General Discussion

EffieBlack

(14,249 posts)

75. I can't believe anyone actually has to explain this to you

Mon Apr 9, 2018, 04:33 PM

Apr 2018

And I also can't believe that I'm taking the time to do it, but here goes.

Please read the following two excerpts from my two different OPs.

One of these things is not like the other. Can you tell us why they're different and why that matters?

1.

"He's smart and nice, but he just doesn't have what it takes"
"She's really sweet and everyone likes her, but she just isn't fitting in"
"He has a great personality, but I'm just not sure he can do the job."
"Sure he's a good talker, but ..."
"You can't deny his charisma, but he's not ..."
"He may be a nice guy, BUT he's just not competent ..."

"Let me preface this by saying this is in no way an attack on - or even a criticism of - Bernie Sanders or a diminishment of his civil rights activism in the 1960s or an effort to 'refight the primaries.' But all too frequently, any attempt to question or, God forbid, criticize, Sanders' record, attitudes or comments on civil rights today is met with a reminder that he was arrested while protesting for civil rights in 1963, often with an accompanying photograph and sarcastic comments such as 'Here's a picture of Bernie hating black people,' or similarly snide remarks."

"Bernie Sanders' participation was admirable and laudable and appreciated. But he did not get involved or make the kinds of sacrifices that many other students made. "

"He could have stayed in his comfy dorm room, but he went out, inconvenienced himself, and lent himself to the fight."

"He was on the right side of history. But people should recognize that participating in a righteous fight in the past does not, in and of itself, completely define a person for all time."

"For me, the bottom line is that Bernie Sanders did the right thing in 1963. I give him a lot of credit for that. But that credit is not unlimited and it definitely isn't a bottomless store of goodwill that shields him from any responsibility for or scrutiny of his subsequent actions, positions, views, or comments today."

"I appreciate what he did, but I don't OWE him anything, including reverent acceptance of whatever he says or does, for it."

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Highlight:

Why "Bernie was arrested in '63" is an inappropriate answer to criticism of his civil rights record [View all] EffieBlack Apr 2018 OP

This should be fun..... brooklynite Apr 2018 #1

I don't understand why Sanders has so much realty on here trixie2 Apr 2018 #71

Excellent Read Me. Apr 2018 #2

"He was a small part of something very important. He did the right thing." mcar Apr 2018 #3

K&R Gothmog Apr 2018 #4

Wow! You really beat the crap out of that strawman! Billy Jingo Apr 2018 #5

... LexVegas Apr 2018 #17

How wonderfully mature of a response. Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2018 #24

That's the latest thing here. chwaliszewski Apr 2018 #36

That was not a strawman. Caliman73 Apr 2018 #88

Very well said. Orsino Apr 2018 #6

Hillary was a high school student still living with her Republican parents pnwmom Apr 2018 #29

Hillary doesn't need to be defended for Goldwatering. Orsino Apr 2018 #34

She shouldnt have to be but she is BASHED constantly EVERYWHERE about that Eliot Rosewater Apr 2018 #81

Agreed. At this point, it's ancient history. DinahMoeHum Apr 2018 #7

What has anyone in the Democratic party been doing lately? progressoid Apr 2018 #43

Great question.. mountain grammy Apr 2018 #63

The answer for sure. hahaha!! InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2018 #133

I notice there is no response to your question sammythecat Apr 2018 #123

I notice you had no response to my response to the question EffieBlack Apr 2018 #125

Because his question was factually un-informed emulatorloo Apr 2018 #129

Your question isn't pertinent to the point of my OP EffieBlack Apr 2018 #124

Big fail. You got your ass handed to you above. And Bernie doesnt need your kind of help emulatorloo Apr 2018 #128

Another outstanding post all american girl Apr 2018 #8

Very good BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #9

Of course EffieBlack Apr 2018 #20

The civil rights movement was not a gift to black people. It wasn't a movement in which white people Exotica Apr 2018 #10

Outstanding post, Effie. (Thank you!) NurseJackie Apr 2018 #11

Thank you mia Apr 2018 #12

K&R sheshe2 Apr 2018 #13

K&R. Thank you for the work you do here. You shouldn't have to but I appreciate it. WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2018 #14

