Tuesday Debate Thread #2

[MustLoveBeagles]

Have at it everyone.

[Cha]

1. I'm just reading DU..

Thanks everyone.. MustLoveBeagles!

[MustLoveBeagles]

6. It's been interesting so far

I wish Beto would jump into the fray more, but he's doing better tonight which is a big relief.

[Cha]

14. I just read Beto was

doing Better!

Good, Mahalo!

[Funtatlaguy]

2. Thank you, Beagles.

[MustLoveBeagles]

8. Your welcome

[madaboutharry]

3. This debate is giving me a headache!

The candidates are getting scolded and spoken to by Tapper and Bash like they are in boot camp.

There has to be a better way of getting people to keep to the time limits.

[elleng]

4. I agree; bad format.

[Cha]

21. I hate that.. and when does it Ever

change?.. I'd want to jump through the screen if I were watching

[frazzled]

35. The moderators are breaking the rules they stated themselves.

They keep cutting off all the candidates besides Warren and Sanders, to whom they keep returning and allowing to go on. This is not what democracy looks like. Every candidate on that stage, no matter what they are polling, deserves equal time and equal respect.

[blm]

75. Warren gets interrupted every time.

[frazzled]

92. She has the second highest time count

Next to Bernie, who has 3 1/2 times the amount of speaking that the least candidate (Hickenlooper) has gotten. It’s very lopsided.

[blm]

100. Because the moderators were gunning for her, and then interrupting

and showing disrespect. Been noted on earlier debate thread

[True Dough]

168. I'm no math genius

but I believe Mayor Pete's 5:60 would be an even 6 minutes!?!

[Celerity]

197. lol, that reminds me of Pete's 'I may not be a master fisherman, but I know bait when I see it' line

[True Dough]

198. Oh yeah, that was a superb line!

I guess I was subconsciously drawing on it. Always inspired by Pete!

[TruckFump]

47. The Mods are HORRIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rude, even worse than MF45, IMO.

[radical noodle]

52. Whackamole...

They go over time and a big gavel comes down and bops them on the head. I'm having trouble watching a bunch of Democrats fight amongst themselves on prime time.

[DesertRat]

5. These mandatory 15-second responses are a joke

This is debate about the future of our country, it's not a game show.

[elleng]

7. YES, LOUSY.

[BumRushDaShow]

11. But that's the only thing they know how to do - "infotainment"

[MustLoveBeagles]

12. This just as bad as the stupid hand raising in the first debate

[BadgerMom]

179. Could the party say "no" to a given format?

Certainly some of these problems are foreseeable.

[Celerity]

9. Warren is being disingenuous by conflating asylum seeking with non asylum illegal entry

[Chemisse]

167. I noticed that.

It was a bit annoying, and otherwise she has done really well.

[Bettie]

10. The questions seem to be crafted to give

the Republicans canned talking points, they are ALL gotcha questions. Fer cryin' out loud CNN.

[DesertRat]

17. Every question is a republican talking point.

[TruckFump]

50. Exactly! EOM

[MustLoveBeagles]

18. Yeah

I'm not too impressed by that.

[jcgoldie]

20. I agree...

You frame the health care debate with a stupid question about raising taxes on the middle class and the immigration debate by completely focusing on decriminalization.

[Cha]

25. Exactly, it never changes. from what

I read about anyway.

[nini]

13. I turned it off

they're not allowed enough time to finish what they're saying.

I get the time limits but they need more than 30 seconds or whatever it is.

[elleng]

22. Yes

[Bettie]

29. Turning it off now.

just too many right wing talking points phrased as questions. Makes me feel ill.

[Celerity]

40. This (through no fault of anyone on stage) is doing overall damage to our Party IMHO

because of the RW question-framing.

[elleng]

49. For format reasons, imo;

questions are pretty universal.

[Celerity]

67. Fair point

[IcyPeas]

15. wow, I just agreed with Williamson

never saw that coming.

re: causes of some sicknesses... chemicals. etc.

[elleng]

24. They each have good things to say.

[nolabear]

26. She said that last time. Valid but it'll never get traction.

[Ponietz]

31. Not as long as there's a fast-food industry lobby

[dflprincess]

46. I liked that response

and I like what she's saying about campaign funding.

