This is my first and probably only post in Primaries.

[The Polack MSgt]

So, I read a recent article in medium - https://medium.com/justinward/i-wont-vote-blue-no-matter-who-d97b823af0d3

If this has already been discussed here, I apologize. I'm on the road and have been away from DU.

Mr. Ward doesn't represent the vast majority of the Sanders backers I've interacted with since I 1st met a Sanders supporter. But his attitude is not rare either.
(Edited to correct a big error he DOESN'T reflect the vast majority in my experience, I fucked up a cut and paste)

Mr. Ward and his compatriots are harmful to the Senator's cause.

I believe further that his position will poison the well in the General if Senator Sanders does in fact win the nomination.

I cannot condone simple blackmail, and that is all his OP-ED is. His concluding statement is simple enough to understand:

The threat that we won’t show up at the polls is our bargaining chip. I might vote in November. I might not. If you’re worried about it, then I guess you better vote to nominate Bernie Sanders.

Nice America you got. Be a real shame if something were to happen to it.

Democrats need to so massively swamp the polls that not only do we short circuit Putin's ratfucking, and the GOP's voter suppression efforts but also overwhelm whatever percentage of Sanders' supporters who would rather assist Trump than oust him.

Edited again to fix link... Sheese

[Fresh_Start]

1. I too see it as blackmail or a terrorist threat nt

nt

[Sloumeau]

2. I am guessing that most Democrats do not take kindly to blackmail. :) nt

[TwilightZone]

3. If he can't see the threat that four more years of Trump poses...

he needs to pull his head out of his ass.

We need all Democrats to vote in November, regardless of the nominee, not only to regain the presidency, but for down-ticket races, as well. Congress and state legislatures are going to be vital parts of any Democratic agenda.

[Iliyah]

4. To be honest . ..

I don't think Senator Sanders will the Democratic Party's nominee. But thanks for the heads up.

[ibegurpard]

5. no denying there are lots of really obnoxious and destructive Sanders "supporters" out there

I would suggest that they are republican or russian agitators and ratfuckers but I know several real-life people that are just as bad. All I can suggest to the legitimate Sanders people out there trying to make the case for him is to reign in the obnoxious people that you know that are actually harming his campaign. They won't listen to anyone else.

[The Polack MSgt]

15. Some absolutely are Trumpsters playing a long con

Not all of them, but enough to sow doubt

[MH1]

31. Yeah, it's my real life experience that tells me the "Bernie Bro" is not a myth.

But OF COURSE, the real ones are multiplied by the fakes provided by the opposition. But they back-slap each other on social media anyway. There seems to be very little if any motivation by the campaign to tamp down this bullshit.

And THAT'S my problem with Sanders. (well I can't stand his yelling or his rigidity, either)

[ehrnst]

42. Yep. (nt)

[Cha]

6. Thanks for posting this, The Polack MSgt!

https://medium.com/justinward/i-wont-vote-blue-no-matter-who-d97b823af0d3

[StrictlyRockers]

7. I will vote for whichever Dem gets the nom, unless it's an oligarch I disagree with completely

Last edited Fri Feb 14, 2020, 01:36 PM - Edit history (1)

Is that any better? Am I allowed to say that?

Or am I blackmailing you for expressing my political opinion on a public forum? How is this blackmail?

[The Polack MSgt]

13. Not my rules - DU's TOS

Explicitly prohibits your post. Because they say you cannot declare that you won't vote for a Democrat if there is a Democrat running

Also, how did I become a Bloomberg supporter alluva sudden?

[StrictlyRockers]

40. Oh I didn't realize that.

Last edited Fri Feb 14, 2020, 06:53 PM - Edit history (1)

I will vote blue no matter who. Bernie is the candidate that inspires me more than any other candidate on the field. I think he's going to win big in November.

[The Polack MSgt]

41. +++

Can't argue with you about that

[Anon-C]

8. All things as they are; I would have a hard time voting for a Sanders/Stein or Sanders/Gabbard...

...ticket, yet I suspect the Sander's campaign may select just such a ticket if they were to win the nomination outright.

[The Polack MSgt]

11. Stein on the ticket would be a cyanide capsule

She's so toxic that even working for her in the past is enough to get you on the list of persona non grata to many democrats

[MH1]

32. She's an anti-vaxxer. How the hell could any sane person vote for her on the ticket, except that the

alternative would still be Trump?

It would be a tough choice for most Dems. Those here know the stakes and would suck it up and vote anyway. Most people in the wider world would not. We would lose badly.

[Tom Rinaldo]

9. He's not representative of me or of other Sanders supporters I know. However...

This forum is loaded with people expressing fear that "centrist" voters will be "scared away" from voting Democratic if Sanders is the nominee. Physical ballots can not distinguish between centrist and leftist voters, they just record who is being voted for, and the loss of a vote from the left is the same as the loss of a vote from the center. I spent much of the 2016 campaign arguing with leftist to get them to vote against Trump. Some did, some didn't. I will do all I can to make the attitude you are complaining about rare. But if Democrats nominate someone like Mike Bloomberg for President don't be naive about that not costing us votes from the left. It would.

[The Polack MSgt]

12. When (if) Bloomberg ever gets a delegate and his supporters publish articles like this -

I will definitely post my concerns - I am not a Bloomberg fan at all.

His law enforcement policies as Mayor were shit.

He used his anti gun organization as little more than an Email address harvesting operation in preparation to running for president and he is a smarmy asshole in my opinion.

In other words about 27 times better than Trump.

