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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

highplainsdem

(48,718 posts)
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 07:54 PM Nov 2019

Biden: Insulting those who don't share same approach to reaching goals belongs in the other primary

That thread title is paraphrasing Biden, since the full quote won't fit and I wanted to get the gist in.


https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/468692-biden-defends-record-after-warren-attacks-im-a-card-carrying-democrat


Former Vice President Joe Biden hammered Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) Saturday as the conflict between the two 2020 frontrunners continues to escalate. Biden defended his record as an unwavering Democrat who has been loyal to the party for many years after Warren criticized her opponent for his health care plan.

“Yesterday, Elizabeth Warren suggested I was ‘running in the wrong presidential primary’ because I believe in building on Obamacare — not getting rid of it. That's so wrong, it’s almost laughable. I’ve been a card-carrying Democrat since I was 27. And I am running for president because of my progressive record,” Biden wrote in an email to supporters, hitting Warren for registering as a Republican for years before becoming a Democrat.

“If my opponents want to have a debate on what they've done to truly implement progressive, meaningful change in our country — not what they’re planning, not what they’re proposing, but what they’ve accomplished — I welcome it,” he added, swiping at Warren’s “I’ve got a plan for that” mantra. “But to hurl insults because we don’t share the same approach for the best way to get to the same goal…well that is something I would expect in the other primary.”

