Scenes from the Iowa Democratic Meltdown, Bernie supporters chant 'F*ck Warren.'

[wyldwolf]

There was panic on the streets of Des Moines, Iowa, as Democrats wondered: Could life ever be sane again? Even before the state bungled the results of its all important caucus vote, internecine beef within the Democratic party was beginning to boil.

The night before the caucus clusterfuck, while the Super Bowl played, Bernie Sanders acolytes threw a party at a hole-in-the-wall bar in downtown Des Moines.

Link to tweet

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/bernie-sanders-joe-biden-iowa-caucus-democratic-meltdown-947545/

[bluewater]

1. NEWSFLASH: A drunk in a bar shouted something.

Ok...

[Hassin Bin Sober]

16. Biden supporters seem very concerned.

[bluewater]

17. I, too, shall note the concern...

Hmmm. Concern....

[ehrnst]

85. Sure beats dealing straight on with the facts

doesn't it?

[bluewater]

94. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

[ehrnst]

105. Copy and paste, copy and paste...

Just keep on kicking that OP!

[Cha]

218. Not really

[ChubbyStar]

18. My great Nan had a saying

People feel deeply when the drain is circling.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

63. Love it!

[ehrnst]

95. Yes, like when their candidate is not living up to their own and their supporters' hype..

and the tolerance level of anyone talking about it is zero?

Like that?

[Cha]

207. lol

[ehrnst]

80. Not just Biden supporters who are "concerned." You have to admit, it's not the first time this kind

of thing has happened.

There's video even.

Link to tweet

[Cha]

216. Who wouldn't be?

[George II]

25. NEWSFLASH II: it was more than a drunk in a bar.

[ehrnst]

26. SHHHHHH!!!!!

doubleplusthoughtcrime....

[bluewater]

34. NEWSFLASH III: Update.. it was several drunks in a bar!

Slow news day on the Bernie Bashing front, perhaps?

[George II]

35. I just don't see campaign workers being disrespectful about opposing candidates a laughing matter.

Some may, but I don't.

[DanTex]

56. You mean like saying "Bernie needs to be ground to a pulp"? That kind of disrespectful?

[George II]

58. Who said that? So I guess you don't have a problem with an organized chant of "F* Warren".

[DanTex]

59. Would you have a problem if anyone said that? A high level Dem operative perhaps?

[ehrnst]

66. Would you give it a pass if it was any other candidate's soiree...

A high level Dem operative, perhaps?



Interesting how you try to make "high level Dem operative" sound so.... sinister..

Operative - super secret spy agent...



Nice try at a hail mary end run around the actual topic, though. I'll give you that.

[betsuni]

140. Here's what Bernie said about personal emails hacked by Russia:

"If they went into our emails, I'm sure there would be statements that would be less than flattering about, you know, the Clinton staff. That's what happens in campaigns."

It's 2020 now, by the way.

[DanTex]

141. Which shows what an honorable person and team player Bernie is.

And, along those lines, I'm sure that drunk supporters of other candidates also blow off steam in bars.

Like Bernie said, that's what happens in campaigns.

[ehrnst]

143. Those "drunk supporters" sure do get AROUND, don't they?

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

Why do you think these crowds of "drunk supporters" seem to be "blowing off steam" pretty much exclusively at women candidates and POC?

Can you provide examples, like the ones in the link above, of this kind of behavior in those "other campaigns" that Bernie is pointing to?

[betsuni]

181. Bernie said the primary wasn't rigged: "That's not rigged. I think it's just a dumb process which

has certainly disadvantaged our campaign."

Now he says it was rigged. Which is it? Honorable and team player?

[ehrnst]

191. Tell us when those staffers publicly yell "f*ck Sanders" and all the other candidates, in public

will you?

Also, let us know if that campaign has had a history with sexual harassment settlements, "happening in it", K?

Then you might have that equivalence you are trying so desperately, and so unsuccessfully to convince people of.

Then we can tell you how common it is for staffers to get drunk and blow off steam in that way, particularly after they are supposed to have had training....

[George II]

149. Did someone say that? Otherwise it's a hypothetical like "when did you stop beating your wife?".

[DanTex]

150. I can assure you it's not hypothetical. So what's your answer?

[George II]

151. As far as I know, no one said that so it's a moot point.

[DanTex]

153. LOL. That's a dodge. Like all the other anti-Bernie stuff, this is all just more faux outrage.

[George II]

156. You're implying something in a hypothetical question but not saying if it really happened.

[DanTex]

157. It did really happen.

[ehrnst]

172. So why don't you want to say that it was in an email?

Because that would really look silly trying to hold that up as somehow canceling out in a breathtaking false equivalence a mob of canvassers and campaign staffers chanting "f**ck Warren" then going on to do the same for all the other candidates.

