Beto O'Rourke calling for Reparations is a big mostake

[brooklynite]

It’s an impossible policy to implement and a deadly campaign issue.

[True Dough]

1. Actually, a mostake is a mistake

[littlemissmartypants]

14. ..

[True Dough]

15. Don't encourage me!

I have a little "smartypants" in me too!

[littlemissmartypants]

18. I'm sorry. I have to take my laughs when I can get them.

And you definitely tickle my funny bone.

[True Dough]

19. I guess you could say

it's a gif...

[littlemissmartypants]

20. Definitely. nt

[customerserviceguy]

27. That may be the

cutest video I've ever seen!

[JI7]

2. if anyone can get people to understand the issue it is Beto

[wasupaloopa]

3. It is not impossible to implement. There are already ideas

being discussed.

It could be like improving chances for jobs or education or neighborhoods.

[brooklynite]

6. Yes you could do that; just don't call it reparations.

[wasupaloopa]

21. I think it should be called reparations. That is because

basis is to acknowledge that this country supported slavery for hundreds of years.

[asiliveandbreathe]

4. Hey, you are there..can't wait for your OP..Mr. sittin' in the 10th row....

Must be awesome.....don't know if you have been reading the debate thread..seems the mods are catchin' it...

[Tarc]

5. Repatations is a hard pass for me

If we're talking programs and policies to address systemic racism and wealth imbalance, that's a good thing. But most hear "reparations" and equates it with simply cutting a check to descendants of slaves. That is a long-dead issue.

[brush]

17. It's not about cutting checks. It's job training programs, college aid, small business...

grants, community infrastructure improvement and development. No one with any sense is advocating cutting individual checks.

But something sure should be done or 100, 150, 200 years from now the racial divide will still be here and some will be saying we can't do reparations because it just can't be done. And the nation witll be no better off because we have refused since the end of enslavement and Jim Crow to tackle and make sincere efforts to address the most heinous wrong in the history of humanity. We've kicked it down the road for forever because whites don't want to deal with what their ancestors did and what they still benefit from.

[wasupaloopa]

22. You do a good job of explaining reparations.

[brush]

23. Thank you. I feel most people once they understand it's not about cutting individual...

checks but a sincere attempt to right a heinous wrong, they will see it from a different perspective and be more receptive to the idea.

It's about finally righting a wrong.

[CTyankee]

30. I get this, especially since my family, all Southern and from Confederate states, benefitted from

the slave labor of black slaves, so that means I did, too.

However, what do you say to someone who, unlike me, came to this country much later, but maybe from a European country such as Italy or Ireland, and had nothing to do with slavery. Of course, you and I would say "But you benefited from what the slaves built and being white, you did not suffer racial discrimination when getting an education or a job or buying a house." I see that but I'm sure most of them wouldn't.

[brush]

35. People from other countries will have to be educated about what happened, just as...

Americans will have to be. Those from other countries once they got here struggled—first generation especially—but eventually assimulated into the nation and weren't discriminated against because of skin color. They benefited from opportunities because of their white skin while blacks who were here long before them were denied the same opportunities—jobs, mortgages, apartment rentals (see trump and his father's policies), promotions once on a job, just daily racial slights and slurs. Many of this still happens.

Let me put it this way. There must be a serious attempt at righting a serious wrong. Here's a graphic way to understand it. Millions of ensldaved people had their labor stolen from them. Just using the principle of compounding, where money doubles every seven years, that uncompensated labor of milliions over 250 years, and we won't even include the 100 years of jim crow, if all those wages were calculated and compounded over 250 years, if that had to be paid it would bust the US Treasury so programs of job training, college tuition, small business grants, community infrastructure improvements and such is a real bargain. It's about finally making an attempt to right a wrong.

If people came here after all this happened doesn't erase that it happened.

[JI7]

40. my family came from a non european country that was colonized . I would say if it weren't for the

civil rights movement we would not have the rights and the life we have been able to make here . those before us fought for these things. when we came much later we benefited from these things.

so i have no problem with reparations.

[Demsrule86]

52. Scotus will never go for it...and it will out hatred...lot of poor of all

colors who would benefit from such programs. It is also fatal in a General Election and probably a primary as well.

[brush]

53. Agreed it shouldn't be a campaign issue, but what does SCOTUS have to do with it?

Someone might later try to gin up standing to take it to court but it would be a legislative matter first.

Some don't even understand the real issue. It's not about people having to dig in their pockets and individual checks being cut to people. That thinking couldn't be any sillier.

There are many institutions and corporations still extant that participated and made money in the slave trade (research Brown University for example. And there are many others). Why not hold them accountable? And why not hold the US Government that legalized such inhumanity accountable?

Here's a graphic way to understand it. Millions of enslaved people had their labor stolen from them. Then they were "freed" and set adrift in a hostile nation with just the clothes on their backs and not a cent of compensation to face an additional 100 years of Jim Crow racism. Wonder if a less hearty demographic would've even survived in such a sea of hate?

