General Discussion

EffieBlack

(14,249 posts)

223. I dont lump them together definitionally, but they need to sort themselves out

Tue Mar 20, 2018, 10:23 AM

Mar 2018

Since I can’t tell them apart. The ones who want to be rescued need to identify themselves - we shouldn’t have to run into the belly of the beast and waste time with people who are still ok with Trump.

I have no problem reaching out to people who are receptive to outreach. But they have to reach out, too - and given the circumstances, they need to meet us more than halfway. But I’m not going to and I don’t want my party to go chasing around after anyone and everyone who voted for Trump hoping that we can cull a few converts.

Conor Lamb did the former and it worked. He didn’t go out and actively campaign to Trump supporters - he left them the hell alone because he probably knew it was a waste of time. Instead, he put out a message and platform that was very progressive for his district and offered a viable alternative to disillusioned Trump voters. I sincerely doubt, however, that he converted many, if any at all, people who were still supporting Trump when they first heard Lamb’s message.

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To those insisting that we "reach out to" and "understand" Trump supporters, let me break it down [View all] EffieBlack Mar 2018 OP

Fuck em... mikeysnot Mar 2018 #1

And Republicans In General PaulX2 Mar 2018 #39

Agree, you might as well be talking to a potted plant. Pepsidog Mar 2018 #44

Accually, talking to a potted plant has some benefits elmac Mar 2018 #52

A lot of "plants" have been repotted and replanted by Hortensis Mar 2018 #69

True Pepsidog Mar 2018 #78

Double fuck 'em lillypaddle Mar 2018 #76

They have been like this for generation. Good article here in BigmanPigman Mar 2018 #192

thanks for the link lillypaddle Mar 2018 #210

Trump voters and Trump voter defenders can fuck off! They're all sympathizers and enablers... NurseJackie Mar 2018 #2

And they are everywhere. Eliot Rosewater Mar 2018 #101

This message was self-deleted by its author RestoreAmerica2020 Mar 2018 #209

That attitude sure worked well for us recently hueymahl Mar 2018 #3

bullshit heaven05 Mar 2018 #12

Just so I am clear hueymahl Mar 2018 #23

I'm not about to call heaven05 Mar 2018 #60

Ahhhh...yeah. You wrote what you wrote, right? brush Mar 2018 #66

I never have heaven05 Mar 2018 #80

Sorry, I meant to respond to Hueyman. I agree with your post. I will delete and re-post. brush Mar 2018 #89

Ahhhh...yeah. You wrote what you wrote, right? brush Mar 2018 #87

Where did I say they were decent people? hueymahl Mar 2018 #113

Are you trying to inject reason into our venting BlueWI Mar 2018 #183

LOL hueymahl Mar 2018 #198

Wow. Are you sure you're in the right place? EffieBlack Mar 2018 #203

Woohoo. Well said. brush Mar 2018 #64

There were non-racists who voted for Trump, despite his obvious racism... thesquanderer Mar 2018 #70

I can and will heaven05 Mar 2018 #77

Exactly! Unca Jim Mar 2018 #90

good point heaven05 Mar 2018 #104

Yes, that much is true, I'll give you that! (n/t) thesquanderer Mar 2018 #189

Period. sheshe2 Mar 2018 #135

Painting with a broad brush, without looking at individuals can be "common sense"... thesquanderer Mar 2018 #188

I learned heaven05 Mar 2018 #191

I think it is human nature to generalize... thesquanderer Mar 2018 #196

undoubtedly heaven05 Mar 2018 #216

13% of Trump voters voted for Obama over Romney in 2012. thesquanderer Mar 2018 #232

I understand your point that racism is simply not as important to them as other things, EffieBlack Mar 2018 #235

re: "but how do you explain..." thesquanderer Mar 2018 #246

For me, the bottom one is not whats in their hearts. I dont care if they meet the definition EffieBlack Mar 2018 #247

yep nt heaven05 Mar 2018 #249

You are attacking Democrats and dividing us ollie10 Mar 2018 #83

your line of reasoning heaven05 Mar 2018 #102

Very well said hueymahl Mar 2018 #115

"These are potential D voters in 2020 if we give them a good reason to vote D" lunamagica Mar 2018 #120

We spent too much time focusing on Trump, not enough on our message ollie10 Mar 2018 #123