She may be "out there" but she is an intelligent woman and she's able to say things that need to be said because she has no delusions about where her campaign is going.

[elleng]

51. Yes.

[thesquanderer]

113. If I didn't know she was a kook, I could be impressed. (n/t)

[dflprincess]

140. Actually I am impressed

not enough to support her of course, but still enough to hope the other candidates will think about what she said and remember the reactions she got from the crowd.

[Bradshaw3]

16. I'm sorry but this format just sucks

Debates among this many candidates provide little insight or valuable discussion. I don't think it shows the candidates at their best, either. I would propose interviews by moderators like Cooper with perhaps four canddiates and no audience. Also no Williamson, Delaney, etc.

[elleng]

27. SOME other way.

Can't show ANYONE at their best.

[Bradshaw3]

33. Agree, ANY other way would beat this

[onecaliberal]

19. How does a Donald trump even get within cheating distance.

-Pete Buttigieg

[nolabear]

23. Hickenlooper's out.

[Celerity]

64. He and Ryan have been very very poor both debates. Beto too (gonna catch heat on that one lol)

as well. He is not good in this format. Bullock and Pete have been great. Warren looks radical far more this debate. Not a good look.

Bernie is Bernie. Love him or hate him he is the same every time.

Klobuchar seems anxious and off her game. Williamson of all people actually has been good. Delaney is hurting all by repeating Rethug talking points.

[nolabear]

74. I'm surprised Warren isn't doing better. Klobuchar has had the least speaking time.

CNN is keeping a running tab on time. Any needs to stop being so polite. She’s getting nothing.

[Celerity]

89. Warren just SLAMMED Delaney, lololol

[nolabear]

91. That was golden! 😄

[Celerity]

97. +1

[thesquanderer]

160. Beto is much better than last time, and I think Warren is doing okay...

...but I agree with all your other assessments.

[Celerity]

164. Beto was doing better the 2nd half, but then lost the plot on reparations

[DesertRat]

28. Amy is very impressive with her passion and knowledge

[elleng]

36. She is.

[MustLoveBeagles]

39. Yes she is

[BumRushDaShow]

30. Klobachar called out Turtle!

[DesertRat]

34. Yes!

[nolabear]

32. Bullock's out.

Dark money and the Koch brothers will get him nothing.

[Celerity]

94. Not at all, dark money is a HUGE reason we are all in this mess

It has shaped the legislative agenda for ages in a horrid way.

[lapucelle]

37. Based on reponses, it seems lke some of the candidates have never read the 2016 Democratic platform.

Securing Universal Health Care

Democrats believe that health care is a right, not a privilege, and our health care system should put people before profits. Thanks to the hard work of President Obama and Democrats in Congress, we took a critically important step toward the goal of universal health care by passing the Affordable Care Act, which has covered 20 million more Americans and ensured millions more will never be denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition

The right to healthcare has been a core Democratic Party value since the 1990's.

[Cha]

43. smh..

Mahalo, lapucelle

[lapucelle]

58. Why are some of the candidates talking about a "healthcare as a right" as if it' s a new concept?

Securing Universal Health Care
Democrats believe that health care is a right, not a privilege, and our health care system should put people before profits. Thanks to the hard work of President Obama and Democrats in Congress, we took a critically important step toward the goal of universal health care by passing the Affordable Care Act, which has covered 20 million more Americans and ensured millions more will never be denied coverage because of a pre-existing condition. Democrats will never falter in our generations-long fight to guarantee health care as a fundamental right for every American. As part of that guarantee, Americans should be able to access public coverage through a public option, and those over 55 should be able to opt in to Medicare. Democrats will empower the states, which are the true laboratories of democracy, to use innovation waivers under the ACA to develop unique locally tailored approaches to health coverage. This will include removing barriers to states which seek to experiment with plans to ensure universal health care to every person in their state. By contrast, Donald Trump wants to repeal the ACA, leaving tens of millions of Americans without coverage.

[nolabear]

38. Per CNN Klobuchar has had the least speaking time.

She needs to shout those men down.