But getting back to the compensation issue, just using the principle of compounding, where money doubles every seven years, that uncompensated, dawn-to-dusk labor of miliions over 250 years, and we won't even include the 100 years of jim crow, if all those wages were calculated and compounded over 250 years, if that had to be paid it would bust the US Treasury so programs of job training, college tuition, small business grants, community infrastructure improvements and such is a real bargain. It's about finally making an attempt to right a wrong.

And if the excuse is what about people who came here after all this happened? So? That doesn't erase that it happened and some attempt should be made to right this wrong. Japanese internment victims were compensated. German Jews were compensated. But when it comes to African Americans why is it that so many whites react immediately with NO, NO, NO. Is the racism that strong?

[doc03]

7. He isn't the only one. If Democrats think they are going to beat Trump they sure as hell

aren't going to win promising Medicare for all, free college, reparations and a program for every damn thing, that spells one thing to swing voters, they are going to "Raise Your Taxes". They will not win the rust belt states we need with that. This debate really depresses me. Nobody on that stage stands out as someone to beat Trump IMO.

[JI7]

9. he came close to winning Texas and his most famous moment was defending black lives matter

and kneeling black athletes. and saying he would support impeachment of trump.

beto is the one who can call for these things and still appeal to more people.

[doc03]

10. He ran against the most hated man in DC. nt

[JI7]

12. cruz beat trump in the primary in Texas which rubio could not do in his own state

so he isn't as weak as some may think in texas.

[Indygram]

24. He got more votes than Obama ever did...and HRC....and

Every Democrat in the history of Texas....and for a MIDTERM election. He got almost presidential race turnout.
Minimizing the history he made in Texas and all he did to flip safe Republican seats and elect 17 black women judges in one district alone is kind of pathetic. If Beto is the nominee Texas goes blue. If anyone else is, Texas stays red. Period.

[customerserviceguy]

28. Exactly

If we were talking about Senator Beto O'Rourke being in the debate, then we're talking about delivering Texas in November 2020.

Beto did an OK job tonight, at least no one took him to school like Castro did. Maybe they've already looked past him. Maybe the next debate he'll have a major moment.

[Indygram]

31. Castro and everyone who agreed with him is wrong

Section 1325 is what allows suspected human traffickers and drug traffickers to be detained and questioned. Everyone who calls for repealing section 1325 is essentially calling for open borders for the areas other than official entry points. That is a massive gift to Trump. Texas knows both Beto and Castro and there is a reason why Castro is not popular in Texas.

[customerserviceguy]

34. So, what do you

think was Beto's shining moment tonight? I may have missed it while posting here.

[Indygram]

36. He had multiple great moments for a general election

And he caught the eye of the people of color and veterans who may not have been familiar with him. The Texas poll that came out today will also send Texans the message that the national media stories intended to discourage them from supporting him are full of crap.

[mr_lebowski]

43. This ... exactly. Calling for 'Reparations' is a LOSER for Democrats, period

We should champion programs that will help ALL the disadvantaged, regardless of race. This is a much easier sell. And because PoC's tend to be disadvantaged at a higher %, they will inherently be 'helped more' by such plans than the average white person.

You know for every 1 black person out there that would say to themselves 'Hell yes, I want reparations!', I'd bet there's 2 that would just like a leg up by virtue of the fact that they're struggling, and the system is set up against poor people, and DON'T want such a program to ONLY be offered to AA's, out of some sense of White Guilt over what a bunch of long dead people did.

IOW, it's not even going to be a particularly winning issue among AA voters, I don't think.

OTOH, it'll hurt us electorally ... with considerably more people. And especially in States we'll really need to win.

Here, Dem Leaders who may be reading ... here are terms that actually WORK:

Tuition Reform
Help with Vocational Training (you don't want it to sound like only 'elitist' college kids will be helped)
Student Debt Restructuring
Fixing the ACA with the Public Option it was always meant to have
Medicare BUY IN
A Jobs & Education Program to Help Lift Folks out of Poverty
A 21st Century Energy Program (not 'end fossil fuel use' by 2030 or whatever ... even though that should be the goal).

People like hearing of things that sound positive, and even more, that sound FAIR.

As the post I'm responding to points out:
Medicare For All (easy to spin as wildly unfair to Seniors who paid in all their lives)
Free College (easy to spin as unfair to non-elite kids who want vocational training and/or don't have the grades to get into college)
and for the love of Dog, Reparations? (it polls TERRIBLY)

Simply put ... these are ALL LOSERS.

[Indygram]

8. Reparations is NOT about money, it is about REPAIRING what is broken

Beto is 100% right that until an HONEST conversation is had we will just keep revisiting the same things over and over and over again.

[littlemissmartypants]

16. Wouldn't it be nice to see

Beto team up with Reverend Doctor Barber and The Repairers of the Breach movement? I so want him to catch fire! I hope he stays in.