-snip-
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
90 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Biden: Insulting those who don't share same approach to reaching goals belongs in the other primary (Original Post) highplainsdem Nov 2019 OP
When Warren throws it expect push back. Frankly I was surprised by her comment FloridaBlues Nov 2019 #1
What was her exact comment? Can you quote it as said? blm Nov 2019 #26
Here it is beastie boy Nov 2019 #37
She said SHE is just not sure where he's going. Why did you blm Nov 2019 #69
I quoted Warren precisely. Didn't change one letter. beastie boy Nov 2019 #82
You wrote your viewpoint over cherrypicked words. blm Nov 2019 #83
So I no longer changed her words. Good. beastie boy Nov 2019 #84
One candidate wanted to primary Obama and another one is among those desperate to undo his signature Skya Rhen Nov 2019 #2
Well said, and I agree. Demsrule86 Nov 2019 #16
Well stated Skya.. thx Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #20
Yeah, the heck with them.. I'll take President Obama Cha Nov 2019 #29
Thanks for saying this, Skya. Obama is a great man and was a great president. I am sticking emmaverybo Nov 2019 #42
Did you support Hilary? wnylib Nov 2019 #68
Hillary was a Goldwater girl is high school peggysue2 Nov 2019 #74
Hillary changed her political views wnylib Nov 2019 #88
Wtf Cailinrain Nov 2019 #79
This! A million times, this! She was on the other side during the Civil Rights fight but expect AA Skya Rhen Nov 2019 #80
Yes Hillary was politically active at wnylib Nov 2019 #89
Hillary was 17 years old OldRed2450 Nov 2019 #87
+ a million!!!! Tarheel_Dem Nov 2019 #76
Warren was criticizing Obama -- and Clinton by association -- right up to 2016 election. Hoyt Nov 2019 #3
I don't have problems with candidates criticizing each other Hoyt within the party, but I wish all still_one Nov 2019 #17
I suggest criticizing Clinton running up to Nov 2016 helped elect you know who. Hoyt Nov 2019 #18
I understand. It sure didn't help, though I think it was Comey's interference, and the media's still_one Nov 2019 #22
You are correct the other stuff was the main reason. I won't criticize after it's clear who will Hoyt Nov 2019 #52
Hillary said that McCain was far more qualified to be Commander-in-Chief than Obama. She emmaverybo Nov 2019 #27
I agree. My point was simply that approach helps no one except the republicans. I don't think this still_one Nov 2019 #30
I agree. Calling out Biden and others in this way is no argument for M4All and really does not emmaverybo Nov 2019 #36
highplainsdem, thanks for this posting. Sloumeau Nov 2019 #4
This... a voice of sanity/reality...thank you Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #21
Neener neener!!! She said it first. TidalWave46 Nov 2019 #5
I guess that we didn't read the same OP... Skya Rhen Nov 2019 #7
I read this one. TidalWave46 Nov 2019 #9
Thanks for this highplainsdem. Reminds us that we all support the same goals despite emmaverybo Nov 2019 #6
Untrue statement by Joe Biden crazytown Nov 2019 #8
Oh come on, it is clear what was meant...she wants to ditch Obama Care and I am against this Demsrule86 Nov 2019 #12
And why didn't she defend her plan instead of attacking a former Vice President in the Obama Demsrule86 Nov 2019 #15
One has to wonder that. She has all these plans she wants to extol, seems an opportunity missed Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #23
She has...running on MFA is going to hurt her chances in the primary...and I believe we lose the Demsrule86 Nov 2019 #25
Yup! Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #32
She has over twenty. All very costly investments, financially and politically. So far she is emmaverybo Nov 2019 #44
Maybe she is still miffed at rhe way wnylib Nov 2019 #72
Thanks for setting the record straight. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #39
It's what she said right after what you quoted that makes the statement true. beastie boy Nov 2019 #45
Warren was answering a question about costs - crazytown Nov 2019 #49
Whether it is in response to a question or a stand alone statement, beastie boy Nov 2019 #54
Her statement was in response to the question I quoted. crazytown Nov 2019 #61
Good answer, He can't let her get away with this sort of thing. Demsrule86 Nov 2019 #10
That's a great response from Biden! OldRed2450 Nov 2019 #11
And untrue. crazytown Nov 2019 #13
Very sad indeed... but, not unexpected. It tells you who's winning!! InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #40
Warren, Bernie, and Biden are in a statistical tie in a lot of polling I've seen n/t emulatorloo Nov 2019 #48
Joe is running against Trump. All the other Dems are running against Joe redstateblues Nov 2019 #14
That's about the sum of it peggysue2 Nov 2019 #19
Oh you bad!! Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #24
This spat is about the direction of the party as a whole. LonePirate Nov 2019 #28
I prefer real progress to pipe dreams. And Biden is more liberal than Hillary Clinton was: highplainsdem Nov 2019 #33
I prefer a party that can win and hold on to power. All Dems want change, but ya gotta win first Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #34
We can put a corpse on the ticket and still win in 2020 against 45. LonePirate Nov 2019 #47
Such complete and utter bullshit dansolo Nov 2019 #38
That still excludes health care for millions of America and very expensive for millions.more. LonePirate Nov 2019 #46
Insinuating that a fellow DU'er doesn't want affordable healthcare because you two have a policy emulatorloo Nov 2019 #50
The ACA is not afforable universal health care. Anybody pushing the ACA is against that. LonePirate Nov 2019 #51
The fastest and easiest way to fix that is more subsidies and a Public Option. Hoyt Nov 2019 #53
It doesn't help when Dems or DUers are pushing Republican and industry lies about MFA. LonePirate Nov 2019 #55
Got it, any policy discussion/difference in implementation is "A Republican Talking Point" emulatorloo Nov 2019 #57
Pushing a solution which does not guarantee affordable, universal health care is simply wrong. LonePirate Nov 2019 #60
So cram it down their throats, as being best for them, and see how quickly people will turn on Hoyt Nov 2019 #63
The choice is affordable health care or expensive health care. That choice is easy. LonePirate Nov 2019 #66
Fine, Sanders can tell voters it's her plan, like it or not. That won't get us far. Hoyt Nov 2019 #71
You have it backwards; public option is the fastest way for the HC system to collapse. MFA saves it! InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #75
What Hoyt said. Insinuating your fellow DU'ers are 'bad people' because they have different emulatorloo Nov 2019 #56
Are you saying people against affordable, universal health care are good people? LonePirate Nov 2019 #59
Stop putting words in my mouth I didn't say. And mischaracterizing what I have said. emulatorloo Nov 2019 #62
So it's OK for you to say I am insinuating something but I can't say the same about you? LonePirate Nov 2019 #64
Your basic premise is false. You claimed I made an argument I didn't make. emulatorloo Nov 2019 #67
The latter (like Warren AND Bernie). InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #41
Trump is the status quo now. BTW there's nothing "centrist" about the public option emulatorloo Nov 2019 #43
Joe Biden has spent his life helping elect Democrats across the country and served with honor.. Cha Nov 2019 #31
You nailed Cha!! Thekaspervote Nov 2019 #35
Joe says Warren is "making it up" on MFA, she hits back and he whines BeyondGeography Nov 2019 #58
I was a fan of Elizabeth Warren until this! Tumbulu Nov 2019 #65
Try reading what she actually said and not the overwrought spin. blm Nov 2019 #70
THIS!!! InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2019 #73
Just thought I'd throw this in there as well, Biden's polling in Iowa is not looking good. YOHABLO Nov 2019 #77
South Carolina will decide who wins this Primary. Take that to the bank. Skya Rhen Nov 2019 #81
Don't start none won't be none. /nt tonedevil Nov 2019 #78
Biden defends record after Warren attacks: I'm a 'card-carrying Democrat' Gothmog Nov 2019 #85
Pelosi cautions 2020 Dems over liberal proposals: 'You must win the Electoral College' Gothmog Nov 2019 #86
K&R Scurrilous Nov 2019 #90
 

