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[Turin_C3PO]

1. Well, it's not Bloomberg.

He’d suppress turnout much more than Sanders. The answer is Biden or Warren.

[EveHammond13]

4. I'll go with Joe. That works.

[handmade34]

27. ...

[tavernier]

142. Joe, of course.

But there are many who would rather vote for BS even knowing he can’t win. The team mentality does strange things to ppls minds. Joe is my preference but if I felt someone had a better chance at beating Rump, I would give them my full support.

[Martin Eden]

122. I agree. GOTV will by HUGE in this election -- especially among POC

Bloomberg would be just about the WORST choice for that.

[dware]

2. +100 nt

[Blues Heron]

3. since you put it in caps it must be true right

plenty of americans have, can and will, despite your protestations to the contrary lol

[EveHammond13]

11. Based on what? The voters we need to get back will not vote for a socialist.

Polls are crap. You'll be saying BUT BUT the POLITO POLL! when you wake up the morning after trump wins.

[Perseus]

118. Please provide your analysis, your data that helped you arrive at that conclusion, please help us

We really need to see that because maybe some of us are believing what seems that about 78% of the country thinks the opposite of what you are saying and we may be walking into a trap. Please help, share your data, your analysis.

Polls are crap but not what you offer here, I would like to know what methods you used to reach your conclusion. It should be shared to help us see the light.

[Steven Maurer]

139. This isn't rocket science. There are polls.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/285563/socialism-atheism-political-liabilities.aspx

Willingness to Vote for a Party's "Well-Qualified" Candidate for President, Based on Candidate Characteristics
% Yes, would vote for that person; Selected trend

Type 1958 1983 2007 2015 2020
Black 38 77 94 92 96
Catholic 67 92 95 93 95
Hispanic -- -- 87 91 94
Jewish 63 88 92 91 93
Woman 54 80 88 92 93
Evangelical -- -- -- 73 80
LGBT -- 29 55 74 78
Under 40 -- -- -- - 70
Over 70 -- -- 57^ -- 69
Muslim -- -- -- 60 66
Atheist 18 42 45 58 60
Socialist -- -- -- 47 45

The percentage of the public willing to vote for a "well qualified" socialist has actually gone DOWN.

[Perseus]

157. Any Democrat will be labeled as a socialist, not sure where you got those polls

or if the question was "will you vote for a socialist", considering 90% of people don't have a clue what "socialism" is it is a bogus poll.

Other polls say 78% of the country want what Sanders and Warren are offering.

[Steven Maurer]

159. You obviously didn't read the link or you wouldn't be asking were I got the poll from...

And the public doesn't care what Republicans call Democrats (or the reverse). They care what Democrats call themselves.

Say some Republican started calling themselves a "Democratic NAZI". All policies aside, do you think that candidate would do better or worse than a different Republican in the general election?

[jalan48]

5. Then Bernie should lose the Primary. No worries.

[thesquanderer]

34. Exactly. And I also remember when people were sure America would not vote for a black man. (n/t)

[redstateblues]

51. Bernie is no Obama. Obama was inspirational. Bernie is an angry shouter

[earthside]

119. I would pick a different standard for comparison if I were you ...

... Biden is not inspirational in the slightest.

Biden is no Obama, either.

[Me.]

54. Possibly, If It's Not Rigged

Russians/Moscow Mitch

[jalan48]

129. Yes we've seen that before.

[DanTex]

6. Democratic Socialist. Who is leading in all the polls.

[aeromanKC]

13. Thanks to GOP interference

Operation Chaos

[Gidney N Cloyd]

39. And lack of a deep dive-- so far-- into Bernie's baggage.

[ramen]

124. This is news to me, any source for that? n/t

[DaDeacon]

138. Come on...

Stop trying to fight opinions with fact based evidence...lol

[Steven Maurer]

144. People won't give you that because we know it's useless

I've provided plenty of information before (it's all available on google), but people who ask aren't really interested in any real information. They just want to waste other people's time.

This "Sealioning" is a type of sociopathic behavior that no one is going to bother to indulge.

[DaDeacon]

149. At least you admit it...

[Steven Maurer]

154. That you're a sociopath?

Um, well, I suppose.

I try not to be quite so blunt about it normally, but there are obviously people who derive pleasure not so much from doing well themselves, as hurting others that they (for whatever reason) hate. In this case, asking someone to write a lengthy summary of Sanders weaknesses not for information, but because you can laugh at them for being able to waste their time.

Not a lot of people like you who openly admit it though. That's certainly different.

[DaDeacon]

178. saddly no...

you admit you don't really care for debate or an honest assessment of facts or ideas. Nice name-calling.

[Steven Maurer]

184. You said this of yourself, not me

And you're 100% projecting in terms of making disingenuous arguments. Everyone else is so over the "make me admit something I never will" sort of sealioning we get from the bros.

But it is what it is. If Democrats do make the mistake of picking that guy, you'll have four more years of Trump to pick apart his campaign.

[ramen]

164. Pardon? Seeking a source for an unsupported claim that Sanders' early lead is

a product of republican interference is sociopathic? Here, I'll throw out an unsupported claim and label anyone who calls me out on it a sociopath.

Biden, um, purees Asian babies and uses the puree as a condiment on hot dogs. Don't waste my time asking me to link show you that it is true, just use teh google. And stop 'sealioning' me.

Goodness


EDIT: gop interference was the accusation, not Russian, as I originally wrote, in what is apparently a display of sociopathy.

[highmindedhavi]

166. yup

[LonePirate]

7. Plenty of people think a socialist would be infinitely better than 45.

It sounds like you have convinced yourself otherwise, though.

[handmade34]

25. "plenty" does not win an election

"In America, a sociopath will beat a socialist seven days a week and twice on Sunday"

[whathehell]

46. "Plenty", as opposed to a majority, won the election for Trump

Maybe "a sociopath will beat a socialist seven days a week" in your corner of America, not in mine.

