Bernie, 2012: "I think it would be a good idea if President Obama faced primary opposition."

[pnwmom]

Bernie said this as Obama was preparing to run for his second term.

I don't know why any real Democrat would support Bernie after that.

Bernie's camp denies that Bernie said it, but it was taped on a radio show, and I remember hearing about it at the time. The Politico piece contains a link to the Biden ad that includes an audio of Bernie saying it would be a good idea for Obama to face primary opposition.

ON EDIT: For those who cannot believe the words that came from Bernie's mouth, there are multiple witnesses.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/sanders-obama-primary-challenge/606709/

That summer, Sanders privately discussed a potential primary challenge to Obama with several people, including Patrick Leahy, his fellow Vermont senator. Leahy, alarmed, warned Jim Messina, Obama’s presidential reelection-campaign manager. Obama’s campaign team was “absolutely panicked” by Leahy’s report, Messina told me, since “every president who has gotten a real primary has lost a general [election].”

David Plouffe, another Obama strategist, confirmed Messina’s account, as did another person familiar with what happened. (A spokesman for Leahy did not comment when asked several times about his role in the incident.)

Messina called Reid, then the Senate majority leader, who had built a strong relationship with Sanders but was also fiercely defensive of Obama. What could you be thinking? Reid asked Sanders, according to multiple people who remember the conversations. You need to stop.

Sanders didn’t end up running against Obama. But their relationship didn’t improve in the years that followed. In another incident, in 2013, Sanders laid into Obama in a private meeting he held with Democratic senators, saying that the president was selling out to Republicans over Social Security benefits. (More on that incident, which has also not been previously reported, below.)

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/24/biden-ad-sanders-undermined-obama-election-117218

But back in Washington, there was one guy with another plan,” the narrator says before an audio clip is heard of Sanders saying, “I think it would be a good idea if President Obama faced some primary opposition.”

SNIP

“This never happened. Bernie Sanders never considered a primary challenge to Obama,” deputy campaign manager Ari Rabin-Havt said in a statement. “Bernie was running for reelection in 2012, and that’s what he was focused on.”

[TwilightZone]

1. If he'd run, he would have gotten demolished.

And we probably wouldn't be where we are in the 2020 campaign.

[sheshe2]

2. +++++++++++++++++++++++

Truth.

[MisterFred]

3. He didn't want to run.

The idea was that someone could run a protest campaign to try to push Obama to be more of a liberal. Sanders isn't insane enough to think Obama could be beat.

[TwilightZone]

8. Then he shouldn't have brought it up and then claimed he never said it.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/sanders-obama-primary-challenge/606709/

[MisterFred]

10. That story is based on 2012 stories, based on a few people spreading rumors.

Reid denied any such conversations happened.

Now, perhaps you think Reid is a liar, and you think these "sources" are telling the truth.

Perhaps you think Reid is honest, which would bean this story is a load of horseshit.

Either way, this attack is weak.

[pnwmom]

12. No, it was based on Bernie's own spoken words on a radio show,

words which were confirmed by Senator Patrick Leahy, among others.

[MisterFred]

13. Incorrect.

Sanders wanted someone to run as a protest candidate, but he didn't want to. That's the radio quote.

The linked Atlantic story is a hell of a lot more than that, and was weaksauce. Did it even mention Reid's outright denial that the "conversations" ever happened?

[pnwmom]

15. He should have disavowed the suggestion, not said it was a good idea.

It was a terrible idea.

[MisterFred]

16. Yeah, probably. I just don't get why everyone wants to pretend he wanted to run personally. nt

[pnwmom]

31. Probably because of reports like this:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/sanders-obama-primary-challenge/606709/

That summer, Sanders privately discussed a potential primary challenge to Obama with several people, including Patrick Leahy, his fellow Vermont senator. Leahy, alarmed, warned Jim Messina, Obama’s presidential reelection-campaign manager. Obama’s campaign team was “absolutely panicked” by Leahy’s report, Messina told me, since “every president who has gotten a real primary has lost a general [election].”

David Plouffe, another Obama strategist, confirmed Messina’s account, as did another person familiar with what happened. (A spokesman for Leahy did not comment when asked several times about his role in the incident.)

Messina called Reid, then the Senate majority leader, who had built a strong relationship with Sanders but was also fiercely defensive of Obama. What could you be thinking? Reid asked Sanders, according to multiple people who remember the conversations. You need to stop.

Sanders didn’t end up running against Obama. But their relationship didn’t improve in the years that followed. In another incident, in 2013, Sanders laid into Obama in a private meeting he held with Democratic senators, saying that the president was selling out to Republicans over Social Security benefits. (More on that incident, which has also not been previously reported, below.)

[MisterFred]

32. Please review post #10. nt

[pnwmom]

33. Please link to Harry Reid's denial and Patrick Leahy's denial. nt

[MisterFred]

34. Well, I'm sorry you're too young to remember 2012. I don't have the links, but

plenty of recent stories on the subject have mentioned Reid's denial. Unfortunately, Google likes to spam recent stuff. But if you look around you'll find both denials. You'll just have to look for the articles from 2012 or 2016, which weren't quite the hack jobs the recent articles are.

[pnwmom]

37. Hah. So you looked and couldn't find any. That's what I thought. n/t

[TwilightZone]

17. Oh, please.

Who do you think he meant?

When did Harry Reid deny that the conversations took place?

Oh, right. He didn't. He neither confirmed nor denied the story in interviews that took place after it was released.

Is Pat Leahy lying, too?