That's why you keep demanding other people talk about the email, isn't it?



Because if you did, you know that people would point out that it's in no way comparable to an email, not a one-off, one "drunk guy," or even just one "drunk crowd at a bar."

The poll’s results supposedly were good for Bernie and bad for the centrists, particularly those they call Uncle Joe and “Mayo Pete.” Upon hearing the gossip, one canvasser began twerking to scattered applause.

Another hopped on stage and grabbed a microphone for a call and return with the crowd.

“When I say ‘Fuck,’ you say ‘Biden!’”

“Fuck,” he yelled. “Biden,” the crowd roared back.

“When I say ‘Fuck,’ you say ‘Warren!’”

“Fuck,” he yelled. “Warren,” the audience answered back.

And so it went with Buttigieg, Steyer, and even Tulsi Gabbard, the poor thing.

If it came out that any other campaign staff and canvassers did the same thing in Iowa, you would have posted six OPs on DU about it within the hour, clutching pearls and talking about how Bernie's people would NEVER EVER do anything of the sort, because he had that ALL DAY meeting with those former staffers who "felt" that they had been harassed, and therefore guaranteeing that nothing even remotely misogynist or hateful would EVER happen in his campaign EVER again, so clearly there is no other candidate even remotely morally fit to be our nominee.

You'd think that what came out last January would have had them discouraging this in staffers from day one, wouldn't you?

Doesn't bode well for learning from past mistakes.

[ehrnst]

187. A dodge is when one doesn't want to admit the source of their outrage is

an email, while trying to defend what the staffers and canvassers did in that bar.

Especially in light of the revelations in January 2018 about what women endured in the 2016 campaign.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/30/bernie-sanders-campaign-harassment-1077014

One would think that the campaign would have done some sensitivity training at least.

[DanTex]

189. LOL. You're saying low-level supporters drinking in a bar is *worse* than

emails among top campaign officials? Like it's horrible if some volunteer college kid says something, but if the campaign director says it, that's OK?

[ehrnst]

190. So you are trying to dismiss the staffers of one campaign shouting epithets about other

candidates, in public, but clutch your pearls at an email that didn't even leave the office...except for it being leaked.




That you can't even manage to find a link to.



Ironic, and surprising, especially considering what female staffers have have reported about previous campaigns...



Were you the one just complaining about 'faux outrage?"

Nice view in there?





Who are you going to accuse of 'being divisive" next?

[ehrnst]

204. Oh look - more "drinking in a bar"

Link to tweet

[ehrnst]

67. Whataboutism for the win!!!

When you have no rebuttal to a very uncomfortable revelation...

:

I was wondering when you would show up to protest loudly at the very idea that a post involving Senator Sanders even peripherally that wasn't adequately praising him, and repeating the talking points of the aura of inevitability that HE WILL BE THE ONE.

And here you are, right on schedule!

[bluewater]

83. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

An ad hominem attack and an accusation of "whataboutism" when hypocrisy was discussed!

[ehrnst]

87. Anything to avoid dealing with the facts, eh?

Proceed....it seems people are quite disturbed by journalism that doesn't flatter their leader.

[bluewater]

92. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

Using an ad hominem attack against that poster!



BZZZZT. Game over. That's a forfeit.

Better luck next time.

[ehrnst]

93. The "I know you are but what am I?" reposte...

And GAME OVER - NO TAG BACKS!

Is that what you're left with?

[bluewater]

96. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

Shame. an Ad hominem attack is beyond the pale. Shame.

[ehrnst]

97. Copy and paste, copy and paste...

Just when I thought the bar was at the ground....



But keeping the OP kicked is just gravy...

[bluewater]

100. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

using an ad hominem attack.... bad!

[ehrnst]

107. Keep on kicking the OP!

Fish ain't biting, Hon.



Do go on....

[bluewater]

111. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

Hon?

Misogyny now too?

[ehrnst]

118. Keep on kicking the OP!

Fish ain't biting, Sweetie darlin'.

[bluewater]

120. "Fish ain't biting, Sweetie darlin'."

Ad hominem attacks and misogyny?



Very disappointing.

[ehrnst]

122. Keep on kicking the OP!

Fish ain't biting, babe.

[bluewater]

128. "Fish ain't biting, babe.

Babe?

misogyny and inappropriate familiarity?



that's gone too far now...

I feel uncomfortable continuing this exchange with you.



good bye forever

[ehrnst]

129. Keep kicking the OP!

Fish still ain't biting, Honey Bun.

[bluewater]

132. "Honey Bun." ? This level of misogyny goes to far.

