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Joe BidenCongratulations to our presumptive Democratic nominee, Joe Biden!
 

Quixote1818

(28,930 posts)
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 03:04 AM Feb 2020

This video by the Atlantic back in 2016 before the General Election seemed to nail why 4.4 million

Obama voters stayed home in 2016. Keep in mind the election had not occured yet when the video was made. He suggested those voters were already a bit disillusioned that Republicans stopped so many of Obama's policies and that Sanders was the only one they thought might make a difference. Sure, they were naive and should have gotten their asses out to vote! However, what he is suggesting is that we need a Sanders or Obama to get them back out again.

I should mention that he said if Sanders does win and can't get anything done they may stop voting again.

Video is embedded in this article:
Bernie Is Not a Socialist and America Is Not Capitalist
Scandinavia is, by one measure, a freer market than the United States

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2016/03/bernie-sanders-democratic-socialism/471630/


538: Registered Voters Who Stayed Home Probably Cost Clinton The Election

Registered voters who didn’t vote on Election Day in November were more Democratic-leaning than the registered voters who turned out, according to a post-election poll from SurveyMonkey, shared with FiveThirtyEight. In fact, Donald Trump probably would have lost to Hillary Clinton had Republican- and Democratic-leaning registered voters cast ballots at equal rates.

Election-year polls understandably focus on likely voters. Then, after the election, the attention turns to actual voters, mainly using exit polls. But getting good data on Americans who didn’t vote is more difficult. That’s why the SurveyMonkey poll, which interviewed about 100,000 registered voters just after Election Day, including more than 3,600 registered voters who didn’t vote, is so useful.1 It’s still just one poll, and so its findings aren’t gospel, but with such a big sample we can drill down to subgroups and measure the demographic makeup of nonvoters to an extent we couldn’t with a smaller dataset.

Let’s look first at the most newsworthy finding: Registered voters who identified as Democrats and independents were more likely than Republicans to stay home.

More: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/registered-voters-who-stayed-home-probably-cost-clinton-the-election/

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
5 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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This video by the Atlantic back in 2016 before the General Election seemed to nail why 4.4 million (Original Post) Quixote1818 Feb 2020 OP
They're calling Bernie a liar tirebiter Feb 2020 #1
They aren't calling him a liar. Yes he has been confusing but he clearly advocates for Scandinavian Quixote1818 Feb 2020 #4
lol the sanders sit-outs chose trump over hillary, thus attacking democrats yet again nt msongs Feb 2020 #2
Sanders sit-outs were a normal number historically. More Hillary voters crossed over to McCain Quixote1818 Feb 2020 #3
They don't want to get it. It is easier to blame Bernie ms liberty Feb 2020 #5
 

tirebiter

(2,536 posts)
1. They're calling Bernie a liar
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 03:53 AM
Feb 2020

Sanders calls himself and his policies socialist.
And do we have to go over the difference between Democratic Socialist and Social Democrat yet again?
Audacity was the winning element.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Quixote1818

(28,930 posts)
4. They aren't calling him a liar. Yes he has been confusing but he clearly advocates for Scandinavian
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 04:52 AM
Feb 2020

style democracies. I think the confusion is that the issues he want to focus on as President would become more socialist like HC etc. but he intends to leave the capitalist structure firmly in place and has been very clear about this.

Snip:

Sanders described himself as a "democratic socialist"[5] and an admirer of aspects of social democracy as practiced in the Scandinavian countries. In an address on his political philosophy given at Georgetown University in November 2015, Sanders identified his conception of "democratic socialism" with Franklin D. Roosevelt's proposal for a Second Bill of Rights,[6][7] saying that democratic socialism means creating "an economy that works for all, not just the very wealthy," reforming the political system (which Sanders says is "grossly unfair" and "in many respects, corrupt&quot , recognizing health care and education as rights, protecting the environment, and creating a "vibrant democracy based on the principle of one person, one vote."[8] He explained that democratic socialism is not tied to Marxism or the abolition of capitalism but rather describes a program of extensive social benefits, funded by broad-based taxes.[9]

Snip:

Socialist organizations
American socialists and representatives belonging to the Democratic Socialists of America, Socialist Workers Party and Socialist Party USA have criticized Sanders, arguing that he is not a socialist because he aims to reform capitalism rather than to replace it with an entirely different socialist system.[13] Despite these criticisms, the Democratic Socialists of America "strongly support(ed)" his campaign for President.[14] Former Sanders colleague, Peter Diamondstone, claimed that Sanders was a socialist during his time in the Liberty Union Party but is no longer a true socialist.[15]

Bhaskar Sunkara, the founder, editor, and publisher of the socialist journal Jacobin, considered Sanders to be a social democrat and not a socialist.[6]

Other commentators
In 2015, The New Republic distinguished between socialism and "democratic socialism", suggesting that Sanders himself was loose with the distinction in his terminology and that the United States already had such social democratic programs as Social Security and Medicare.[16] Noam Chomsky, a social commentator and activist, called Sanders an "honest New Dealer" and not a true socialist.[17] In a 2016 editorial, The Economist suggested that, despite calling himself a "democratic socialist", Sanders actually fits the mold of a "social democrat" for his embrace of "private companies that thrive and grow in America" and belief that "the middle class and the working families who produce the wealth of America deserve a fair deal".[18] A Forbes commentator suggested that his "democratic socialism" is really social democracy, as found in much of Europe and especially in the Nordic countries.[19] Danish Prime Minister Lars Løkke Rasmussen has also disputed Sanders's portrayal of Denmark, denying that the nation is socialist and noting they have a market economy.[20]

In 2018, The Week suggested that there was a trend towards social democracy in the United States and highlighted the implementation of such policies in the Nordic countries, suggesting that Sanders’ popularity was an element in favor of possible growth in acceptance of social democracy.[21]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Bernie_Sanders

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

msongs

(67,405 posts)
2. lol the sanders sit-outs chose trump over hillary, thus attacking democrats yet again nt
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 04:06 AM
Feb 2020
If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

Quixote1818

(28,930 posts)
3. Sanders sit-outs were a normal number historically. More Hillary voters crossed over to McCain
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 04:37 AM
Feb 2020

This has been pointed out over and over and yet some here just don't seem to get it or just want to keep sticking it to Sanders regardless of the historical evidence.

Snip: Moreover, defections from a primary to general election are common. More voters went from Hillary Clinton to John McCain in 2008 than went from Sanders to Trump in 2016; about 13 percent of Trump’s 2016 voters also voted for Barack Obama in 2012.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/8/24/16194086/bernie-trump-voters-study

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
 

ms liberty

(8,574 posts)
5. They don't want to get it. It is easier to blame Bernie
Mon Feb 17, 2020, 07:09 AM
Feb 2020

And it fulfills their need to have an enemy to blame. To do otherwise would be for them to admit their candidate was not flawless.

If I were to vote in a presidential
primary today, I would vote for:
Joe Biden
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