[BeyondGeography]

41. Williamson yadayadayada

I’m glad she’s a Democrat but what a waste of space.

[IcyPeas]

45. she, of course, doesn't stand a chance...

and I don't know why she is even there.

But, I agree with her views.

[Blue_true]

53. A rightwing radio talker saw the debate entry criteria and did

a campaign to help her meet it. With the polling standard raised for the next debate, she likely won't make any more.

[MustLoveBeagles]

63. I like her but her anti-vaccine views are a dealbreaker for me

I can't go there with her.

[customerserviceguy]

42. Yadda, yadda, yadda

Is that some kind of mantra?

[demtenjeep]

44. yada yada yada-who is this woman? HOW does she have the backing to make the debate?

she is strange

[Blue_true]

66. A rightwing campaign helped get her on.

They can't influence democratic polls, so tonight is likely her last debate.

She is a true democrat and has a wonderful heart (ran a campaign to feed homeless people each day, even cooking meals in that effort), but she doesn't have the grounding of someone who has run a political campaign, like everyone else on stage with her.

[MustLoveBeagles]

86. She's a little late for the Steinfeld audition

She's okay, well mostly. I just don't think she's presidential.

[IcyPeas]

48. Bernie said there would be a pharma commercial during the debate

waiting for it so I can laugh.

[elleng]

54. Watching Monsanto round up helpline.

[lillypaddle]

55. They sure are giving BS a LOT of time

and he's getting on my last nerve.

[BeyondGeography]

56. Hickenlooper runs away from the question

And should keep running straight out of the primary.

[KentuckyWoman]

101. Hickenlooper, a victim of his name.

He could be the sharpest person on the planet. This country will not elect President Hickenlooper.

Although to be honest, I had to eat a jar of horseraddish because Ah nold got himself elected governator of California.

[susanr516]

57. Tapper sucks

He's asking questions that encourage the candidates to attack each other.

[Duppers]

173. Zactly.

[jcgoldie]

59. FUCK YOU CNN

Middle class tax raises is how they frame health care... decriminalization is the only way they address immigration... now a fucking question about SOCIALISM?!? Go fuck yourself... i think these candidates are doing great and this is all a fucking setup.

[The River]

60. I Never

turned it on. Reading up thread comments a nap was a better idea.
Besides, it will all get repeated and analyzed all week. Wake me when the less than 1%'ers have dropped out or gone broke.

[emmaverybo]

61. Bernie said since health care is a right, everyone, including anyone who comes in even without

legally immigrating, being a refuge, or seeking asylum, will be covered. No other country does this.He says we have enough money to do this.

Really? I get covering those going through legal immigration, DACA, those we are going to document, but the idea that we can cover anyone who comes here is not reasonable.

[Skittles]

141. so you're saying

for example, undocumented immigrants with a sick baby - that baby should not receive medical treatment?

[emmaverybo]

192. Of course the baby should. But free healthcare for all is ridiculous. In every other single payer

country, people without papers who have not been given any status, as refuges, or immigrants, do not get full healthcare. Emergency hospitals and urgent care, but not complete coverage.

Do you think in France or Germany or Ireland or England that people without papers are given full
benefits?

[Skittles]

196. so you think people who are ill should not receive medical attention?

or is there an age limit?

[emmaverybo]

199. I think no country that has universal coverage offers that coverage regardless of immigration

status. Witness France, where West Africans who have not been granted papers, are protesting their being excluded from all benefits and protections.

Now, they do have a case to make for being in France and wanting legal immigration status.

In the US, with a more sane policy, we should be taking on war refuges as we had promised, asylum seekers, and giving amnesty to millions who have lived and worked here for years, while granting immediate citizenship to DACAs. All of these new immigrants, in process folks, and new citizens must have full health coverage.

But if we try to extend full health benefits to those who do not qualify under a fair and comprehensive immigration policy, we will stretch health dollars to breaking, resulting in
poorer quality for all, and the need to privatize. We will also incur a far right wing backlash such as Europe is undergoing.

Yes, if anyone is sick and on our soil, he or she should be treated. Yes, we need don’t ask don’t tell
Vaccination programs, screening and treatment for infectious diseases, care during emergencies.

