Kamala - Let's be clear: marijuana isn't a gateway drug and should be legalized.

[USALiberal]

Link to tweet

[Ferrets are Cool]

1. Thank you for being the "adult" in the room Ms Harris!

[blm]

2. ✔️

[Eliot Rosewater]

32. So you ARE SAYING that Joe Biden is NOT an adult, right?

Go ahead, say it, it is EXACTLY what that REMARK means.

so sick of this shit



putting the word adult in quotes...why are people BASHING JOE BIDEN on Democratic Underground??????????

__________________________________________________________

As an ACTUAL supporter of Kamala, who WONT bash her later on when her past or comments are brought up, I support her comment on this of course. But I am willing to bet MOUNTAINS OF MONEY if she gets close to being the nominee certain folks will be BASHING THE HELL out of her...

[Ferrets are Cool]

52. I believe it is childish and uninformed to SAY that marijuana is a gateway drug.

I will not back away from that statement. You, however, can choose to disagree.

[Eliot Rosewater]

57. NOW you are calling JOE BIDEN "childish and uninformed"...welcome to how we got

in this condition in the first place.

I can only IMAGINE the comments in the past about another Democrat.


THIS, to all my liberal friends, is what we have to overcome SOMEHOW!

[Ferrets are Cool]

64. If you are worried about ME, you are wasting your time

but it IS your time. Waste it in any manner you wish.

[Eliot Rosewater]

66. Oh yeah, I am worried about ALL who CLAIM to be on the left who will NOT vote blue no matter who

[Ferrets are Cool]

85. I wont even dignify this apparent attack on me except to say this conversation is over.

[cwydro]

3. Rec.

[Skya Rhen]

4. When Kamala says she's running for President and isn't interested in being anyone's VP, she was

serious. I look forward to seeing her remain in the senate for many years to follow.

I know a personal and unnecessary dig when I see one. I hope that the Biden campaign sees what I see and chooses Joe's VP wisely.

[USALiberal]

7. She is just correcting Biden's mistake! Nt

[Skya Rhen]

9. At her expense, perhaps.

[llashram]

5. I agree

[LeftTurn3623]

6. It shows you how out of touch Biden is

Biden just recently said marijuana is a gateway drug.

[beastie boy]

13. All the excessive focus on pot legalization on DU shows how out of touch some Dems are.

Democratic voters couldn't care less about it.

https://morningconsult.com/2019/06/25/climate-guns-and-abortion-are-top-debate-topics-for-democratic-voters/

[Act_of_Reparation]

14. Who gives a shit?

If John Q. Asshat handed out academy awards, Ashton Kutcher would have a war chest full of Oscars. Some issues are important and worthy of discussion, regardless of what some people think.

[Thekaspervote]

15. Why sooooo angry..

[Act_of_Reparation]

19. Such a substantive rejoinder.

Ashton Kutcher fan, I assume?

[LanternWaste]

47. Much as is "who gives a shit?"

"Such a substantive rejoinder..."

Much as is "who gives a shit?"

Six of one, half a dozen of the other (regardless of the petulant irrelevance of favorite television actors).

[Act_of_Reparation]

54. Most posts contain words beyond the subject line.

But I'm sure you already knew that.

[AtheistCrusader]

44. Because there are americans decomposing in jail over this shit.

You do know that, right? That hundreds of thousands of lives are directly impacted by this issue? Tens of thousands of lives destroyed, not by the drug, but by our legal policies toward it? People racially profiled/racially discriminated against in our justice system?

ACLU:

Of the 8.2 million marijuana arrests between 2001 and 2010, 88% were for simply having marijuana. Nationwide, the arrest data revealed one consistent trend: significant racial bias. Despite roughly equal usage rates, Blacks are 3.73 times more likely than whites to be arrested for marijuana.

Yeah, I'm fuckin angry. Why aren't you?

[beastie boy]

18. It's not "some people" It's the vast majority of people.

And I am not questioning your right to discuss any issues. I am just exercising my right to point out how insignificant the issue is to the Democraric Primaries, which is, after all, the title of this forum.

[Act_of_Reparation]

21. I assume you know what a bandwagon is.

And I assume you understand we are primary voters, and the issue is important to us. If our concerns are not widely shared, then it's of no consequence to Biden and you have nothing to be worried about. So what's the problem?