[MisterFred]

29. A protest candidate.

This is not exactly new. Reid denied the conversations in 2012 and 2016.

[thesquanderer]

4. No, on that radio show, he said it might good if SOMEONE did, but not that HE might.

He also didn't say the intent was "to prevent him from having a second term' but rather to exert pressure from the left to counter pressure from the right.

[pnwmom]

11. All "pressure from the left" would have accomplished was weakening Obama before the election.

Bernie should have disavowed the suggestion, not said it was a good idea.

And Patrick Leahy warned Jim Messina that Bernie WAS considering the idea. (I added a link to the OP.)

[thesquanderer]

41. Yes, I saw the link you added.

I believe Bernie has denied that account, so it is not as unambiguously true as the other stuff we were talking about. But... maybe.

re:

Bernie, 2012: "I think it would be a good idea if President Obama faced primary opposition."
Bernie said this as Obama was preparing to run for his second term.

Bernie's camp denies that Bernie said it"

I don't know who the "camp" is, but Bernie doesn't deny he said that. I didn't think anybody did. Lordy, there are tapes!

He wasn't talking about primarying Obama himself,... in fact, if you go to the tape, the very first thing talked about is how Sanders was saying he would NOT run against Obama. I can see where some people would say that that distinction is not important, but I think one still wants to be accurate.

To see EXACTLY what he said, in full context, here it is:

No, it is not flattering to Bernie, in terms of his thoughts about Obama. But at least you'll know what's fact and what's fiction.

[sheshe2]

14. No.

He said it and Harry Reid told him to back off.

[thesquanderer]

39. My post was specifically about what he said in the radio program. It's confusing...

...because the post I was responding to was edited after I posted that response. The reply was exactly relevant originally, but is a little out of whack as a response to the OP as it stands now.

ETA: as for the Harry Reid exchange about Sanders thinking about running himself, that is what's in the new Atlantic article (which was not part of the original post). Unlike the stuff I was talking about where there are recordings, the Atlantic article is a little more ambiguous in its sourcing. Sanders has denied it, so, maybe, maybe not. I'm hesitant to say it is fact at this point. But it could be.

[TwilightZone]

19. He told Pat Leahy he was thinking about running.

Leahy told Jim Messina, Obama's campaign manager, that Sanders was talking about running and had discussed it with him.

Then, Harry Reid got involved.

So, either everyone else is lying or Sanders is obfuscating.

[thesquanderer]

40. That's from the new Atlantic article...

Sanders denies... so while it's certainly possible, I don't think we yet can say for sure that it's accurate. But... maybe.

[mcar]

5. Kick

[Cha]

6. Is BS really denying he said that?

Link to tweet

[oasis]

20. Jonathan Alter: "Bernie was the most anti-Obama Democrat I met. By far."

That should seal it folks.

[Cha]

22. Yeah.. he can't deny this happened.

Mahalo, oasis!

[oasis]

26. Bernie folks were quick to dismiss every negative OP Jennifer Rubin

has written about Senator Sanders. "She's a right wing Republican, blah, blah,blah".

They cannot attack Alter's credibility, nor his motives for stating what he believes are the facts about Bernie.

Mahalo to you Cha, for your valuable contributions to our DU boards.

[Cha]

28. You're Welcome, oasis..

I Thank you, back!

[Bonobo]

7. I cannot understand what is wrong with that.

I was SO Pro-Obama in 2008, but then was SO disappointed that he was intensifying the Afghanistan war and drone strikes.

I WANTED another choice. That is what democracy is about.

What's wrong with that?

[pnwmom]

9. Because all Bernie would have accomplished would be kneecapping Obama

before Obama faced the R in the general.

There was no way in hell Bernie was going to beat Obama in the primary; the best he could have done was weaken Obama before the general.

[brush]

18. Seriously? You don't see what's wrong with primarying a sitting president of your own party?

That's hard to understand. Last time that happened Carter lost.

[Bonobo]

21. Yup, seriously.

[brush]

23. Learn some history. Incumbency is a huge advantage.

Even for an idiot like trump.

[Bonobo]

24. That is absolutely true

And absolutely irrelevant to me

[brush]

25. Apparently.

[Bonobo]

27. Yup. It's a democracy, donchaknow.

[Cha]

35. Then why did BS deny it?

Biden this week released an ad in South Carolina accusing Sanders of not supporting Obama in 2012.

Sanders denied the allegation that he planned to challenge Obama while speaking at a CNN town hall on Monday..

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/484635-biden-attacks-sanders-at-debate-over-obama-primary

The Hidden History of Sanders’s Plot to Primary Obama

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/sanders-obama-primary-challenge/606709/

[Bonobo]

38. I don't know. Ask him. As for me, "primarying" a president after a term is fine

if you don't like his policies.

Why wouldn't it be?

[Cha]

42. BS needs to own it.

[LanternWaste]

43. Is anyone arguing otherwise?

Or simply another irrelevancy designed to appear clever?

[evertonfc]

30. Sanders is no Obama

[HarlanPepper]

44. Understatement of the millennium

He thinks he is though. Better even.

[Cha]

36. And BS denies it..

Biden this week released an ad in South Carolina accusing Sanders of not supporting Obama in 2012.

Sanders denied the allegation that he planned to challenge Obama while speaking at a CNN town hall on Monday..

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/484635-biden-attacks-sanders-at-debate-over-obama-primary

The Hidden History of Sanders’s Plot to Primary Obama

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/02/sanders-obama-primary-challenge/606709/

[HarlanPepper]

45. If only there was a word for people who aren't truthful.