But we received MILLIONS more votes. The election was stolen lunamagica Mar 2018 #138

We need to win more states ollie10 Mar 2018 #148

Those are people who will NEVER vote democrat. Pandering to them -like Gore did by lunamagica Mar 2018 #149

We seem to be talking about two different groups of Trump voters ollie10 Mar 2018 #153

How do we do that? Like I said in my post (and you ignored) lunamagica Mar 2018 #155

We were talking about Hillary's speech ollie10 Mar 2018 #157

Again, I'm sure that those who were offended are the unreacheable ones lunamagica Mar 2018 #158

Hillary was unfairly criticized constantly for supposedly being dishonest EffieBlack Mar 2018 #217

*The media* spent too much time focusing on Trump, not enough on the Democratic message muriel_volestrangler Mar 2018 #231

I will try to be clear ollie10 Mar 2018 #233

So Trump had great success saying "my opposition is useless", but we should avoid saying that muriel_volestrangler Mar 2018 #237

Anyone who would be turned off if we go after Trump needs to stay over theres with him EffieBlack Mar 2018 #239

So what are you saying? ollie10 Mar 2018 #241

Lamb ran in the most Republican district it's possible to think could be flipped muriel_volestrangler Mar 2018 #245

Ok. Just explain to me.. ollie10 Mar 2018 #248

The problem is saying we need to "reach out to" people who voted for a bigot muriel_volestrangler Mar 2018 #250

I posted my comment before I saw yours, which says exactly what I wanted, only better! EffieBlack Mar 2018 #255

A little shame goes a long way - and some of them may only switch if they EffieBlack Mar 2018 #256

Hillary admitted that calling half of Trump supporters ollie10 Mar 2018 #259

This has nothing to do with getting our ideas out there. EffieBlack Mar 2018 #253

that's false....Dem messaging will not convert a Trumpster BoneyardDem Mar 2018 #257

THIS progressoid Mar 2018 #169

YOu and the OP relayerbob Mar 2018 #96

All you have are disingenuous insults and Cha Mar 2018 #208

Well youre a lovely one, arent you? Thanks for making this a great place! MadDAsHell Mar 2018 #105

just stating heaven05 Mar 2018 #108

Losing elections? gratuitous Mar 2018 #21

There's an old saying about counting your electronic votes before they've hatched. -nt CrispyQ Mar 2018 #24

And we only had to let the worst person of all time get elected president to do so hueymahl Mar 2018 #25

If you're saying they're decent people, they'll come around on their own. Let them, but not... brush Mar 2018 #57

Until we deal with the Fox News and their traitor shows, wingnuts will never be abandon Dotard. Pepsidog Mar 2018 #67

Actually it has. Hence, Blue Wave. MrsCoffee Mar 2018 #74

Rather like trying to persuade... 3catwoman3 Mar 2018 #4

Reaching out is a two way street. I am willing to do it... if they are as well ck4829 Mar 2018 #5

Beautiful post EffieBlack Mar 2018 #6

+++BAM!!!! heaven05 Mar 2018 #7

The deplorables are unreachable unless the democratic party wants to welcome racists workinclasszero Mar 2018 #8

As Hillary was trying to point out, there are TWO baskets. Only one... LAS14 Mar 2018 #59

All the time, effort and manpower to get one damn Trump voter to grudgingly vote democratic workinclasszero Mar 2018 #98

If you live in Alabama instead of Harlem, your position makes no sense. nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #109

Here are the Trump voters you are so passionate about going after...good luck! LOLOL workinclasszero Mar 2018 #100

I never once said I was passionate about going after Trump voters. LAS14 Mar 2018 #110

LOL- how many threads about Trump voters did you start? Its your passion alright. bettyellen Mar 2018 #139

Point to one. LAS14 Mar 2018 #143

Exactly. whathehell Mar 2018 #174

Not only is there a plethora of "It's political suicide not to reach out to Trump supporter" OPs EffieBlack Mar 2018 #182

Wow. Thats a pretty succinct summary of the MAGA crap. Thanks. bettyellen Mar 2018 #140

You are welcome workinclasszero Mar 2018 #142

Reach out, perhaps not. But, you've got to understand the virus to properly eradicate it. TheBlackAdder Mar 2018 #9

That's what the right wing infopedia is for. ck4829 Mar 2018 #11

That's very high-level and doesn't seem to delve into root causes. TheBlackAdder Mar 2018 #128

