Are you fucking kidding me!!!??? Rant on:

[Comatose Sphagetti]

This election is for all the marbles, folks. It's a choice for a semblance of the country we know or the adoption of full-on right-wing authoritarianism.
And Bernie or Pete may be the nominee? Don't get me wrong - both good men with some great ideas.

But both unelectable.

See the electoral map? See allllll that red part? That's rural America. Populated predominantly by Jesus/guns/'Murica types. Think they're going to vote for Bernie (socialist!!!) or Pete (gay!!!)? Think you'll see one Bernie sign/bumper sticker out here in the hinterlands? Or Pete? No fucking way. I'm already seeing trump flags/yard signs everywhere out here.

Yeah, I know - we outnumber them. But two words: Electoral College. It bit us in the ass last time and it could again.

The rise of Bernie in the primaries indicates to me that too many believe this to be a normal election. It is not. Again; it is for all the marbles and the republican smear machine hits its collective knees every night praying the nominee is Bernie or Pete. Biden/Bloomberg scares the shit out of them. They fear too many disaffected trump voters/independents will vote for them. And they would.

So I'm gonna say it; WE HAVE TO PLAY IT SAFE! Someone that republicans/independents tired of trumps bullshit will go for. Bernie/Pete ain't it. Not now. They and those with their ideas of a progressive agenda will have a shot in the near future if trump is defeated. If not, perhaps never.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. I've already seen several Pete signs here in the Midwest.

Of course, this is the People's Republic of Minneapolis so we might not be typical.

[IVoteDFL]

39. I'm in Maplewood/White Bear Lake area

I go past a few Pete and Sanders signs on my way to work.

[Autumn]

2. I live in a red rural area, god and guns. Bernie's got support here. From some of the most

unlikely neighbors.

[Farmer-Rick]

106. Yup, I live in the most beautiful place in America but surrounded by some of the ugliest Americans

The heart of red hat Trump country, bright raging red.

And already neighbors are seriously considering voting for Bernie. He has support here, despite the evangelicals, despite the silly red hats, despite the RepubliCON voting. They don't really care if you call it socialism. They want healthcare. They want college for their kids. They want what Bernie is offering.

If these staunch RepubliCON voters are talking about Bernie, I think he has a chance.

[Zolorp]

3. Out here in rural Kentucky, a Sanders nomination destroys any possibility of defeating McConnell

We have a real chance to do it this year.

If Bloomberg was on the top of the ticket, it's almost a slam dunk to take out McConnell.

[guillaumeb]

4. No matter who the Democratic nominee is,

the GOP and Russia will do everything that they can to paint that nominee as wanting to take away freedom and impose socialism.

The ACA was a very insurance industry friendly program, but the GOP called it socialism.

[mr_lebowski]

8. Most of it's tenets were crafted by right-wing think tanks as a market-based solution (nt)

[guillaumeb]

17. And that did not stop the GOP from lying.

We cannot craft our policies with pleasing the GOP voter as the primary factor. We must make the case for our policies, and that takes actual outreach, not simply a few speeches.

[mr_lebowski]

27. No argument my friend

However, red-state Dems in Congress and need for 60 Senate votes ... also contributed to limiting our options.

[KPN]

69. Exactly. And folks here call that moderate these days. "Are you fucking kidding me?"

[wnylib]

111. When Medicare was being established

back in the 1960's, there was a lot of fear about socialized medicine from the right and from moderate to conservative Dems. Now that it's well established, people love it and would not give it up.

BUT, it happened under a Dem President already in office and a majority Dem Congress. It was not an election year.

In today's political climate, proposing expanded social medicine coverage in an election year is much more risky.

Csn we afford to take such risks in such a critical election year? Having Medicare as a public option will sell. Having it as a mandatory obligation that replaces existing private coverage will not.

[guillaumeb]

117. Well argued.

The flaws in Medicare need to be fixed, and if that were to be done, these private plans called "Medicare advantage" would be unnecessary.

Lowering the eligibility age to enroll in Medicare would be one way to expand it faster.

[wnylib]

118. Yes, it would expand faster then.

Warren would be in a better position in the primaries if she had not pushed for mandatory coverage. People are ready for a medicare option, but not mandatory. I like Warren, but her MFA position will keep her from getting the nomination. She's a fighter, and I know she will continue to fight for economic reforms in the Senate. We need to give her a Dem Congress and President so she can succeed in her reforms.

[William769]

5. You can play safe all you want.

I'm going to let Democracy play out. There's a reason we have a big tent. Deal with it.

[lunasun]

31. +1

[KPN]

70. +2!

[The Mouth]

86. +3

[redstatebluegirl]

6. I had a young man knock last night supporting Bernie and had a Pete supporter a few days earlier.

We are as red as it gets. There are supporters of both of those candidates everywhere. Now, with that said you make some good points, some red states no democrat can carry and some those two would be a major problem because of how narrow the thinking is of the majority.

