The "movie line" Biden used is one HE GOT FROM HIS BROTHER

[highplainsdem]

That seems to have been overlooked in all the shrieking and outrage about the line.

Ir's apparent from what Biden said when he used this line in 2018 that his source for the line is his brother, and his brother told him where the line came from, and Biden believed him.

Biden himself didn't hear the line in any movie.

https://slate.com/culture/2020/02/joe-biden-dog-faced-pony-soldier-john-wayne-tyrone-power.html

Later, Biden’s spokespeople said the line was taken from a scene in a John Wayne movie in which a Native American chief refers to Wayne as a “lying, dog-faced pony soldier.” Biden has used the phrase, and attributed it to a John Wayne movie, in the past; at a 2018 campaign event for Heidi Heitkamp, Biden said the following about Heitkamp’s opponent Kevin Cramer:

As my brother who loves to use lines from movies, from John Wayne movies, there’s a line in a movie, a John Wayne movie where an Indian chief turns to John Wayne and says, “This is a lying, dog-faced pony soldier.”

There’s video of that, too:

-snip-

So.

Biden's brother got a line from a movie wrong.


Now, we could argue all day over HOW Biden's brother got the line wrong.

But we don't even know how old Biden's brother was at the time. Or how long after seeing some film he thought he'd heard that line in he crystallized it into what is obviously an incorrect quote. (Incorrect because pony soldiers would refer to cavalry, while dog faces refers to infantry soldiers of a later period, World War II, according to Wikipedia.)

People misremember movie lines ALL THE TIME:

https://www.wescreenplay.com/blog/top-20-misquoted-movie-lines/


My guess is that Biden's brother scrambled memories of more than one film, creating that line in his own mind.

And probably he thought it was a funny insult, and he probably used it a lot on people around him, including Biden.

And Biden picked it up from him, and believed him about where the line came from.


And yes, Biden should stop using that line, even as a joke.


But once you know that he got the line FROM HIS BROTHER, the line being mistakenly attributed to a John Wayne film becomes more understandable.

[Cha]

1. Thanks for the history, hpd.

[highplainsdem]

3. You're welcome, Cha! I gave three siblings, and I couldn''t count the times they've "quoted"

something someone said, and it turned out to be wrong. At least partially wrong, anyway.

People misremember and misquote all the time.

[musicman65]

24. Oh Dear God

Joe,not really a good idea,especially to a young person,that does not know a tyrone powell flick
anyway bad thing on His part in general,,,sorry folks

[SMC22307]

61. He called a young woman a 'liar' and 'dog-faced'...

very disrespectful and no one should be giving him a pass. How do you think that young woman feels?

[WhiskeyGrinder]

2. It's a shitty line no matter where he got it. Calling someone a liar is a shit move.

[highplainsdem]

11. Oh, FFS. It's an over-the-top line used as a joke. I'd guess Biden and his brother

were probably kids when Biden's brother started using that line and saying it was from a John Wayne film.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

14. You keep talking about Biden and his brother. The opinion of the person the line was directed at

matters the most in this incident, IMO. And she said the line shook her.

[cwydro]

60. Calling a woman "dog-faced" seems a doubtful thing to do also.

[Autumn]

4. So he forgot that he got a "funny insult" from his brother and thought he got it from a movie.

Okay.

[highplainsdem]

6. Read the excerpt I have in the OP. His brother told him it was a line from a John Wayne movie.

And Biden believed him.

[Autumn]

9. Does it bother you that he used a "funny insult" on a young woman who was obviously nervous at

his campaign event for asking a question? A question that deserved an answer? It does me.

[highplainsdem]

17. I didn't think she sounded nervous. And that old line Biden got from his brother was a joking

way of expressing skepticism about what she'd said about having been to a caucus.

The people there realized how he'd meant it.

[Autumn]

21. As a woman I saw it as nervousness. I don't see why he would be sceptical she had been to a caucus

There have been many pics of the Iowa caucus, a lot of young people were there caususing. Would he be that way with an older woman and imply that she was lying?