Thanks EffieBlack Apr 2018 #22

TRUTH WhiskeyGrinder Apr 2018 #42

I may have to ratio this on my forehead grantcart Apr 2018 #46

Thank you, Effie. kstewart33 Apr 2018 #15

Another important post. Thank you. yardwork Apr 2018 #16

Good Post, but you are triggering those with BDS* hueymahl Apr 2018 #18

I've always heard that anytime you place a "BUT" after your Ferrets are Cool Apr 2018 #19

Post removed Post removed Apr 2018 #21

Or the reverse PJMcK Apr 2018 #25

GOT Jon Snow: "Father always said everything before the word 'but' is horseshit.' AtomicKitten Apr 2018 #69

LOL yes, you are so right. My bad. Ferrets are Cool Apr 2018 #104

No bad, Ferrets PJMcK Apr 2018 #105

That story is hilarious. TY for sharing it. Ferrets are Cool Apr 2018 #107

One may safely presume 'however', 'although' and 'yet' also used to express this alleged negation LanternWaste Apr 2018 #27

Wrong. It's the opposite, actually. nt pnwmom Apr 2018 #30

Because actually addressing the points in my OP is just too difficult? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #31

Hrmmm...where'd ya read that. TCJ70 Apr 2018 #68

I'm so glad you're reading my posts! EffieBlack Apr 2018 #70

I can't believe anyone actually has to explain this to you EffieBlack Apr 2018 #75

It can be far more subtle than that treestar Apr 2018 #82

Message auto-removed Name removed Apr 2018 #101

I think it tends to negate what came before the but. David__77 Apr 2018 #151

Here is something from 1964 that was prescient BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #23

27 years in congress, NAACP 100% approval 27 times jg10003 Apr 2018 #26

That's nice EffieBlack Apr 2018 #28

Good read, thank you. Brogrizzly Apr 2018 #33

LOL! EffieBlack Apr 2018 #35

Wow how similar themes to a recent photo op disaster, guns I think? Brogrizzly Apr 2018 #39

"he was screaming and yelling on the floor of the House but the chamber was usually empty" BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #41

My (D) Senator Bob Casey BumRushDaShow Apr 2018 #32

Well said. Thanks. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #37

K&R brer cat Apr 2018 #38

Thank you! n/t pnwmom Apr 2018 #40

If it is not a bash-Sanders thread, why start it at all? Save a post like this for a reply Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #44

How is this a "bash Sanders thread?" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #45

You scratch an open wound UNnecessarily, keeping it festering without healing. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #47

So, it's NOT a "bash Sanders" thread, then but "scratches an open wound?" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #48

Call it that if you prefer, because it does that. It was UNnecessary to start a THREAD. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #51

Perhaps you'd like to join THIS thread, which occurred BEFORE my OP, and admonish folk not to EffieBlack Apr 2018 #53

That backhanded argument is not you at your best. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #78

Thank you for your "feedback." EffieBlack Apr 2018 #80

You're not the boss.. I'm glad Effie Black post as she Cha Apr 2018 #97

It's known as "vetting" a potential candidate, something that is finally being done here on DU George II Apr 2018 #66

Vetting is great. Opening this thread out of context is not the best way to do that, I feel. . nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #79

How can an OP be "out of context"? It is it's own context. George II Apr 2018 #83

Apparently, some topics are only to be discussed in "quiet rooms" nt EffieBlack Apr 2018 #84

Nonsense. Nothing I wrote implies that. I even encouraged you to use it as a reply multiple times. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #86

"Quiet Rooms" buried in various random threads in response to various random posts EffieBlack Apr 2018 #90

Of course. I feel that creating a context like that was unnecessary for what is a "response". Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #85

When all else fails.. Cha Apr 2018 #118

Indeed. Nt EffieBlack Apr 2018 #119

+1000 nt Plucketeer Apr 2018 #49

Oh, and thanks for your advice on where and how I should communicate on DU EffieBlack Apr 2018 #52

If we can't give each other feedback, we lose a way to improve. You can reply to POST you mention. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #58

I posted it in another reply to you, but here it is again EffieBlack Apr 2018 #61

Purism in feedback & instruction is impractical. As if your post there didn't "instruct". & OP here. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #72

Just alert on the thread and be done with. Or else simply trash the thread emulatorloo Apr 2018 #132

Don't tell Effie how to post. Cha Apr 2018 #96

Perhaps we should hope you take your own advice about telling people how to post. . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2018 #98