It was refreshing to see those two canvassing for their candidates though. I could support Pete, not problem, Bernie is a no go after what happened at the 2016 convention but I would vote for him in the general if he is our candidate.

[mr_lebowski]

12. I think Pete could be VP on a winning ticket fwiw (nt)

[Eyeball_Kid]

126. I suggest that whoever is the VP nomination, it can't be a Senator.

The likely scenario is that a Senator will be nominate for Prez. If s/he picks a Senator for VP, that's TWO vacancies in the Senate. Dems don't want two vacancies in the Senate.

[guillaumeb]

19. Welcome to DU.

But by your logic, Obama was clearly unelectable, correct?

[guillaumeb]

38. But Obama was clearly black.

As the GOP pointed out about a trillion times.

And yes, the GOP is trying to keep that bubble going, especially with low interest rates for borrowers.

[Beringia]

50. I heard that too, the OMG, are you kidding me, a black man winning

[guillaumeb]

52. The GOP, being the official Party of racists,

will use that "fear of Obama" forever.

[Beringia]

57. I even lost a treasured MySpace friend

because he was constantly posting horrible things about Obama. I didn't know him in person, but we made a real connection and I liked many things about him, and he really liked me. I just knew a person that would post the garbage he would post, about Obama not being a citizen and other stuff, I couldn't tolerate him. Well MySpace died anyway, so that is some consolation.

[guillaumeb]

59. Sorry to hear that, but at least you learned an important fact about that person.

Racism is the foundation of the post-1968 GOP.

[CaptYossarian]

91. Obama's middle name wasn't an asset either.

[Bettie]

36. I recall hearing that a lot

when he was a candidate. Weird, right?

[ChiTownDenny]

114. Well,

a black man got more votes than any other presidential candidate in history. A white woman got more votes than any white man running for president, ever. A gay man is currently leading in the delegate count. The people you describe aren't going to vote with us anyway.

[Kerrycrat]

128. Indeed

Just what I was thinking

[calguy]

9. Some common sense at last

DU has been and is being, hit by a wave of BernieBullshit posts almost 24/7 in an attempt to drown out all other opinions. They think their world is the only world that exists. Reality is gonna be a bitch if these hard left extremists get their way.

[Comatose Sphagetti]

14. This. nt

[FoxNewsSucks]

34. Hardly,

seems like the pro-Biden/anti-everyone-else posts are the most aggressive and attempting to drown out the rest.

[Bettie]

37. Well, the pro-Bloomberg

"only he can possibly win" contingent is growing too.

[YOHABLO]

49. Only because Bloomberg's minions, paid for by the way, are out there trying to get noticed.

He's got them as guests on MSNBC and CNN. He's buying up advertisement left and right. Bloomberg's the one out there telling people he's the only one who can beat Trump.

[tiredtoo]

97. " Bloomberg's the one out there telling people he's the only one who can beat Trump."

Seems i remember someone in the last presidential election telling us he was the only one that could save America.

[calguy]

45. Already trying to drown me out

Why am I not surprised?

[Beringia]

53. No, it is anti-Bernie 24/7

And many here support Biden or Warren when it didn't reflect how Iowa and New Hampshire voted

[Tweedy]

92. Really?

Senator Warren came in third in Iowa ("3 tickets out of Iowa" is a phrase older than most of us here).

Are you suggesting 2 states should guide us all?

Iowa is a favorite state of mine. Unfortunately, I haven't made it up to New Hampshire; yet, it looks quite lovely.

Nonetheless, who is willing to cede such an important choice to two relatively small states? I am not.

Finally, Joe Biden has not cratered in national polling. Still to this day, the one name my red state friends and family repeat with affection is Joe Biden. The former VP has a very deep well of affection with u.s. None of them are on the Bloomberg train as of now.

The wisdom of the American people is what we need to place our hopes on here. We will make the best choice if we pick the right candidate with the best chance of fixing this GOP mess and moving us forward in a permanent way.

Maybe Senator Sanders can get there;
he has not yet. No one is entitled to this. A quarter of us neither makes a primary victory, nor a revolution.

Nevertheless, this voter will vote for whoever the democratic nominee is.

[KayF]

10. Barack Hussein Obama?

the fucking red states are going to vote for Barack HUSSEIN Obama? Get real!!!!

[mr_lebowski]

24. Do you think he'd have won if the economy didn't crap out?

Further, do you think he'd have won had he staked out political positions similar to Bernie's?

Despite his scary-sounding name, he positioned himself as a moderate.

[handmade34]

65. THIS is why Obama won...

[mr_lebowski]

105. While of course I LOVE that ... I don't know that he wins without THAT ... AND the economy tanking

Under GOP leadership.

Obviously we'll never know, but ... we currently have nobody running like Obama, and I'm not at sure the economy won't be in the same shape it is now come November.

Ergo ... the potential appeal of a wildcard like Billionaire Bloomie.