I feel unsafe continuing this exchange with you.

[ehrnst]

135. Keep kicking the OP!

And "continuing the interchange," sweetheart.

Fish still ain't biting.

You know that saying about trying the same thing over and over, and expecting a different outcome?



Good luck to you and your preferred candidate going forward.

[sheshe2]

163. I use to hate when my records were scratched.

Repeat, repeated, repeatedly. You had to put your finger down on the stylus to move the song forward.

[ehrnst]

164. Yeah, I remember that too. One reason that vinyl was replaced.

[Cha]

210. Yes.. prompt!

[ehrnst]

110. What campaign supporters were saying this en masse?

Link?

By link, I mean like the ones provided here:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

You're welcome, Danny!

[DanTex]

119. I still haven't gotten an answer. Do the people complaining about a Bernie supporter blowing

off steam in a dive bar think that's an appropriate thing to say. Nobody seems to be answering. I wonder why. Hmmm

[ehrnst]

124. That's one way to evade having to put your money where your mouth is, isn't it?

It seems like "blowing off steam" gets ugly in more places than just dive bars... you don't seem to be explaining why it's generally the supporters of one candidate in particular.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

I wonder why. Hmm.

So where are your examples of other campaigns 'blowing off steam" in such a hateful way?

[DanTex]

125. Another dodge by you. Everyone dodging a simple question. LOL.

I wonder why?

[ehrnst]

131. "I know you are but what am I?" non-answer

Last edited Thu Feb 6, 2020, 10:21 PM - Edit history (1)

Once again.

You seem completely intimidated by being shown this, which you can't seriously equate with a single statement by a single person in an email...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

https://qz.com/741448/bernie-sanders-supporters-chant-lock-her-up-protesting-hillary-at-the-dnc/

Another evasion coming in 3...2...1...

[Cha]

173. Snap!

[lapucelle]

167. Didn't BS promise that the campaign would work harder to keep in check

the predatory element among his supporters?

Either BS isn't trying hard enough or the toxic faction doesn't respect him enough to pay any attention to what he says.

Bernie Sanders apologizes for allegations of sexism in 2016 campaign
“If I run, we will do better next time.”

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/3/18166725/bernie-sanders-sexism-sexual-harassment-2020

Bernie alumni seek meeting to address ‘sexual violence’ on ’16 campaign

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/30/bernie-sanders-campaign-harassment-1077014

Be Your Own Hero — Because Bernie Is Not It

https://medium.com/@mashamendieta/be-your-own-hero-because-bernie-is-not-it-c4add2e08029

[ehrnst]

182. I know, right?

[betsuni]

183. +1

[Cha]

200. uh huh

[treestar]

194. that's just saying we want to beat Bernie

figuratively - like "beat him like a drum."

Not the same as publicly saying F---- Warren.

[ehrnst]

148. Not to mention numerous times.. and after the revelations of January of last year,

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/30/bernie-sanders-campaign-harassment-1077014

I'd think that the campaign would want to strongly discourage the kind of behavior that could be described as misogynistic...

[Cha]

208. It's really

isn't.

[ehrnst]

45. Looks like this hit a deep, deep nerve...

[bluewater]

49. lol

NEWSFLASH: Getting the first post into a thread gets to disproportionately set the tone of the discussion and is often used as a rhetorical device to rebut, mock, minimize or deflect the thread's OP article.

Um, I hear that happens a lot here.

"The moving finger, having written, moves on..."

Enjoy your Evening.

[ehrnst]

50. Lol...

Must be a reaaaaaalllly sore spot.

Um, I hear that happens a lot here. Especially when something is published that doesn't flatter certain politicians.

Enjoy your Evening.

[Cha]

219. Yeah.. the deflection didn't work.

[ehrnst]

31. I guess that's way easier than reading what actually happened...

[mcar]

43. Please point to where supporters of any other candidate

participated in a similar call and response. I'll wait.

[DanTex]

81. Like "Bernie needs to be ground to a pulp", for example?

[mcar]

84. Huh?

[DanTex]

88. Would that be the kind of example you're looking for? Of campaigns behaving badly.

You asked for examples. I gave one.

[ehrnst]

89. Speaking of examples:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/25/lock-her-up-sanders-trump-clinton-chant

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/rep-tlaib-boos-hillary-clinton-s-name-encourages-sanders-supporters-n1128191

Perhaps you can cite the source of your "example?"

[mcar]

106. Could you provide some context?

I have no idea what you are talking about.

[ehrnst]

109. Join the club.

[DanTex]

130. It's a simple question. Would you consider "Bernie needs to be ground to a pulp"

as an example of the kind of behavior by campaigns that you object to. You asked for examples, and I'm asking you if this qualifies as an example.