FloridaBlues

(3,991 posts)
1. When Warren throws it expect push back. Frankly I was surprised by her comment
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:09 PM
Nov 2019

I hope it doesn't get worse as the next few months go forward and the squeeze of campaigning can really take its toll.
Sling the arrows at the republicans!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

blm

(112,919 posts)
26. What was her exact comment? Can you quote it as said?
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:18 PM
Nov 2019

TIA

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

beastie boy

(9,056 posts)
37. Here it is
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:40 PM
Nov 2019

“The cost projections that we have on Medicare were authenticated by President Obama’s head of Medicare. Our revenue projections were authenticated by President Obama’s labor economist. And the employer contribution is already part of the Affordable Care Act that President Obama put into the Affordable Care Act. So if Joe Biden doesn’t like that, I’m just not sure where he’s going."

She stated that if Biden doesn't agree with her plan after it was "authenticated" by former Obama officials, he doesn't know where he is going. Not only does this statement make no sense as a defense against Biden's criticism, Warren made it personal In response to his comments about the plan.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

blm

(112,919 posts)
69. She said SHE is just not sure where he's going. Why did you
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:20 PM
Nov 2019

change her words, or did you just misread it?

This seems like it’s being stretched and spun into a sin by Biden camp.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

beastie boy

(9,056 posts)
82. I quoted Warren precisely. Didn't change one letter.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 10:42 AM
Nov 2019

But let me rephrase my comment, based on what you apparently object to:

"She stated that if Biden doesn't agree with her plan after it was "authenticated" by former Obama officials, SHE doesn't know where he is going. Not only does this statement make no sense as a defense against Biden's criticism, Warren made it personal In response to his comments about the plan."

Does it change anything?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

blm

(112,919 posts)
83. You wrote your viewpoint over cherrypicked words.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 10:46 AM
Nov 2019

You are attached to your characterization of what she said instead of just lettin her own words stand.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

beastie boy

(9,056 posts)
84. So I no longer changed her words. Good.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 10:52 AM
Nov 2019

Am I still entitled to my viewpoint? Biden, and many others, seem to share it. That's a lot of cherry picking consensus out there!

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Skya Rhen

(2,701 posts)
2. One candidate wanted to primary Obama and another one is among those desperate to undo his signature
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:09 PM
Nov 2019

legislation. I will stick with the candidate who has always been loyal to the best President of my lifetime.

At least my candidate has never switched sides...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
16. Well said, and I agree.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:28 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(32,605 posts)
20. Well stated Skya.. thx
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:42 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cha

(295,899 posts)
29. Yeah, the heck with them.. I'll take President Obama
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:28 PM
Nov 2019

and Joe Biden who has always stood up for Obama.

Thank you, Skya! candle:

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
42. Thanks for saying this, Skya. Obama is a great man and was a great president. I am sticking
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:49 PM
Nov 2019

with his loyal and accomplished VP.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
68. Did you support Hilary?
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:12 PM
Nov 2019

She was a Young Republican before she became a Dem.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(10,811 posts)
74. Hillary was a Goldwater girl is high school
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 02:41 AM
Nov 2019

Not a 40-something adult.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
88. Hillary changed her political views
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 04:14 PM
Nov 2019

gradually while in college. In her senior year she left her activism for Republicans permanently after having supported Goldwater and then Rockefeller. She was drawn by her social values into the social activism movements of many young people in those days.

So, yes, you are right about the age difference between Hillary and Warren when they changed political affiliations.

