General Discussion

Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)

231. The result against T___p would have been exactly the same if Bern had been barred from running.

Sat Feb 17, 2018, 07:23 PM

Feb 2018

It's a waste of time to argue against his presence last time-his campaign didn't cause T___p and there was never any point at which everybody was all in for HRC and we were a lock for victory.

Nor were we going to do better if fewer people had voted that year, which is all that would have come of barring the guy.

We wouldn't have done any better with a debate-free primary and a blander platform. And we wouldn't have done any better if the attack ads against Trump had started earlier-the GOP contest had already decisively proved that attack ads NEVER worked on him.

I wish HRC were in the White House now.

And I don't think Bernie should run again.

But it serves no purporse to keep attacking him for running last time.

We can't DO anything about last time.

Why not focus solely on the future, and on building unity for the future?

Besides which, based on the way his personality seems to work, you're probably far more likely to cause him to run again by continuing to say he shouldn't have run last time. The best way to keep him out is to let that go.

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You can forget about Bernie running for President in 2020 [View all] scheming daemons Feb 2018 OP

Fuckin A BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #1

He runs, he gets my vote DiverDave Feb 2018 #141

Not me Joediss Feb 2018 #179

I would consider voting for him again. David__77 Feb 2018 #182

His reliability, his ability to pull in a majority is now in question more than ever. BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #195

He doesn't speak for me. He didn't speak for ne when he voted against immigration reform. He didn't lunamagica Feb 2018 #214

He didn't speak for me on his pro-gun votes, lapucelle Feb 2018 #235

Yup. That's a big issue for me. I can't believe I forgot to list it. lunamagica Feb 2018 #238

Yeah Sherman A1 Feb 2018 #2

Sticking with what Ive been saying. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #3

How can you say that when you don't know who else would be running? ProudLib72 Feb 2018 #10

I can easily say it. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #13

Interesting thought BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #41

I dont think he would have done as well either. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #55

After the primary, many turned against him. I wont say anything about during the primary bettyellen Feb 2018 #54

Why is it still important to you to try to delegitimize the last campaign? Ken Burch Feb 2018 #152

Ummm, I didnt say he should not have run. Im saying he should have stopped running once he lost bettyellen Feb 2018 #154

He stopped when it was decided. HRC didn't go over the top until almost the end. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #220

I stopped reading when you started to rationalize that inane shit show the BOBs put on at the DNC. bettyellen Feb 2018 #222

How could you expect those kids to just sit and cheer Ken Burch Feb 2018 #224

They were provoked into booing every black speaker? For fucks sake they showed bettyellen Feb 2018 #230

No one was booed for being black. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #232

Please, point to me where she says he shouldn't be allowed to run lunamagica Feb 2018 #215

Hes making this up as he goes along. bettyellen Feb 2018 #223

The whole point of the OP is to trash the idea of the guy running, which is pointless. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #225

See, you couldn't poit it out to me because it isn't there lunamagica Feb 2018 #226

I didn't claim she said he shouldn't be allowed to run. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #228

"why still argue that he shouldn't ever have been allowed in at all?" LanternWaste Feb 2018 #237

You're simply making inferences and allegations predicated on your own biases. LanternWaste Feb 2018 #236

He didn't do well in primaries. He did well in caucuses. LisaM Feb 2018 #81

I agree with you about the early going, but that won't last. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #119

"All to his right" mcar Feb 2018 #146

What the HELL is it with reading comprehension on DU? Jim Lane Feb 2018 #147

Ahhh...to those pitching Sanders, he is not a Democrat. The party is not going to allow... brush Feb 2018 #160

I have a question about "The party is not going to allow" it. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #167

My take is as stated. Who wants that divisive crap from 2016 repeated again from someone... brush Feb 2018 #168

Sorry, I still don't understand your answer Jim Lane Feb 2018 #173

Again, no one wants the divisiveness another Sanders campaign as a Dem will bring to the... brush Feb 2018 #194

Don't Worry About It Me. Feb 2018 #205

This. But he probably thinks he can get away with it again lunamagica Feb 2018 #216

Then He Will Have A Choice To Make Me. Feb 2018 #219

Youre so right. David__77 Feb 2018 #183

LOL, more prefabricated 2020 DNC conspiracy theories! R B Garr Feb 2018 #159

Guess he'll be running as an independent, what he is btw, because the Democratic Party... brush Feb 2018 #157

I agree. He has a base and inertia Lee-Lee Feb 2018 #12

+1 NCTraveler Feb 2018 #14

His "large base" has now been exposed as being fake, or easily duped scheming daemons Feb 2018 #17

I dont think they have been exposed as either. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #33

some had to have been the Russians... after this indictments this much is clear. I don't Demsrule86 Feb 2018 #165

