General Discussion

Qutzupalotl

(15,820 posts)

108. You seem to be stuck on the idea that impeachment means a Trump win.

Mon Dec 10, 2018, 05:56 PM

Dec 2018

That assumes facts not in evidence. You are probably basing this on Clinton’s impeachment, but he had the support of the public going in. That one actually was a witch hunt.

Trump has been denying everything about the investigation and his numbers are tanking. He’s now near 60% disapproval, and that’s likely to rise a lot more. For him to point to a Senate not convicting him after impeachment would only enrage the public.

The Mueller report will be entirely separate from Congressional investigations and presumably provide a basis for impeachment; it does not exist yet. We don’t know all the crimes that will be uncovered.

Mueller’s authority to prosecute includes any member of Congress. As just one example, we know that the Republican National Committee conspired to launder Russian money through the NRA into Republican campaigns. Anyone who did so knowingly is in trouble. Fewer Republicans left standing means a lower bar, and possibly even Democratic control of the Senate.

So it’s too early to say a) we won’t have the votes to convict next year, even though that is true today; and b) failure to convict will guarantee a Trump victory in 2020. The public will know a LOT more in 2020 than we know today.

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What 20 (or more) GOP Senators will vote to remove Trump from office? [View all] Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 OP

Groan. OnDoutside Dec 2018 #1

Yes Reality makes some groan. nt Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #2

How about you lead off with your list ? Y'know, pour encouragez les autres. OnDoutside Dec 2018 #3

...s'il vous plait. jberryhill Dec 2018 #6

Et apres, moelleaux au chocolat....yum OnDoutside Dec 2018 #8

That's the point. Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #7

Not "who they are" but "who they will turn out to be" jberryhill Dec 2018 #12

And you really think there are 20 Republicans who Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #14

When the time comes, it won't even require integrity jberryhill Dec 2018 #15

Dude, you've got a fucked up dog! nt Codeine Dec 2018 #22

Yeah, but... jberryhill Dec 2018 #27

Fear? Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #32

I have no possible candidates but I imagine it would take ones who are intelligent enough to see the alwaysinasnit Dec 2018 #4

This is my problem as well. Can't think of one GOPer that fits the bill, today. susanna Dec 2018 #120

Thanks for posting the link. I will check it out. alwaysinasnit Dec 2018 #125

Zero of them. Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #5

With out 67 votes in the Senate it is a useless exercise Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #9

No it would not be useless. Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #47

With out a conviction Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #48

Nope. The evidence would be public. Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #49

That doesn't require an impeachment dansolo Dec 2018 #52

Regular hearings can be obstructed. Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #57

And a GOP majority in the Senate can Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #58

No - an impeachment investigation in the House Voltaire2 Dec 2018 #75

Yes have hearings in the House for the next year Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #82

You're absolutely right on this. Impeachment should be the 1st order of business. InAbLuEsTaTe Dec 2018 #110

Why would he win? treestar Dec 2018 #51

Yes Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #59

but won't the Dems be called weak treestar Dec 2018 #71

By whom? Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #74

If it's to happen, it will involve at-risk Senators up for re-election . . . Journeyman Dec 2018 #10

There are only 21 GOP Senators up for re-election in 2020 Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #13

And how many up in 2022, who will be looking beyond the 2020 election? . . . Journeyman Dec 2018 #20

By 22 it will be forgotten. Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #34

Get them on the record. Let them try to defend their acquittal votes. scheming daemons Dec 2018 #80

And what good is that if Trump wins re-election Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #83

Totally clears the President. Thank you! XRubicon Dec 2018 #11

Arlen Specter, Howard Baker, Pete Dominici, Jim Jeffords Bleacher Creature Dec 2018 #16

Metzenbaum was not a Republican Polybius Dec 2018 #30

Sorry, you're right. I was thinking Baker and wrote Metzenbaum. Bleacher Creature Dec 2018 #31

No problem Polybius Dec 2018 #33

Good one. Bleacher Creature Dec 2018 #39

Let's Face It, There Aren't 20 Republican Senators with the Ethics to Vote for Impeachment dlk Dec 2018 #17

Almost all GOPers will encourage trump to resign when trump supporters Hoyt Dec 2018 #18

Yes that's the key FakeNoose Dec 2018 #100

I'll start Sedona Dec 2018 #19

Kennedy is another possibe vote. Even someone like Ernst. It really comes down to the evidence... Tom Rinaldo Dec 2018 #29

Joni enid602 Dec 2018 #37

Not terribly familiar with Kennedy TheFarseer Dec 2018 #63

Based on what? Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #35

Just my hunch, nothing more. Sedona Dec 2018 #38

Just getting 10 Republicans will make Trump look bad and other Republicans look like they are puttin Quixote1818 Dec 2018 #44

could pence cast a deciding vote to make himself president, Liberty Belle Dec 2018 #55