[handmade34]

55. "my corner of America"

is Vermont where we all love Bernie as our Senator

the United States is a big, diverse world... my views are largely informed by my 12 years of traveling the United States (for work) and going into neighborhoods throughout... witnessing how people live and what they believe

the quote is Steve Schmidt's and I think it is apt

[whathehell]

66. "The United Stated is a big, diverse world"...No kidding -- I've spent 70

years living in all parts of them -- Forty years on the East Coat, 10 on the West and the last 20 in the Midwest...I've visited 26 others.

I like Steve Schmidt, but he's a decided Republican..I'm sorry to hear you've accepted his slanted view of the country as your own.

[handmade34]

85. don't be sorry...

I haven't accepted his slanted view of the country as my own... I just think it is apt at this time... the people that are not astute students of history, that have been brainwashed, taught, conned into believing that "socialism" is evil... those people will vote for trump before they do Bernie...

I do believe they are the minority and I believe that Bernie could win all the 'blue' states... but... Bernie is offensive to many (I find his demeanor unpleasant), the republicans are dishonest and brutal, and what we need to concern ourselves with is the electoral college... your statement that "Plenty, as opposed to a majority, won the election for Trump" is pretty much what I am arguing...

I said plenty does not win elections... I should have further said unless you cheat and also get the swing states... I don't believe Bernie will carry those states we need

[whathehell]

101. What people don't get is that Socialism isn't the big "scare" it

iwas during the Cold War years...Study after study confirms that A. Most Americans FAVOR "socialist" programs like M4All and higher taxes on the wealthy. B. Socialism has LOST much of it's stigma, especially among younger people who don't remember the Cold War and it's attendant propaganda.

[paleotn]

112. Vermont here as well and Steve Schmidt is wrong.

It's kind of like fighting the next war with the last war's tactics. The thing about elections, times change and no two are ever the same. I know folks in NC, TN and AL that would happily vote for Bernie. Not enough to move ruby red TN or AL, but NC is another story. But that's irrelevant at this point. I don't care who's leading now. Whole lot more election to go before summer. So I'm not going to hyperventilate about who's leading in Feb like our caps lock challenged OP. I doubt it will be Bernie come summer. Who it will be, I haven't a clue. Stay tuned.

[gollygee]

52. I question whether that's the case in swing states

I think the overall mood will be that 45 is horrible but at least he isn't a socialist and trump will win again.

[Perseus]

126. Yes, at least trump is not a socialist, he is a maniac who is destroying the country and democracy

But thank God he is not a socialist, imagine the horror of free education, medicare for all, reversing trumps' tax cuts, putting all the criminals in jail after fair trials, restoring our reputation with World leaders, etc.

So glad trump is not a socialist, but wait a minute...Putin IS a so called socialist, actually its worst than that, Putin is a COMMUNIST DICTATOR who is taking over the USA thanks to trump, but hey, we can put up with that because trump is not a socialist.

trump is giving Putin our intelligence secrets, but hey, so glad he is not a socialist. trump is destroying the rule of law in the USA, but he is not a socialist, thank God for that...Wow, the more I write the more convinced I am that we must vote for trump if Bernie is the nominee, because trump is not a socialist and some people say Bernie is...now I am scared...The socialist Bernie Sanders vs the maniac trump, easy choice right? Lets avoid the socialist.

[gollygee]

165. You'd be surprised how many people feel that way nt

[NCjack]

68. If the disaffected vote for Trump, they will be voting for a Socialist. Trump likes

keeping the super rich off of the nation's safety net for billionaires. He plans another tax cut for the rich later this year, just in time to goose the stock market before the election.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

8. I don't think liberals will vote for someone

who enacted and has not walked back from stop and frisk. Nor someone that has horrible sexual harassment allegations against him and refuses to address those issues well.

Gen X and younger don't have the same propped up hatred of socialism that Boomers and older have. I'm about as old as you can be and still be Gen X, so I lived through the end of the cold war. Those younger than me didn't get the propaganda of "communism bad" pushed down their throat and most realize that socialism is not Marxist-Leninist authoritarian communism.

[UniteFightBack]

20. Well maybe they should do some god damn research before purporting to know wtf they are

talking about.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

23. What exactly are they getting wrong from what I posted?

Do you think that Sanders is a Marxist-Leninist authoritarian communist?
Do you think that the programs Sanders is proposing are like the USSR?
Do you think that stop and frisk wasn't horribly racist?
Do you think that the sexual harassment claims against Bloomberg aren't problematic?

I guess I don't know what your specific problem is, so I can't really reply to it.

[UniteFightBack]

30. They are getting WRONG how socialism is still perceived. This isn't 30 years in the future

when they can define things...this is NOW.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

40. Gen X and younger have more people than Boomers and older

The (false) perceptions of socialism are going away. DU is not representative of how the majority of the population perceives socialism. I get that Baby Boomers and older Gen X might perceive it a certain way. That does not mean that the majority of the population does.

And, for the record, we all know that no matter who the Dem nominee is, Trump will call them a socialist.

And, lastly, I don't think you fully grasp how defining things works. Just because you still define it one way doesn't mean that others HAVE to define it the same way. Things change. You aren't going to be able to stop that.

[UniteFightBack]

43. Yeah we'll get called Socialist but Sanders has RECEIPTS to back that up. Excuse me but

the majority of Dem's don't want the socialist label -- what majority of the population are you talking about????

Like I ALREADY SAID this is the way it is defined today so GET REAL. In 20-30 years there can be a redefined definition after some die off takes place but that is NOT TODAY.

I hate it when I have to repeat myself because someone
doesn't 'fully grasp'....REALITY.

