Biden spars with Warren and Sanders at first event facing rival Democrats

[BlueMTexpat]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/17/biden-warren-sanders-democrats-poor-peoples-campaign-event

From the link:

...
Joy Reid, an MSNBC host who moderated the question and answer sessions, asked Biden how he would get his plans through a resistant Congress, noting that, when he was vice-president, the Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, considered anything that came from the White House “dead on arrival”.

Biden fixed his gaze on the sitting Reid, walked closer and leaned towards her as he replied: “Joy, I know you’re one of the ones who thinks it’s naive to think we have to work together. The fact of the matter is, if we can’t get a consensus, nothing happens except the abuse of power by the executive. Zero.”
...
Warren, who is gaining on Biden in opinion polls, told the forum: “Let’s be clear, if we’re in the majority and Mitch McConnell wants to block us on the kinds of things our country needs and the kinds of things they elected me and other people to enact, then I’m all for getting rid of the filibuster.

“We cannot let him block things the way he did during the Obama administration. I’ve been there when it was one set of rules when President Obama was president and now it’s a different set of rules now that they’ve got Trump in the White House. We can’t do that as Democrats. We have to be willing to get in this fight.”

I also believe that today's GOP no longer gives a sh*t about anything except keeping themselves in office. We simply cannot believe - given the evidence before our own eyes and ears - that they will suddenly begin acting like normal, caring human beings. They passed the point of no return LONG ago. And we need to be willing to call them on it.

NOTHING can be worse than it is now. THEY WILL NOT CHANGE!

I will add that I believe that Michael Bennet also made some excellent points.

[George II]

1. This is like 2016 all over again with Joy Reid. As a MODERATOR, she should not be imposing....

....her political preferences on others. She should be neutral.

[crazytown]

2. And Joy is the one demanding impeachment

knowing the articles have no chance in the Senate.

[Skya Rhen]

3. I used to like Joy but can't stand her, now...

[Kahuna7]

11. Same here. I gave her the benefit of the doubt about her anti-gay bashing.

I never believed she was hacked. I just gave her the benefit of the doubt that she had grown and changed. I can no longer give her the benefit.

[BlueMTexpat]

4. "Imposing" her preferences?

I'm not quite sure what you mean.

Surely she asked a valid question.

Frankly, I was a bit creeped out by the description of the way that Biden answered her question. If anything, you have more right to have issues with the writer of the article, IMO.

[Kahuna7]

9. Joy is off the rails. I'm done with her. She views herself as an advocate..

for the positions she agrees with, vs. an impartial panelist.

[FloridaBlues]

16. Joy has clearly tweeted her dislike of Biden. He's right no candidates plan/ policies will pass with

Sen Turtle in charge. Esp the ultra rich tax hike being put forth by one of the candidates. Who ever the Dem nominee hope they have extra long coat tails reaching Kentucky!!

[thesquanderer]

20. In her position here as moderator, I did not see her "imposing her political preferences",

...by which I mean, if you did not know her feelings from having watched/read her elsewhere, I doubt anyone would find anything she said here problematic.

[Kahuna7]

48. Biden pegged her correctly when he tole her to her face he knew how she felt about

working across the aisle. I'm glad he told her to her face.

[thesquanderer]

49. Yes, but again, he was depending on prior knowledge.

And that's fine.

My point is that I think she did a good and fair job at moderating regardless of her personal preferences. That is, if someone had no prior knowledge, they would consider all her questions reasonable, fair, and properly respectful

[marehare]

25. Joy is overstepping

I totally agree. I also like that Joe Biden said he wants to work with the GOP (like he did when he was in Senate). He has many friends in Senate who respect him (GOP senators) and could get good dialog with them. The biggest impediment to bills getting passed in Senate is McConnell.
Vote him out and we may get some good legislation and House Bills finally passed.
Joy is pushing for impeachment and attacking Democrats for not doing it ASAP. I can see that as of today, there still isn't that much support for impeachment, but more for an inquiry. I also support Speaker Pelosi as she knows more than any of us what's going on and what data they have and still need.
Joy isn't acting as an un involved news person, but is injecting her own personal views and needs.
Rachel is much better at this, by not interjecting her personal views, and rather giving us the facts to make our own minds up.