[Squinch]

32. I know it's unscientific, but Obama had a hell of an IT factor. He's dripping with IT. None of

these guys is.

[YOHABLO]

51. Some of those red states aren't as red as you make think.

[TheCowsCameHome]

11. This time is different.

The conventional rules do no apply.

It's all or nothing. We can take no chances, it is MUST WIN situation.

Socialism would sink us as well as Sanders if he gets the nomination. Warren isn't far to the right of Bernie, either. Pete is very good, the gay issue isn't a deal breaker.

It is imperative we go with the candidate that can take out Trump by the biggest margin.

[Red Oak]

40. Those words have been spoken by every authoritarian in history.

"I alone can fix it"

Sounds familiar. Donald Trump July 2016




Bloomberg is dangerous.

[BusyBeingBest]

13. Bernie can win, I think. Bernie's got force of personality. Pete is like a carefully-crafted pie

that was taken out of the oven too soon. I don't think people in general will have an issue with his homosexuality, but rather his inauthentic vibe and his lack of vetting and experience. He's a media or DNC creation to me right now. He should run for governor or Senate in Indiana.

[lastlib]

26. Pete would be a GREAT Senator, IMHO!

[BusyBeingBest]

28. He would be.

[PatSeg]

35. I'm not that confident that Bernie can win

but I agree about Buttigieg. I couldn't quite articulate what bothered me about him and it is his "inauthentic vibe", almost robotic. That said, I think he could do well in a senate run or maybe governor. I just can't understand how anyone would think it was a natural progression to go from mayor of South Bend to the White House. I don't know if it is hubris or just a poor life plan. Obama ticked off several boxes before he ran for president.

[BusyBeingBest]

42. Yeah, once Obama was elected Senator of Illinois, he was able to stand

in 2008 on fairly equal footing with Hillary, Biden, Edwards, and later McCain. It was like a test he had to pass first--had he been in the Illinois state house and decided to run for President, it would have looked like delusional hubris. Even then, there was a lot of consternation about his lack of time in the Senate, and he had to be almost "approved" to run by elders like Durbin. I don't really know why Pete didn't continue building his creds, he's 37, for God's sake. But personality-wise, he's pleasant but programmed. Might get better as he gets more seasoning.

[PatSeg]

55. Yes

I remember that many considered Obama too inexperienced at the time and I must say I felt that way as well. He proved that he clearly was ready for the job, but that came after putting in the time and effort to earn some cred.

With Buttigieg, it reminds me of Beto O'Rourke trying for a presidential run too soon. He had the momentum and campaign cash to run for senate again, but he got bit by the presidential bug. Sometimes I think all the attention goes to their heads and they think they are invincible.

[OnDoutside]

15. Biden and Bloomberg is not a playing it safe option, it's the smart option.

This is not a Policy election, it's a referendum on Trump, so give the people what they want. Don't give them reasons not to vote Democratic.

[CentralMass]

16. Who is your choice and how are they any more likely to win either the primary or the general ?

[doc03]

18. I agree 100%. You won't see very many in

this area with a Sanders, Warren or Buttigieg sign or
bumper sticker. I would support any one of them over Trump myself but few here would. I am in the tristate
area of western PA, WV and Ohio.

[blue-wave]

21. Sadly too many

appear to be delusional. It's common sense and it just seems common sense just ain't so common anymore.

[PatSeg]

41. We live in very strange times

and often common sense is replaced with reactive emotions and sadly it can be seen on both the left and the right. We desperately need some stabilization and normality, so we can mend and rebuild after the mess Trump and republicans have created.

[lastlib]

22. ALL the marbles!!

Don't get me wrong--I LOVE all of the Dem candidates (EXCEPT Gabbard!)!! I WILL vote for the Dem. candidate, even if it's an old rusty Dodge hubcap (and I LOATHE Dodges!) But we have to offer up the candidate who can bring the biggest chunk of the electorate to the table in even the red-leaning states. My humble opinion is that, of the remaining active candidates, only Biden and Klobuchar can do that. I would like to be wrong on this, believe me, but I just don't see it any other way. I, like so many Dems, like the ideas that Bernie and Elizabeth and others bring up, but I have a fear that they would scare away a good many voters back to Shitgibbon. In my gut, I don't want to risk that--I just don't think we have a margin of safety to play with. Feel free to persuade me otherwise.

[left-of-center2012]

23. Will a socialist win over Trump voters?

Uh, no

[Liberty Belle]

25. I don't think anyone wins over Trump voters. You have to get others out to vote.

[apcalc]

30. The question is- will a socialist win over moderates??

No, no, a thousand times no.

And I live in a suburb.

[Bettie]

43. If they are STILL supporting Agent Orange

then they will NEVER vote for any Democrat.

[Love-All]

29. I think more people in middle America support Bernie than you think. Look at Iowa!

[lunasun]

44. +++ exactly and look who he was up there with in numbers ..Pete . Seems Sanders and Pete were

chosen on what they had to offer voters
Not the fear of Jesus/guns/'Murica types

[handmade34]

58. Iowa was a Democratic Primary

General is another story and Electoral College makes it even another story...