[Indygram]

11. Definition of reparation

reparation noun
rep·​a·​ra·​tion | ˌre-pə-ˈrā-shən
Definition of reparation
1a : a repairing or keeping in repair
b reparations plural : REPAIRS
2a : the act of making amends, offering expiation, or giving satisfaction for a wrong or injury
b : something done or given as amends or satisfaction
3 : the payment of damages : INDEMNIFICATION
specifically : compensation in money or materials payable by a defeated nation for damages to or expenditures sustained by another nation as a result of hostilities with the defeated nation —usually used in plural

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/reparation

[brush]

13. That's your opinion. And it is not impossible to implement.

[customerserviceguy]

29. It won't have to be implemented

because anything with that label cannot get through both houses of Congress.

[brush]

32. That's your opinion also. once they understand it's not about cutting individual checks...

but a sincere attempt to right a heinous wrong, they might see it from a different perspective and be more receptive. And it doesn't have to be called reparations since many whites get their backs up and think nothing should be done for blacks who had their .LABOR STOLEN FOR 250 YEARS then were "freed" and set adrift in a hostile nation with just the clothes on their backs and not a cent of compensation to face an additional 100 years of Jim Crow racism. Wonder if a less hearty demographic would've even survived in such a sea of hate?

It would be about job training programs, college aid, small business grants, community infrastructure improvement and development. No one with any sense is advocating cutting individual checks.

But something sure should be done or 100, 150, 200 years from now the racial divide will still be here and some will be saying we can't do reparations because it just can't be done. And the nation witll be no better off because we have refused since the end of enslavement and Jim Crow to tackle and make sincere efforts to address the most heinous wrong in the history of humanity. We've kicked it down the road for forever because many whites don't want to deal with what their ancestors did and what they still benefit from.

[customerserviceguy]

33. It's also about who's paying for it

I was born in Canada, we didn't have slaves. And there are loads of immigrants who came to America after slavery was over with, and they were discriminated against, their descendants will resist paying for it.

Will there be a credit for families who can trace back to a Union soldier who actually died to stop slavery?

This is a losing issue for the Democratic Party, expect Trump to remind the mushy middle all about that.

[brush]

39. Of course it should'nt be a campaign issue but it's silly to think anyone who came...

later or even those who have always been here are going to dig in their pockets and pay for it. There are many institutions and corporations still extant that participated and made money in the slave trade (research Brown University for example. And there are many others). Why not hold them accountable? And why not hold the US Government that legalized such inhumanity accountable?

Here's a graphic way to understand it. Millions of enslaved people had their labor stolen from them. Just using the principle of compounding, where money doubles every seven years, that uncompensated, dawn-to-dusk labor of miliions over 250 years, and we won't even include the 100 years of jim crow, if all those wages were calculated and compounded over 250 years, if that had to be paid it would bust the US Treasury so programs of job training, college tuition, small business grants, community infrastructure improvements and such is a real bargain. It's about finally making an attempt to right a wrong.

If people came here after all this happened doesn't erase that it happened.

[customerserviceguy]

42. Trump and the GOP

will absolve the mushy middle from worrying about it by pointing out that we have had affirmative action in hiring and college admissions for fifty-plus years now, and even electing Barack Obama twice. We've already seen them use that line.

[brush]

44. There's always excuses to not right this wrong. You found another one.

Just go ahead and say you're against it. It doesn't bother me. We've been fighting those attitudes for hundreds of years.

[customerserviceguy]

45. I don't think it's a winning issue

I think that's why President Obama avoided it during his two terms. Did he have a bad attitude about the subject?

[brush]

49. I said in our first exchange it should not be a campaign issue so don't even try that.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

25. No! Not impossible!

[redstateblues]

26. Electoral loser. Sorry. I like him but Beto is desperate. Not a good look.

[VarryOn]

41. O'Rourke

No way I can roll with him. I've worked with his type in the corporate world. Doesnt seem that serious....certainly not working that hard. I'll no longer give him consideration.

[Bayard]

37. Not happy

Nobody is talking about reparations to Native Americans, most of whom live in abject poverty.

[brush]

48. Spot on. There's a lot of inhumanity in the history of this country that should be...

addressed. So many whites just automatically get their backs up about it but that doesn't erase the fact that blacks were enslaved for 250 years and the Native America population was decimated, their land was stolen, treaties ignored and they were isolated on reservations.

People don't want to talk about it even though they benefit from it to this day.

I mean what's there to say about what was done to AAs and Native Americans? It's hard to face.

At least some attempt should be made to right these historically heinous wrongs. But mention reparations and everyone loses their minds.

So don't call it reparations and get to it.

[Indygram]

50. Reparations.Are.Not.About.Money

And Native Americans DO have a form of Reparations. I know this because one of my immediate family members belongs to a tribe and is on the official census. As a result that family member is entitled to tuition free college, medical care, can claim free land that is owned by the tribe, etc.

That doesn't mean that it's enough to address as much as it should...but those are examples of reparations.

[Bayard]

56. What about living conditions on the reservations?

Still like a third world country. They at least deserve decent housing, with things we take for granted, like running water.

[Gothmog]

46. O agree with Beto

[Gothmog]

47. Beto had a good night

Link to tweet

[SouthernProgressive]

54. It's not a mistake.

It's necessary. I'm glad we have quality people talking about it.

[brooklynite]

55. If it's necessary...

...the you shouldn’t risk your chance of getting elected by bringing it up as a campaign issue.