I'm with Kamala, but I would happily support Biden if he is the candidate. I will support any REAL DEMOCRAT that wins the nom.

[Kahuna7]

47. Joy forgets how she got her job in the first place. She will MHP herself

out of her job is she keeps pushing so hard.

[qazplm135]

51. oh stop

if he can't handle that pretty mild question from Joy Reid then he doesn't need to be elected anything.

stop whining. Your guy is the front-runner, guess what, he's going to be questioned and attacked and vetted and ganged up on.

Just like anyone else who was the front-runner.

And if Sanders or Warren end up in front, they will get exactly the same.

So good grief, either you have confidence your candidate can handle it or you don't.

[Cha]

58. Joy Reid certainly insulted Biden Supporters on May 29, 2019..

Link to tweet

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287135099

[Blue_true]

65. She asked a legitimate question.

How our President will deal with republican obstruction is critical. I am all for just rolling over them once we regain all power, they really didn't give a shit about what we thought about issue between 2015 and 2019. They even blocked even giving a Supreme Court nominee a hearing.

[JaneQPublic]

5. "Biden fixed his gaze on the sitting Reid, walked closer and leaned towards her"

I saw the video of this, and the entire exchange knocked Biden down about 5 pegs in my candidate ranking.

The dude really needs to learn to respect women's personal space, especially when he's literally getting in Joy's face.

Reid was simply doing her job and asking the hard questions; doing so is not personal bias. If Joe can't handle it, then he's no better than Trump.

[George II]

7. If it was a male moderator would you be as equally outraged?

[thesquanderer]

17. At 20:35 in the video you posted, he touches the male moderator.

But these are not the issues I have with his performance at this event.

[George II]

22. I wish I'd bookmarked it, but over the weekend I saw one of the women candidates putting her hand...

....on the shoulder of someone in her audience. My thought was, "what if that was Biden?"

He's a politician, they're ALL politicians, they casually touch people they're talking to. They don't grab them, they don't grope them, they simply "touch" to make a connection with the person they're talking to.

I do it, women I know do it, it's something that happens.

[marylandblue]

41. I saw Biden's clip and did not think it looked good for him.

It's not just the touching it was aggressive posturing towards all the moderators. He was leaning forward, getting in close, pointing and had a harsh tone. I got the sense he was angry at Joy for asking the question.

Maybe he did think the question unfair, but there are more respectful ways to express disagreement.

[Butterflylady]

56. Wow, now no one is allowed to listen intenly or touch anyone

What so ever. Wow.

[marylandblue]

57. He's allowed to do whatever he wants. I didn't think he looked or sounded good. YMMV.

[George II]

59. Only when it's Biden, no one else. Some can have rampant sexual abuse and harassment.....

....in their campaign, to the point that two dozen women have to travel to Washington two years later to address it, and it's forgiven because the candidate was "busy".

[R B Garr]

44. Joy Reid was waving her hands at Biden almost the whole

time she was asking her question. And “fixed his gaze”, what drama. He was listening to her. What else is he supposed be doing. This silly season is getting to be too much. I can hardly stand the lameness anymore.

[Demit]

36. That's the very thing he's incapable of doing, respecting women's personal space.

It's the second time in the last week or so that he's been confronted with a question from a woman, and twice he's been pictured leaning in close, pointing his finger, and remonstrating with her. By now I think it's instinctive with him. He doesn't react well when given a challenging question from a woman. It's a dominance display, getting in close.

Reverend Barber asked a challenging question as well—that's what the event was about, candidates answering questions!—and Biden did not display the same attitude. He felt he could speak man-to-man with the Reverend. In fact, he was quite ingratiating.