The vote totals in the last primary say otherwise Lee-Lee Feb 2018 #38

Those were the easily duped. They'll be angry at themselves for falling for Russian active measures scheming daemons Feb 2018 #40

I'm among the many who weren't duped. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #92

His base was manufactured in part with Russian assisance BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #51

Also Republicans in open primaries helped. bettyellen Feb 2018 #57

Exactly. Codeine Feb 2018 #124

So true BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #129

Agree Joediss Feb 2018 #192

What lie did Bernie tell you? Jim Lane Feb 2018 #204

Yes. This. Exactly. Thank you! NurseJackie Feb 2018 #76

I wasnt duped to support him. BlueTsunami2018 Feb 2018 #79

Bernie supporter lindalou65 Feb 2018 #90

We can already see right here JackInGreen Feb 2018 #133

Which also points to the divisiveness that comes with Sanders as a Dem candidate. brush Feb 2018 #211

Same here Joediss Feb 2018 #181

Thank you. David__77 Feb 2018 #184

What's not to like? I have plety of stuff I do nott like about him lunamagica Feb 2018 #217

"Easily duped"? DiverDave Feb 2018 #144

That is how Trump defeated the other 16 TOP candidates--they split the slightly less tblue37 Feb 2018 #65

I disagree Gothmog Feb 2018 #28

Disagree. He only got where he did because he R B Garr Feb 2018 #44

While I do not agree that he got MuseRider Feb 2018 #48

Yes, more transparency would probably be expected. nt R B Garr Feb 2018 #95

The media will not start questioning him. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #60

Yes, privileged status is an excellent description. R B Garr Feb 2018 #97

NO. Cha Feb 2018 #66

Its what I truly see happening. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #69

He's not a Democrat. There won't be a repeat of that 2016 divisiveness. The party would be crazy... brush Feb 2018 #162

Why do you think that? Why would you think that? ehrnst Feb 2018 #93

. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #120

I think that prior to vetting, it's a bit premature to crown anyone. ehrnst Feb 2018 #126

Who will be asking them? The media? NCTraveler Feb 2018 #130

So, it'll be a coronation?...nt SidDithers Feb 2018 #105

And a disaster. NCTraveler Feb 2018 #127

God, not another one. (n/t) Iggo Feb 2018 #140

LOL! R B Garr Feb 2018 #148

A caucus, maybe. Primaries, not so much. TeamPooka Feb 2018 #142

I don't think he does. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #151

He's not a Democrat. That what's going to stop him as the party would be crazy to allow that... brush Feb 2018 #163

The result against T___p would have been exactly the same if Bern had been barred from running. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #231

I don't agree at all. Some Sanders voters stayed home or voted Stein in the GE... brush Feb 2018 #234

Hmmm...no. I think he does because not enough people will vote for him. It's that simple lunamagica Feb 2018 #218

As I said, I don't think he actually WANTS to run. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #221

The guy want to run. In fact, he has bbeen running for 2020 since Nov. '16 lunamagica Feb 2018 #227

That's your interpretation. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #229

Ahhh...he lost the primaries easily in 2016. Many new, younger, attractive candidates will emerge. brush Feb 2018 #155

Bernie now has two strikes. Adrahil Feb 2018 #175

Lynch mob now! moondust Feb 2018 #4

I wasn't even worrying about it maxsolomon Feb 2018 #5

How can you say that? Has Mueller's final investigation report been released? DonViejo Feb 2018 #6

Sad to say on the other hand I still have seen his full tax returns either uponit7771 Feb 2018 #7

He had not a fucking thing to do with it and you know it. alarimer Feb 2018 #8

People don't like to find out they've been duped. scheming daemons Feb 2018 #19

Just stop with the bullshit. alarimer Feb 2018 #27

I'm assuming nothing. I'm reading it in Mueller's indictment. scheming daemons Feb 2018 #31

According to the indictment (I'm paraphrasing) Russians posed as Sanders supporters.... George II Feb 2018 #49

Guess what askyagerz Feb 2018 #86

And there it is. Codeine Feb 2018 #128

Yep we all commrades askyagerz Feb 2018 #137

Well, one big point is he's not a Democrat so pls no more 2016 divisiveness. Another point is... brush Feb 2018 #166

It may be sour grapes. David__77 Feb 2018 #188

In worry about no vote on russian sanctions. boston bean Feb 2018 #94

The usefully vague term "supporters" lends itself to a totally false impression Jim Lane Feb 2018 #96

More nonreality and pure fabrication. There are criminal R B Garr Feb 2018 #161

After the primary it was quite apparent- RT articles and stupid memes and yeah... bettyellen Feb 2018 #62

The Russians saw a chance to put a wedge between the left askyagerz Feb 2018 #84

Yeah like all the people who went to all his rally's were imported from Russia. Cobalt Violet Feb 2018 #87