[Desert grandma]

88. Neither Iowa nor New Hampshire are representative of America

It has been said by many here and elsewhere that a Democrat cannot win without the African American vote....especially that of older African American women. The ONLY candidates that are polling well with this group are Biden and even Bloomberg. Getting rid of the Orange Maggot is the priority and yes...I will vote for ANY candidate running against trump in the GE. I just hope we nominate the most electable candidate.

[aikoaiko]

46. Nope. Not kidding you.

[FoxNewsSucks]

47. I live in a city, but travel rural MO, KS & OK a lot

for work. THe t-shirts I wear, and my bumperstickers, have made my anti-Bush, anti-republican and anti-tRump opinions clear. In so many small-towns, I have had people come up to me and say they agree but "are the only Democrat in town" only to have someone else do the same an hour later.

There are obviously a lot of Fox & Hate Radio addicts out there, and there is no other readily-available media for them. But that does NOT mean there are few or no liberals in those areas. You just don't see them. Rightwingers will blanket areas with their yard signs, they put Fox on public TVs, and they do everything to make their presence loudly-known. But that exaggeration is a lot of what makes everyone else think that they hold the "correct majority" position. It's not nearly as big a majority as you think.

If the media would actually inform the public, instead of just being a propaganda organ for republicans, we wouldn't be in this place. But I wish people here would stop falling for that illusion that rightwingers are some vast correct Christian majority.

I really hate seeing posts on here along the lines of "OMG we can't run a SOCIALIST!!! " We need to run on what democratic social policies are and what they do for working Americans. Stop letting the right define words like "social democrat" and "liberal" as evil disgusting insults.

On the topic of the electoral map, http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/2016/ that is a good explanation of the 2016 maps. They've gone from using the red/blue state map to claim most supported Bush in 2000 to using the county level map making the vast swaths of red seem like an overwhelming majority.

It is not, it's an illusion and it's bullshit that people here keep falling for it.

[jmg257]

48. Interesting - what do you think about Amy and Liz? ANY chance for them in your 'Murica?

Edit: And How about Gabbard? Post above mine mentions Fox addicts and she goes there.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

54. Let's work out a deal to run Mitt Romeny, then.

He's sure to win. Yeah, we completely sell out everything we stand for, but what the fuck, right? At least he wins.

I'm going to guess whomever the Dem nominee is will actually show up in WI, so they have a chance to win this state back. Plus, we can also learn other things from the last electoral loss. Or not and we just do stupid shit so we lose again.

[Iggo]

125. .

Couldn't believe my eyes last week. Glorifying Romney while shitting on Dem candidates. Not our best look.

[LeftTurn3623]

56. Are you kidding me?

With you fear post? Bernie is polling better against Trump than Biden?

And to tell people not to vote for Pete because you are scared him being gay can’t win? That is the definition of Discrimination. You think Democratic voters should discriminate against Pete? Wow!

Bloomberg has so much racist and sexiest stuff coming out right Incase you haven t watched the news. Not to mention he helped support Republicans to keep control of the Senate - oh and he was a republican.


Sorry fear will not make me decide who to vote for and I promise you when it gets to PA and if it’s between Bernie and Bloomberg I will vote for Bernie and tell everyone of my friends to do the same.

As far as I’m concerned. Not only do we need to stop Trump we need to stop Bloomberg

[RazBerryBeret]

62. completely agree

it's like a wise man once said:
“If one candidate is appealing to your fears, and the other one's appealing to your hopes, you’d better vote for the person who wants you to think and hope!”

[RazBerryBeret]

60. Could we please stop this Henny-Pennying?

the sky is not falling. This is America, this is our primary season.
Everyone gets a vote, the candidate with the most votes gets the nomination. if there is no monkey business, the person who gets the nomination is the most popular candidate of the Democratic Party.

Keep in mind, One thing America LOVES is the underdog.

"A black man will never win the election"
America: here, hold my beer.

"a reality TV star with zero experience will never be President"
America: here, hold my beer.

I live in Ohio, both Bernie and Pete have support here.

[handmade34]

67. ....

this is why Obama won...

and trump 'won' only because of the electoral college and serious deception and cheating

[handmade34]

61. two words: Electoral College

don't think too many people are listening to you Comatose...

people, even Democrats tend to be ruled by emotion and we liberals know that "Democratic Socialism" isn't a scary thing, but try telling that to all the people that have been scared silly by all the lies, hyperbole, disinformation, etc. that has been thrown their way

I get it, Bernie is exciting... but as I keep pressing as a Vermont resident... Vermont is a world unto itself and Vermont likes Bernie Sanders... but even in this Bernie loving state (I can take him or leave him) Vermont cannot implement all those policies that Bernie advocates... idealism doesn't often work in the real world

Electoral College is everything now and we should get smart... think with our head and strategize, not be ruled by our heart or emotions right now

[Comatose Sphagetti]

64. This. nt

[pandr32]

63. Biden or Bloomberg are both great choices, not just safe

[Jirel]

66. Are you fucking kidding us?!?!

Kerry! Safe as houses! Gore! VP, totally safe! Hillary! Ex-FLOTUS, powerhouse senator, and ex-SOS - natural safe candidate!