And if not, I'd be curious to know why a few drunk supporters blowing off steam in a bar is so horrible, but saying "Bernie needs to be ground to a pulp" is not.

[ehrnst]

133. So are all these people the same 'few drunk supporters?"

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

And why is a statement by one person so horrible, but all these incidents are somehow not.

(see what I did there?)

It's a simple question...

Another evasion, and post with a non-answer in 3...2...1...

[mcar]

169. I have asked you to provide context

Who are you talking about? Is there a link to such behavior? You provide none.

[ehrnst]

188. You're outraged about an email, and think it negates those real actions of the Sanders staffers

and canvassers...

Got it.

[Sapient Donkey]

139. I am guessing it's referencing this

(I just searched for the phrase on google)

I figured I'd post it to clear up the mystery.

https://www.salon.com/2016/11/03/leaked-email-bernie-needs-to-be-ground-to-a-pulp-clinton-advisor-and-lobbyist-wrote-to-john-podesta/

[sheshe2]

108. You have said that twice.

Who said it? Name names, link to a source....or it never happened.

[mcar]

115. This is some strange whataboutism, she

I still haven't seen a link for that assertion.

[DanTex]

117. I'm waiting for an answer. Haven't got one yet.

Wondering if any of the people freaking out about some people blowing off steam in a bar actually answers about that quote. If I get answers, I'll let people know who said it.

You could answer if you want.

Or you could just google it.

[ehrnst]

121. You haven't answered where campaign supporters in any other campaign are doing similar.

So there's that.

You could just google for links to support your claim...

But it seems like there's an awful lot of "people freaking out and blowing off steam" by hatefully trashing the opponents of one particular candidate...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

[DanTex]

123. I asked first! Give me an answer, and then I'll point you to who said it.

For some reason people are all dodging my question. Why would that be lol?

[ehrnst]

127. No, actually you didn't. And like a particular candidate, you like to evade really uncomfortable

answers by saying, "NOT UNTIL YOU ANSWER MY QUESTION!!!"

I take it you have no examples, as usual.



You drop a quote as a red herring and use it to avoid the hard realities of such incidents as these:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

I can understand why you wouldn't have the courage to engage on that. It's just beyond what one can just try to falsely equate with the statement of a single person....

[treestar]

193. Your example was not meant to be public

isn't it from the stolen emails?

[DanTex]

195. Does that make it different? Do you think the people in the bar were making a public statement?

[treestar]

196. Being in a bar is in public

A bar is a public place.

[DanTex]

197. So you really think that makes all the difference.

If it had been a private party, you'd be OK with it? It wasn't what they said, so much as the fact that they didn't rent out the entire bar for a private party before they said it.

Interesting.

[treestar]

198. We wouldn't know about it except second hand at a private party

but they were out in public.

The emails were not public in any way, in fact, they were hacked.

Also they just express a desire to beat Bernie, which is normal for anyone running against Bernie (or anyone else for that matter). That's different from "F ---- Bernie."

[ehrnst]

212. It is different when it's public than within the office, yes.

There are many "behind closed doors" discussions and airing of frustrations (you know, blowing off steam...) in most organizations, including campaigns and party leadership. If you have never expressed frustrations about a coworker or supervisor with another coworker, and told them not to tell anyone else, you certainly are one of a lucky few.

I refuse to reveal where I work on my FB page, because I don't want my posts to be construed as being representative of those of my employer.

Sanders is very VERY specific about what he does not want made public concerning internal discussions, messaging and decision making.

Why do you think that the Sanders campaign made the sexual harassment settlement concerning two of their staffers confidential? Do you think that Sanders was happy it was made public?

Why do you think that Sanders was so upset that one of his staffers talked to the Washington Post about the issues the union staffers were having with management? He called that "not really acceptable," despite the fact that the NLRB has stated that union workers have a right to talk to the media about what is going on in their workplace, including discussions with management.

He is known for tight control on what he considers to his privacy and his campaign's. Yet as of now, I have not heard him say anything to apologize for, or reprimand his staffers for this hate-filled, public spectacle. If you have, please share.

You're familiar with the concept of "disclaimers" aren't you? You've seen them at the bottom of emails saying that they are not to be shared, and are confidential, Yes? There has been no 'disclaimer' or apology from the campaign concerning the hate-filled public behavior of the staffers.

What members of his staff say behind closed doors and in emails is not the public face of the campaign, because there is a public face to the campaign, and a private one. If this chanting had been behind closed doors and staffers told NOT to do this publicly, then yes, it would have been different. It still would have been disturbing, but it would not have the appearance of being blessed by the campaign, and therefore encourage other supporters to do it.