Every country where universal works has eligibility criteria that must be met for one to be put permanently on health care benefits.

[Skittles]

200. Yes, if anyone is sick and on our soil, he or she should be treated

that's all you needed to say

[LibDemAlways]

176. Communicable diseases do not discriminate

based on immigration status. Accidents happen to citizens, non-citizens, and newly arrived immigrants alike. People need cancer screening and other preventative care. If health care is a human right, we must provide health care to everyone in the country. It would be dangerous to do otherwise.

[emmaverybo]

193. I am not talking about immigrants or about refusing care for emergencies. Any single payer

system would be utterly jammed and bankrupt if the full panoply of services were extended to all
people.

And yes public health centers should screen for communicable, infectious diseases.

[roody]

191. They go to the ER now.

It would be better to have them in the pool.

[Funtatlaguy]

62. Bernie & Hick have a moment...throwing arms in air...lol.

[customerserviceguy]

69. Reminded me of Arlo Guthrie

and the shrink at the draft board in "Alice's Restaurant"!

[IcyPeas]

70. i'm afraid that's going to turn into a meme real quick

[BeyondGeography]

65. Tim Ryan aka the GOP talking point machine

[jcgoldie]

68. Its like he wrote all the questions

[BumRushDaShow]

78. That's a perfect description!

[BeyondGeography]

71. Do Republican candidates ever get asked if the party is moving too far to the right?

[Funtatlaguy]

73. Nope 👎

[Pachamama]

72. Just started watching....

Watching Sanders looking angry and waving hands....Hickenlooper made him looking bad....

[customerserviceguy]

79. He even made me check

to see if I was standing on his lawn.

[nolabear]

81. He's looking more like a kabuki warrior all the time.

Does nothing for me.

[KentuckyWoman]

76. Moderating is pretty bad... but ALL the candidates are lightyears ahead of the alternative

Props to Mayor Pete for staying on point and sharp delivery.
Props to Tim Ryan and Beto O'Rourke for a good diversity of ideas mixed with pretty good delivery.
Props to Warren and Sanders for sticking with their guns in the face of general disagreement on the fine points.

They are all amazing candidates, those not mentioned are impressive too. But the ones I mentioned above are the stand outs to this undecided for this debate.

[W_HAMILTON]

77. Why the hell is Bullock getting so much air time?

It seems like they go to him for a response for every question they ask.

[Duppers]

177. That's a puzzle to me too.

[BeyondGeography]

80. Warren goes boom

Lol

[nolabear]

83. REALLY a great point!

[dflprincess]

85. I think everyone in my apartment building heard me yell

"I love you Elizabeth!"

[Pachamama]

82. Warren for the Win!!!!

[customerserviceguy]

87. She's on fire

and as I predicted, so far, nobody's challenged her directly. They'll challenge Bernie on her issues, which is safer.

[RhodeIslandOne]

84. Ahahahaaaaaaa

Get the hook on Delaney.

[Pachamama]

90. Definitely....

[susanr516]

88. GO Liz!

She's on fire!

[madamesilverspurs]

93. Glad to see Amy avoid Tapper's sloppy trap.

Geez that was blatant!

[susanr516]

96. Good for Amy

[backtoblue]

95. I love the play by play on DU!

Thanks!!!

[monmouth4]

103. Me too, from the sound of it I'm glad I'm watching "Elizabeth", a good period movie..n/t

[Funtatlaguy]

98. Seems that the moderates are trying to go after Warren/Sanders

as if they are the same candidate....and not 2 separate candidates.

[Blue_true]

104. They are trying to induce a fight between the two.

More drama.

[IcyPeas]

99. no no no Beto just said he agreed with trump

no no no

[Pachamama]

102. I have been watching for 15 mins and its so badly moderated & would say the women

...win the Night so far....

...and a few people like Delaney need to quit the campaign for President....

[Tarc]

105. I'll be glad when the 1-2 percenters are gone, then there will be more time for deeper responses

This 30 second thing sucks, but it is a problem of the party's own doing.

[IcyPeas]

106. it's riduculous. it's not really a debate. it's speed dating.