I was merely ponting out that Warren is not the first candidate to have changed parties. Hillary was a political activist at a young age. Warren did not enter politics until later in life. Until then she was a registeted Republican and an Independent for a while. She supported Carter over Reagan in 1980.

I have nothing against Clinton. She was my senator and I voted for her in the Senate as well as for President.

Regarding Warren, I am more interested in who she is today. People change.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Cailinrain

(14 posts)
79. Wtf
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 04:45 AM
Nov 2019

I never post but this got to me. How ridiculous. Your own post states “young republican.” HRC has been a Democrat since college yet EW switched parties in her 40’s. No fucking comparison... where was EW when aids was raging?! Where was she when I was afraid to hold my girlfriends hand in public even in liberal land Seattle in the early 1990’s? Civil rights?! Gay rights?!? Where is the work?!!! EW did not have my back but other actual democrats did and I will throw my support their way rather than someone who switched sides during mid life crisis time. I want someone who uplifts our party and has been doing the work historically. EW has a place in o ur party but for someone who supported a republican agenda till midlife, they do not deserve the title of a democrat president.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Skya Rhen

(2,701 posts)
80. This! A million times, this! She was on the other side during the Civil Rights fight but expect AA
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 06:16 AM
Nov 2019

support now? We know who all were in the trenches fighting for us, during that time. The nerve...

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
89. Yes Hillary was politically active at
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 04:51 PM
Nov 2019

a very young age and left the Republican Party for good in her senior year of college. I was happy to have her as my Senator and voted for her in her Senate runs as well as for President in 2016. I was fortunate to meet her during a Dem rally in NY and to speak with her briefly.

I was merely pointing out that Warren is not the first candidate to change parties. Yes it was much later in life than Hillary. Warren was not politically active in rights issues when younger arid was registered as a Republican and as an Independent.

You are right that Warren has not contributed anywhere near what Hillary has on civil and human rights issues.

I am interested in who Warren is today and what she might or might not contribute to the party and the nation today. But you are right that she does not have an established record of fighting for civil and human rights.



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

OldRed2450

(710 posts)
87. Hillary was 17 years old
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 11:43 AM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
3. Warren was criticizing Obama -- and Clinton by association -- right up to 2016 election.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:10 PM
Nov 2019

Maybe someone should have called her out for helping the other candidate, who was also criticizing Obama/Clinton for same thing.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,937 posts)
17. I don't have problems with candidates criticizing each other Hoyt within the party, but I wish all
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:31 PM
Nov 2019

our candidates would refrain from comparing our candidates with “republican like” characteristics

To me that is counter productive, and hurts us all

Hillary did something like that by implying she and McCain had experience and President Obama had nothing.

For right now I don’t think any of this is a show stopper for any of our candidates, but I sure wish they would not use republican comparisons toward each other. Arguing things like “favoring insurance companies, etc is fair game, and should be debated, but let’s not make republican like characteristics against each other

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
18. I suggest criticizing Clinton running up to Nov 2016 helped elect you know who.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:35 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,937 posts)
22. I understand. It sure didn't help, though I think it was Comey's interference, and the media's
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:46 PM
Nov 2019

distortion and misrepresentation of that, that was the main culprit. At least implied from the polls before Comey and after Comey’s nonsense

but with the point you are making we are pretty much on the same page

Right now we are in the primary, but once our nominee is chosen I will be very upset if criticism of our nominee happens from our fellow Democrats



If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
52. You are correct the other stuff was the main reason. I won't criticize after it's clear who will
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:16 PM
Nov 2019

win nomination. But, we aren't there yet.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
27. Hillary said that McCain was far more qualified to be Commander-in-Chief than Obama. She
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:24 PM
Nov 2019

pretty much pulled out all the stops campaigning against Obama. I didn’t like it then and don’t now approve of Warren’s tack.