Critical thinking should tell you he's not a Democrat and the party would be crazy to invite that... brush Feb 2018 #164

Latest 2020 polling show Biden polling higher than Bernie in Trump match-ups emulatorloo Feb 2018 #170

Or........... George II Feb 2018 #47

What? Is that in the reporting that it is a known fact that neither he or anyone in his Eliot Rosewater Feb 2018 #26

You are casting aspersions with no evidence alarimer Feb 2018 #29

How in the FUCK is my ASKING you to point me to the story that proves your assertion is me Eliot Rosewater Feb 2018 #30

You are the one that Sanders knew about Russian interference. alarimer Feb 2018 #34

WHERE did I say that PROVE it this INSTANT or RETRACT it THIS INSTANT Eliot Rosewater Feb 2018 #37

"Prove" something that wasn't said? Really? George II Feb 2018 #52

I was amazed to see such an absolute statement made so I just had to inquire. Eliot Rosewater Feb 2018 #59

your knee jerk, defensive, apologist reactions are funny BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #56

The indictment says the Russians actively helped him. It does *NOT* say he knew about it. scheming daemons Feb 2018 #36

Exactly, to which this was said by someone Eliot Rosewater Feb 2018 #39

Bernie was given ample opportunity to reign in the bot messaging.... BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #64

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #88

Not just bullshit -- DOUBLE bullshit! Jim Lane Feb 2018 #101

Bernie is lucky to have you in his rah-rah section BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #109

Yes, he is, and he realizes it. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #112

That's a super strange admission. BoneyardDem Feb 2018 #123

Cold War mindset. David__77 Feb 2018 #187

I dont think there were many Russians at those the packed stadium rallies Fiendish Thingy Feb 2018 #9

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #45

I'm guessing it was more Fake online support TNLib Feb 2018 #63

Maybe the Russians encouraged them to show up? And they weren't all that packed anyway. George II Feb 2018 #91

You are mistaken Fiendish Thingy Feb 2018 #100

Sanders had crowds "reported" over 10,000. Check the indictment, looks like the Russian groups.... George II Feb 2018 #136

It was the bullshit being spewed by the Broskis Codeine Feb 2018 #118

I am not sure...always a discrepancy between who went to the rally and the vote. Demsrule86 Feb 2018 #208

Bernie will know what to do and do what he wants. MuseRider Feb 2018 #11

Post removed Post removed Feb 2018 #25

LOL MuseRider Feb 2018 #32

Why is his response so damned weak? Adrahil Feb 2018 #176

Bernie tends to not want to discuss MuseRider Feb 2018 #186

He needs to discuss it because too many of his followers fell victim to it. Adrahil Feb 2018 #190

What you demand that he say about party unity is what he SAID at the convention. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #198

It's always been Lukewarm. Adrahil Feb 2018 #200

Perhaps you should write to him. MuseRider Feb 2018 #213

Meh. He'll easily be the frontrunner at this point leftstreet Feb 2018 #15

This message was self-deleted by its author BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #21

I think you're wrong. People hate to find out they were duped. scheming daemons Feb 2018 #23

You'll really think Trump supporters care that they were the targets of Russian interference? Ace Rothstein Feb 2018 #61

Anyone could be "the frontrunner" at this point, because there's no race.... ehrnst Feb 2018 #74

That is not true...I thought he should not run in 20 anyway because we need younger fresher Demsrule86 Feb 2018 #209

So you're OK with foreign powers picking and/or disqualifying our candidates? shanny Feb 2018 #16

That's some creative spin BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #18

It's the company I keep shanny Feb 2018 #24

I hope we will be much smarter next time 4now Feb 2018 #20

Stein will run again, if not indicted. She has no shame. samir.g Feb 2018 #22

Indicted for what? nt Snotcicles Feb 2018 #35

She should be indicted for that fucking recount scam she ran BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #43

Lots of DUers sent her money oberliner Feb 2018 #53

probably for helping Russia interfere with our election samir.g Feb 2018 #82

Plenty of us knew..... and Jill Stein certainly knew. NT Adrahil Feb 2018 #42

If I were able to go back in time... demmiblue Feb 2018 #46

I completely agree with you about both of my 2016 votes Jim Lane Feb 2018 #106

It's sad because even in late 2015 I was noticing Blue_Tires Feb 2018 #50

Exactly! EffieBlack Feb 2018 #111

Typical Jeff Weaver, imho emulatorloo Feb 2018 #171

Love Bernie, but I wouldn't be sorry if he stayed out of the race... Wounded Bear Feb 2018 #58

Agreed - he did a lot of good hueymahl Feb 2018 #75

Some good and some harm WhiteTara Feb 2018 #80

I agree. He energized people who had been turned off by the sheer mountain grammy Feb 2018 #99