If there is real evidence of Sgent Dec 2018 #64

Impeachment is not a useless exercise. strongermessage Dec 2018 #21

+1000. Plus, it allows for investigations, hearings, testimony, and unearthing 45's business secrets lindysalsagal Dec 2018 #23

It is.... Xolodno Dec 2018 #106

if the evidence is tight enough the vote to remove will be in the 80s 0rganism Dec 2018 #24

You really think GOP Senators has that much integrity? Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #36

don't know if i'd call it "integrity", per se 0rganism Dec 2018 #41

The evidence about climate change is increasingly irrefutable Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #42

"they" are a fading minority segment of the population 0rganism Dec 2018 #45

They still control the Senate Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #46

Zero as of today. No sense to predict a what if scenario beachbum bob Dec 2018 #25

Lamar Alexander- he's very old and likely not running- plus he's in Howard Baker's seat redstateblues Dec 2018 #26

So here is how it could work. Algernon Moncrieff Dec 2018 #28

None of them. roamer65 Dec 2018 #40

Susan Collins - on twenty COLGATE4 Dec 2018 #43

IMO this skips over the fact that by the end of the hearings treestar Dec 2018 #50

You're making the assumption Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #60

why not? treestar Dec 2018 #69

If they had any integrity or honor Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #73

Because if they did Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #113

This doesn't require any integrity YessirAtsaFact Dec 2018 #109

Your making the assumption that Sgent Dec 2018 #65

Good point Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #68

Wouldn't there be tremendous pressure on him? treestar Dec 2018 #70

Maybe The OP Author's Question is Premature - Maybe There are More Important Questions to Start With DDySiegs Dec 2018 #53

You put too much faith in Republicans Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #61

Impeachment is a pointless exercise, no way the senate will convict. JustABozoOnThisBus Dec 2018 #54

Exactly Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #62

Could not disagree with you more hueymahl Dec 2018 #89

How many will be indicted for their crimes? That's an unknown. shraby Dec 2018 #56

Susan Collins will express concern Retrograde Dec 2018 #66

They will take that dare Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #67

They won't remove him, I honestly think we'll be stuck with him until 2020. Luciferous Dec 2018 #72

Irrelevant, fatalistic question hueymahl Dec 2018 #76

There will never be 20 GOP votes in the Senate. Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #84

Doesn't matter hueymahl Dec 2018 #87

The point is Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #90

And that is where you and I disagree hueymahl Dec 2018 #93

It is useless Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #95

Like I said, that is where we disagree hueymahl Dec 2018 #96

It will Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #98

You seem to be stuck on the idea that impeachment means a Trump win. Qutzupalotl Dec 2018 #108

No I'm basing on the actions and additudes of GOP Senators Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #112

We should definitely wait for Mueller to report or finish Qutzupalotl Dec 2018 #116

No it enrages the left Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #117

That depends on what Mueller finds, doesn't it? Qutzupalotl Dec 2018 #118

Maybe Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #119

I didn't say everyone, and we don't need everyone. Qutzupalotl Dec 2018 #121

True Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #122

True, and I'm not. Qutzupalotl Dec 2018 #123

Wait for the Mueller Report. They can avoid taking this seriously until then. PubliusEnigma Dec 2018 #77

The 1st 20 who don't want this jammed up their nose: Ponietz Dec 2018 #78

Do you really think they care? Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #85

Perhaps a couple but, on the whole, I think they are rats infected with greed and hate. Ponietz Dec 2018 #99

I agree Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #104

22 Republican Senators are up or re-election in 2020. Get them on the record. scheming daemons Dec 2018 #79

Most are in deep red states Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #86

We thought Arizona was a deep red state a few short years ago. scheming daemons Dec 2018 #92

But not all Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #94

What is the relevant point of asking for prophecy? Thanks. LanternWaste Dec 2018 #81

LOL hueymahl Dec 2018 #88

The point is Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #91

The Ambitious, the Pontificant, or Both JCMach1 Dec 2018 #97

And the rationale Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #102

Ambition cleans even the brownest of noses JCMach1 Dec 2018 #111

Maybe Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #114

0% orangecrush Dec 2018 #101

You will need 21, Joe Manchin won't vote for it. nt doc03 Dec 2018 #103

Good point Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #105

It will be closer to +40 aeromanKC Dec 2018 #107

In a perfect world yes Trumpocalypse Dec 2018 #115

It's not going to happen until more comes out during 2019 NewJeffCT Dec 2018 #124

Currently, none. WeekiWater Dec 2018 #126