[George II]

60. He does the same thing when asked questions by men, too (Reverend Barber included). And please.....

.....let's not get into a discussion about candidates pointing fingers, please!

[Demit]

64. You are alluding to another candidate, I take it?

Let me set you straight in your apparent hunch. If you mean Bernie Sanders, I'm not a fan of his. I have no interest in comparing and contrasting Biden and Sanders.

[still_one]

6. Let's go Joe!!!

[Kahuna7]

13. That's right. She addressed her because she's been advocating

doing what? What exactly would she want a candidate to say?

[List left]

8. How the F*ck can we have bipartisianship when one side refuses?

Obama is a wonderful man but was a shit negotiator.
Until the latter part of his presidency he started negotiation where he thought they would end up. By the time he began to strike harder bargains it was late in the game.

We need someone who will fight for what is right and not cede the ground before negations even start.

I am sure I will be flamed for this but if we do not have an honest assessment and learn from our mistakes we are doomed to repeat them.

[shanny]

14. I agree on all points. Well said.

[earthshine]

55. I, too, agree on all points. Biden is too buddy-buddy with the repubs.

To Biden, the senate is a good ole boys club.

Too keep things friendly, I believe he will easily "cede the ground." They will not give him anything.

[Blue_true]

66. I agree with you. nt

[NYMinute]

10. Joy Reid is so obviously biased. nt

[George II]

12. Here is the full video, the interchange starts around 19:00. The description is very exaggerated...

....and he never "violated her space" or was "in her face"....

[BlueMTexpat]

15. Thanks for your

post.

[George II]

26. You're welcome. Good that people get to see it and make their own judgement rather than take...

...the word of the writer, who seems to have a negative bent toward Biden. Just the headline, "Biden spars with Warren....", none of them were on the stage together.

[BlueMTexpat]

29. While I admit that I was likely

influenced by the description in the article, Biden was still more "in her face" than I personally would have liked.

In the video, there is somewhat more of a "mansplaining" feeling, however. And since Joe is STILL not among my preferred candidates in part because of the Anita Hill episode, that rankled with me. I am likely not alone.

[onetexan]

69. I didnt see it that way

[JaneQPublic]

18. Sure looks like he did.

He walked right up to her, was impeded by her crossed leg, so then bent over to get "in her face."

[BlueMTexpat]

24. We who are women may

be more sensitive to that than males apparently are.

Unfortunately, both the description and the action shown in the video brought back memories of Trump hulking it over Hillary at the 2016 debates. Because he could.

I did not see this live - as with so many things - because I don't live in the US for the most part. I may have anticipated the action more because of the article. But ... my reaction was the same to both.

[JaneQPublic]

28. Good comparison.

I felt the same.

[George II]

46. He wasn't impeded by her crossed leg, he never got even close to it. He got even closer to....

....Reverend Barber, indeed he put his hand on Barber's arm.

If people WANT to see a problem with the way he acted, they will. But this is Joe Biden, so.....

I don't know who this David Smith is, but he may have had an agenda - even his headline is negative toward Biden - "Biden spars with Warren and Sanders at first event facing rival Democrats".

They were all on stage separately, how did Biden spar with Warren and Sanders, and then did not Warren and Sanders spar with each other, too?

[JaneQPublic]

50. Who are we to believe: you or our lying eyes?

I've watched the exchange on TV and on the above video clip about 6 times.

Joe takes 4 or 5 steps forward, stops about a foot short of Joy's foot dangling out in front of her, and then bends forward to mansplain how she doesn't understand things.

If some guy did that to me simply because I was doing my job, I'd be tempted to make good use of that pointy shoe dangling out in front of him.

[qazplm135]

52. I'm not a Biden fan

he's not even in my top five, but sorry, I don't see what you see.

[OKNancy]

32. Exactly as I remember it..

He wasn't really that close, and the whole thing about working with Republicans and shaming them has been taken out of context.
His basic argument was that you have to move people, to move the public to be on your side. Also that you have to go out and beat them (the Republicans). At that point Republicans will have to work with you if the public is on your side.