[Pachamama]

107. Speed De-bating.....

[MustLoveBeagles]

115. Good one!

[IcyPeas]

162. ha ha that is perfect.

[Pachamama]

108. Bernie's turning red and yelling....

[customerserviceguy]

112. How can you tell?

[JudyM]

123. That's how many of us feel about the importance of these issues.

[lapucelle]

109. "Democrats are afraid of big ideas".

smh

[Pachamama]

111. Who said that?

I missed it....Bernie was yelling and it rattled me...

[MustLoveBeagles]

114. Bernie did

[LiberalFighter]

110. Ok -- Ryan got a dig in on Sanders.

He said, "You don't have to yell".

[BeyondGeography]

116. Bullock doesn't always have a plan for, you know, talking

[customerserviceguy]

125. "Dark psychic force..."

It's almost like a seance.

[phylny]

118. Klobuchar has been forgotten.

[Pachamama]

120. Talking now....

[customerserviceguy]

121. She just got a softball question.

[bearsfootball516]

119. I look forward to this being Bullock's first and last debate.

[ecstatic]

131. Yeah. I liked him in the first 2 minutes, but he seems more

and more obnoxious as the debate goes on.

[MustLoveBeagles]

138. Same here

[asiliveandbreathe]

156. Debate thread 3..?????

[demtenjeep]

134. I agree and that williamson woman too

she is awful

[lapucelle]

181. Well she does have a plan that even E Warren somehow seems to have missed...

... a plan to "combat the dark psychic forces".

[BlueWI]

188. Loved her answer on the college question.

Refinancing college debt would help the economy.

Reminding us of the core Democratic philosophy of putting people first.

[demtenjeep]

122. Like me some Mayor Pete

but there are some good things being said between all the mess

[True Dough]

124. Big hand for Williamson

She's doing better than expected tonight.

[customerserviceguy]

128. She's still said her goofy stuff.

[True Dough]

137. But it was 80% less goofy!

If only she can keep it up!

[customerserviceguy]

142. Goofy lite, I guess!

[ecstatic]

147. Only goofy to those who aren't in tune with the universe.

[customerserviceguy]

150. Damn, you're right, mine is on AM!

[elleng]

130. Well earned.

[highplainsdem]

132. She deserved it then.

[Pachamama]

133. All three of the women - and Mayor Pete are the ones impressing me tonight....

[IcyPeas]

126. I can't believe people in Flint are still using bottled water

WTH?

[ecstatic]

127. Wow @ Marianne Williamson.

"If you think any of this wonkiness" is going to address the evil that trump has dredged up... (paraphrasing).

[Pachamama]

129. Marianne Williamson!!!

She doesn't have a chance....but wow, she speaks the truth...

Again....the women tonight are the most impressive....

[IcyPeas]

135. agree, she should have some role in the up coming administration

I'm not sure what though

[ecstatic]

143. She mentioned a department of Children something on an interview

I can't remember the name but I thought it was a really good idea.

[customerserviceguy]

144. Chaplain? n/t

[Bradshaw3]

146. Science advisor maybe?

[susanr516]

139. That was a good response

[Duppers]

180. ++

[Pachamama]

136. DOMESTIC TERRORISM - Warren said it!!!!

[susanr516]

145. Yes, domestic terrorism

[demtenjeep]

149. bought damn time

we have only been saying it for years

[BootinUp]

148. Pete handled that tough question like a pro. Nt

[demtenjeep]

159. I am almost ready to say Biden/Pete

Warren for Secretary of anythng she wants!

[ecstatic]

151. O'Rouke's hail mary pass. nt

[customerserviceguy]

152. Williamson is going for the reparations issue

Pete must be sweating like crazy right now.

[ecstatic]

153. Marianne is speaking truth right now. nt

[elleng]

154. Yes

[susanr516]

155. Yes, she is

[Funtatlaguy]

157. Reparations ARE warranted, but VERY unpopular with the public.

Sad to say it, but it’s a bad issue for us to run on.

[Lithos]

166. Money won't fix the inherently racist and biased system

It also won't address the side effects that this same racist and biased system is also hurting other groups.

It will take serious investment into fixing the system - a job which will take both money and time - to address and truly fix things.

