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karynnj

(61,102 posts)
23. Thanks for posting this, but everyone will likely continue to see it through a lens of 2016
Fri Apr 6, 2018, 09:43 AM
Apr 2018

The paragraph that was extracted is exactly what one would expect from anyone who is on the very progressive/ anti trade deals would say. Consider it as the mirror image of the 1990s/2000s DLC comment that the Democratic Party needed to change its message from the union/liberal driven message of the then "old" party that lost many races in the 1980s. The comment that OBama won due to his charisma, not the establishment policy he ran on -- could be balanced by saying (in retrospect) that Bill Clinton won because of his charisma - not the shift in what the Democratic platform was.

I think in both cases, that should have been the start of a discussion - not a war and certainly not a call that saying it insulted anyone or calling anyone as not in the Democratic tent.

In both cases, splitting the party primarillarly on trade policy, where they do differ, ignores that on most issues - including most that are most personal and most important to most people, the policies pushed by both parts of the Democratic party are the same. Both are for providing affordable access to healthcare, education (including college), and housing. Both are for a livable wage. Both are for a woman's right to choose and sensible gun control.

2016 was even more complicated, because Clinton, a long term establishment politician shifted on trade - even though TPP would have been her biggest accomplishment as Secretary of State. This was a gamble and was likely because she saw that policy as something that most Democrats supported and that it could heal that rift. She might have seen that as needed because on another issue where the party had factions, she opted to take a more hawkish position either Obama or Kerry.

What is really happening now is that the Sanders/Progressive wing of the party wants the conventional wisdom to be that the establishment message failed -- and further, it has failed in past elections other than when a charismatic leader. Implicitly, their message is that the winning platform would be theirs - something for which they have no proof. There are also people, who align with Obama, who think the platform is fine .. but that Clinton was a mediocre candidate. The solution for them is the Obama message with a better candidate. People aligned with Clinton argue that it was extraneous forces, not the candidate or the 2016 platform that led to Trump becoming President.

This is a fight for what the party should be going forward. My own opinion is that it has to be an open enough tent to include everyone who agrees on most issues. I would also note that OBAMA himself accomplished this - even on issues where people - on either side - hoped he would move in their direction.

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I hope everyone here will listen to this postive, inspiring video in which Berni Sophia4 Apr 2018 #1
This video enraged me and made me more certain that Sen. Sanders should not run in 20. Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #13
You find this positive and inspiring? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #18
In this speech, Bernie encouraged people to run for office. Sophia4 Apr 2018 #43
You think the audience needed Bernie Sanders to tell them that people should run for office? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #44
Unfortunately, there are many here who are incapable of seeing / hearing RandomAccess Apr 2018 #35
Thank you so much Raine Apr 2018 #2
K&R diva77 Apr 2018 #3
i read some & i was huh? sounded good to me. now more good. pansypoo53219 Apr 2018 #4
Nonsense, they gained seats because of racism,Republican propaganda and njhoneybadger Apr 2018 #5
CORRECT Skittles Apr 2018 #6
and supressing voting eShirl Apr 2018 #7
Racism, GOP propaganda, gerrymandering, and voter suppression still exist. progressoid Apr 2018 #9
Thanks to an overwhelming dislike of Trump and the gerrymander has weakened as shown Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #12
"and the gerrymander has weakened" -- in most places the lines for districts have not changed karynnj Apr 2018 #17
I think you're mistaken about the old PA districts being in place. sl8 Apr 2018 #24
We're saying the same thing. karynnj Apr 2018 #27
Which supports what Sanders said at 1:50 in the video. progressoid Apr 2018 #20
Exactly Adrahil Apr 2018 #10
+1, don't forget voter suppression uponit7771 Apr 2018 #36
K&R DLevine Apr 2018 #8
There is nothing inspiring about trashing Pres. Obama, the Democratic Party and Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #11
"Charismatic" "extraordinary" "brilliant" are not trashing words. panader0 Apr 2018 #14
+1 shanny Apr 2018 #28
How do you not see through that vaneer? Adrahil Apr 2018 #33
+1. The CEO of GM is great but GM sucks... How in the hell is that a positive thing ?! uponit7771 Apr 2018 #38
The contrasting but after is though uponit7771 Apr 2018 #37
It is what I call a back handed compliment...soft racism...Obama just wasn't good enough oh sure Demsrule86 Apr 2018 #42
I have no animus toward him but I am tired of him. DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2018 #16
Calling him an empty suit as head of a party that has been "A failure" for 15 years ehrnst Apr 2018 #26
+1, this is some gas lighting aint it !? The CEO of GM is great but GM sucks isn't a compliment uponit7771 Apr 2018 #40
The RawStory article was absolute shit... NCTraveler Apr 2018 #15
K&R.. disillusioned73 Apr 2018 #19
K & R and thank you. mountain grammy Apr 2018 #21
+1 progressoid Apr 2018 #22
Thanks for posting this, but everyone will likely continue to see it through a lens of 2016 karynnj Apr 2018 #23
He was well received Tom Rinaldo Apr 2018 #25
Well said, thank you. nt shanny Apr 2018 #29
Well said. However, progressoid Apr 2018 #30
Oh it will still be here.... vi5 Apr 2018 #32
Good god, thank you for that.... vi5 Apr 2018 #31
+1 leftstreet Apr 2018 #34
In a vacuum your right, this is ... NOT ... a vacuum and many on this site are not LIVs. uponit7771 Apr 2018 #39
Thank you. My god these same tired roundabouts are fucking lame Arazi Apr 2018 #41
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