Okay. Could you enlarge on that a bit? Demit Mar 2018 #16

What is it's source? Such as Southern Paternalism, Evangelicalism, Cloistered or Remote Tribalism? TheBlackAdder Mar 2018 #126

I'm afraid that doesn't explain the racism in large cities, such as Boston or Philadelphia. Demit Mar 2018 #212

I'm sure there is peer reviewed research on the topics. What you ask can not be answered in a post. TheBlackAdder Mar 2018 #225

I was only asking you to explain "you've got to understand the virus to properly eradicate it." Demit Mar 2018 #226

Is this a troll post, asking to be spoon-fed with countless redirects? You asked about cities next. TheBlackAdder Mar 2018 #227

If their loyalties can switch that easily, they can be snatched back easily, too EffieBlack Mar 2018 #230

If you think asking someone to enlarge on their breezy generalization is trolling, Demit Mar 2018 #258

racism is fear Hermit-The-Prog Mar 2018 #145

Racism is more than just fear EffieBlack Mar 2018 #218

no diminishment, not excused Hermit-The-Prog Mar 2018 #234

Agree with everything you said, Effie. flibbitygiblets Mar 2018 #10

Indeed, I think that's why his daily life became the scandal to them ck4829 Mar 2018 #13

Don't forget the "flag pin" hysteria, the "Terrorist fist jab" BumRushDaShow Mar 2018 #32

God... ck4829 Mar 2018 #33

The lazy N___r meme exboyfil Mar 2018 #30

Well considered and well written---as usual. K&R. nt Atticus Mar 2018 #14

They're the fringe minority.... fuck them! Chakaconcarne Mar 2018 #15

About all I can give these people is my promise Burma Jones Mar 2018 #17

"understand" does not mean "sympathize". . . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Mar 2018 #18

Absolutely!!! nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #61

Here's A Good Example Of Those We're Expected To 'Forgive & Forget' Who They Are Me. Mar 2018 #19

Ignore them. GOTV. dalton99a Mar 2018 #20

Again, millions of Romney voters broke for Clinton. NCTraveler Mar 2018 #22

Great post. safeinOhio Mar 2018 #26

Trump supporters and the wide group of Fox News conservatives have been programmed to hate liberals lancelyons Mar 2018 #27

I do not believe True Blue American Mar 2018 #34

Thanks for your post! Big K&R! Anon-C Mar 2018 #28

I don't know about reaching out loyalsister Mar 2018 #29

I totally agree! LAS14 Mar 2018 #68

Thank You For That True Blue American Mar 2018 #31

The last time I discussed politics at work...... dameatball Mar 2018 #35

Reaching out to a supporter of that Progressive dog Mar 2018 #36

That's my question, as well gratuitous Mar 2018 #53

Well said Progressive dog Mar 2018 #62

They're the winners... lame54 Mar 2018 #37

On a personal level I agree. We can do what we want. jalan48 Mar 2018 #38

You cant fix stupid. Or evil. kairos12 Mar 2018 #40

There is absolutely no way sagetea Mar 2018 #41

Those who love that he's shaking things up do so because.......... MRDAWG Mar 2018 #42

Bookmarked and thanks for your words. yonder Mar 2018 #43

they are a waste of time Angry Dragon Mar 2018 #45

I agree! leftofcool Mar 2018 #46

Not One More Minute DownFromTheMountain Mar 2018 #47

I tried to reach out to the them in the GC & RKBA sub forum and that didn't work out well ffr Mar 2018 #48

If they even cared one rip about the fact that their party is destroying the country my onecaliberal Mar 2018 #49

Yep. I would rather make sure minorities can vote and we're upholding our Constitutional values ck4829 Mar 2018 #51

The thing that made this crystal clear to me is they supported a fucking child molester rather than onecaliberal Mar 2018 #91

Oh yes. Wake up call to me too. ck4829 Mar 2018 #92

Not a Party The Wizard Mar 2018 #119

Woohoo! I love this righteous rant.Straight and to the point. brush Mar 2018 #50

There is a difference between people who ... Whiskeytide Mar 2018 #54

Your mistake is that you equate "they" with "all of them." LAS14 Mar 2018 #55

They'll have to hit rock bottom. Turbineguy Mar 2018 #56

And Mussolini made the trains run on time. BobTheSubgenius Mar 2018 #58

Living in rural Missouri Kurt V. Mar 2018 #63

Excellent post. I hate his supporters more than him amuse bouche Mar 2018 #65

It Texas, the Texas Democratic Party focused on winning east Texas for too long Gothmog Mar 2018 #71