However, I think Hillary a very fine states person, politician, and top notch presidential candidate. She is a brilliant, strong woman. Just a force of nature. What she and Bill has to suffer! She earned her stripes the hard way. She has been tested, forged in fire.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

still_one

(91,937 posts)
30. I agree. My point was simply that approach helps no one except the republicans. I don't think this
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:34 PM
Nov 2019

approach helps Warren

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
36. I agree. Calling out Biden and others in this way is no argument for M4All and really does not
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:39 PM
Nov 2019

help the party either. Surely she can do better.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Sloumeau

(2,657 posts)
4. highplainsdem, thanks for this posting.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:10 PM
Nov 2019

President Barack Obama had to scale back his desire for a Public Option and give us Romneycare in order to give millions of Americans a chance to get healthcare. Obama recognized the political realities of the moment. Joe Biden also realizes that the path to single-payer healthcare may be in stages. Just because Senator Warren favors a huge, expensive plan does not mean that everyone pushing for a smaller, more likely to pass plan is a Republican.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(32,605 posts)
21. This... a voice of sanity/reality...thank you
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:43 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

TidalWave46

(2,061 posts)
5. Neener neener!!! She said it first.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:11 PM
Nov 2019

I love the guy but that’s weak.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Skya Rhen

(2,701 posts)
7. I guess that we didn't read the same OP...
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:14 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
6. Thanks for this highplainsdem. Reminds us that we all support the same goals despite
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:12 PM
Nov 2019

differences in how to go about achieving them. I am glad to see Biden vigorously defend his record, one of accomplishment on multiple fronts.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

crazytown

(7,277 posts)
8. Untrue statement by Joe Biden
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:16 PM
Nov 2019

“Yesterday, Elizabeth Warren suggested I was ‘running in the wrong presidential primary’ because I believe in building on Obamacare — not getting rid of it.

What Elizabeth Warren said was

If anyone wants to defend keeping those high profits for Insurance companies, and those high profits for Drug companies, and not making the top 1% pay a fair share in taxes, and not making corporations pay a fair share in taxes, then I think they are running in the wrong presidential primary.

How can this be spun as "because I believe in building on Obamacare — not getting rid of it"?

Warren was taking issue with the Biden's campaign disputing her costings:

The cost projections that we have on Medicare were authenticated by President Obama’s head of Medicare. Our revenue projections were authenticated by President Obama’s labor economist. And the employer contribution is already part of the Affordable Care Act that President Obama put into the Affordable Care Act. So if Joe Biden doesn’t like that, I’m just not sure where he’s going

This is sharp politics on VP Biden's part, which deserves an equally sharp response.


If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
12. Oh come on, it is clear what was meant...she wants to ditch Obama Care and I am against this
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:22 PM
Nov 2019

also, starting from scratch makes no sense. And I fear we will fail and lose both the ACA and any chance at MFA...then what. She shouldn't have said it. Biden is a national treasure.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
15. And why didn't she defend her plan instead of attacking a former Vice President in the Obama
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:26 PM
Nov 2019

administration who dedicated his entire life to the progressive movement. Can she defend her plan? Because I promise you, the GOP and Trump will come at her way harder than Biden in a general.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(32,605 posts)
23. One has to wonder that. She has all these plans she wants to extol, seems an opportunity missed
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:50 PM
Nov 2019

Just IMHO.. this is more about her not wanting to say. She’s gotten herself in a very tight spot

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
25. She has...running on MFA is going to hurt her chances in the primary...and I believe we lose the
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:12 PM
Nov 2019

general if we run on MFA.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

emmaverybo

(8,144 posts)
44. She has over twenty. All very costly investments, financially and politically. So far she is
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:56 PM
Nov 2019

being challenged only on M4All, so defending it without resorting to “RW talking point” will be good
practice.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
72. Maybe she is still miffed at rhe way
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:43 PM
Nov 2019

Biden grabbed credit in the debate for Warren's achievement in her appointed position under Obams and then patronized her when she took back the credit. She restrained herself then but against Trump she wouldn't. We have already seen her take Trump on and I am sure she could do it again.

I was put off by both of those moves by Biden in the debate. He struck the first low blow so why does he complain when she fights back in the same manner?

But I hope the disagreements stay on issues in the future and not on personal attacks. Who would want to immitate the Republican debates of 2016?

Biden also needs to take a higher rosd than he has. And knock off the patronization toward a female candidate. Women are watching these debates and forming their views of Biden as they do.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
39. Thanks for setting the record straight.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:46 PM
Nov 2019

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

beastie boy

(9,056 posts)
45. It's what she said right after what you quoted that makes the statement true.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:58 PM
Nov 2019

“The cost projections that we have on Medicare were authenticated by President Obama’s head of Medicare. Our revenue projections were authenticated by President Obama’s labor economist. And the employer contribution is already part of the Affordable Care Act that President Obama put into the Affordable Care Act. So if Joe Biden doesn’t like that, I’m just not sure where he’s going."

