of all of the unethical things she has done, I think the worst was her intentional sabotage of the progressive revolution.
For years, democrats and liberals have blamed republicans for the problems that plague our country. MSNBC regularly issued scathing reports about republican corruption and obstructionism. Progressives rallied behind the "liberal media" and the democratic party (some reluctantly) who were doing what little they could do given the republican opposition.
Democrats have always defended raising money from special interests because it was a necessity. They had to do it because the republicans were doing it. But, Bernie Sanders proved that his platform combined with his refreshing honesty and consistency was so popular that he could raise massive amounts money without relying on any special interests.
This is something Hillary Clinton could not do if her life depended on it. This is not a phenomenon that can be manufactured by anyone with money and power. This is a phenomenon that can only be created by a candidate with an impeccable track record marked by a commitment to altruism and reason.

Hillary should have dropped out early and supported him. The democratic party would have had an incredibly strong candidate with a scandal-free past. The vast majority of her supporters would have accepted him with open arms and been just as passionate about him as his current supporters are. He would be virtually guaranteed to win in a landslide victory against any candidate the republicans could put forward.

But, Hillary Clinton had different plans. She wanted more than anything to be president -- and in the course of this campaign, she has revealed the truth about the democratic party and the "liberal media."
When Bernie Sanders' generated a massive amount of momentum for the progressive revolution and the progressive principles that the democratic party and liberal media claim to want, he and his movement were not accepted by the media nor the democratic party. Instead, he was seen as a threat and the democratic party and the Clinton campaign sought to extinguish his momentum.
They could have embraced Bernie's revolution and doubled its support. They would have been able to launch a fierce campaign uniting enough people to win majorities in every branch of government.
But instead, they sabotaged his campaign through the use of propaganda. Sometimes the propaganda was blatant, sometimes is was subtle, but there is no doubt it was there and there is no doubt it was effective.
Bernie was painted as a pie in the sky idealist with no chance of winning and no concept of reality. But this is not the case and it is not what the Clinton campaign and the media believe. They knew that Bernie Sanders could win and the progressive revolution could build support. That is why the DNC had to hide Clinton and schedule debates at times when people wouldn't see them. If Bernie couldn't win, then the DNC and the media wouldn't have to resort to protecting Hillary and vilifying Sanders.
The republicans are extreme and their policy is worse than Clinton's center-right policy agenda. But at least the republicans don't pretend to be on our side. The Clintons and the liberal media are not stupid. They know what they did and Sanders supporters know what they did -- and it was nothing short of a betrayal.

So if Clinton wins the nomination, don't be confused when millions of Sanders supporters stay home or vote for Trump. Betrayal is personal and millions of people are more angry and discouraged than many people realize.

https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/4h6eb0/to_those_of_you_liberals_who_dont_understand_the/?
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To those of you liberals who don't understand the Bernie or Bust movement (*Bernie Sanders Group*) (Original Post) Playinghardball May 2016 OP
Don't stay home and don't vote for Trump. VOTE for the candidate you want. ReasonableToo May 2016 #1
Yep. No lesser of two evils...that's still evil. HooptieWagon May 2016 #2
If you vote the lesser of two evils you might as well vote Cthulhu 2016 Dragonfli May 2016 #11
Cthulhu campaign strikes back at Clinton's LongTomH May 2016 #19
I side with Bernie Sanders and Dr. Jill Stein. Silver_Witch May 2016 #4
those were my top two hits ReasonableToo May 2016 #7
Those political quizzes are nonsense. Maedhros May 2016 #12
Exactly. #WhichHillary does the quiz use? Ino May 2016 #15
i absolutely will not vote for trump tk2kewl May 2016 #17
Neither will I! ReasonableToo May 2016 #18
Thank You For Promoting The Truth cantbeserious May 2016 #3
Should I punish the party? HassleCat May 2016 #5
I am definitely registering as an independent after I vote for Bernie. I'm done. jhart3333 May 2016 #9
Same story here HassleCat May 2016 #10
Haven't been at this as long as you two but I'm also a life long Dem. RichVRichV May 2016 #13
Ditto--- Land of Enchantment May 2016 #21
Bernie or Bust!!!!!! Hillary is the worst outcome Joob May 2016 #6
I am not voting for Trump or staying home. Ilsa May 2016 #8
I won't either - I will vote Green. nt TBF May 2016 #20
From my canvassing, Dems who support Sanders would vote for Clinton as the nominee eridani May 2016 #14
If Trump was president... Ino May 2016 #16
Democracy is too difficult for some. They just want to appoint a president, their choice of course. rhett o rick May 2016 #22

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
11. If you vote the lesser of two evils you might as well vote Cthulhu 2016
Sun May 8, 2016, 11:46 PM
May 2016

Evil cannot be extinguished by evil, only consumed eventually by the greater evil and since Hillary is the lesser evil, she will be consumed and make even greater the great evil that is the immortal Deity!



[font size="5"; color="2E8B57"][center]Cthulhu 2016 [/center][/font]

because no matter which lesser evil you choose (if you choose evil at all) the greater evil will only consume it and run things anyway! Lets cut out the ceremonial middle-man (or woman) and get on with the inevitable destruction and mayhem!

Vote Cthulhu which is the greatest evil if you like evil at all, why not, he will only consume all lesser evils and run things regardless.