[marylandblue]

42. Often it's not what you say, but how you say it.

And I think this is a classic example.

[emulatorloo]

54. Tiring of DU'ers promoting the wingnut "Biden is a Pervert" meme

Thanks for the video.

[George II]

62. It is getting tiring. Damn, if Biden gets within 3 feet of a woman they go crazy, but....

....the fact that he grasped Reverend Barber's arm is of no consequence.

So, three feet from Joy Reid and there's outrage.
Grasping Reverend Barber's arm, nothing.

And no mention of other candidates touching, pushing, and "violating the space" of women. Go figure.

[aidbo]

19. Boy, the knives have really come out for Joy Reid!

[BlueMTexpat]

21. Very interesting, that! Indeed! eom

[LanternWaste]

23. I'd pretend the same...

if my narrative depended on such.

[aidbo]

43. oooh, very cryptic

[Hassin Bin Sober]

45. Pay no mind.

[OKNancy]

34. I've been disenchanted with her long before this forum

For some reason she thinks that as a person with a tv show on the weekends at MSNBC gives her the power to call out Democrats who don't agree with her. She has been particularly hateful toward Nancy Pelosi. IMO, Pelosi knows more about politics than Reid.

[BlueMTexpat]

37. Nancy knows more about

politics than just about anyone else alive.

I may not like Joy's treatment of Nancy, but I think that some posters here have been unduly harsh towards Joy in this situation. After all, she was supposed to be doing the grilling. There are always those who will not like the questions.

[melman]

63. Isn't that something?

Seems like only yesterday you'd get pounced on for questioning anything she said.

I got called "right wing shit" for merely posting an article about her time traveling hackers.

[samnsara]

27. i think we at least have to try......

[stonecutter357]

30. i stopped at Joy Reid ..

[BlueMTexpat]

31. You have that right.

But you may miss some things as a result.

[BeyondGeography]

33. As a frontrunner, Biden is a less impressive version of HRC

Some would say much less. His path to the nomination, if he gets there, is not going to be a straight line. As a national campaigner, he has never been known for being disciplined or organized. Plus he faces a lot more competition.

If he takes the underwhelming reaction to events like yesterday to heart and works at getting better, he will be formidable. If he shrugs his shoulders, asks what the big deal is and says I thought I did great, look out below.

[BlueMTexpat]

35. This.

If he takes the underwhelming reaction to events like yesterday to heart and works at getting better, he will be formidable. If he shrugs his shoulders, asks what the big deal is and says I thought I did great, look out below.

And if some prefer to make it about the questioner rather than about him, they have missed the point.

[Blue_true]

68. It was not about the questioner. How our President deals with sure republican obstructionism is

important. Personally, I hope that McConnell is not in the Senate in 2021 and beyond. But if he is, he is going to be pulling shit, even if we have a majority there. He needs to be dealt with forcefully.

[honest.abe]

39. No comparison to HRC.

With all do respect Hillary had a ton of baggage to deal with and decades of RW bashing which unfairly tainted her with the general public. Biden has little to none of that. I predict his path to the nomination will be smooth sailing!

[BeyondGeography]

40. Biden has his share of baggage, he's just not weighed down as much by it

Some might attribute that to his gender. He has been around forever and stepped in his share of piles.

But at the end of the day, you're right, his personal negative ratings are much lower. That's about the only area of superiority he can claim over her, but it's not insignificant.

[Blue_true]

67. I truly that soon it will come down to Biden v Warren nose to nose.

I simply don't know how that will go for Biden, because I believe Warren face to face can erode his strong areas like African Americans.

[honest.abe]

38. I like it that he is being somewhat aggressive in a situation like this.

He will need to be even more like that once its him versus Trump.

It gives me some comfort knowing Biden still has the spark. That was one of my main concerns with him that he might be too passive in debates with Trump.

[samnsara]

53. i like bennet!