[LakeArenal]

79. I live in a Socialist country.

Govt owns everything.

That’s not America in every way.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

81. Good thing that isn't what Sanders is proposing, then.

But, hey, why not just keep pushing that he is. That should help.

[LakeArenal]

83. I thought that sorta supported Sanders.

But you take it as you want and quit pushing your opinion then.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

87. My bad.

I thought this was a "WE AREN'T SOCIALIST" post. Apologize for my knee jerk. I see your point as you intended now.

[LakeArenal]

92. I also don't think the term Socialist is a dirty word.

Repukes are gonna dirty every label an opponent uses.
The bad part is people believe what they want to believe.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

94. I really think it is just bad for those that are older than Gen X

And I get that. They had horrible propaganda shoved down their throat. I was born in 66, so I got some of that, too, but, as a whole, Gen X got very little of that. Younger Gen X and younger really don't have the visceral hatred of socialism that so many here are assuming is universal.

And, I agree that Repubs will call whatever candidate we put forward a socialist.

And, again, sorry for knee jerking to your post.

[LakeArenal]

95. I'm old. I get it.

Have a nice day.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

86. I hate repeating myself, too, but the die off is happening now.

From this source:
Millennial and Gen X = 42% of the population
Boomer and older = 30% of the population

The old views of socialism created by cold war propaganda are going away as the Boomer and older generations become a smaller and smaller part of the population. Add to those number the Gen Z that can vote and it gets even larger for those less impacted by the Cold War.

Edited to add the source link because it has been a long week, apparently.

[mtron32]

137. Sanders has the ability to slip those punches..

He's got so much experience with the left attacking his Democratic Socialism and responding to those attacks that he's not going to scare, he owns it. Fighting for his values where the other candidates would probably try to go right of center is what he has to do, retreat is weakness in the eyes of Americans and we need our tribe to turn out.

You never hear a Republican saying they need to go further left to convince people, they come with a concise message until that shit becomes a reality in the voters minds. Democrats need to stop acting out of fear.

[calimary]

162. Perception is EVERYTHING.

Even if it’s not solidly based.

It’s not what IS.

It’s what people THINK it is.

From what I’ve observed and studied (and I’m BIGTIME fixated on messaging and salesmanship and sloganeering schticks-and-tricks - my dad was a salesman), much of America is STILL spooked by the word “socialist.” And by what they THINK it is.

And I fear that the “much of America” will vote their fears, as unfounded and old-fashioned as those fears may be, and run, not walk, AWAY from “Bernie-the-Socialist/Communist/Fascist/Whatever “ist” distortions trump wants to throw around. FEAR is a mighty motivator. And too many Americans don’t do nuance, and don’t bother to read past the headlines, and don’t do their research to look beyond the campaign slogans and promises that sound soooooooo good but in practicality may not have a chance of realistically getting off the ground on Capitol Hill. And worst of all, don’t vote head over heart.

There are misconceptions GALORE about the scary “socialism” label and the scary old Communist/Iron Curtain hangover from the last century. Heck, I can still remember in kindergarten when the nun urged us to “pray for the conversion of Russia, because the mean scary COMMUNISTS would come into schools and poke long sticks into children’s’ ears to break their eardrums and leave them deaf if they didn’t fall in line with the Communist dictates. I am not kidding.

I get the general concept about what advanced the greater good. I get that. But too many Americans don’t.

Too many people are scared of that. AND then you combine fear with resentment (the “free stuff” argument) that tries to portray a lot of “lazy moochers” (note the CODE-SPEAK here) and others among the purported “undeserving” being given “free stuff that YOU worked hard for and were either denied or it’s-not-fair-that-they-get-it-too-cuz-they-didn’t-earn/don’t-deserve-it.” That’s what trump is really good at. And most of our Dems still don’t get that. And it strongly suggests a recipe for a Bernie-led disaster in November.

I wish it weren’t true. But MY fear is that it will be what’s true by Election Day. If, indeed, it’s not true already.

[mtron32]

171. Don't be afraid.

I've perused plenty of conservative forums and never seen fear approaching what DU provides. How are you afraid of the socialism/commie attack when you are running against a KGB backed dictator loving incumbent? Democrats need to stop worrying about how conservatives will portray them and make their case to the people, Americans respect strength first and foremost.

[redstateblues]

53. It's a very toxic label

[Cuthbert Allgood]

82. Why?

Because of lingering cold-war propaganda? Certainly we are better than that.

And do you think it is a toxic label for Gen X and younger? You know, the largest group of the population.

[paleotn]

121. In 1964, yes.

This ain't 1964. You do know that, don't you?

[evertonfc]

9. especially an 80

year old one that has tons of old videos and writings that praise socialists, Karl Marx and other actions that middle America finds revolting. The party will pay a price for decades.

[EveHammond13]

12. Bernie as the nominee is SUICIDE for our party and our country. WAKE UP EVERYONE.

[5X]

105. old white billionaires would be the death of us.

I seem to remember "America will never elect a black man..."

[LexVegas]

10. Sanders as the nominee will flip Virginia to Trump. nt

[Bluepinky]

14. And how do you know this?

Let’s see what unfolds and get out there and vote!!
Last election, everyone thought Hillary would easily win but it didn’t happen.

[EveHammond13]

16. AMERICA. IS. NOT. VOTING. FOR. A. SOCIALIST.

Especially not against trump's $1 BILLION propaganda machine.

[Bluepinky]

22. Your opinion.

My family and I (4 total) will vote for whatever candidate wins the nomination to defeat Trump, and I know plenty of others who will do so as well.
You don’t know what will happen. See my message above about Hillary. The fact that you capitalize what you say doesn’t make it more true.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

24. Polls disagree with you.

[Bluepinky]

32. I could show you polls that do agree with me.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

41. How many polls show Sanders losing to Trump?

Please do show me those.