[font size="4"; color="8B0000"][center]OR try something different - Vote for the Good Instead![/font][/center]

A very unusual choice these days after all of the "vote lesser evil" training we've received, but as I said, the degree of evil matters little if you choose to vote evil in any form rather than voting for the greater good.

Experience has taught us that the lesser evil is always consumed by the greater and the greatest evil wins every time in the end. Our training is based on a lie! It is time to vote for our best interests rather than against them! It is the only way to avoid the ever greater evil that grows worse with each passing 2 year election cycle, soon, the new corporate gilded age will be complete if we don't stop voting evil, an age that will make Dickensian times look like a time of prosperity for all. The choice resides within each of use, choose well!

LongTomH

(8,636 posts)
19. Cthulhu campaign strikes back at Clinton's
Mon May 9, 2016, 02:58 PM
May 2016
https://cthulhuforamerica.com/cthulhu-strikes-back-clinton-campaign-nobarriers2016/

“The bulk of their budget is dedicated to crushing her primary opponent and his followers. However, we have already been subject to nonsense attacks by her campaign,” explained Eminence Waite, campaign manager for Cthulhu.
Cthulhu for America will “hit back harder and with intelligence” to online and offline attacks. Ms. Waite also described the head of Correct the Record, David Brock, as a “thuggish propagandist.” She was quick to suggest that if he ever wanted to graduate from the kiddie pool the candidate of True Evil would welcome him to the cult with open tentacles.
 

Silver_Witch

(1,820 posts)
4. I side with Bernie Sanders and Dr. Jill Stein.
Sun May 8, 2016, 10:19 PM
May 2016

they say somewhat Clinton - but only based on her proposed stances on things.

 

Maedhros

(10,007 posts)
12. Those political quizzes are nonsense.
Sun May 8, 2016, 11:58 PM
May 2016

They use the very broadest of brushes to paint the candidate's positions, with predictably useless results.

When I took it, I think I got 99% Bernie and 92% Hillary, which is nonsensical. The two candidates are not NEARLY that close together in reality.

And really, how stupid is it to let an automated web quiz tell you how to vote?

Ino

(3,366 posts)
15. Exactly. #WhichHillary does the quiz use?
Mon May 9, 2016, 08:06 AM
May 2016

Have they updated it every time she switches positions? then switches back? Does the quiz take her words at face value, or does it look at her record?

It's just not a reliable measure.

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
5. Should I punish the party?
Sun May 8, 2016, 10:19 PM
May 2016

I think about this a good deal. For 30 years, I have watched the leadership of my party offer up corporatists and tell us we had to support them because they were better than Republicans. I have watched my party and its presidential candidates embrace candidates at the federal and state level who were wrong on all the issues, but willing to put a "D" behind their names. I have watched as "Democrats" undermined the president and watered down his legislation. I am in a mood to punish my party for its misbehavior, and the only way I know how to do that is by denying them my vote. I am considering not voting for president, and voting for Democrats I can support further down the ticket. I'm not there yet, but I'm getting closer every day. I don't know what will push me over the edge, but the edge is getting closer.

jhart3333

(332 posts)
9. I am definitely registering as an independent after I vote for Bernie. I'm done.
Sun May 8, 2016, 10:57 PM
May 2016

All it took was hard work and perseverance on their part. At 63 I'm a lifelong member of the Democratic party except for a short bit with the Greens to get them on the ballot. Maybe I should have stuck with them.

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
10. Same story here
Sun May 8, 2016, 11:06 PM
May 2016

Same age, same history with the party, caucused for Barry Commoner to get him on the Green Party ballot, long time member of Democratic Socialists, but always work for Democratic Party candidates at all levels, contribute money to Democratic candidates, etc. This could be the last dance. The thrill is gone, to quote BB King.

RichVRichV

(885 posts)
13. Haven't been at this as long as you two but I'm also a life long Dem.
Mon May 9, 2016, 12:40 AM
May 2016

After this primary I'm done with the party. I have had it with the compromises and the constant drifting right. It's time to throw all the Incumbents out of office regardless of party affiliation. 2012 was my last lesser evil vote of my lifetime.

Land of Enchantment

(1,217 posts)
21. Ditto---
Mon May 9, 2016, 04:12 PM
May 2016

same age too and have been used to accomplish their ends for the very last time. Welcome to the group.

Joob

(1,065 posts)
6. Bernie or Bust!!!!!! Hillary is the worst outcome
Sun May 8, 2016, 10:22 PM
May 2016

Progressives can unite against a Republican, but if Hillary tries something that a progressive wouldn't agree with, then we'd lose half our fighting power.

eridani

(51,907 posts)
14. From my canvassing, Dems who support Sanders would vote for Clinton as the nominee
Mon May 9, 2016, 05:11 AM
May 2016

But Dems are only 30% of the electorate. The independents and highly alienated voters who support Sanders are a different matter--I see most of them dropping out. I did meet one independent that will vote for Trump if Sanders doesn't get the nomination. Trump is such a loose cannon that he scares the shit out of me.

Ino

(3,366 posts)
16. If Trump was president...
Mon May 9, 2016, 08:17 AM
May 2016

all the Dems and half the Repubs in Congress would oppose him. What power could he really wield?

If Hillary is president, all the Dems and half the Repubs would SUPPORT her. That scares me. There's nothing she couldn't do. Curtail Social Security... who would oppose her? Start a war... they'll go along with it. It would be the Bill Clinton administration all over again, on "muscular" steroids, further destroying the 99%, complete with endless investigations/hearings/impeachments.

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