Excellent example dalton99a Mar 2018 #84

Going after white voters is a waste of time and resources Gothmog Mar 2018 #116

Huh? whathehell Mar 2018 #173

In Texas we wasted a ton of time and money going after trump voters in East Texas Gothmog Mar 2018 #176

Okay, but that's a small subset ... When talking about "white people" whathehell Mar 2018 #180

I choose a different path 2left4u Mar 2018 #72

And how did that work out for him? lunatica Mar 2018 #86

A man is but a product of his thoughts. What he thinks he becomes. 2left4u Mar 2018 #94

fuck all republicans and specially trump supporters gopiscrap Mar 2018 #73

There are more of us then there are them, so fuck them. world wide wally Mar 2018 #75

When I grew up these were the people lunatica Mar 2018 #79

Thank You. n/t Mister Ed Mar 2018 #81

Hear Hear Leith Mar 2018 #82

I don't think I can reach out...they make me feel all yucky inside when I hear them talk C Moon Mar 2018 #85

I wouldn't spend two seconds reaching out grumpyduck Mar 2018 #88

In other words, if people don't agree with you, they are wrong mythology Mar 2018 #93

+1,000,000 - well said - n/t Locrian Mar 2018 #95

Division 2left4u Mar 2018 #106

Hits the nail on the head hueymahl Mar 2018 #118

Thanks for this post! nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #114

You nailed it. stranger81 Mar 2018 #177

Sorry too extreme of a position for me askyagerz Mar 2018 #97

Thanks for this post! nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #112

DU rec... SidDithers Mar 2018 #99

:-) EffieBlack Mar 2018 #121

At my age The Wizard Mar 2018 #103

People in DU are suggesting we reach out to dumpsters? ailsagirl Mar 2018 #107

It's unbelievable, but true lunamagica Mar 2018 #156

Another one of these? melman Mar 2018 #111

Dems have been winning a lot of Trump districts lately IronLionZion Mar 2018 #117

Not all people who voted for Trump are cut from the same cloth Martin Eden Mar 2018 #122

They voted for a clear bigota sexist and a racist. ismnotwasm Mar 2018 #127

I know some people who voted for Obama twice, then Trump. Martin Eden Mar 2018 #134

Voting for Obama does NOT preclude one from being a racist ismnotwasm Mar 2018 #137

What I object to is soft-pedaling racism, sexism and bigotry. Martin Eden Mar 2018 #160

Thanks! nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #132

+1 progressoid Mar 2018 #170

Great post, Effie! I agree completely! Time is precious, and should not be wasted on people lunamagica Mar 2018 #124

There is absolutely no reason why you should have to do either. Tom Rinaldo Mar 2018 #125

We can forget them as long radical noodle Mar 2018 #129

Your very premise is wrong, but hey, don't let that stop the Two Minute Hate jerk-fest. Decoy of Fenris Mar 2018 #130

Thanks to you and to all that have taken the time to respond carefully... LAS14 Mar 2018 #131

Always a pleasure. Here's hoping we can maintain that edge. This place has me wondering some days nt Decoy of Fenris Mar 2018 #133

Well said 2left4u Mar 2018 #150

Can win midterms by resisting voter suppression ck4829 Mar 2018 #151

We just won an election in a swing district where health care was the most important issue BeyondGeography Mar 2018 #152

Yep 2left4u Mar 2018 #154

"Not everyone's life revolves around race." BumRushDaShow Mar 2018 #172

Well said, EB. I am increasingly suspicious of the "Make Nice With Trumpsters" threads on DU. Paladin Mar 2018 #136

You hit the nail on the head. Sadly, we can't even discuss or question them without lunamagica Mar 2018 #141

(1) Dilution of energy and focus, (2) Reconciliation, (3) Ideological accommodation dalton99a Mar 2018 #146