I think he'll have a shot at the nomination if he runs. dawg Feb 2018 #67

Sad BlueDog22 Feb 2018 #68

I once admired John Edwards BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #72

So Did I... BlueDog22 Feb 2018 #73

So essentially the Russians destroyed two Democratic candidates for the price of one? AtheistCrusader Feb 2018 #70

Looks that way here appalachiablue Feb 2018 #125

As long as loons like Nomiki Konst are in his camp, Sanders ain't winning shit Blue_Tires Feb 2018 #71

Bernie has a core of support. it's a cult of personality. SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2018 #77

Right, no one could possibly support Bernie on the issues. Keep telling yourself that. (n/t) Jim Lane Feb 2018 #108

I do not believe that to be true. I know many passionate . . . SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2018 #158

You know who else has a "Cult of Personality"? Motownman78 Feb 2018 #138

absolutely. n/t SleeplessinSoCal Feb 2018 #156

Bernie pamdb Feb 2018 #78

He's going to win. Cobalt Violet Feb 2018 #83

Lol BannonsLiver Feb 2018 #85

One assumes the assist from Putin and his bros Codeine Feb 2018 #116

Why this need to denegrate Bernie? yellowwoodII Feb 2018 #89

I am ok with him running if he choses to. Blue_true Feb 2018 #98

Of course he did not know. Bernie has integrity. applegrove Feb 2018 #102

I hope so. nycbos Feb 2018 #103

You say that "Bernie needs to explain" a vote that he explained at the time. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #110

DU rec... SidDithers Feb 2018 #104

Russians did prompt anyone to come to our cacus. waterwatcher123 Feb 2018 #107

For sure Russia will push him again because he is a massively divisive figure Exotica Feb 2018 #113

Theyre pushing him now, right here. Codeine Feb 2018 #132

And, Wall Street and the Big Banks are ecstatic with the news!! jalan48 Feb 2018 #114

Hes a one-trick pony lanlady Feb 2018 #115

Good. (nt) Paladin Feb 2018 #117

I dont think he would run anyway Renew Deal Feb 2018 #121

He wasn't helped by Russia the first time, and his support was and is real. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #122

People were just indicted for helping him. Codeine Feb 2018 #131

If anything like that happened, he'd have had no way of knowing it. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #135

Bernie knew Russians were dividing Democrats w anti HRC agit-prop and has said so emulatorloo Feb 2018 #172

"The first time"? How many "times" were there? George II Feb 2018 #143

The last campaign was the first time. Ken Burch Feb 2018 #150

This message was self-deleted by its author Exotica Feb 2018 #145

Funny, because Bernie's platform would do a hell of a lot to make PatrickforO Feb 2018 #134

Lol. He ain't walkin' in the woods. Sorry to Burt your bubble Hassin Bin Sober Feb 2018 #139

The Russians love this kind of thinking. bluedigger Feb 2018 #149

Let's hope ellie Feb 2018 #153

It's only fodder for Bernie haters who still blame him for HRCs loss. aikoaiko Feb 2018 #169

I actually agree with you...and that is why I think he will not win a primary...too many blame Demsrule86 Feb 2018 #212

Don't forget, only two Senators voted against the Russia sanctions (98-2) George II Feb 2018 #174

Or, to restate it, only two Senators voted against the Iran sanctions. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #197

I read his statement at the time of the vote, and to be honest I'm really not interested in... George II Feb 2018 #199

"Using Iran sanctions as an excuse" -- what complete bullshit Jim Lane Feb 2018 #201

I know it does, and it includes sanctions against North Korea as well. So we shouldn't sanction... George II Feb 2018 #203

Yet you still want it to be just about Russia. Jim Lane Feb 2018 #206

Oh ffs tymorial Feb 2018 #177

I don't know if I agree with this, but he's too fucking old anyway. n/t D23MIURG23 Feb 2018 #178

So many here said that Hillary lacked public trust, no matter if the smears were fake ehrnst Feb 2018 #180

He hasn't aknowledged it but Ari Melber's calling him out.. Cha Feb 2018 #185

I don't care for Bernie but I also don't think it is fair to blame him for this. StevieM Feb 2018 #189

I still want to know why Sanders was one of two senators to vote against the Russia sanctions DesertRat Feb 2018 #191

I'll let Bernie himself tell you why Jim Lane Feb 2018 #196

that part was nowehere near as important as russia sanctions AlexSFCA Feb 2018 #210

We had quite a few posters that sowed the seeds of discord. RT & Sputnik were their go to sources. grossproffit Feb 2018 #193

Some folks always looking for a reason to hate Bernie left-of-center2012 Feb 2018 #202

I think it boils down to ones own critical thinking skills and your political issue astuteness. YOHABLO Feb 2018 #207

If he runs, he'll have my vote. LWolf Feb 2018 #233