[Thekaspervote]

22. Whyyour constant need to keep banging on this issue when Biden is farther left than any president

And has a very progressive stance. This has been so blown out of proportion

Biden’s official stance on marijuana

Link to tweet

/photo/1

[Act_of_Reparation]

55. As long as it remains illegal at the federal level...

...none of this means anything.

[Gothmog]

58. Thank you for posting this

[tishaLA]

70. It's good he spent so much of his adult life working on that, then

How many bills did he write or sponsor or support while he was in the Senate or VP? He had 40+ years in public life for it.

[beastie boy]

24. I thought I knew what a bandwagon is, but now I am not sure.

Are you by any chance applying the term to describe the majority that wins elections? Ok, it's not a conventional definition of a bandwagon, but I will accept it.

And it appears to me the issue is not as important to you as you claim. It is remarkable how quickly comments on Kamala's remark turn to Biden bashing. Something tells me the latter may be just as important to "we", if not more so, than what Harris said.

[George II]

39. I don't know who your "we" and "us" are, but I am a primary voter and there are dozens....

....of issues more pressing in 2019/2020 than getting high.

[LeftTurn3623]

17. obviously there are more important issues

it doesnt make Biden any less out of touch

[beastie boy]

28. An issue is an issue, no matter how insignificant. Discuss it all you want.

Just don't turn this discussion, over, and over, and over again to Biden. Makes your focus on the issue suspect.

When you tell the same joke more than twice, no matter how funny, it loses its punch. And I've read the same Biden joke dozens of times.

[LeftTurn3623]

33. what is the joke you are referring to?

[beastie boy]

40. It is a metaphor. I am referring to overly excessive mentions of

Biden in a thread that was intended to be about Harris.

[George II]

41. Biden is out of touch? Sheesh....

?itemid=5047272

[The Valley Below]

30. No, what he said was that it "might be" a gateway drug, which is in line with the best science.

Use by adolescents seems to change the structure of the brain, lowers IQ, lowers dopamine levels, and makes future drug abuse more likely.

We need people who are actually in touch with reality in positions of leadership.

[George II]

37. That is a LOT different than "he said it was a gateway drug"! Thanks.

[The Valley Below]

38. Correct. Unfortunately the science does seem to suggest the likelihood that such is the case.

Adults should look hard at the evidence at the negative aspects of marijuana on adolescent brains.

[Calculating]

86. Which is exactly why you need to be 21 to legally use it

What is your point? Nobody anywhere is suggesting adolescents should have access to cannabis, and even then alcohol is still worse. Law abiding adults should not face legal repercussions for responsible use.

[The Valley Below]

90. My point is that when CA voted to legalize recreational pot we were were promised...

that the trade would be well-regulated.

That is not what's happened.

Here in CA the illegal trade dwarfs that of liscenced dispensaries. There are illegal shops everywhere and--more troublesome--illegal delivery services. Many of these criminal enterprises sell to minors.

Enforcement has virtually ended. And marijuana--especially vape products--are in the hands of teens at unprecedented levels. Use by teens--often during school hours, on campuses--has skyrocketed and it is taking a huge toll on learning, causing emotional and mental health, failing academics, altered brain development, lowering of IQ, and other problems.

We need a better path than the one here in CA to protect adolescents, as it has been a massive failure here and the problems are far (far) greater than is being acknowledged.

[George II]

36. No he didn't. Just when/how DID he say marijuana is a gateway drug?

[jalan48]

79. Viewing marijuana as a gateway drug was in vogue during the same time phonographs were in use.

[LeftTurn3623]

84. lol

nice

[pecosbob]

8. I agreed with this argument forty years ago and still do.

Last edited Tue Nov 19, 2019, 12:28 PM - Edit history (1)

It's forty years late if you ask me.

[BigOleDummy]

12. Agreed

Seems I don't know how to post this morning , sheesh. But to try again. I almost fell out of my chair when I read Mr. Biden say that tired old canard. Followed with support for a death penalty?!? The D.P. as a deterrent as well as the "gateway" canard has been disproven countless times. I believe poor old Mr. Biden has shot himself in the foot with this one.

