Democratic Primaries
Related: About this forumCan we please wise up to what Putin is actually doing?
Putin doesn't care who the nominee is, he wants Trump to be re-elected, and in order to accomplish that, he wants to sow discord among Dems and get us to point fingers at each other. And that's what he's doing.
So far, there's been no quantifiable evidence that Putin has intervened in any significant way to help Bernie. The closest I've seen is a website that showed a few hundred retweets of pro-Bernie hashtags. Which is nothing. What Russian intervention looks like is 2016, hacking into Dem accounts and collaborating with Roger Stone and Wikileaks to release hacked materials in damaging ways.
In this primary, the only consequential things that have happened are (A) front-page headlines all over the media talking about how Russia wants to help Bernie and (B) Trump intelligence officials all over the talk shows talking about how Russia is propping up Bernie. Those things don't help Bernie, they hurt Bernie. And they hurt the Democratic Party as well. Which is what Putin wants: Dems to be going after each other instead of after Trump.
Bernie, at this point, is likely to be the Dem nominee, and Putin would like nothing more than for the Dem nominee to be somehow tainted with these kinds of unsavory accusations. We already know that Trump is going to try to paint Bernie as a Russian stooge, he's already started doing that. Democrats should not be helping him do that, we should be pushing back, because everyone knows that the only actual friend Putin has in this race is Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Botany
(70,614 posts)Oh please yes he does and that he is why he is working to make Bernie the
nominee because he would be the easiest to beat.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DanTex
(20,709 posts)headlines published across the media saying "Putin is helping Bernie." That doesn't help Bernie. That helps Trump.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
TwilightZone
(25,499 posts)They're not mutually exclusive. In fact, it's the main point that you intentionally ignore quite consistently.
He's helping Bernie because he believes he would be the weakest candidate against Trump. Same as 2016.
You really think he'd only be helping Bernie if he wanted him to win the presidency? That's hilarious.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Vivienne235729
(3,390 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Butterflylady
(3,553 posts)They don't want see any other scenarios other him winning. They don't want to acknowledge the amount of money Russian oligarchs are putting in the GE race. I could go but would do any good.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
LaurenOlimina
(1,165 posts)Speculation. We know he helped Bernie last time to hurt Hillary. This time it could very well be to sow discord amongst Dems. That would be consistent with the Russian doctrine of hybrid warfare.
If you have evidence that, "He's helping Bernie because he believes he would be the weakest candidate against Trump." I'd like to see it.
Right now, it obviously helps Trump, that's why Trump is tweeting about it.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
lark
(23,166 posts)Maguire told the truth to the Senate, PUtin's thumbs are on the scale for both Bernie and drumpf. Drumpf fired him for letting the cat out of the bag, because he too has been pushing Bernie, at PUtin's request. Drumpf hires people to lie and fires them when they tell the truth. He knows who he can beat and that's the person he and his master wants him to run against in the general.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
JudyM
(29,294 posts)theyre up to. Believing they actually want Sanders to win, and adding to that discord, is playing right into their hands.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
uponit7771
(90,367 posts)... Putin cares who the winner is.
Come on Dan
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DanTex
(20,709 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Butterflylady
(3,553 posts)Yeah the polls had Hillary winning to. How'd that go.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
JustAnotherGen
(31,937 posts)When only three states have had a primary, caucus, primary/caucus. I think - it ain't over for any candidates until Super Tuesday. This 'inevitable' meme caused discord between HRC and Sanders supporters in 2016. Can we knock it off? Because it sounds the exact same way when Sanders supporters say it - as it did in 2016.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DanTex
(20,709 posts)All the data points in that direction. No, he's not a lock. He's just the leader. And that's why Putin and Trump are trying to hurt him.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
JustAnotherGen
(31,937 posts)The thing to remember? Folks on the coasts have a mean streak of 'state's rights' (I see it in NJ politics quite a bit - hence Murphy's popularity) -
If you are a solid Sanders supporter - be very careful in your interactions. You are dealing with someone like me - think its fucking great that Murphy acts like a liberal SMART version of Trump and does shit like take down the Mississippi State flag at Liberty State Park, and flips the bird at Trump on immigration, and sues the Fed Gov because it's fun (literally like Trump . . .
I'm doing 'opposite day' along with a lot of Democratics in NJ
We (the Democratic Voters) - we the people on the left of all stripes need to come together NOW.
I'm a blue dot in a sea of red - nothing pisses a trump voter in a Porsche (Hunterdon County NJ - it's not economics - it's racism out here) that an anybody but Trump T-Shirt in the Shoprite on a Sunday morning.
Trust me - I did it yesterday!
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Botany
(70,614 posts)Do you really think anybody is gonna buy that codswallop?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TwilightZone
(25,499 posts)He posts about it about fifty times a day.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Nobody can name any example of Bernie actually being helped by Putin in any material way. On the other hand, the Bernie-Putin association being front page news is obviously being used against Bernie.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
Botany
(70,614 posts)Except for:
Giving time to pro Bernie people on R.T..
Pushing the meme that Bernie is inevitable.
Poll manipulation.
Facebook manipulation.
Twitter manipulation.
Having bots post pro bernie stuff on discussion boards.
And God only knows what else.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
katmondoo
(6,457 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...like he has some power to stop it. He doesn't and he's not to blame for others actions. I mean, what is he supposed to realistically do about it?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mopinko
(70,268 posts)fire people who are nothing but shit stirrers.
moderate his fan pages better.
vet his donors, and return those that smell.
tell the truth. be transparent.
and show us your plan to outsmart them in the general.
tough talk and $5 will get you a vente at starbucks. that's it.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TwilightZone
(25,499 posts)It's really not complicated and those things should be part of any campaign.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
greatauntoftriplets
(175,755 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
TwilightZone
(25,499 posts)Mueller Report.
It's naive to believe that they did it in 2016 and wouldn't do it again in 2020. Burying our heads in the sand isn't going to help.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
rzemanfl
(29,573 posts)point. Thank you.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
58Sunliner
(4,419 posts)Take a good look at that. What hurts us is low voter turnout. Nevada numbers are scary.We have to start there. Bernie thinks moderates don't win, yet 2018 showed that he was so wrong. Bernie has a fantasy that only he can save us. That is delusional. Where have I heard that before?????? We lose down ballot with Bernie. Bernie voted against the Magnitsky Act and could not be bothered to vote for sanctions. So if it was a repuke what would a dem do?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
boston bean
(36,224 posts)Period end of story.
That is the discord he wants to achieve. Not dem against dem or repug against repug.
He wants the minority rule the majority. Doesnt matter if it is dem or repug.
That is where the chaos thrives.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
Fresh_Start
(11,330 posts)nt
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
rzemanfl
(29,573 posts)point? Was it in a memo?
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
apcalc
(4,465 posts)We do know that he worked with Manafort, Stone, Trump Jr and a whole cast of others to undermine Hillary and sow discord. In addition , trolls ,robotic and otherwise, were used to pollute the website discussions, like this one and social media.
Further, they were and are injecting cash into the NRA and individual Rs campaigns, possibly the entire RNC.
It cost us the last election, imo
Who is doing what now? We dont know. It is my belief that there are new players.
Is it massive? Yes. Almost guaranteed.
They want to win, and they cheat in as many ways as possible to do so.
This aint beanbag.
primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden
mopinko
(70,268 posts)and the uae. putin was in on it, but it was m.e. money.
he's been pointing the finger at the saudis for a while.
primary today, I would vote for: Undecided
apcalc
(4,465 posts)primary today, I would vote for: Joe Biden