Bwahahahahaha! SAFE HAS LOST EVERY. FUCKING. TIME.

Get out of our faces with your “safe” nonsense. Hair Hitler was a radical, crazy candidate - America (the idiot side) wanted an out of control maniac for president. People are out of love with safe, on BOTH sides. Fire up the base with an exciting candidate like Liz or Bernie, someone with passion and ideas. That’s your winning path, not another snooze-fest hoping to pick up the mythical handful of “undecideds” who will never come to the polls anyway unless you capture their imaginations.

Who looks great in the polls against Dolt45? Bernie. And the less safe folks.

[pnwmom]

71. Warren's not an unsafe candidate. And she'd be much better than Bernie or Pete. nt

[Baclava]

73. You're not wrong....playing it safe with charisma and charm works though!

[robbob]

83. The first two I agree with...

But Hillary was NOT the safe pick (except maybe next to Bernie, and that was basically the 2 choices offered). She was a woman; historical first. She was the victim of a decades long smear campaign, which had made a negative impression on the minds of many less informed voters. She was the wife of a former president who had plenty of political baggage of his own (right or wrong).

Tell me Hillary was one of the most qualified and able people to ever run for the office and you’ll get no argument from me. Point out that she actually WON the popular vote and probably would have won the EC without election interference from Comey and I will agree with you 100%. But, except for the fact that there WAS no “safe” choice in 2016, I would hardly call her nomination safe! It was bold, it was risky, it was historic, and ultimately it was to easy to game the election and install a moron.

[ChiTownDenny]

115. +1

[Jirel]

133. Aside from being female, she was as "safe" as the other two.

Every Dem who has a shot, especially with an expressed interest in running for POTUS, has been the victim of a smear campaign sooner or later. Gore had been smeared for years before he ran, too. He was smeared for his environmental stances, as well as the stupid “Iinvented the Internet” trope. It took longer for Kerry to be swiftboated, but when the Rethugs went for it, it was vicious and unending - and ultimately successful.

All of these candidates made a negative first impression on brainwashed, uninformed voters. Hillary’s baggage was par for the course. It’s the same as Dump and Rudi are orchestrating for Biden - smeared for years as Obama’s VP, and now “investigated” for a nonexistent scandal.

As for smear campaigns, Obama was gifted with an incredible one - birth certificate, Islamophobia, ugly racial hatred, endless lies about his policies from “grabbing guns” imminently to “death panels.” Hillary had no worse than Obama, but Obama won... twice... despite it. The Obama difference was that he stoked up passion in the base with ideas that had the power to both inspire and divide. He was not “safe.”

Inevitably, any candidate who gets the nom will be treated to this, in one form or another. Strategically, it’s great that we had a packed field this year - too many targets to thoroughly smear everyone at once.

But let’s not rewrite history. Hillary’s platform was “safe.” Hillary’s qualifications were rock-solid “safe.” Hillary’s party loyalty and pedigree were “safe.”

[Arkansas Granny]

68. As much as I would like to see a more progressive Democratic candidate and platform,

this is not the time for it. A moderate will have a better chance of siphoning votes away from Trump whereas they could be put off by someone who is seen as too liberal or progressive.

As I see it, this year the main consideration is who can best beat Trump by a big enough margin that the outcome can't be disputed. If we can take the White House and get a majority in the Senate, then we can move policy further to the left. If we lose, I don't know what this country would look like after 4 more years of Trump.

This may be the most important election of my lifetime.

[yaesu]

72. Actually Bernie did just fine in the last red state primaries which ending not voting for the

"safe bet". Its just not a concern, Bernie has just as much draw power as any center left candidate.

[KPN]

79. Exactly.

[Love-All]

120. Exactly Exactly!

[rainin]

74. Play it safe and young people stay home.

We can't win if we don't mobilize young people.

[JohnnyRingo]

75. That is the hard truth.

I hear the people who say it's about time to accept a gay man or a self described socialist, but I have good democrat voting union friends who say they'll never be able to bring themselves to vote for a gay man who brings a husband to the WH. They don't even consider the socialist as a real contender.

It's too bad the country as a whole may not be ready for such change, but I'm just relating what I hear in the Midwest.

[DENVERPOPS]

76. Couldn't agree with you more CS

We are going for broke here folks. Even Biden/Warren would be better than the other candidates.

Of course we are thinking that it is going to be a non corrupted election.

It used to be: "Beware the Ides of March".........now it's November 3-4th.

