Sanders' comments on Fidel Castro are ill-informed & insulting to thousands of Floridians.

[pfeiffer]

Link to tweet

[stonecutter357]

1. K&R

[flamingdem]

2. Let's not parrot right wing talking points about Cuba. The USA is responsible for blockading Cuba

and causing billions in damages after having used Cuba imperiously for a century. Castro is a product of US domination of Cuba and related human rights abuses.

Obama opened things up. Trump closed things back down. Nothing repubs do regarding Cuba is kosher. Bernie was right to approach Cuba and Castro with an open mind.

DO NOT listen to the cold warrior Cubans in Miami EVER. They are a blight on our political system.

[Midnightwalk]

6. Stephanie Murphy is a Democratic representative

Last edited Mon Feb 24, 2020, 07:44 PM - Edit history (2)

From Florida so I think characterizing her statement as a right wing talking point is wrong.

Forgetting the cold war stuff, I agree Obama was right in opened up Cuba.

Bernie could have said he would reverse trump’s decision and even praised the cuban medical system without praising castro.

I don’t see any reason to unnecessarily antagonize Cuban Americans in Florida. Sometimes saying less is better.

I’ll agree with you on part. For example, the Elian Gonzalez case was ridiculous to me. The child should have been brought back to his father who was the surviving parent. The hatred of Castro overrode the sense of right and contributed to us losing Florida. Note the word contributed.

But why stir up that antagonism unnecessarily?

[uponit7771]

10. +1

[Blue_true]

13. She is a democratic US Congresswoman, in her second term. nt

[Midnightwalk]

15. Thanks

I read about a state senator making a comment and saw upon’s post and broke it. I’ll fix it back.

[Blue_true]

16. A State Senator that is Cuban, a democrat and represents a Miami district

did in fact make a statement on Bernie's 60 Minutes claim. Stephanie Murphy is based farther north.

[Happy Hoosier]

18. Let's not blame Cuban human rights abuses on American Imperialism.

Castro based his rule on Marxist-Leninist-Stalinist approaches to communism. We can be critical of both.

[flamingdem]

3. Before posting Stephanie Murphy's tweet read her earlier post supporting Bloomberg

Not Biden. We don't need Republican lite.

[Blue_true]

14. She is in her second term in Congress from a now purple district, it was red.

Her voting record in support of policies put forward by Speaker Pelosi is very sound.

[MaryMagdaline]

4. I had similar thoughts about Castro before moving to Miami

Yes, the increase in literacy rates and the vast improvement of medical care on the island were tremendous accomplishments. The types of things that can get done in a totalitarian state, where belonging to the state is like being in the military. I was surrounded by working class refuges in Miami who had no love for Castro. Even when they benefited from greater education, they suffered from loss of personal freedoms. Castro was also a war monger. I cringed when listening to Kruschev's people who told us years later that Castro was egging on the Soviet Union to bomb the USA. He sacrificed his people to fight Marxist wars in Africa and South America (the price, no doubt, for receiving Soviet aid).

Along with the increase in literacy rates, there was also mandatory attendance at pioneer camps, similar to Soviet and Nazi camps for re-education. Your children belonged to the state.

The problem with Sanders is that he is that he values egalitarianism so highly and does not value personal liberty at all. Cuba is not Vermont, where generations ago, good old Yankee know how brought high literacy rates, good medical care, and high level of personal freedom.

Sorry, Bernie, I don't shrug off the Sandanistas and Castros. I know too many poor Cubans and poor Nicaraguans who enjoy a little personal freedom just like the rest of us.

[uponit7771]

11. +1

[Nanjeanne]

5. Can we check and see if she condemned Obama when he said the same thing?

[uponit7771]

12. Obama did not defend Castro with needless "not all bad" deflection

[Gothmog]

17. No, Bernie Sanders' Discussion of Cuba's Castro is Nothing Like Obama's

Link to tweet

Eric Levitz in New York Magazine on Monday makes the case that Bernie Sanders’ 1985 interview admiring some aspects of Fidel Castro’s regime in Cuba was roughly the same as Barack Obama’s 2016 discussion of Castro. This is in large part just an amplification of ideas flying around Twitter this week, as in the tweet pictured above. A quick look at Sanders’ and Obama’s statements shows why this analysis is entirely incorrect.

In 2016, Obama was addressing hundreds of young business and social entrepreneurs from across Latin America in Buenos Aires, Argentina. If you read the transcript of his talk, you see immediately that Obama, in his signature style, was reinforcing the message of pragmatism and evidence-based decision making — as he puts it “be[ing] practical and just choos[ing] from what works.” He was in fact arguing against ideology, at a time when he must have been watching the destabilizing effects the surge in ideological politics was causing not just in the United States but in other countries long considered staid and practical.

In discussing Cuba, Obama relayed direct conversations he had with the Castros, insight into the diplomacy of highlighting policy areas where there might be more agreement in order to create common ground with space to push for change in other areas. I doubt many would think it rational to approach a nascent foreign relationship with a guns blazing, take no prisoners attitude, especially when any agreement depended on the other country’s support. Obama was relaying one relatively high stakes conversation with foreign leaders to another unaligned audience in a foreign venue. I expect it does not take an expert in international relations to see the U.S. interest in pitching this information a certain way for both of these audiences.

In contrast, Bernie Sanders’ 1985 interview was not conducted for foreign consumption or to support U.S. national interests, and it did not come at a time of opening up in the U.S.-Cuba relationship. Instead, it was given for a local public access TV show. It was effectively a vanity project giving Sanders a platform to expound his views of politics and the world. Because of this, the messaging here is all Sanders. Further contrasting Obama, it was rooted in ideology, with Sanders opening, “As a socialist, the word socialism doesn’t frighten me,” before launching into his discussion of self-described socialist regimes. While you could argue the interview might not be a perfect snapshot of today’s presidential candidate’s innermost thoughts, it was a clear statement of what Sanders believed at the time and unfiltered by the degree of drafting and review Obama’s messaging on this topic would have undergone....

From this brief look, we can see that Obama’s talk involved a little flattery, a little spin, and a good deal of appealing to an audience that he saw as future leaders. In contrast, Sanders’ words were simply praise without an intentional objective towards a defined audience. Conflating these two discussions is flimsy, misleading, and indicative of the pro-regime propaganda captured in Sanders’ own sentiment.

[Gothmog]

19. This talking point being used by sanders supporters is simply false

Link to tweet

[LonePirate]

7. Castro has not been in power for almost 10 years. People no longer care.

[Gothmog]

8. Florida Democratic Party disavows Sanders.

Link to tweet

[Gothmog]

9. Biden campaign response to sanders praising Fidel Castro

Link to tweet

[Gothmog]

20. you can always count on @JoeBiden to defend @BarackObama 's record and legacy.

Link to tweet

[Gothmog]

21. Sanders comments on Castro are hurting sanders

Link to tweet

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