Oh right.. just keep it up then, if you so desire Cha Apr 2018 #100

Heh. Thanx coach The Polack MSgt Apr 2018 #108

I certainly do. nt EffieBlack Apr 2018 #116

Of course that's true. But what's the point? Tom Rinaldo Apr 2018 #50

I find it hard to believe you missed the point. But let me explain it again EffieBlack Apr 2018 #56

I got that point Tom Rinaldo Apr 2018 #92

My post does not "make Bernie Sanders a daily topic of negative discussion" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #94

In all of these types of threads, I fail to see what terrible things Bernie has done IronLionZion Apr 2018 #54

Either you didn't read my OP or you're being ridiculous on purpose. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #59

What's your purpose? IronLionZion Apr 2018 #65

I explicitly stated it in my OP EffieBlack Apr 2018 #67

I dont know if its inappropriate. I dont find it especially pertinent. David__77 Apr 2018 #55

Then please feel free to ignore it if it's not pertinent to you EffieBlack Apr 2018 #57

I referred to the reference to past participation in demonstrations. David__77 Apr 2018 #60

Got it. I misunderstood you. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #62

No problem at all! David__77 Apr 2018 #64

Bash, bash, bash... mudstump Apr 2018 #73

Where in my post did I "bash Bernie?" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #77

If you have to start your post with... mudstump Apr 2018 #74

Not at all - I have to preface my post with such verbiage to try to prevent the alert-mongers and EffieBlack Apr 2018 #76

Or not. Caliman73 Apr 2018 #93

right.. No one must have any criticism of BS at Cha Apr 2018 #99

What can you do, Cha? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #103

Nothing will satisfy Cha Apr 2018 #106

Oh, well ... EffieBlack Apr 2018 #109

K&R betsuni Apr 2018 #87

Awesome post, Effie. greatauntoftriplets Apr 2018 #89

Another great post. Effie. lunamagica Apr 2018 #91

Thank you, Effie Black Cha Apr 2018 #95

Imagine that Hillary Clinton took a year of attending Wellesley to work to desegregate karynnj Apr 2018 #102

Imagine supporting Bernie without engaging in Trumpian Whataboutisms n/t emulatorloo Apr 2018 #130

I am not supporting Bernie karynnj Apr 2018 #136

It is Trumpian because Trump answers all criticisms with but What About Hillary? emulatorloo Apr 2018 #138

You miss I praised HRC, unlike Trump, who never does karynnj Apr 2018 #142

Did you actually read the OP? EffieBlack Apr 2018 #139

Your condescension is obvious and I refuse to play your game karynnj Apr 2018 #141

In other words, you made a claim about me you can't back up. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #144

No anyone reading your repeated attacks stating that I karynnj Apr 2018 #147

"Sanders really did put himself on the line far more than almost any white politician I have read of EffieBlack Apr 2018 #137

You are incredidably articulate, therefore I assume karynnj Apr 2018 #140

"What he did was far more than an average liberal white man or woman in that time frame did" EffieBlack Apr 2018 #143

Again, i said white liberal POLITICIANS karynnj Apr 2018 #145

No, that's NOT what you said. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #146

It is exactly what I said in post 102 karynnj Apr 2018 #148

I wasn't responding to Post 102. I was responding to the post I responded to EffieBlack Apr 2018 #149

However that is not true karynnj Apr 2018 #150

I don't care that the Black Community Jspur Apr 2018 #110

That's on you.. I do care. It's not that Cha Apr 2018 #111

That, along with his certainty that his meager record entitles him to gratitude, EffieBlack Apr 2018 #112

Exactly, Effie Cha Apr 2018 #114

Elaborate on Jspur Apr 2018 #115

Two Wrongs don't make it right.. I care about the Native Amercians Cha Apr 2018 #117

And he and his supporters claim mcar Apr 2018 #120

Not just happy, but grateful and - unless we're offering praise and thanks - silent. EffieBlack Apr 2018 #127

Empathy is the ability to understand he feelings of others EffieBlack Apr 2018 #122

fair points. nt JCanete Apr 2018 #113

The way a photo of Sanders was thrown at me yesterday as some great point. NCTraveler Apr 2018 #121

That's why I wrote the OP EffieBlack Apr 2018 #126

Excellent post. It's relevant to more people than just Bernie MaryMagdaline Apr 2018 #131

Thank you for getting it and for explaining it so well EffieBlack Apr 2018 #134

Thank you. I think PropaneJane knocked some sense into me MaryMagdaline Apr 2018 #135