Just to be safe, every dem should order a Trump sign so if it get's crazy they can sneak out later the evening of Nov 3rd and put it up in their front yard...........

[Amimnoch]

77. but Bernie is so loved by the Red states.

He's so beloved that Republican leadership is asking their own electoriate to go to our primaries and vote for him!


https://www.wyff4.com/article/upstate-conservative-campaign-encourages-republicans-to-vote-for-bernie-sanders-in-sc-presidential-primary/30780304#

"This is an opportunity for us to support President Trump. We can't vote for him in primary this year so we can help him by participating in the Democrat Primary and voting for the candidate we feel is least electable and is also creating a lot of dissension between The Democratic Party and the Democrat voters,” said Shea.

https://thehill.com/homenews/481489-republicans-urging-gop-voters-to-vote-for-sanders-in-south-carolina-primary-report

Leupp said that he believes that the state's large Republican voter base could make the difference in the primary. To his point, in 2016 roughly 740,000 people voted in the state's GOP presidential primary, while only 370,000 voted in the Democratic version.
“I think we can easily affect the outcome,” Leupp told the paper. “This is going to catch on like wildfire.”

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/05/07/bernie-sanders-republican-senate-1307296

Republicans like their chances of keeping the Senate in 2020. But there’s one thing they think would all but seal the deal: Bernie Sanders as the Democratic presidential nominee.
Some GOP incumbents are practically cheering him on, confident there’s no way a self-described democratic socialist could win a general election against President Donald Trump and that he’d drag other Democrats on the ballot with him.

“It would be good for us to have a nominee like that,” said Sen. Joni Ernst (R-Iowa), who is up for reelection next year and sounded downright giddy about the prospect of Sanders representing Democrats at the top of the ticket.

[slumcamper]

78. I feel the exact same way. WAKE the *** UP, people!

E L E C T O R A L
C O L L E G E

PLEASE--think harder--and consider our existential place in social, economic, and political time and space!

Any realistic assessment will conclude that everything is at stake. All could be lost. Much already is. Do you think shit is bad now???? Me too! But if this autocrat is reelected because so many of our friends are willing to strap themselves to the hull of the good ship USS Idealism, say goodbye to whatever remains of this country.

Most certainly, idealism has its place. However, for idealism to bear fruit it must be tempered by an abiding sense of reason. For the moment I've set my idealism aside for the sake of reason, while clinging to a vestige of optimism that holds that we can and MUST win to have any opportunity to restore the damage done and make progress. And reason buoys hope for:

S U P R E M E
C O U R T

U S S E N A T E

[calimary]

80. Yep. Indeed, indeed, indeed!

[jmg257]

81. Yeah - Go Tulsi!!!

"Someone that republicans/independents tired of trumps bullshit will go for."




Safe to say, at least they've heard of her...or better yet - seen her!

[Iggo]

124. She still running?

[jmg257]

132. So I hear - she did have a town hall in Maine the other day.

[Curtis]

82. This whole thing of winning over Trump voters is stupid

They can't be won over. They've drunk the Koolaide and are irredeemable. They are lost. They are brainwashed. And, we as a party always fall into this crap of trying to win over Republican voters and it NEVER works. NEVER. So, how about we target the reasons people stay home on election day instead? Maybe give people a reason to show up and vote? Instead of going for that middle of the road mediocrity crap that turns people off, we go for someone with some ideas that actually excite people? Obama did that with his "Hope and Change" and won handily. Hillary tried to ride the middle of the road and couldn't quite pull it off. Don't get me wrong. All of our candidates are heads and shoulders above the idiot from the GOP. But, I'm talking exciting the voters who stay home. If we have two sides of the same coin, what's gonna make the voter who is wanting change go out and actually vote for one of the two people who look and sound the same (to them)?

[Mc Mike]

84. A ton of people said that America would never elect a Black President.

Fucking Rump was, and is, eminently un-electable.

I'll back any Dem that wins the primary.

[ananda]

85. Actually, Berniei is the most electable of them all.

That's because he never changes his message, and he
never goes to the center.

He speaks to a people-first agenda, and that always
wins!

If Democrats would all do this, then we wouldn't even
be having this conversation.

Sue

[johnthewoodworker]

87. I know. Lets find a candidate who is a racist, corrupt, lazy, dumb nazi.

Then we can surely capture some red state votes. All we have to do is become who we hate. But, for God's sake don't vote for someone whose values you share.

[aeromanKC]

89. +1000

In addition, the importance of the down ballot races cannot be under-scored. Winning the tight swing state and red state Senate races we need to win to take back the Senate cannot be won with Sanders on the ticket. If Bernie is on the ticket, I can see many voters that we need to beat Trump voting against Trump but for the R in the Senate race to make sure his policies do not get enacted but still getting rid of Trump. If we want Democratic policies to get enacted we need to take back BOTH the WH and Senate!!