L-

[customerserviceguy]

158. The crowd loves it. n/t

[demtenjeep]

161. can we get another thread for the last part

its getting kind of long

[BumRushDaShow]

165. Go ahead and start one!

[onecaliberal]

163. Even if you have insurance and get sick, you will be bankrupt. Why is any democrat fighting to keep

That system.

[elleng]

169. because it's complicated.

[emmaverybo]

175. It is not true that even with insurance, you will be bankrupt. Some plans cover 100 percent with

minimal co-pays, extremely low drug costs, and offer top clinics and hospitals and doctors. Medicaid offers excellent coverage and even pays for in-home care. Some retirees as part of their
retirement benefits have Medicare plus a plan for low or no cost.

[onecaliberal]

187. I have very good healthcare. This is an example of what happens.

My husband had a massive stroke right after dump was installed. Some of the treatment, meds and doctors were out of network cost. Which means insurance doesn’t cover it. We ended up with a 200,000 bill when we left the hospital.
Most insurance is good if you’re not sick, but if something tragic happens or you get cancer you’re screwed. Ask most people with diabetes how much their insulin costs. Read about how many of them have passed because they can’t afford it. Check out go fund me, thousands of people begging for money to help them buy Medicine to stay alive. Profiting off healthcare is immoral and pathetic.

[emmaverybo]

194. Out of network surprise bills are the subject of legislation now. It is terrible that happened to

your husband. This has got to change and can through legislation. In the case of a widely known hospital in CA, these bills have been fought and people are winning.

ACA can be made affordable and offers complete coverage. Medicare with a supplemental, good plan can give 100 percent coverage.

Medicaid does cover insulin, specialists even, good hospitals, and doctors, at home care too.

Many union plans are excellent.

People with good plans want to keep them and should be able to.

Every one else should be covered too and not with lousy plans.

I am simply not for one way to get to universal coverage.

It simply is not true that most good insurance plans only hold up if you don’t get sick. Medicare plus a supplemental gives 100 percent coverage. Medicaid 100 percent. Yes, most will not pay for
experimental treatments. But neither do single payer systems. They do decide based on stats what
they will cover and what they won’t.

Anecdotal? Ok. I am reimbursed through my pension the cost of Medicare. My retirement benefits
gives me a PPO plan and pays the premium. I am covered 100 percent and pay 10 dollar deductibles. My drugs cost between a few dollars and tops, 15 dollars. My mother paid 261 a month for an excellent Kaiser plan, much like mine. Hers also a retirement deal. A few costs out of pocket, not much, for one of her major illnesses.

And I could go on.

[onecaliberal]

195. For many of us, my story is the reality.This is why the profit must be removed. However that happens

[napi21]

178. Because, if you're lucky, like my son is right now, his insurance has no deductibles, and no

all the premiums are paid by his employer. Before you say anything, I admit his position is one in a million. But the idea is the same, lots of people who have insurance through their employer are pretty happy with it and are AFRAID of change. Afraid what you're offering won't be as good.

[onecaliberal]

190. A system that bankrupts other people that don't happen to be you

Is immoral IMO

[BootinUp]

170. Tim Ryan thinks he can fix it.

[BlueWI]

171. Warren, Williamson, and Mayor Pete are most impressive so far.

Not the best day IMO for Sanders/ORourke. Williamson is more clear tonight than Kloubuchar.

Ryan, Delaney, and Hickenlooper need their own party.

[Pachamama]

172. Agree on all counts....

[susanr516]

174. I'm pretty much done with Delaney

[AnnieBW]

182. Delaney Tried To Mansplain Economic Policy to Liz

He died on that hill.

[BlueWI]

183. Agreed

It's interesting to see Bullock. Haven't heard him before. Seems sensible - not quite at a level with Warren and Inslee, IMO, my personal top two.

[Duppers]

185. Same here.

[MBS]

184. Why oh why are they giving Delaney so much time?

Ridiculous.

[orleans]

186. question: bernie & trump said the same thing

about not being world police. how can we tell the difference between the two of you?


HAHAHAHA!!!!

what a STUPID fucking question!

[BlueWI]

189. Yep.

Sanders had a nice one liner.