[EveHammond13]

36. polls are so reliable

[Cuthbert Allgood]

42. How are you supporting your claim that people won't vote for him?

Typing in all caps is not data.

[nobuddy]

48. Activate CAPS LOCK

+4 Damage

[Cuthbert Allgood]

72. Probably hoping to roll a nat 20, too.

[whathehell]

49. No, every random person and their uncle are much more reliable

[secondwind]

62. My goodness, you are sure adamant about your position. Let's let the voters decide..

[paleotn]

117. Stop hyperventilating.

Take a deep breath...count to 10...there. All better. Now what's up with those non-disclosure agreements? It's been my experience that they only used to hide really bad stuff and in the end, don't work. Seems Bloomberg may be walking around with time bombs strapped to him. Now THAT would be a wonderful Oct. surprise if he gained the nomination.

[Iggo]

170. You hope.

[handmade34]

21. nah...

this is too serious to "let’s see what unfolds"

[mr_lebowski]

56. OMG seriously? They did no such thing (nt)

[brush]

64. What? She easily beat Sanders in the primary.

[UniteFightBack]

15. I think 2018 illustrated that perfectly. Most Bernie backed candidates LOST. Do we want to win or

what???

[EveHammond13]

17. +100

[nobuddy]

18. THE CAPS LOCK HAS LOGGED ON

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_sanders-6250.html

[Hassin Bin Sober]

76. Oh noes! Not teh caps lock! My eyes!

[Thomas Hurt]

19. Ah, but Bernie is the perfect candidate to escalate on the GOP.

The GOP antes with a populist, nutjob fascist, the Democrats raise them a populist social democrat or whatever.

[Politicub]

26. Much of America wants a democratic socialist. As Bernie has said,

we already have socialistic policies that benefit the rich and the haves.

It’s time for the majority of Americans to have a system in place where everyone can reach their full potential without the fear of medical bankruptcy or going hungry.

This is why Bernie’s message is resonating.

Democrats who know better are attempting to conflate democratic socialism policies with authoritarianism and soviet-era communism.

Democratic socialism is a safety net. It awakens a sense ingenuity without fear of ruin after failure. It is the next wave of America living up to its potential of a more perfect union.

[redstateblues]

58. America won't elect a Socialist. My Trump hating spouse won't vote for a Socialist

she won’t vote for Trump either I’m not sure what she’ll do but we both agree that Bernie won’t win

[Politicub]

125. I wouldn't know how to convince someone like your spouse that by not casting a vote,

she would be helping Trump.

Furthermore, I don't understand the mindset of people who don't see Trump as an existential threat to our country. It is a waste of time for me to try and figure out how to reach them.

Sanders has a path to the nomination. Biden does, too, and we could see some surprises come Super Tuesday with the other candidates.

While Sanders is not my first choice, and I know it would be an uphill battle for him to get elected, the possibility remains that he may be our nominee. And I will do everything I can to help no matter who comes out on top after the convention.

[paleotn]

133. If Bernie is the nominee, she is voting for Trump.

I'd vote for a 400 lb poland china boar hog painted iridescent blue before I would NOT vote on Nov. 3. And as a born and raised, former Tennessean, I don't think TN voters are a microcosm of the national electorate, Hell, even the my ole 5th district is just light blue at +7 Dem according to Cook. Jim Cooper needs to be housed in a zoo as a nearly extinct species. The last of the blue dogs. Thank God for Steve Cohen or I'd have a mind to forge my birth certificate.

[redstateblues]

179. She's not voting for Trump

[Turin_C3PO]

134. Your wife is giving Trump a vote

if she sits out. Not voting for the nominee is equivalent to voting for fascism. Sorry your wife can’t see that.

[Scotch-Irish]

28. A Democratic Socialist...like the rest of the industrialized world.

Ignorance is rampant about this issue.

[EveHammond13]

37. "ignorance is ramant about this issue" AND IT'S NOT GOING TO CHANGE

[MarcA]

38. Agreed. n/t

[brush]

57. Careful, you're the one showing ingorance.

You do know Sanders has been calling himself a socialist for decades, right?

Sanders regularly appeared on "The Thom Hartman" radio show for years and proudly called himself a "socialist" without the word "democratic" in front of it.

In more recent years he's added the word "democratic" in front of it to soften the negativity of it as he became interested in using the Democratic Party to run for president. But video and ample other evidence is out there of him touting socialism. He should've said years ago he was a "social democrat" in the Nordic model if that is really what he meant but he's stuck with the baggage-laden, self-appellation of "democratic socialist" when the social democracies of Europe are actually capitalist countries, not democratic socialist countries.

Labeling himself a democratic socialist was a mistake not just because there actually is a Democratic Socialist Party in the US which actively advocates actual socialism, historically there's never been a sustained, successful deployment of socialism in any country. And as I said, the social democracies of Europe are actually highly regulated and highly taxed capitalist countries with strong, robust safety nets provided for by the high taxes—single payer healthcare, free college, etc..

[Sloumeau]

29. K&R

[TheCowsCameHome]

33. Too risky to take the chance this time.

The stakes are too high with Trump as the opposition.

America isn't ready to vote socialist,a t least not yet. Sanders will get creamed.

[UniteFightBack]

45. I'm not sure why this is so hard to grasp for some people....talk about living in a bubble! nt

[FiveGoodMen]

80. And the next time, and the next time, ...

[IronLionZion]

35. ALL OR NOTHING

If this country, as a whole electorate, doesn't want your candidate then we can't nominate them as our candidate. That rules out every candidate.

[demmiblue]

44. WHAT? I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!11!!!!1!!

[Vogon_Glory]

47. It's more than just who can get elected

The 2020 election is more than replacing the Blot and putting a Democrat in the White House. It’s about keeping control of the. House of Representatives and wresting control of the US Senate away from the Republicans.