After all, Bernie promised that things would be different in this campaign. Not looking good so far.

Bernie Sanders apologizes for allegations of sexism in 2016 campaign
“If I run, we will do better next time.”

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/3/18166725/bernie-sanders-sexism-sexual-harassment-2020

You're welcome.

[ehrnst]

211. Yes, it does. Yes they did.

Last edited Fri Feb 14, 2020, 09:14 AM - Edit history (1)

You're welcome.

You dismiss staffers chanting hate-filled epithets at all other candidates, in public, as just "drunk people blowing off steam" but damn an email sent to a coworker in private to be an unacceptable attack on a candidate.

I'd call it a double standard, but it goes far beyond that.

[mcar]

170. You are waiting for an answer about a claim you have not substantiated.

[ehrnst]

186. "Prove a negative" fallacy

That is when one makes a statement, with no evidence to back it up, then demand that others "prove it wrong."

[Cha]

2. classy

[highplainsdem]

4. Also typical.

[Cha]

11. Predictable

[highplainsdem]

14. That's what I meant. Typical for them.

[ehrnst]

36. +10,000. "the audience answered back."

But by all means, let's say it was "one drunk guy."

[Cha]

39. Exactly.

[sheshe2]

40. I wonder if...

I wonder if they were drunk at a bar when they booed John Lewis, Elijah Cummings, Michelle Obama and more...oh wait that was the 2016 Democratic Convention. Was Rep Tlaib drunk at a bar when she lead a chant booing Hillary...oh wait that was at a campaign event for Sanders 2020. FYI, Hillary is not running.

They need to grow up a bit.

[ehrnst]

57. Precisely. "Drunk" or "stoned" is excusing away people showing their real selves....(nt)

[sheshe2]

64. When they show you who they are, believe them. nt

[ehrnst]

70. Especially after the 10th or 20th time they do so. (nt)

[sheshe2]

78. Come on Ehrnst, they are just kids funning around.nt

[ehrnst]

99. Yeah, I know. We just expect too much from kids, don't we?

[emmaverybo]

73. Yes!

[sheshe2]

79. Thanks, emma!

[emmaverybo]

91. It's not just that I agree, but what a sharp argument. You can go up in front of a jury with it. So

sure, you were drunk at a bar that time, but what about when you did the same damned thing at the convention? Drunk then?

Love it sheshe2.

[LakeArenal]

53. Beat me to it. Not very Democratic either.

[highplainsdem]

3. There was an earlier thread about this, but the subject line was vague, didn't mention what they

were chanting, so I'm glad you posted about it.

They chanted similar vulgar idiocies about Bernie's other rivals:

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/bernie-sanders-joe-biden-iowa-caucus-democratic-meltdown-947545/

Rumors about the results of the scuppered Des Moines Register poll — the hotly anticipated barometer for Democratic candidates that was shelved the day before due to data-collection hiccups were flying around the bar. The poll’s results supposedly were good for Bernie and bad for the centrists, particularly those they call Uncle Joe and “Mayo Pete.” Upon hearing the gossip, one canvasser began twerking to scattered applause.

Another hopped on stage and grabbed a microphone for a call and return with the crowd.

“When I say ‘Fuck,’ you say ‘Biden!’”

“Fuck,” he yelled. “Biden,” the crowd roared back.

-snip-

Warren was the next target, then Buttigieg, Steyer, and even Tulsi Gabbard.

The author of the article commented, "So much for party unity."

[Kentonio]

5. I completely abhor that kind of behavior.

The guy (and anyone who joined in) is an idiot.

[ehrnst]

27. Then I'm sure that Sanders will decry it as well.

Last edited Thu Feb 6, 2020, 07:19 PM - Edit history (1)

Being as it was more than one guy.

Waiting....

But your response is the truly one that matters. I wish more here were on board with that, rather than shooting the messenger.

[still_one]

37. That is the correct response no matter who the supporters are. Thank-you

[questionseverything]

69. if it is even true

some drunk in some bar shouted something awful...so Bernie is bad?

[ehrnst]

76. All those people there who joined in were not one drunk...

What kind of culture is that among those supporters? And it's not an isolated, aberrant incident. There is history, recorded on video.

Link to tweet

[LisaM]

185. You saw them booing Hillary a few nights earlier - including ELECTED officials.

It has to stop.

[sheshe2]

113. thank you.

[Cha]

206. Exactly.

[Me.]

6. This Is The People He Attracts?

What's the difference between them and what we have now? Or did they also add :lock her up"?

[R B Garr]

12. +1

[HarlanPepper]

22. Yes.

[ehrnst]

146. Yes, I remember seeing the video of then screaming "LOCK HER UP!"

I thought it was Trump supporters at first....