Hmmm 2left4u Mar 2018 #147

What someone has said (You, 2left4u, I think) is that... LAS14 Mar 2018 #163

Yes 2left4u Mar 2018 #165

+1 BlueWI Mar 2018 #186

Baloney, baloney, baloney!!!! LAS14 Mar 2018 #164

Thank you EffieBlack. sheshe2 Mar 2018 #144

Or let me put it more simply gay texan Mar 2018 #159

so what's the solution? Locrian Mar 2018 #161

Exactly! Thanks for this. nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #162

I love how you jump around my threads cheerleading and encouraging everyone who EffieBlack Mar 2018 #166

Yes, I am invested in my mission to keep the flag of intelligence flying among progressives. nt LAS14 Mar 2018 #167

Yes, I'm sure that's what it is ... EffieBlack Mar 2018 #168

*They* are the problem, *They* ARE that division you mention ck4829 Mar 2018 #181

Break it down to the DNC. whathehell Mar 2018 #171

I understand Trump voters all too well. Ill do my reaching out to Millenials and minority voters. argyl Mar 2018 #175

Except for the ones that voted for Obama twice 2left4u Mar 2018 #178

Actually, anyone who voted for Obama twice and then voted for Trump is confused EffieBlack Mar 2018 #184

I agree with you on that...confused is being polite 2left4u Mar 2018 #236

Thats a rare breed in my experience. The one thing they wouldnt call Obama is Mr. President. argyl Mar 2018 #195

This message was self-deleted by its author goldenheart Mar 2018 #179

How do the Democrats appeal to voters who want great wealth and power over others? And why would we EffieBlack Mar 2018 #185

Forget It goldenheart Mar 2018 #194

Not much flesh left on this dead horse..... Glamrock Mar 2018 #187

So true, but still... BlueWI Mar 2018 #197

if you vote for a racist, you ARE a racist Skittles Mar 2018 #190

I don't think voting for a racist necessarily makes one a racist ... EffieBlack Mar 2018 #193

My favorite - "He's pissing the Liberals off. That's all I care about!" Oneironaut Mar 2018 #199

The built in destruct mechanism for liberalism is tolerance for people who would murder them Abu Pepe Mar 2018 #200

Yup. Antidemocratic ideologies, world views and symbols are NOT free speech. There's a terrible cost FreepFryer Mar 2018 #202

Snd yet, no. I cant go for banning any speech or symbol. Abu Pepe Mar 2018 #204

A ban isn't the core of the issue. FreepFryer Mar 2018 #205

Shame works, usually better than anything among homo sapiens Abu Pepe Mar 2018 #206

As we have seen, not everyone is susceptible to shame. Denazification works too. (n/t) FreepFryer Mar 2018 #207

Once they are de-Nazified, we can look to understand and help them recover from their actions. (n/t) FreepFryer Mar 2018 #201

Trump supporters are traitors to our Democracy! BlueJac Mar 2018 #211

There are "Trump supporters" and there are those who voted for Trump in ignorance Nitram Mar 2018 #213

I have been making this point constantly - but some insist on mischaracterizing what I've said EffieBlack Mar 2018 #219

Exactly. If we lump them all together, we will lose elections. Nitram Mar 2018 #220

I dont lump them together definitionally, but they need to sort themselves out EffieBlack Mar 2018 #223

Ye will judge them by their actions. A bunch of ex-Trump voters just voted for a Democrat in Nitram Mar 2018 #224

Ding! Ding! Ding! EffieBlack Mar 2018 #229

Some are purists and have a thing about being "more liberal than thou." Nitram Mar 2018 #244

It's all about our message 2left4u Mar 2018 #238

Not about name-calling - but we should call them out for their behavior. Pretending that voting for EffieBlack Mar 2018 #240

I agree 2left4u Mar 2018 #242

Nobody is saying "voting for Trump was an innocent mistake." We are saying Democrats are welcome Nitram Mar 2018 #243

Did some DUers get tired of winning? IronLionZion Mar 2018 #214

They view "Liberal" as evil Cary Mar 2018 #215

I get the "I've chosen to overlook" his sexism and sexual assault of women mcar Mar 2018 #221

And some of these are the same people who claim they voted for Obama but soured on him because they EffieBlack Mar 2018 #228

Well said, Effie. brer cat Mar 2018 #222

People are still sawing that log? tazkcmo Mar 2018 #251

I have my own ideas. What do you think? EffieBlack Mar 2018 #252

Everyone needs a hobby tazkcmo Mar 2018 #254