The implication of this is that, according to Warren, authenticating parts of her plan by former Obama officials constitutes agreement with her plan, which it does not, and by the virtue of this authentication, Biden is not permitted to disagree with it. And if he does, he, according to Warren, doesn't know where he is going. Not only does her statement fail to address Biden's criticism, she responded with insulting Biden personally.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

crazytown

(7,277 posts)
49. Warren was answering a question about costs -
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:07 PM
Nov 2019

The actual question was: "Q:Joe Biden called your plan 'mathematical gymnastics’, Said it is impossible to pay for Medicare For All without middle class tax increases. What is your reply ..."

The obvious interpretation of her answer is .".. if he does not accept these numbers ... what is he saying"?

You can put the worst spin on her response if you want to.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

beastie boy

(9,056 posts)
54. Whether it is in response to a question or a stand alone statement,
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:21 PM
Nov 2019

If you take her statement as a whole and don't try to parse it, it speaks for itself.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

crazytown

(7,277 posts)
61. Her statement was in response to the question I quoted.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:38 PM
Nov 2019

Biden's characterization is sharp and mendacious.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Demsrule86

(68,347 posts)
10. Good answer, He can't let her get away with this sort of thing.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:20 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

OldRed2450

(710 posts)
11. That's a great response from Biden!
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:20 PM
Nov 2019

Look at what I have done, not what I say I will do.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

crazytown

(7,277 posts)
13. And untrue.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:23 PM
Nov 2019

Sad stuff.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
40. Very sad indeed... but, not unexpected. It tells you who's winning!!
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:47 PM
Nov 2019

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
48. Warren, Bernie, and Biden are in a statistical tie in a lot of polling I've seen n/t
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:04 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

redstateblues

(10,565 posts)
14. Joe is running against Trump. All the other Dems are running against Joe
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:25 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

peggysue2

(10,811 posts)
19. That's about the sum of it
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 08:36 PM
Nov 2019

He's fighting two fights at once. And still standing.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
28. This spat is about the direction of the party as a whole.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:27 PM
Nov 2019

Do you prefer the party to adopt moderate, centrist positions that don't change the status quo (like Biden) or do you prefer the party adopt strong, progressive positions that transform America (like Warren)?

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

highplainsdem

(48,718 posts)
33. I prefer real progress to pipe dreams. And Biden is more liberal than Hillary Clinton was:
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:36 PM
Nov 2019
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287271997



https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/election/campaigns/article234890482.html


From health care to climate change to criminal justice, Biden has proposed ideas more ambitious and liberal than policies supported by Hillary Clinton in the 2016 campaign, a McClatchy review of the candidates’ platforms found.

Taken as a whole, Biden’s policy platform represents a significant shift from Clinton’s. On nearly every major issue, Biden has either exponentially increased the scope of what Clinton proposed or advocated for new ideas that most Democrats would have up until recently considered fringe.

-snip-

And whether voters view a candidate as “liberal” also depends on how they compare to their opponents. In most cases, Biden’s agenda isn’t as far to the left as Bernie Sanders’ or Elizabeth Warren’s, and is roughly comparable to other opponents’ plans like Kamala Harris or Cory Booker.

Still, Biden’s current set of policy prescriptions would likely be considered radical if they had been proposed in any previous Democratic presidential primary. That’s especially clear in comparison to Clinton’s 2016 platform.

-snip-
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Thekaspervote

(32,605 posts)
34. I prefer a party that can win and hold on to power. All Dems want change, but ya gotta win first
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:38 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
47. We can put a corpse on the ticket and still win in 2020 against 45.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:02 PM
Nov 2019

Anybody who says Biden is the only candidate who can win is lying.

Look at what Americans 30 and under want for this country - profound change. Biden is the antithesis of that.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

dansolo

(5,376 posts)
38. Such complete and utter bullshit
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:43 PM
Nov 2019

Do you know what doesn't change the status quo? Pushing a fantasy plan that has zero chance of ever passing instead of even accepting any sort of improvements, no matter how minor. The ACA was not perfect, but we can fix the broken parts and roll back the Republican sabotage so it can work like it was intended.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
46. That still excludes health care for millions of America and very expensive for millions.more.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:59 PM
Nov 2019

I guess affordable health care for all Americans is something you do not believe in if you're pushing fixes to the ACA. The ACA was a compromise with conservative Democrats and committee Republicans, who voted against the bill anyway. We can do better than the ACA.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
50. Insinuating that a fellow DU'er doesn't want affordable healthcare because you two have a policy
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:09 PM
Nov 2019

difference is a sad rhetorical device. You are surrounded by left liberals and progressives here.