[BlueWI]

5. The pretzel logic continues.

The potential leader of the free world inaccurately heard the source of his unfunny joke from his brother, so that makes it all good.

Ok. Please stop the excuses.

I said please.

We're Democrats. We know how to acknowledge our errors and move on. Don't turn into a pretzel defending the indefensible.

[highplainsdem]

8. Read the excerpt in the OP. He got the line from his brother, who loves to use lines from John

Wayne films. His brother told him it was from a John Wayne film.

And Biden believed him.

[BlueWI]

30. And this has what to do with a question

from a 21-year old during a campaign for the presidency?

Before you answer a simple question, throw in a movie line from the days of yore as a fake insult?

Pretzel logic wins this round, I guess.

[JoeOtterbein]

7. Regardless of the source. It's another rookie mistake by Joe. This should be easy:

Don't insult a possible fan the crowd.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

10. Ya know, I've been digging around in my pockets and under my couch cushions,

and try as I might, I can't seem to find a single fuck to give about any of this.

[Midnight Writer]

16. As Pappy used to say "A fart in a windstorm".

[still_one]

33. +++

[TwilightZone]

41. Agreed. I think people are slightly more concerned about jobs and health care.

But that's just me.

The people claiming this is Biden's "Dean Scream" are taking wishful thinking to a previously-unseen level.

[Jedi Guy]

45. All mine are on back order. Much ado about nothing. N/T

[Hav]

12. And what many seem to overlook in their supposed outrage,

the point wasn't to call Cramer's appearance dog-faced or that he is a pony soldier. The point was about not being exactly truthful.

Biden shouldn't have used the line, simple as that, as it invites controversy. You cannot talk like this anymore (or ever?), especially if the context and story behind it is unknown for many.
But people also shouldn't act as if his intention was to call a woman literally dog-faced because I'm pretty sure that she isn't a pony soldier either.

[MustLoveBeagles]

13. I'm sad by what I've seen on this site for the last week

Last edited Sun Feb 9, 2020, 09:56 PM - Edit history (1)

I don't think a damn thing has been learned from 2016. Joe's been a human pinata on this board almost nonstop since the Iowa Caucus for one reason or another and I don't see that stopping anytime soon. I appreciate your post but won't change any minds.

[Cirque du So-What]

26. The OP won't change any minds?

Referring to people as ‘the outrage squad’ will surely work much better.

[MustLoveBeagles]

38. I'm sorry

I was angry when I typed that, but think this is being blown way out of proportion. I'll change the title to something less inflammatory but I stand by the rest of my post. This infighting is very damaging for our party.

[SMC22307]

15. He needs to stop staying stupid shit that requires this much explanation! (n/t)

[Cirque du So-What]

34. And there you have it

Yet some insist on attacking those who dare to hold Joe Biden to task for saying imprudent things.

[SMC22307]

36. I suppose we should be thankful he didn't tell her to vote for someone else. (n/t)

[Cirque du So-What]

37. Well...

Voting was already over. There’s always next time.

[melman]

18. How is this relevant in any way?

Serious question. He calls a young woman " lying dog faced pony soldier" and it's okay because he got it from his brother? How does that make sense?

[highplainsdem]

22. It was obviously a joke, and the people around him got it.

[melman]

23. So why does it matter where he got it?

[highplainsdem]

32. It matters because I've seen people here VERY upset because they can't find that line

in any John Wayne film, and they seem to be blaming Biden for that, suggesting he's lying or can't remember. In one case, accusing Biden of "racism" because of the John Wayne film that might have inspired his brother's incorrect memory of the quote.

It was his brother's mistake, not Joe's. It's quite possible Joe never saw that film or other John Wayne films his brother liked to quote, or misquote.