[rockfordfile]

7. This seems like crap that's trying to divide us.

It could be a pos republican doing it

[Steam93]

29. It could be a pos' republican doing it

Lets investigate this! My girl isn't winning yet

[Laelth]

48. Quite likely. n/t

-Laelth

[ehrnst]

51. Or it could be the free press reporting something that actually happened.

[Hermit-The-Prog]

155. Those are not mutually exclusive ...

It could be the free press reporting what actually happened and have been instigated by an operative seeking to create division. What I haven't seen yet, is the candidate disavowing such action and the participants apologizing.

Not going to hold my breath while waiting for either.

[ehrnst]

158. But this isn't an isolated incident.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/25/lock-her-up-sanders-trump-clinton-chant

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

Were all those people on Sanders' staff chanting "f**k Warren" "operatives?" If so, what kind of slack hiring practices does the campaign have?

[Hermit-The-Prog]

168. Nope. At -best-, they're rude. ...

We know that Putin likes division and boosted Sanders in 2016 to augment division. It's very likely happening again, anywhere they find a response they like -- a willing petri dish. That would include encouraging supporters to trash other candidates.

It is up to Sanders to shut that shit down. So far as I know, he hasn't. So far as I know, he didn't in 2016, either.

If a group of Warren supporters started chanting anything similar about Sanders (or any other Democratic candidate), I would expect her to make a statement against it.

It's too much like trumpers. It's too close to 'whatever it takes to win'.

[ehrnst]

174. You'd think that after what came out in January 2018 that his campaign would

have been a bit more serious about discouraging that kind of behavior.

[ehrnst]

160. A whole crowd of them got jobs on Sanders staff to do this?

Are these the same ones?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/25/lock-her-up-sanders-trump-clinton-chant

[BusyBeingBest]

8. Well, I heard that a supporter said BLAH and this other guy said

BLAH BLAH and then some other people chimed in with BLAH BLAH BLAH and then somebody laughed and...

[zackymilly]

10. That's it. He's dead to me now!

[BusyBeingBest]

13. Well, some anonymous nobody somewhere was an asshole, so that's the logical

conclusion I guess.

[ehrnst]

159. Yeah a whole crowd of anonymous nobodies, I guess.

And they keep showing up for some reason...

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/25/lock-her-up-sanders-trump-clinton-chant

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

[LanternWaste]

15. Illustrative relevance can be inconvenient.

But yeah... someone's laughing.

[bluewater]

21. Extraneous Irrelevancies can be Serviceable Distractions

But yeah... someone's laughing.

[ehrnst]

62. Nervous Laughter, Clearly...

[ehrnst]

55. Yeah, because that's what journalists always do, isn't it?

At least when it's something that makes one uncomfortable to hear...

I hear that from Trump supporters.

[sheshe2]

126. Hey.

They were caught on camera many times booing the black speakers at the DNC 2016. Who does this kind of shit? They have a well noted history of this type of behavior including throwing dollar bills at Hills motorcade.

This isn't the first or last time for them.

[ehrnst]

145. Yeah, it's not like it's happened before!

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1287&pid=482804

[Zolorp]

9. And Sanders seriously expects the supporters of these candidate to vote for him???

WTF?

[denem]

19. Bloomberg News party: 'Nobody went outside to smoke'

[Blue_Tires]

20. classy...

Yeah, keep on telling me these people will support the Dem nominee after St. Bern drops out.

[ehrnst]

23. Exactly...

[NurseJackie]

24. Oh, classy! This isn't the first time.

[ehrnst]

28. Not by a long shot...

Ask John Lewis.

[NurseJackie]

30. This is why caucuses are a VERY bad idea. People are bullied.

This is why caucuses are a VERY bad idea. People are bullied. Either "peer pressure" bullying to change their candidate, or they already know what a hostile environment some candidate's supporters can generate, so they don't even bother to show up.

Caucuses are a joke.

#EndCaucusesNow
#EndTheCaucus
#NoMoreCaucuses

[Scurrilous]

41. Yep.

They had higher turnout for midterms. People stayed away. Maybe they don't want to be mobbed by manbuns for Bernie.

[ehrnst]

75. Word.

[Scurrilous]

98. ...

[polichick]

33. Smells like disinformation.

[ehrnst]

38. Care to tell us why?

Confirmation bias is a powerful thing, so I'm sure that you have facts that back up your claim, and can produce them presently.

[polichick]

42. Talk about confirmation bias! Those presenting the claim need to show facts.

[ehrnst]

44. So you got nothing.

Noted.

[polichick]

46. So far, there's nothing in the claim...

You’re barking up the wrong tree.

After 2016, all of us should be more careful about chowing down on disinformation.