Make no mistake I WILL VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO, but I agree that a Bloomberg candidacy would hurt turn out on the left

[George II]

10. After all the outside interference in 2016, I don't trust anything.

Mr. Ward is pretty obnoxious and offensive, example:

Obama’s presidency was a disappointment—albeit one I saw coming. He managed to wind down US involvement in Iraq only to expand the War on Terror to multiple other theaters. He traded the one big “dumb war” for several smaller—and more inconspicuous— “smart wars” fought with “surgical strikes” delivered by high-tech drones.

Obama was timid in his first term despite having control over Congress and a firm mandate. Instead of being aggressive and using this advantage to push through some of his more ambitious proposals, Obama opted to pursue bipartisanship with a Republican minority hell-bent on obstruction.

If he's such an expert, I wonder how he'd do in the Oval Office?

[Cha]

16. omg..

[ehrnst]

14. K&R. (nt)

[NurseJackie]

17. I agree with you. Anyone who lacks loyalty to the Democratic party cannot be trusted.

[treestar]

18. Not a "bargaining chip" at all

Actually that attitude is self destructive. They don't seem to see that the elections don't work like that. They will not get any progressive policies by not voting. It's odd they don't see that.

[SunSeeker]

19. K & R

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

20. I am sure that there are supporters of every one still running

(and maybe even supporters of those who are no longer still running) who feel the same way. Those people are not real Democrats.

[TomCADem]

21. Classic BS Campaign Move.

Bernie's campaign once again elevates Bernie by threatening to destroy the Democratic Party around him.

[Gore1FL]

24. The article said otherwise.

[xyoungblood]

22. Interesting thread but,

we should vote blue no matter who because of the supreme court. RBG might want us to elect a Dem president just so she can retire from the courts and let a Dem pres seat a progressive judge. She deserves the respect of the Dem voters. If you don't want to do it for any other reason do it for someone who has spent her life fighting for us.

[ibegurpard]

23. yup

that's my argument for anyone on the left who will consider sitting it out if we end up with someone not progressive enough for them. Centrists Bill Clinton and Barack Obama had solid records when it came to judicial picks.

[progressoid]

26. NEWSFLASH!! People switch votes in every election cycle.

Statistics have shown that Sanders supporters were typical voters as in other election cycles in support of the eventual nominee.

There will always be those who don't want to support the nominee. There were Hillary supporters who refused to vote for Obama (PUMA voters). Hell, I remember Democrats who refused to vote for Dukakis!

As for "blackmail." Paleeeze. 99.9% of American voters won't even read his screed.

[relayerbob]

27. Sadly

Morons aren't contained to only the GOP. This article's author is demagogic, and rather clueless. Little apparent understanding of real history, but well-set in his fantastical view of it. No credentials other than being a small time gadfly. Undoubtedly voted for Stein. Hope I never have to see his "work" again

[James48]

28. Note to all:

As a long-time Sanders supporter, AND as a former Army officer, I can tell you that:

1. I don't know ANY Sanders supporters who talk like that.

2. That is CLASSIC Russian style misinformation utilized to divide and confuse, and intended to raise suspicion between allies.


Don't fall for it. Sanders supporters are NOT the enemy. Trump is. And with Trump, is the whole back force of Russian propaganda experts.

I vote blue, no matter who. I am supporting Sanders, because I think he's the best bet, and the real deal. I will also vote for whoever gets the nomination.

Don't fall for the Russian diversion.

[The Polack MSgt]

34. I do state in my OP that the majority of Sanders backers I know don't say these things

But some do - But i'm not acquainted with so Bernie people many that my experience is somehow more than anecdotal.

But I didn't write this article.

Also, this article is far from the 1st time I've read or heard this position advocated and every time I read this POV I get angry AF.

I will say this though friend... It gravels my ass that the Sanders campaign has never stomped on this line of "persuasion" in either primary season.

Would love to see some youtube campaign adds that started

"Got a favor to ask of you, please stop treating my campaign as a scorched earth assault on Democrats that you don't support"

[Ferrets are Cool]

29. Very tRumpish sentence there bud.

Nothing more than blackmail.

Thanks for posting MSgt

[Cha]

30. KICK

[aikoaiko]

33. The idea that the nominee should expect every voter who supported others is weird.

We have to expect it. Even Hillary supporters didn't vote for Obama in 2008, but Obama still won.

Strong candidates don't need to be concerned about protest votes.

[The Polack MSgt]

37. In the Trump era, on a site that requires its members to support Democratic candidates

I do not think it odd to expect all of our ALLIES to vote against Trump.

I am either the worlds oldest Gen X-er or the worlds youngest Boomer depending which cutoff date you choose and I have always voted in every election - local state and federal

But to be honest, I've voted against far more people than I have ever voted for.

What the Bernie or Busters are saying is "Everybody is Trump except Bernie, so fuck it" and that is harmful toxic bullshit.



ETA- when deployed or stationed overseas I voted via absentee ballot in Fed and State elections. PA, NY and IL (My legal residences while OCONUS) absentee ballots did not include the option to vote for offices below the state legislature.

[aikoaiko]

38. I would like all our allies to vote for the Democratic candidate, but I accept that we can't get all

Harping on them is counterproductive.

To them I say, vote your conscience and I hope you'll see that that it's better to get Trump out.

And then GOTV to people who don't vote and appeal to those in the middle because there are a lot more of them than defecting allies.

[The Polack MSgt]

39. On this we agree - The counter to disaffected Berners & Russian/GOP fuckery is to swamp the polls

Happy Valentine's day

[Cha]

35. Kick

[Progressive dog]

36. That is a reprehensible threat from those who would destroy

our system of government if they can't control who leads it.