[Thekaspervote]

16. Here's Joe Biden's OFFICIAL stance on marijuana and is very progressive

Link to tweet

/photo/1

[George II]

43. Interesting, I don't see anywhere that Biden said marijuana is a gateway drug.

[loyalsister]

46. His sentiiment does not align with that policy

He is leaning on an outdated concept of gateway drug.
We have failed to fully address the destruction that comes with substance abuse by injecting morality and criminalization. The behavior that leads people to break drugs laws is not always necessarily damaging. But, getting caught can burn down their lives. We failed to make important distinctions long ago when we criminalized substances rather than work on trying to understand the myriad of behaviors which are part of drug seeking.

[KPN]

23. I really like Kamala Harris. She's sharp. She'd make a great President.

I'd happily support her if she wins the nomination which, unfortunately, doesn't look very likely at all. VP then!

[Skya Rhen]

25. Perhaps Warren's or Sanders' VP but I don't care for her being Biden's VP - still too adversarial.

[LovingA2andMI]

26. And this is why....

She is struggling with the same voters that Biden has in S.C. - Older African-American Voters.

[The Valley Below]

27. The science doesn't support Sen. Harris's conclusions.

Epidemiologic and preclinical data suggest that the use of marijuana in adolescence could influence multiple addictive behaviors in adulthood.

In rodents exposed to cannabinoids during adolescence, there is decreased reactivity of the dopamine neurons that modulate the brain’s reward regions.18 The exposure of rodents to cannabis in utero alters the developmental regulation of the mesolimbic dopamine system of affected offspring.19

If reduced dopamine reactivity in the brain’s reward regions does follow early exposure to marijuana, this effect could help to explain the increased susceptibility to drug abuse and addiction to several drugs later in life, which has been reported in most epidemiologic studies.20

This theory is also consistent with animal models showing that THC can prime the brain for enhanced responses to other drugs.21

Although these findings support the idea that marijuana is a gateway drug, other drugs, such as alcohol and nicotine, can also be categorized as gateway drugs, since they also prime the brain for a heightened response to other drugs.22

However, an alternative explanation is that people who are more susceptible to drug-taking behavior are simply more likely to start with marijuana because of its accessibility and that their subsequent social interactions with other drug users would increase the probability that they would try other drugs.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4827335/

[crazytown]

59. "could"

'could influence' 'could help to explain' - It's speculative science based on a mouse model. The science doesn't disprove Sen. Harris's conclusions either.

[The Valley Below]

60. Science does not support Sen Harris's conclusion.

She is absolute in saying marijuana is NOT a gateway drug. The evidence suggests that conclusion is not supported by the evidence.

Biden is the adult-in-the-room who has it right.

He is listening to the science and encouraging further study. That is smart. And that's what I expect from liberal Democratic leaders who hope to be the next president.

We have too much at stake to get this wrong.

[crazytown]

61. You can't prove a negative.

[The Valley Below]

62. That not the operative condition here.

Sen Harris makes a positive statement claiming marijuana is NOT a gateway drug.

There is strong evidence to suggest otherwise.

Therefore her proposition lacks the support of science.

This has nothing to do with "proving a negative."

Furthermore, the harms done by marijuana consumption, especially by adolescents, go far beyond it being a potential "gateway drug."

[crazytown]

63. A mouse model is NOT strong evidence.

We have strong evidence we can cure cancer too.

[Calculating]

87. Marijuana is not a gateway drug

Come on, didn't we get past this nonsense 20 years ago? The whole gateway drug concept is flawed because it can apply to anything pleasurable. Sugary foods and video games could be considered addiction gateways under the logic behind calling cannabis a gateway drug.

[boomer_wv]

29. Disingenuous

How many people did Harris help put away in California for marijuana related crimes?

[beachbumbob]

31. Long time overdue

So many lives ruined from being busted for mere possession.

[Grins]

34. The gateway drug....is tobacco.

...to marijuana, alcohol, OxyContin. We have known that for years.

[stonecutter357]

35. marijuana was a gateway for me ...

[tonedevil]

45. What do you mean by that? /nt

[jalan48]

42. Thanks for bringing the discussion into the 21st century Senator Harris.

[DesertRat]

48. k&r

[Bettie]

49. Yes

it should be legal. Thanks Sen. Harris for this!

[Andy823]

50. Once again

Harris shows she is in touch with what the people want. She listens to them, and that is what we need in a president. She has my vote.

[guillaumeb]

51. Recommended.

That does seem obvious, and evidence supported.