[ehrnst]

47. You are pooh-poohing journalists from a valid free press source as propaganda.

Why is that? Because they are not promoting and flattering a particular pol? That's sounds familiar...

I'll say to you what I say to them: Burden of proving the validated free press wrong is on you. What are your credentials on the topic?

After 2016, all of us should be more careful about chowing down on disinformation.



If one's definition of "misinformation" is something that is uncomfortable, then one is indeed chowing away...

[polichick]

60. Simply silly. I'm supporting both Bernie and Warren...

Thus, the undecided thing.

Your assumptions aren’t smart or helpful to the Dems.

[ehrnst]

65. This is about what happened in Iowa.... who one supports shouldn't affect one's

ability to acknowledge facts.

If one is required to reject any facts that don't flatter one's candidate, perhaps it's time to rethink why one supports a candidate.

[polichick]

68. It's also about ridiculous assumptions, but nice try.

[ehrnst]

72. If one considers any assumption that doesn't confirm one's bias to be 'ridiculous'

then one is going to find, many, many reports of facts concerning the candidate "ridiculous."

[lunasun]

86. Well in the second paragraph there is an incorrect statement but not related to the politics .

The person writing it must not be from the Midwest or does t have a map when they stated

“The nearest L train stop was 1,100 miles away.”

It’s about 300
Also
Rollin Stone has had to walk back stories before

[polichick]

90. Hmm, interesting catch!

[ehrnst]

101. Well, hope springs eternal, don't it?

[OilemFirchen]

147. Second time I've read this weird "correction".

The previous sentence:

Writers from New York magazine, as well as leftwing publications like Jacobin and n+1, sidled up to the bar and got down to discussing labor rights.

All of those publications are headquartered in New York City. No sentient human would think that the writer was referring to anything other than the traditional NYC L Train. Des Moines to NYC is 1,107.6 miles via I-80 E.

Who's disseminating this distracting nonsense? And why the fuck is it supposed to be relevant?

[ehrnst]

165. Well, there are some who are incredibly disturbed at the implications of the OP

and frantic attempts to deride, dismiss, derail, and otherwise distract from it are all in play.

[OilemFirchen]

175. I get that, of course.

Just think it's peculiar that that one non-mistake is a focus for at least two posters here. And I've been off the net for all but a few hours this week, so gotta wonder if it's a strange coincidence or a talking point. Whatever.

[ehrnst]

177. I think that someone has decided to make it a talking point. (nt)

[ehrnst]

166. If the L train they were talking about was in NYC.... then it's not incorrect.

Read who they were talking about when they mentioned the L train...

[MFM008]

52. NH will be different

And Im happy to see caucus's die.

[The Polack MSgt]

54. Bros gotta Bro, Bro

[betsuni]

61. But it's all about policy, they say...

[Cha]

71. Ha!

[ehrnst]

74. TOTALLY!!!

[Skya Rhen]

77. I'm beginning to wonder if some "Warren" supporters, on DU, are actually Bernie supporters - hmmm...

[Gothmog]

82. I saw similar conduct at the National Convention by vetted sanders delegates

Normally going to a national convention is a once in a life time experience. I have worked really hard inside the party on campaigns and voter protection issues for a very long time to earn this trip. Too bad that sanders and his vetted delegates ruined that experience and did their best to help trump. A candidate has absolute approval rights over their pledged delegates because these delegates can change their votes and these delegates represent the candidate and campaign. I helped vet Clinton delegates and I know that I was vetted. The Clinton campaign told us that we represent her and that our actions would reflect on her and her campaign.

In contrast, sanders sent one very weak text the Sunday night before the convention and then did little or nothing to control his delegates. It was nasty I was there when the sanders delegates booed Congressman John Lewis. I was warned about this stunt 30 minutes before it happened by the Clinton campaign whip. According to my whip, sanders was asked to stop this event and declined. That incident will be used against sanders by Russia to suppress the African American vote just as was done in 2016

Link to tweet

Russia will just run material showing sanders delegates booing John Lewis, Elijah Cummings and others to suppress the vote of African American voters and I feel that this tactic would be very effective

I was at the Texas delegation breakfast when a group of sanders delegates marched in and demanded that we condemn Clinton and change our votes to sanders.

sanders spoke to the Texas delegation the next morning and his speech was again solely about himself. There was a mini-riot due to his delegates the prior morning and the only thing that sanders talked about was himself. sanders did nothing to deal with the fact that his delegates were out of control and did nothing to try to help Hillary Clinton win the general election.