[krissey]

90. Warren is the strongest. We need to all get behind Warren. If not Warren, klobuchar.

[JGug1]

93. Electability of Buttigieg

I do not think Bernie can win the election. He is too vulnerable on too many issues. However, I am not clear that Pete Buttigieg can't win. I think that when you make that assertion, you are ignoring that he won with over 60% of the vote in South Bend AFTER he came out. Further, he won (along with Bernie) in Iowa and did very well in New Hampshire.

[James48]

94. No.

We are NOT “playing it safe”.

I’m seeing lots of BERNIE stickers here in Michigan. Yes, that’s right. Bernie is doing well especially among the working class that shifted to Trump last time.

Last time the DNC took “the playing it safe” route, and that bombed.

This time, we are going with a REAL deal candidate who can draw from a wide wide spectrum. Bernie CAN do that. And IS doing that.

I’m with Bernie.

[James48]

100. You tell me-

What candidate, besides BERNIE, has gone on In front of a Fox News audience and gotten applause like this?

https://www.facebook.com/berniesanders/videos/2241428379488406/?vh=e

I’m with Bernie!

[Locrian]

130. op is totally faulty logic

>>The rise of Bernie in the primaries indicates to me that too many believe this to be a normal election. It is not.
>>So I'm gonna say it; WE HAVE TO PLAY IT SAFE!

So its NOT a normal election, but we're supposed to pick a "safe bet"?! SMDH.

You are right though it's not a "normal election". It's people FED UP with the status quo. Didn't we **just** see that with HRC in 2016? It's climate change, planet on fire, rise of authoritarianism, huge inequality, people dying for lack of healthcare. And so now we have to play it safe? Play it safe are you freaking serous? Playing it safe is addressing any of those concerns?


Bernie is the only candidate that is actually generating excitement and passion from a broad spectrum, and has the history of being on the side of the people Most of the rest are establishment candidates, or in Bloomberg's case outright republicans.

[Runningdawg]

95. We may out number them, but they VOTE at a much greater % as their churches demand.

[Cartoonist]

96. Trump was unelectable

Until he got elected.

[tiredtoo]

98. Damn, VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO!

Being old enough to remember when a Catholic could never be elected I look upon this OP with dismay.

[DallasNE]

99. Need To Add Joe To That List

Otherwise Trump Will Run On Ukraine Ukraine Ukraine.

[ramen]

101. I see you are undecided, who do you have in mind as safest?

I also think the stakes are unimaginably high this election, and have no interest in losing it.

[Martin Eden]

102. You think we can convince Trumpers to vote for a Democrat??

Are you Fucking KIDDING ME??!!!

An argument can be made that we need a candidate who can attract swing voters in the key battleground states, but an equally valid argument is we win by GOTV in those states.

[DallasNE]

103. Exactly. n/t

[avebury]

104. I think that a Sanders nomination will

be a disaster. It will tank any chance to take back the Senate and could erode our gains in the House. Even if by some miracle Sanders could win, if McConnell is not defeated and we can’t take the Senate, I doubt that Sanders would be allowed to do anything.

It is imperative that we take back both the WH and the Senate. Anything less than that will be a failure. We do not have the luxury of any kind of purity test where the Democratic Party candidate meets all of our criteria.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

107. This seems SO obvious. If people haven't figured it

Out...doubt we can change minds. But nice try!!! You rank in top ten of people making 100% sense.

The winner must also be the antithesis of trump.

[Collimator]

108. I am not a political strategist, but this is what I told my friend. . .

In the primaries, vote for who you really want. You're not voting against Trump. You are telling the DNC who you want to be president, not who may or may not be electable.

I'm not a mathematician, either, but let's say that the #1 and # 2 slots in various state primaries are spread among four different candidates. Sometimes the win is significant, sometimes the difference between the first and second spots is small. At the same time, the third spot is consistently cornered by the same person.

This is information that the Democratic Party needs to understand what their own members want. Once they have it, then they can put together the best strategy. (And one hopes that they know more than I do.)

Voting for the person that you are unenthusiastically willing to vote for in the general doesn't really tell the party leaders what they need to know. There is going to be some jockeying behind the scenes no matter how the numbers play out. You may as well vote with your true voice now to tell the people in power where you want things to move in the future.

You may not get that option now, but the option will never be considered if you don't let our representatives know what you are really thinking.

[pistdem]

109. I am starting to lose sleep

over a Bernie nomination. I really believe that he is too extreme to beat Trump and I agree we have to play it fairly safe. Unlike some, I think Pete would beat Trump. I think any of the top-of-the-pack Dems would beat Trump and gladly support any of them, I like them all. Bernie on the other hand, is going to be a hard person for me to support. I personally know many others that feel the same way.

[DaDeacon]

113. Why lose sleep?

What evidence supports this fear of ( false evidence appearing real). Polls? Election Results? Just help me Out.