[Devil Child]

53. Thank you Sen. Harris for taking a sane position regarding marijuana!

[Politicub]

56. She's right. And I'm glad Biden clarified his position.

[egduj]

65. I like her stance more.

[aikoaiko]

67. Why is this so difficult for Biden to be a leader like Kamala Harris.

I hope she hammers him in the debate on this and his "decriminalization" verbiage can be confronted for being weaselly.

[The Valley Below]

71. How is Harris a leader on this issue? She put people away for marijuana use.

She was less than truthful about smoking pot in school while she listened to Snoop and Tupac.

And she's wrong in claiming that marijuana isn't a gateway drug.

0/3.

Strike out.

[aikoaiko]

72. The whole concept of a gateway drug is dubious.

Her policy stance is better than Joe's.

[The Valley Below]

73. Not at all. The scientific evidence suggests that it is a gateway drug.

And that's among the lesser risks to users, especially adolescent users.

Her position is far less reasoned that VP Biden's. His caution is grounded in the known science that he wants bolstered with more research.

[Calculating]

88. No

If anything causes it to be a gateway it's the fact that it's illegal and you need to get it from dealers who push the harder stuff.

[The Valley Below]

93. No. It seems THC use--especially my teens--alters brain development and lowers dopamine levels.

Read the medical literature. You are misinformed.

[PatSeg]

68. I wonder how many republican operatives

are visiting these message boards and take notes about infighting among Democrats, so they can use these wedge issues later on to divide us. Its not that this isn't an important issue, but on a list of priorities, I think there are plenty of issues that take precedent.

Down the road, when ideally we have a majority in the senate and the house and a Democratic president, then we can raise hell on such issues. Priority #1 is get Trump out the White House and send McConnell back to Kentucky. If we don't purge DC of republicans, we'll never see the progressive change we desire.

[The Mouth]

69. THANK YOU

Having had two friends who have had convictions for minor amounts of marijuana, and have had their lives negatively impacted, I am utterly zero tolerance for anyone who is anti legalization.

[The Valley Below]

74. Have you had friends whose children have been admitted to neuropsychiatric hospitals...

due to heavy pot consumption?

Because I have.

[The Mouth]

75. spare me.

Anyone against legalization is a jackboot licking police state apologist, and morally responsible for all the MILLIONS of people decomposing in prison for marijuana offenses. Reefer madness isn't a documentary; and you have zero evidence that marijuana is the *CAUSE* of any psychiatric illness, at the most it's correlation and often self medication.

[The Valley Below]

76. On the contrary. The evidence that heavy marijuana consumption is linked to mental illness

--especially with adolescents--is serous and compelling. We need to do more research since "causality" is very difficult to determine conclusively.

Heavy pot consumption is associated with an increased risk of anxiety and depression and with various with psychoses including triggering schizophrenia.

I've had dear friends with children who have been admitted to neuropsychiatric hospitals with serious psychological issues after they starting heavy consumption of marijuana. Kids that were happy and seeming well-adjusted prior to abusing this drug. Kids I've know pretty well.

So I'm not going to "spare you" from the truth of my real world experiences no matter how hostile, abusive, or aggressive you get in your responses.

Science isn't on your side.

[The Mouth]

77. Sorry

Drug warriors are deserving of pretty much the same treatment as homophobes, sexists, and racists- that is opprobrium and ridicule (not that merely being an anti weed warrior is quite as loathsome). Enemies of freedom and agents of oppression and imprisonment of innocent people minding their own business.

At least Biden realizes that the vast majority of rational people now know that it is NONE of the government's business, at least on the federal level, whatever his past errors.

Get it the hell off of the federal scheduling and then the kind of repressive thugs who want to throw people in prison for consuming weed can go to the red states where they belong.

I'm sure you're utterly sincere about the tragic events in your friends lives being actually linked to cannabis consumption, just as people genuinely believed that the Iranians yanked babies out of incubators, or that Saddam had WMDs or that the North Vietnamese attacked us in the Gulf of Tonkin, but I'm going to fight, with a vengance based on the oppression I've actually seen due to anti weed laws, against anyone positing it should in any way be illegal for adults.

[The Valley Below]

78. "Drug warriors?" LOL.

People who have legitimate concerns about the downsides of heavy marijuana use by adolescents are hardly "drug warriors."

You are really being over the top and off base.