All DU’ers want affordable/universal healthcare.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
51. The ACA is not afforable universal health care. Anybody pushing the ACA is against that.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:12 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
53. The fastest and easiest way to fix that is more subsidies and a Public Option.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:20 PM
Nov 2019

Last edited Sun Nov 3, 2019, 09:30 AM - Edit history (1)

If Public Option is anywhere near as good as we think, people will gravitate to it much quicker than Warren can implement, "Medicare Whether You Want It or Not."

Plus, I think MFA is a general election loser, putting us farther out.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
55. It doesn't help when Dems or DUers are pushing Republican and industry lies about MFA.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:24 PM
Nov 2019

People hate change in the health care system but a dramatic overhaul is needed in the health care system in America. That scares people so they will say or do anything to prevent it from happening.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
57. Got it, any policy discussion/difference in implementation is "A Republican Talking Point"
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:30 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
60. Pushing a solution which does not guarantee affordable, universal health care is simply wrong.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:36 PM
Nov 2019

When you have Dems and DUers screaming about higher taxes from MFA, while deliberating ignoring the elimination of current premiums, deductibles, co-pays, prescription costs and other out of pocket expenses - a tactic often employed by Republicans - then yes, I would consider those to be Republican excuses for not implementing MFA.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
63. So cram it down their throats, as being best for them, and see how quickly people will turn on
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:44 PM
Nov 2019

the health plan. Right or wrong, people need to feel they have a choice.

I bet within 5 years 80% will be enrolled in PO. Then we can say, though chit this is what you'll have, like it or not.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
66. The choice is affordable health care or expensive health care. That choice is easy.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:57 PM
Nov 2019

Ignoring the facts and industry experts never turns out well for anyone.

The public option is not the ACA and it is not MFA. It is a compromise between the two. I simply prefer moving directly to the end game solution instead of taking a half-step because people need to be coddled and think having a choice between insurance providers is their best solution, when eliminating insurance providers altogether is by far the better solution.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
71. Fine, Sanders can tell voters it's her plan, like it or not. That won't get us far.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:23 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
75. You have it backwards; public option is the fastest way for the HC system to collapse. MFA saves it!
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 03:02 AM
Nov 2019

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
56. What Hoyt said. Insinuating your fellow DU'ers are 'bad people' because they have different
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:27 PM
Nov 2019

views on how to get there isn’t productive.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
59. Are you saying people against affordable, universal health care are good people?
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:30 PM
Nov 2019

Those people, by their beliefs are fine with Americans not having health care and thus not being able to live. That's essentially the argument you are making.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
62. Stop putting words in my mouth I didn't say. And mischaracterizing what I have said.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:42 PM
Nov 2019

Because you did that, I don’t see any point in continuing this conversation.

That being said, I hope you have a great Saturday evening and a good rest of the weekend.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

LonePirate

(13,386 posts)
64. So it's OK for you to say I am insinuating something but I can't say the same about you?
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:52 PM
Nov 2019

That's certainly an interesting tactic to utilize.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
67. Your basic premise is false. You claimed I made an argument I didn't make.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:00 PM
Nov 2019

Its been an interesting chat. It isn’t productive any more. Bye and good night.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
41. The latter (like Warren AND Bernie).
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:48 PM
Nov 2019

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

emulatorloo

(43,979 posts)
43. Trump is the status quo now. BTW there's nothing "centrist" about the public option
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:51 PM
Nov 2019

Elsewise moderates like Lieberman wouldn’t have killed the public option.

Trump and Republicans are the status quo now, and they have zero interest in universal healthcare.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Cha

(295,899 posts)
31. Joe Biden has spent his life helping elect Democrats across the country and served with honor..
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 09:34 PM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

BeyondGeography

(39,276 posts)
58. Joe says Warren is "making it up" on MFA, she hits back and he whines
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:30 PM
Nov 2019

Meantime, Buttigieg is eating his lunch in Iowa and threatening to eclipse him in NH.