The 2020 election is more than just winning in traditionally blue areas—it’s about expanding the blue into currently red States and red districts.

Bernie’s more starry-eyed followers fail to realize that this election is about more than just one man—it is about the party as a whole. We win by being a broadly-appealing front. Bernie is just not that appealing as the head of the entire party.

America might vote Socialist—if we go through a Trumpie recession during the next four years that makes the 2008 recession look like a Sunday picnic.

I would like to avoid such a recession. How about you?

[counting]

60. then

who is appealing as the head of the entire party?

[Vogon_Glory]

67. Joe, Elizabeth, or Amy n/t

Bernie’s got another problem. I also suspect that come October, thanks to Donnie, Americans might decide they’ve had a belly-full of fast-talking, (cow poop)-slinging New Yorkers of any political stripe and may choose the devil they (think) they know.

[jmg257]

50. Yup - nothing wrong with settling!

As long as your not settling for trump, of course.

[corbettkroehler]

59. 538 Concurs

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Oh, right, only in an alternate universe.

[nobuddy]

63. Your facts were not in ALL CAPS

So don't count

[corbettkroehler]

65. You May Not Think Much Of 538 But Most DUers Do

The truth hurts.

[nobuddy]

69. they were wrong in 2016

therefore everything they say is wrong

[Piasladic]

161. you do know about margins of error, yeah?

And a screaming headline only makes people upset.

[secondwind]

61. Where do you get your information from? As far as I can tell, this is just your opinion, right?

You are a recent DU newbie, so I want to welcome you to our group...

[Anaxamander]

70. Chris Matthews, is that you?

nt

[peoli]

71. It's using our taxes for the people instead of corporations or war machines

So yes we WILL VOTE FOR A DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST!

[tiredtoo]

73. Hard to understand why

A member of DU would post such a negative statement regarding a Democratic candidate for the presidency.

[W T F]

75. I disagree, American's will take a Socialist over a criminal autocratic dictator.

[safeinOhio]

89. Didn't he serve

4 terms?

[elleng]

77. Right, no socialist is running.

ENOUGH with the 'pretend' hate.

[at140]

78. Easy answer..when ONE individual accumulates more wealth than 150 million Americans combined,

the system is obscenely rigged to benefit the rich. Get ready for a revolution.

[tiredtoo]

88. Double posting this from Facebook, think about it.

"Sure would be great if, no matter who, we would stop with the paranoia and simply vote for who we like and support each other. We are all Dems so remember that devisivness within our ranks will lose the election to Trump as quickly as you can shout "Welcome back DT". If you truly care about the future of this country then act like it. Dems are not our enemy, that's DT, for goodness sake."

[MerryBlooms]

98. Beaut.

[Sympthsical]

90. Sanders is at 50% with under 50s

That’s with a crowded field. So someone wants him. Not me, but plenty of people.

Boomers grew up under the Red Scare. They grew up under anti-socialist propaganda. It stuck, clearly.

I consider myself a social democrat. Many in my generation do (I’m older Millennial). I like Sanders’ policies, even if I favor Warren over him. If Warren gets the nod, and I’d be thrilled if she did, she’ll be painted as a socialist, too.

This fear mongering is getting to be a bit much. The primaries have barely begun. We’ll see. But this anti-Sanders stuff has gone beyond hair on fire. It started with the hair, caught the curtains, and now entire people’s houses are up in flame.

Democrats who are not seniors simply don’t share this panic. And enough about McGovern. It was nearly 50 years ago. We’re a very different country and electorate. McGovern never led in the polls. Ever. Sanders does at the moment.

I don’t think later generations should be held hostage to their elders’ PTSD from half a century ago. It’s nonsensical, unfair, and impedes progress and change this country desperately needs. If you’re comfortable, great. A lot of people under 50 aren’t. I have a 47 year old friend still paying student loans. Is fuggin ridiculous.

Sanders and Warren want to change that. Good.

[rwsanders]

91. Try a little windex on your crystal ball, polling says something different...

When the question is broken down to specific policies rather than identifying party affiliation, even the majority of Republicans support a progressive agenda:

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/nprs-egregious-takedown-of-bernie-sanders-fact-checked/

[AtheistCrusader]

93. That's fine because we don't have a Socialist(TM) running.

Edit: Also, Caps Lock is cruise control for 'cool'.

[NurseJackie]

96. Everyone is my family has told me that they WILL NOT vote for a Socialist...

... and I believe them.

[tiredtoo]

100. did you ask them who they will vote for? and do you believe them? NT

[paleotn]

120. Do they like fascist dictators instead?

Just asking.

[NurseJackie]

128. They know their vote won't make a difference and that Trump will win anyway...

... therefore they won't reward the party by showing "support" for the colossal mistake of choosing a Socialist (if that's how it turns out, and hopefully it won't.)

To answer your question directly. No they don't "like fascist dictators". Perhaps they're taking lessons from Susan Sarandon or Michael Moore or Nina Turner or Briahna Joy Gray in refusing to support the party's nominee.

They got a free pass and have been richly REWARDED by being given prominent roles in this campaign. so it hardly seems fair to judge my family so harshly, no?

[paleotn]

136. And in doing so, it's a self fulfilling prophecy.

Personally, I don't want that on my conscience.

[NurseJackie]

141. Again: Susan Sarandon, Michael Moore, Nina Turner, Briahna Joy Gray...

Again: Susan Sarandon, Michael Moore, Nina Turner, Briahna Joy Gray... all richly rewarded for their anger and stubbornness. They don't seem to have any regrets or heavy consciences for their part in giving us Trump. They got a free pass and have been richly REWARDED by being given prominent roles in Bernie's campaign. so it hardly seems fair to judge my family so harshly or to be so scornful and judgmental.