Finally a group of sanders delegates yelled at my daughter and called her the c-Word because she would not try to get me to change my vote. Again sanders was asked to tell his delegates to behave during the convention and sanders refused

The conduct describe in the OP does not surprise me

[Cha]

102. Thank you!

[Gothmog]

179. I am still upset by sanders vetted delegates calling my daughter the c-word

[ehrnst]

103. Wow... THE SAME DRUNK GUY was responsible for those things at all those events?

He must have some serious frequent flier miles...

[betsuni]

112. But a guy said Bernie must be ground to a pulp once so nothing Bernie supporters do counts.

[ehrnst]

116. Yes, I heard that it was said IN AN EMAIL no less!!!!

Last edited Thu Feb 6, 2020, 09:05 PM - Edit history (1)

That COMPLETELY negates the numerous, documented public examples of hateful coordinated outburst by crowds or people supporting a particular candidate, that some here are dismissing as a "few drunk people blowing off steam.."



And I've heard about it several times, so that means that it must have happened several times, which is more than this one time, so therefore, this must be dismissed as anything but reasonable.

I think...

[Gothmog]

178. I wish that these were not isolated incidents

[LisaM]

134. It's hard to get other Sanders supporters to admit this behavior exists.

I sincerely don't get it. They may not mean it as such, but it just looks like behavior designed to completely rip apart the Democratic party, and I though in 2016 we'd arrived at a good place. I was really happy before the convention (I did not attend in person) and very dispirited afterwards, partly because a moment had been stolen from a candidate who'd worked hard and deserved it, and partly because I had a feeling of absolute dread that turned out to be well justified.

And here we go again.

[ehrnst]

138. Yes, that's been shown time and time again. (nt)

[Gothmog]

180. sanders was asked to step in and stop this behavior at the convention

According to my whip sanders refused

[Bayard]

104. I've had about enough of this shit!

The in-fighting has got to stop. We have a common enemy and a common goal--Dump trump. We don't need Dem rallies sounding like trump rallies for gawdsakes!

Divisiveness will be used by trump and Putin operatives. Don't lead them there.

[ehrnst]

114. So journalists should be prohibited from writing such pieces?

[Bayard]

136. I'm not talking about the article,

I'm talking about the people the article is written about.

They're hurting all of us.

[ehrnst]

137. OK, gotcha! Mea culpa.

[TheBlackAdder]

142. I love Bernie, I love Warren and I love Biden. This is bad optics and Sanders needs to crack heads.

.

I don't give a shit if these are drunk people or not. It's base mentality for people professing to be better.

Walk the walk and talk the talk. If not, shut the fuck up and take up bowling, but vote Blue in November.

.

[ehrnst]

144. +1000.

[whathehell]

202. Sounds like the 'Bros..

They're sexist, classless assholes -- Bernie needs to get tougher with them.

[ehrnst]

152. After what came out in January of 2018...

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/30/bernie-sanders-campaign-harassment-1077014

One would THINK that the campaign would strongly discourage staffers from chanting misogynistic rants...like "F**k Warren!"

Doesn't bode well for them having learned the lessons that one would expect after that highly publicized day long meeting they had about it.

[Turbineguy]

154. Better to leave this classy stuff

to trump supporters.

[SMC22307]

161. Hang the blessed DJ already.

I'm OVER this entire process and it's barely gotten started.

[lapucelle]

162. What untenable and dangerous dynamic? What toxic predatory culture?

Bernie alumni seek meeting to address ‘sexual violence’ on past campaign

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/30/bernie-sanders-campaign-harassment-1077014

[NurseJackie]

171. Fuckers.

[NYMinute]

176. As one can see, this too will be justified and/or defended with whataboutism

We are living in weird times.

We have seen Trump supporters defending the "grab them by their p______" remark as well.

Now a days, some of the leaders and their campaigns do nothing wrong according to their supporters.

[Act_of_Reparation]

184. A Biden supporter cut me off on the way to work this morning.

Guess I'll write about it on the internet.

[Cha]

203. You just did

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

192. Stay classy Berners

[Gothmog]

199. There is a pattern here

Link to tweet

[bamagal62]

201. Why is all this happening?

Is it just shit to divide us again? We can’t fall for it. Whoever wins, we need to show up and vote for them. We need to stop this shit in its tracks.

[Gothmog]

205. SNL had fun with sanders and his nasty supporters

Link to tweet

[Gothmog]

209. sanders supporters are doxxing Union leaders

Link to tweet

?s=20

[robbedvoter]

213. Maybe they were from another campaign.... or a 400 lbs guy on his bed

[Gothmog]

214. There is a pattern

Link to tweet

?s=20

[Peacetrain]

215. And the former head of the Democratic Party in Iowa has been receiving death threats

[Gothmog]

217. This stunt fits a pattern

Link to tweet

?s=20