Someone and his team need to wake up.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Tumbulu

(6,267 posts)
65. I was a fan of Elizabeth Warren until this!
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 10:53 PM
Nov 2019

Now I am leaning towards voting Biden. I am aghast at her approach to this difference in opinion.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

blm

(112,919 posts)
70. Try reading what she actually said and not the overwrought spin.
Sat Nov 2, 2019, 11:22 PM
Nov 2019

From the actual transcript...
What Elizabeth Warren said was

“If anyone wants to defend keeping those high profits for Insurance companies, and those high profits for Drug companies, and not making the top 1% pay a fair share in taxes, and not making corporations pay a fair share in taxes, then I think they are running in the wrong presidential primary.”


Warren was taking issue with the Biden's campaign disputing her costings:

“The cost projections that we have on Medicare were authenticated by President Obama’s head of Medicare. Our revenue projections were authenticated by President Obama’s labor economist. And the employer contribution is already part of the Affordable Care Act that President Obama put into the Affordable Care Act. So if Joe Biden doesn’t like that, I’m just not sure where he’s going.”

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

InAbLuEsTaTe

(24,110 posts)
73. THIS!!!
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 12:57 AM
Nov 2019

Bernie/Elizabeth or Elizabeth/Bernie 2020!!
Either way, they're stronger together!!
Welcome to the revolution!!!
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

YOHABLO

(7,358 posts)
77. Just thought I'd throw this in there as well, Biden's polling in Iowa is not looking good.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 03:43 AM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Skya Rhen

(2,701 posts)
81. South Carolina will decide who wins this Primary. Take that to the bank.
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 06:31 AM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

tonedevil

(3,022 posts)
78. Don't start none won't be none. /nt
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 04:19 AM
Nov 2019
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Undecided
 

Gothmog

(143,998 posts)
85. Biden defends record after Warren attacks: I'm a 'card-carrying Democrat'
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 10:56 AM
Nov 2019



“Yesterday, Elizabeth Warren suggested I was ‘running in the wrong presidential primary’ because I believe in building on Obamacare — not getting rid of it. That's so wrong, it’s almost laughable. I’ve been a card-carrying Democrat since I was 27. And I am running for president because of my progressive record,” Biden wrote in an email to supporters, hitting Warren for registering as a Republican for years before becoming a Democrat.

“If my opponents want to have a debate on what they've done to truly implement progressive, meaningful change in our country — not what they’re planning, not what they’re proposing, but what they’ve accomplished — I welcome it,” he added, swiping at Warren’s “I’ve got a plan for that” mantra. “But to hurl insults because we don’t share the same approach for the best way to get to the same goal…well that is something I would expect in the other primary.” ….

Biden slammed Warren’s “Medicare for All” plan Friday, saying that the plan's proposed $9 trillion tax on employers would be passed off to companies’ employees.

“For months, Elizabeth Warren has refused to say if her health care plan would raise taxes on the middle class, and now we know why: because it does,” said Biden deputy campaign manager Kate Bedingfield. “Senator Warren would place a new tax of nearly $9 trillion that will fall on American workers.”
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Gothmog

(143,998 posts)
86. Pelosi cautions 2020 Dems over liberal proposals: 'You must win the Electoral College'
Sun Nov 3, 2019, 11:21 AM
Nov 2019

I stand with the leader of our Party, Speaker Pelosi




“What works in San Francisco does not necessarily work in Michigan,” Pelosi said in an interview with Bloomberg News published Saturday. “What works in Michigan works in San Francisco — talking about workers’ rights and sharing prosperity.”
“Remember November,” she added. “You must win the Electoral College.”

While the California Democrat declined to endorse any candidate in the primary race, she unloaded on progressive policies, saying they fail to make inroads with swing voters who backed President Trump in 2016.

“As a left-wing San Francisco liberal I can say to these people: What are you thinking?” Pelosi said. “You can ask the left — they’re unhappy with me for not being a socialist.”

The speaker specifically singled out Medicare for All as an example of a policy that may be beyond the pale for moderate voters the party will need to win back next year.

“Protect the Affordable Care Act — I think that’s the path to health care for all Americans. Medicare For All has its complications,” Pelosi said, adding that “the Affordable Care Act is a better benefit than Medicare.”
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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