Personally, I don't want that on my conscience.

I understand. Won't make a bit of difference, but I understand.

[paleotn]

147. Won't make a bit of difference put Trump in the White House and will do so again.

Again...maybe some people can do that and live with themselves. I love the country too much for that.

[NurseJackie]

151. They've done well for themselves, haven't they?

They've done well for themselves, haven't they? It looks as those currently running the BS campaign feel differently than you do and don't judge them so harshly for their actions.

I love the country too much for that.

Then do your best to see that our party doesn't allow itself to be taken over by a Socialist.

[paleotn]

156. You don't vote blue no matter who..it's more babies in cages.

Personally, I have a problem with babies in cages. Some may not....I guess...not their babies and all. And that socialist thing...I get the feeling you're not too clear on that. Or maybe you are and should call up the Social Security Admin and tell them to keep the money. After all, that and Medicare are just...socialist...aren't they?

[NurseJackie]

158. I cannot control what they do. Why are you attacking me?

I cannot control what they do. Why are you attacking me? I haven't attacked you? What have I ever done to you that makes you feel it's okay to say things like that to me and about me?

Goodbye.

[Chakaconcarne]

97. We can't give the GOP a narrative....

and they have it with Sanders as a "socialist"....and probably even with Warren. It's up to the candidate to change that narrative...and they've about run out of time.

The GOP will win if they can exploit any narrative on any of our candidates. The GOP can explain away a surprise win with the right narrative...

We need a narrative for Trump and the GOP, but none of our candidates are capitalizing, except Bloomberg..

Our narrative should be at minimum... why would we support a candidate that is backed by Russia? A vote for Trump is a vote for Russia..

[oasis]

99. THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT BE CERTIFIED!

[Perseus]

102. Give it up please...

78% of the country does not agree with that statement, plus Bernie Sanders IS NOT a "Socialist", he is a "Social Democrat".

How about the socialism that Bloomberg is enjoying thanks to the GOP tax cuts, are those OK?

Please stop trying to divide people.

I will answer your question "WHAT IN THIS UNIVERSE MAKES YOU THINK THIS COUNTRY - AS A WHOLE ELECTORATE - WANTS A SOCIALIST FOR PRESIDENT."

1. Most people want "Universal Healthcare" or "Medicare For All"
2. They want a fair tax system where those like the person you support pays their dues and don't get the "socialist" breaks they get today/.
3. Because USA citizens want corporations to pay their taxes and stop the subsidies they don't need and only use to pay their CEO extravagant bonuses. If you didn't create a company you don't deserve a $400 million bonus.
4. Because people are tired of republican governments trying to screw up our education, we know republicans "love their uneducated", they are easy to manipulate. Most citizens want free education, they understand that an educated people cannot be manipulated.
5. Because they want a government that works for all.

I could go on, but I think you get the idea.

[Liberalhammer]

103. Corporate Socialism

Is the way to go.

Just ask Mike.

[the_sly_pig]

104. I want a form of national health care...

A socialist policy. Any candidate that supports national health care is, in part, a socialist. Parse it however you want. Painting Bernie with a broad brush like this is a MSM tactic.

I’m voting for the democratic nominee. I don’t care who it is.

[Perseus]

111. Nope, there are plenty of countries in the World where the citizens enjoy Universal Healthcare

and they are not socialists. We cannot confuse "socialism" with "Social Democratic" governments.

For starters, there are NO "Socialists" countries in the World, "Socialism" is just rhetoric dictators and communists use to lure the citizens into believing they will share the loot with them, they will create social services to help everyone, but it is all crap, when they get in power they become what they always were, corrupt SOBs, like in Venezuela, San Salvador, Russia, etc.

Scandinavian countries practice "Social Democracy" where capitalism still works and it works because it is well regulated. They enjoy free education, free healthcare (paid through fair taxes), and many other social services that are the right of the people, the idea is to make a solid and progressive country where their citizens contribute to the betterment of all.

Have you ever asked yourself why republicans fight regulation so hard? People don't realize that republicans fight anything that produces order, they want chaos and that is why they love the creature, he is the master of constant, sustained chaos.

And yes,, we need to vote for anyone who becomes our nominee...Vote blue not matter who.

[Maraya1969]

106. What I would like to know is how Sanders is allowed on the Dem ticket if he is not a Dem?

[paleotn]

107. Hey....there's a key over on the left side of the keyboard...

It's called Cap Lock or Caps Lock. You might want to click that. Just saying.

Oh, your point. Well. I never thought many Americans would vote for a vagina grabbing, serial lying failed con man, but I was wrong. Forget the "whole electorate". 30 to 40% of America won't vote for Democrat no matter who they are. Jesus Christ himself couldn't get their votes. They're hopelessly lost. What matters is the other 60 +/- %. Getting them excited and out to the polls, voting blue no matter who. And Obama voters who voted for Trump? A myth. They're so small in numbers as to be nearly invisible. As for scaring the shit out of them....are they more worried about a Putinesqe kleptocracy? I should hope so.

[Gothmog]

108. CNN-Bernie Sanders misled America. Voters aren't comfortable with a socialist President

Link to tweet

It is true the Sanders was leading in the poll, conducted by the Wall Street Journal and NBC -- but only among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents when asked who they supported for the Democratic nomination. He had 27% support compared to Mike Bloomberg, Joe Biden and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, each with 14% support. And in a hypothetical matchup, he was narrowly ahead of President Donald Trump.

But two-thirds of all voters -- Democrats plus everyone else -- said they would be uncomfortable with a socialist President.
Come November, it will be all Americans over the age of 18 who elect the Electoral College that picks the President.
Those results and the questions they raise about whether the country would accept a socialist are repeated in an NPR / PBS News Hour Marist poll.