[George II]

49. It doesn't, except to those who want to make it "matter".

[essme]

29. In 1955 perhaps. This is 2020. nt

[George II]

48. No he didn't. Please watch the video again.

[MustLoveBeagles]

19. And the piling on continues

[krissey]

20. I have more of an issue with "shrieking and outrage" than where Biden got the line.

[highplainsdem]

25. I thought it was an accurate description of the histrionics exhibited by some of the

Last edited Mon Feb 10, 2020, 12:16 AM - Edit history (1)

people here.

[krissey]

31. "historionics" yes. This. We are all clever enough to get the point.

[highplainsdem]

35. ????? I might have misunderstood you. I thought you were criticizing me for using the words

"shrieking and outrage" to refer to the reactions here. Apologies if I misunderstood.

[krissey]

40. And now I am calling you out for using "historionics".

1.
exaggerated dramatic behavior designed to attract attention.

[highplainsdem]

42. When the board has everything from posts accusing Biden of racism for using this line (which is in

no way racist) to a poll asking if he should end his campaign over this, histrionics is a perfectly appropriate description.

[krissey]

43. Poll thing was stupid. What Biden said was stupid. The woman was shaken by the comment for a giggle

for the audience at her expense.

[highplainsdem]

44. I'm guessing Biden thought she'd get the joke. And yes, he was wrong about that. But I don't for

one second believe his intent was to leave her "shaken" or to make a joke at her expense.

[krissey]

50. Fine. WHatever. It was a fuck up. That is why people pay attention to what they say.

He was kind enough to come forward and say what she asked wasn't mean, but an honest question. Just do not tell me that it was a joke and dismiss the womans angst.

[highplainsdem]

52. Her "angst"? She'd decided to confront a former VP and presidential candidate with a question she

herself described as "mean." I don't think she's the type to be "shaken."

[krissey]

54. She asked a totally legitimate question that Biden confirmed as honest that many of us have been

asking since Iowa. Just quit blaming the woman because Biden once again said something stupid and his supporters are her to gas light.

"confront a former VP and presidential candidate" Really? Talk about historionics.

[highplainsdem]

56. How hard is it for you to understand that if you ask a candidate a question you yourself describe as

"mean" then the purpose is confrontation, maybe even baiting, rather than dialogue?

[krissey]

57. Biden SAID... Was not mean, was Honest. Maybe you will start calling Biden a dog faced

something soldier liar.

She was BOLD enough to ask a question many of us have been asking. The hesitancy was, it is a tough question. Biden got a tough question. He then answered it well. Good for him. Not so good his supporters playing this game.

[highplainsdem]

58. Biden was being gracious about her question. Which reinforces what I said about how he would not

have intended her to feel shaken (if in fact she did).

The word the woman used to describe her question was "mean." No one asks questions they themselves describe as "mean" unless they're being deliberately confrontational.

[krissey]

59. Being gracious after calling her a liar. Of course he was. Whatever.

[tonedevil]

62. You're a...

lying dog-faced pony soldier.

[krissey]

55. I copied and paste. Go to the post above with our psst.

[essme]

27. I wonder if the mistaken line was "stupid #%#$%%$$ crunchy &%#$@ dipshit"

he would believe that too and use in in a 2020 event to be "cool" an hip?

Oh puhleese...OK boomer (or close enough).

[Eric J in MN]

28. What is the real line in the movie? NT

NT

[highplainsdem]

39. I'm guessing Biden's brother misremembered lines from the film mentioned in this

reply in another thread:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287494228#post5

[David__77]

46. Haha I can imagine the message might be different had Sanders said this.

...

[tirebiter]

47. Big fucking deal.

There was no threat not nor a claim to have acted bravelY in an action against the dirty redskins. It was a misquote from a Tyrone Power movie. Time to move on now that we got that straight.

[NJCher]

51. doesn't help

I still cringe.

Anyone who would even jokingly use a line that implies that another is a liar or "dog faced" (however I do lubs ze doggies), especially when the person is a young woman, has some judgement issues.

Biden needs to use primary sources for his offhand remarks and also, please stick to movies that younger people will understand without having to Google.

[Bradical79]

63. Really terrible joke insult to give to a young woman

I think Joe needs to shelve that one.