[The Mouth]

80. I'm used to having the jackboots of your like on my neck EOM

There is no legitimate reason, unless you have stock in private prisons or enjoy the racist imprisonment of your fellow citizens, or simply lick those jackboots for pleasure, to be opposed to the legalization of cannabis.

Obviously, Joe is running to be the president of even the inbred knuckle-dragging tea partiers who want to keep it illegal; I thought we were more progressive than that around here, but it's a big tent.

[maximusveritas]

82. You're right and I've seen it firsthand

since I work in the field and have seen plenty of such cases where a kid has a psychotic break due to cannabis use.
There is plenty of research to support it too.
No point in arguing with some of these marijuana people though. For them, it is practically a religion, so it's like arguing with a creationist. No point since they are so committed to their position, they don't listen to reason.

[The Valley Below]

83. One situation has hit me particularly hard. A really great kid that my family has known since

he was about six years old, an athlete, a student leader, a talented musician, handsome, social, and a really kind & sweet young man.

He evidently started using heavily in his last years of high school.

Then he went into in a neuropsychiatric hospital after a terrible psychic break. His doctors say the heavy marijuana use likely helped trigger him developing schizophrenia.

He was supposed to start university this fall. Instead he was on the same campus that he was planning to attend, but in the university's neuropsychiatric hospital instead of in school. Devastating.

Thanks for working in the field and helping people. So important. And thanks for speaking up.

Takes some courage, unfortunately.

I really appreciate it!

[Calculating]

92. Oh, the truth comes out

You're referring to schizophrenia, which naturally manifests itself near the late teen years usually. I won't dispute that cannabis can trigger schizophrenia in those who already had a disposition to the illness, but that's hardly a reason why normal people and responsible adults should be criminalized for it. If you don't already have a disposition for schizophrenia, you won't get it from cannabis consumption.

[The Valley Below]

95. Truth comes out? LOL.

There are numerous psychological and mental health problems that heavy marijuana use can trigger. Schizophrenia is one among them, and a particularly serious condition.

Marijuana use my teens also lowers IQ and undermines learning, lowering life prospects.

So we need better plans than the model we have here in CA, which is a complete fail with regard to protecting young people.

[Calculating]

96. They were probably already going to develop schizophrenia

Cannabis may have simply accelerated the inevitable. Nobody anywhere wants teens using it, the laws stopping teens from getting booze aren't perfect either, but that doesn't mean alcohol should be criminalized.

[The Valley Below]

97. That's not clear. Pot use may trigger schizophrenia in teens when it would not have happened

otherwise, and it might be more servere. The data is not entirely conclusive. But there is a clear link. We need more research, which is VP Biden's point.

And alchohol is not generally being consumed at school, although there maybe some cases.

In contrast, THC vape pens are being passed around on school campuses daily. It is way easier to get than alchohol. Illegal delivery services will bring it right to a teen's door.

We need to be more responsible about how we do this.

[Calculating]

89. Pure bs

Nobody needs to go to the psych ward cause of cannabis consumption unless they were already one step from the edge. Are you sure they weren't using spice or something like bath salts?

[The Valley Below]

91. You are dead-wrong.

I'd suggest you delve into the medical literature. The truth is that it is rather common.

Get educated. You are out of step with the science and behind the curve.

[Calculating]

94. My experience is my own, and that of my family/friends

Nobody has ended up in the psych ward, and we all use cannabis. People have had their lives ruined by law enforcement though. In the worst case my brother was caught with it and sentenced to probation with drug testing. To get around the drug testing he started using spice with terrible consequences. It wasn't weed that caused that, it was assinine laws that stopped him from using the safe natural option. Fortunately he got off the spice, and uses the real thing again now. Cannabis prohibition causes far more harm than legalization ever could. A small minority of users with latent mental problems isn't my main concern. We need to stop ruining lives fighting a weed.

[The Valley Below]

98. Why do these debates assume one can't de-criminalize pot while still protecting protect minors?

We need to do both. CA has failed in a very profound way.

People at large are largely blind to the problem that is brewing among teens. The schools are aware. Many parents are aware.

We have a mess to deal with. Lives that have been damaged by pot consumption.

[rollin74]

81. K & R Totally agree with this. Ending the ridiculous federal prohibition on cannabis is way overdue

recent polls show that two thirds of Americans now favor recreational cannabis legalization, including a majority of republicans

the prohibitionist train has left the station, time to modernize our federal laws