In that poll, Sanders had even more support -- 31% in the Democratic primary compared to Michael Bloomberg, in second place with 19%.

Take a look at the party breakdown regarding socialism. Fifty percent of Democrats have a favorable view of socialism compared to 46% who have a favorable view of capitalism.

But again, socialism is far less favorable than capitalism in the country as a whole. In the NPR poll, among Americans overall, just 28% had a favorable view of socialism compared to 57% who had a favorable view of capitalism.
Among Republicans, 76% held a favorable view of capitalism compared to 7% who felt favorably about socialism.

[Traildogbob]

109. Really???

Franklin D Roosevelt Democrat. Stop calling it democrat socialist.. Call yourself a Franklin D Roosevelt Democrat. Let the record speak for itself. We ARE already 50 percent socialists. Anyone here want to list Roosevelt Socialist policies and condemn them? Actually kinda sick of my socialist taxes creating billionaires out of Industrial Military Complex, never speaking a word of non stop ever raising cash flow. Roosevelt specifically warned of the untethered Military Industrial Complex. Zero Taxes for Bezos, Trump, Facebook Frat boy. Is Fucking Socialism.

[Progressive2020]

110. Socialism

They called FDR a Socialist and worse, and he was the greatest President of the 20th Century and of all time. FDR was victorious in War and Peace, but did not achieve all of his goals before his death. He proposed a Second Bill of Rights that would guarantee Food, Housing, Work, and Health Care as Human Rights. Google it or look it up on Wikipedia. Bernie is carrying this tradition forward. He stands for all of the things that FDR stood for. Some people just want compromised Neoliberalism that capitulates to Corporations. We want a real Progressive candidate, a true contrast to the Republicans, that fights for the Working Class and the Middle Class.

[Gore1FL]

173. The GOP calls everyone a socialist. It's a meaningless scare word for them. nt

[Perseus]

113. i will answer one of your statements

"NO REAL SCIENTIFIC FOCUS GROUP ANYWHERE HAS PEOPLE JUMPING TO VOTE FOR A SOCIALIST."

That is because there are no SOCIALISTS in the Democratic party. Poor socialists (if there are any in the USA), they have no one to jump up for, to cheer, they don't have a candidate.

[James48]

114. I'm FULLY ON BOARD WITH BERNIE

Even if you think its not possible.

Yes, it IS.

Bernie is the best hope for a win. He's got a nationwide ground game.

I get it that you are not convinced. Fine. Stand back and watch ALL of us work together, and get him elected.

VOTE BLUE no matter who, but especially for BERNIE!

[Ferryboat]

115. Most voters are unable to parse the difference

Between a "socialist" and a democratic socialist. About every 60 years a progressive gets elected. Its time for another. The word socialism scares people who won't take the time to educate themselves.

VOTE BLUE no matter who.

Sitting this one out is not an option. Didn't work out so well last go around.

I think it was Benjamin Franklin who said;

We are all born ignorant, some work hard to stay that way.

[earthside]

116. I reluctantly agree ...

... but I also think that many Democrats will stay home rather than vote for a billionaire, elitist, no-so-long-ago Republican, ie., Bloomberg.

I am coming to the conclusion that the best bet for Democrats is either one of the two women running.

Biden is too old ... why is he running?
Buttigieg is too young, inexperienced, and too full of himself.

Klobuchar or Warren have less political baggage, have experience, are both good debaters, are both a reasonable age, have the energy, etc.

[Progressive2020]

127. I Agree

I agree with some of what you posted. Biden really shows his age (as opposed to Bernie and Warren, who are around the same age, but have a younger energy). I think that you are spot on about Mayor Pete. He DOES seem full of himself, and I do not like it. I like Bernie, but also Warren. If I had to choose a more moderate candidate, it would be Amy Klobuchar for me. She is both a new face (like Pete) but with experience as a Senator (unlike Pete). So, for me right now Bernie, then Warren, the Klobuchar.

[Dan]

123. Here's the bet -

If you’re right and we have Sanders as the Nominee then this is the wager:

1. We lose the presidency;
2. We lose the House;
3. We lose State races - down ticket.
And even worse
4. We get Trump and there will be no future elections. I would bet the house on this!

[jcgoldie]

130. You can always identify a valid argument

... because it is written in all capital letters.

How about: AMERICA IS NOT VOTING FOR ANOTHER ASSHOLE BILLIONAIRE. PERIOD.

[R B Garr]

131. Agreed. If anyone wants to start a socialist party, feel free.

But why taint my party with this nonsense.

[gldstwmn]

132. Watch them.

[blue-wave]

135. Let This Be A Lesson

The Democratic Party should NEVER allow a non-Democrat to run under it's banner. Never Ever!! Time to make that a rule.

[mahina]

140. In fairness Bernie has had many legislative accomplishments. He's not my choice.

Also it is not helpful to scream when you are trying to persuade people if anything.

Cheers.

[Tien1985]

143. I feel like every time I log into

DU lately, someone is point blank screaming about Bernie Sanders and/or socialists in general.

Maybe it's like some of the posters above are saying and it's because I'm a mid-Millennial. When I was a kid we learned about the Red Scare and got to watch some old propaganda about the dangers of communism and I had figured that it was all history. When I grew older, I realized that some people still had those feelings because they had grown up with it. But here we are almost 20 years later and some folks are still at caps lock levels of fear towards socialism--it's unnerving and does not in any way convince me to their way of thinking. The level of intensity when people are yelling about "SOCIALISTS" is problematic for our overall image as Democrats. Ironically, for the same reasons that Sanders himself can be. Democrats do not want to project the image of "Old Man Yells at Cloud."

There is a primary process, it will do what it is meant to do.

Edited to correct: I flattered myself and wrote "10 years later" HA. 20.