[bitterross]

110. I think you are right. Neither Can Win.

I love Pete. He's intelligent, he's compassionate. Never been a fan of Bernie. I won't vote for him in the primaries. I think he's really just as opportunistic as Trump in the way he uses the Democratic party. It's like Trump uses the GOP. Neither of them really give a damn about the party they're using. In fact, I'm pretty sure Bernie would be happy to burn down the Democratic party all together. If he does end up as the nominee I will hold my nose and vote for him though. We have to defeat Trump.

All that said, I think you are dead on correct. Pete is not going to get the votes of the Bible Belt. They hated the black guy in office for 8 years and they retaliated in 2016 with their votes for Trump. Trump worked their racism, misogyny, and xenophobia perfectly in 2016. He has kept them fired up with his hate rallies, his tweets, and the support of the FUX channel. Playing to their homophobia will be an easy, natural add-on to his vile rhetoric.

The word "socialist" scares them on an emotional level. They are not intellectuals. Bernie doesn't have a chance. The same racism, misogyny and xenophobia Trump used in the last election will work well against Bernie. All those red state people will continue to believe that Socialist Bernie wants to tax them in order to give African Americans, immigrants and other minorities free stuff. That he's taking stuff away from them to do so. That he wants to give women jobs that men should have.

They don't do critical thinking and they won't do it for the election. They won't take time to do the math and see their employer-provided insurance actually sucks when it comes to the deductibles and co-pays. That if they had a major medical issue they'd be screwed. These are the same people who when they get polled about the ACA and it's provisions, support it overwhelmingly when it's called the ACA. But when they get polled about Obamacare with only the word ACA replaced by Obamacare they don't support it. It's not about policy. It's about appearance.

Winning with them is not about policy. It's about appearance and emotions. They are viscerally opposed to socialists and gays on an emotional level. Frankly, where I'm from in the South, they're also very racist when it comes to Jews. My dad, who would not let us use the n-word, would use the awful phrase "Jew them down" when he was talking about negotiating a price on something.

More and more, I'm convinced Obama was a freak of nature. The GOP managed to lose to him twice because they ran men with actual morals and ethics when they ran McCain and Romney. Not that I'm a fan of either of those asshats. I won't speak ill of the dead, but I will say Romney is a corporate raider, taker, and part of the .01%. Both of those men refused to make the election about race and all the other vile things which Trump used so deftly.

Trump is all about show - about emotional response. That is the one thing at which I will say he is a master. People don't think about the fact TV shows are edited and real life is not. They love him from "You're Fired!" because they want to be him. He makes them believe that some day they WILL be him. He plays to their emotions of hatred for African Americans, Jews, strong women, and LGBTQ+ people. He lights up the endorphins their brains with his BS.

If we don't realize that is what we have to run against this year, we will lose.

[DaDeacon]

112. this post is wrong headed.

Anyone can win!!~! The question of whether are not the base will take time to support whoever the candidate is.

[jimlup]

116. But who is that?

I don't think that we are living in normal times and we need to have a good understanding of how the people will break. That just isn't clear to me right now.

I'm honestly perplexed.

[rockfordfile]

119. Every Democratic Nominee is electable. This year it's the Democratic Nominee's election

[Duppers]

121. Damn, you've read my mind.

Thank You for voicing this!!
I've not read the thread yet but I know there'll be folks here who will not see the absolute pragmatic facts you so well stated.

[lees1975]

122. All that red in the middle

doesn't have enough electoral votes to win. So Democrats have to get their majorities out in places like Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Iowa, Florida and focus money and foot power on states like North Carolina, Georgia and Arizona that can be flipped. There, I just added enough electoral votes to the Democrats to go well over 300. It's a matter of making sure turnout happens everywhere.

[Iggo]

123. How did we ever elect a black man?

[macwriter]

127. THANK YOU!

I could not agree more with Comatose Sphagetti. I have been screaming this for weeks. How could we not grasp what an unmigated disaster it will be to have Trump re-elected? WHY DO YOU THINK THAT TRUMP IS BERNIE'S BIGGEST DEFENDER WHEN HE IS TAKING THE SCORCHED EARTH APPROACH WITH BLOOMBERG AND BIDEN?

Wake up! And don't tell me anecdotal evidence of yard signs. It means nothing at this stage of the game.

As of now, I am putting all my energy and donations into the senate races. If our party has totally lost its collective mind and wants to go on this death march to November, I will do all I am capable of to make sure the House stays blue and the Senate turns blue -- WHICH WILL BE MUCH HARDER WITH A LOSING CANDIDATE AT THE TOP OF THE TICKET!!!

And yes, I wlll crawl over broken glass to vote for the top of the ticket, but it will be a futile effort in my opinion if we nominate someone who scares off or turns off independents and never trumpers.

[pansypoo53219]

129. bernie is getting hispanics + has killer mike. plus he is great on messaging w/ blue collar. + he

will make the moron insane.

and COAST ON SAYING NO!

[Squinch]

131. I fear the number of Democrats that don't understand the truth of what you're saying.