[Mila18]

145. I agree with 90% of Sanders' positions and would vote for him ...

if this were 2024 and Democrats controlled the White House and both the House and Senate.

I'm not willing to take a chance this year. Most of the country isn't paying attention yet, and Sanders has not been vetted nationally, even though he ran four years ago in the primary.

[pbmus]

146. BULLSHIT...I am voting blue all the way thru and

Anyone who argues differently is promoting a trumpian socialism [lower taxes for the rich, more corporate tax breaks].

Frankly, my dog could be a better president than the kleptomaniac we are experiencing.

[snowybirdie]

148. Since you're only

A member since Jan of 2020, perhaps you are unaware shouting on a post is considered impolite. Thank you

[Kurt V.]

150. Its not rocket science but it is a very interesting rorschach test.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

152. Republicans have abused the English language beyond recognition.

There are no true socialists running in this election. Period.

If one has advocated government takeover of GE or Ford Motors, please let us know.

Everyone please mail their nearest Rethug a dictionary and highlight the definition of socialism.

KY............

[Fiendish Thingy]

153. SHOUTING DOESN'T MAKE IT TRUE

Rachel Bitecofer’s model has shown that trying to flip Trump voters is a waste of time and resources; her model shows that maximizing the turnout of existing anti-Trump voters is the more effective strategy. Nominating a candidate who will inspire massive turnout (and it ain’t Biden or Bloomberg) is the key.

Stop worrying about who other people will/won’t vote for, and vote your principles.

[AleksS]

155. You don't even need to make it as broad as "America,"

OH, PA, and WI are not voting for a socialist.

What states did Hillary lose that Bernie would win? Let's not forget, Hillary won "America" by 3 MILLION votes. But Trump is president today.

Even if Bernie could win "America" by more than Hillary, if he can't turn WI, OH, PA (Maybe FL), then who cares?

[Progressive2020]

174. Sanders Won

Sanders beat Hillary in the Wisconsin and Michigan Primaries in 2016. Trump went on to narrowly win those states over Hillary in the General Election. So, Sanders had more working class support in those Rust Belt states than Hillary. Bernie might have beaten Trump in those states had he been the nominee.

Also, a large part of the 3 Million votes that Hillary had over Trump came from coastal liberal strongholds like California and New York. To win the Presidency, you have to win in the Electoral College, and that includes fly-over states and the Rust Belt/Mid-West.

Bernie has some appeal to these kind of Mid-West working class demographics that Hillary did not. And so, Bernie has a chance to win Wisconsin, Michigan, and other key states. There is a potential path to victory there.

[JustAnotherGen]

160. I don't disagree

But I also don't think a core constituency really wants to see Bloomberg as the nominee either - and I'm a member of that constituency.

[D23MIURG23]

163. I think the fact trump was elected should put "electability" to bed.

The real "unelectable" candidate is a flat, samey Al Gore or John Kerry candidate. We should nominate a candidate who appears to stand for something, and one who can motivate the base, not one who seems "safe".

[SweetieD]

167. For people under 45, Socialist is no longer a dirty word. We were never indoctrinated

With red scare tactics.

For older people they think having medical care for all means seizing the means of production and us turning into Stalinist Russia.

[MFM008]

168. Repubs will argue

Socialism = communism = death and destruction.

[Gore1FL]

175. Their lack of a dictionary shouldn't curtail our choices, though. nt

[anamnua]

169. Relevant Ronald Wright quote

‘Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.’

[Gore1FL]

172. It MaKeS tHe PoInT bEtTeR iF yOu AlTeRnAtE cAsE. nT

[Progressive dog]

176. No America won't vote for a socialist.

It"s not as if there have never been socialist candidates for president. Eugene Debs got almost a million votes in 1920, but it's been downhill since.

[Boulevardier]

177. Quit yelling. n/t

[dumptrump1]

180. we are a capitalist country and be need somebody to represent

It effectively. Can't do that with a socialist

[Laelth]

181. Well, then it's a good thing that Bernie is NOT a socialist.

He's a liberal, and everything he has proposed indicates that he's a mainstream, FDR, LBJ-type liberal, no matter what he calls himself. He's no socialist, and I think he can beat Donald Trump in November. Of course, I think that Daffy Duck could beat Trump in November, so that's not saying much, but I am losing my tolerance for the chicken-littles who proclaim that Bernie's potential nomination will doom us to another 4 years of Trump. That's just silly.



Bernie is not a socialist, so let's abandon that irrational fear and grapple with the truth. There's a lot of pent-up liberal energy in the party right now, and it has to go somewhere. At the moment, it looks like it's going to Bernie. Ignore Bernie and his supporters at your peril. If you don't like the risk that Bernie and his supporters pose to the party, you had better do something about it and do it fast. Give them someone they want to vote for. You can't just tell them NOT to vote for Bernie because it will hurt the party. You have to give them an alternative that they actually like and want to vote for.

What do you have? Nothing? Most likely, if they can't vote for Sanders, they will vote for Bloomberg, and I predict that Bloomberg will, in fact, be our nominee. At least he's shown his willingness to take the fight directly to the Great Pumpkin. That's more than many of our "traditional" candidates have done so far.

-Laelth

[maximusveritas]

182. "I am a socialist; of course I am a socialist" - Bernie Sanders

Oops.
Even if we didn't have that quote, his policies are not mainstream in that they are by far the most left-wing of any candidate running now or any major Democratic candidate in our history.
Yes, he will almost surely lose. If you fail to see that, you are blinded by bias. The same one that made us think Trump would be easily beaten last time.

[Vivienne235729]

183. Amen to that!

[Wabbajack_]

185. I wouldn't say Bernie is any further left than FDR

Use of the term "socialist" aside, Bernie Sanders appears to me to be what they call in Europe a social democrat. If he's in favor of abolishing capitalism that's news to me.