General Discussion

Jarqui

(10,798 posts)

183. Another really, really silly strawman

Sun Feb 10, 2019, 07:56 PM

Feb 2019

Most rational people can distinguish between the simplicity of assessing two alleged similar sexual assaults by a Lt Gov in a state legislature - when there is not a fruitful criminal court alternative due to lack of evidence - and the complexity of what has gone on with Trump that goes beyond our borders and spans a wide spectrum of crimes, jurisdictions, people, companies, financial institutions and countries.

As well, a bunch of the corruption and perpetrators/co-conspirators/aides/obstructers for the Trump crimes appear to have been committed by members of the very House and Senate you propose to pass judgment on these crimes. Again, very different circumstances from simple sexual assault allegations in VA - differences that even the simple minded can grasp.

As I've outlined in detail, these alleged sexual assault victims in VA (MA/NC) do not have the evidence to obtain a criminal conviction to the standard of "beyond reasonable doubt" against Fairfax. Unlike these simple alleged sexual assaults in VA, as Mueller has proven again and again, there is sufficient evidence to prosecute those he has indicted and received guilty pleas from to the standard of "beyond reasonable doubt". And again, even the simple minded can distinguish the differences here.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

202 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Justin Fairfax is not being Franken'd [View all] boston bean Feb 2019 OP

Look where Kavenaugh is now..... FarPoint Feb 2019 #1

And Fairfax and Kavanaugh should BOTH be impeached sharedvalues Feb 2019 #6

I say ....when Kavenaugh is impeached.... FarPoint Feb 2019 #11

Exactly, it's okay that we might have a rapist as a lt governor at least hughee99 Feb 2019 #13

Yeah, lets get all 'partisan' about rape.. whathehell Feb 2019 #106

Whar are you talking about? FarPoint Feb 2019 #158

They should both be investigated. ooky Feb 2019 #117

Well, yes, because an impeachment is by definition an investigation into PatrickforO Feb 2019 #82

Yeah a rapist on the scotus. Why not one for the governor of Virginia. boston bean Feb 2019 #7

Most acquaintance rapists are bright enough not to leave evidence - OTHER THAN Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #18

I'm saying....take it to Court... FarPoint Feb 2019 #22

So you would rather all of the Cosby victims remained silent? Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #23

I see this current " claim" as a political weapon. . FarPoint Feb 2019 #34

So you are accusing a rape survivor, who happens to be a black, well-educated, college professor Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #43

Unreal isnt it? nt LexVegas Feb 2019 #47

To say I'm picking my jaw up off the floor a lot these days would be an understatement. Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #51

The new thing about the victim lying because its suspicious that she was raped twice. LexVegas Feb 2019 #59

Obviously asserted by people with little understanding of, or experience with, rape. Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #120

You are over thinking this.....You also are confabulating....I didn't say that .. FarPoint Feb 2019 #67

Plus 1 million... Dorian Gray Feb 2019 #115

You are presuming guilt treestar Feb 2019 #186

I am presuming Tyson and Watson are telling the truth - Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #190

An opposite presumption is treestar Feb 2019 #191

Courts alone determine guilt. LanternWaste Feb 2019 #198

That's fine but then it should not lead to treestar Feb 2019 #200

Vanessa Tyson is an African American Democratic scholar and professor. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #75

Excellent credentials for employment.... FarPoint Feb 2019 #78

Are you seriously comparing an African American Democratic feminist scholar and professor DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #80

Only to make a point.... FarPoint Feb 2019 #84

You think that she'd more credible because she's a scholar and professor? Empowerer Feb 2019 #134

I'm saying her background makes it infinitely less likely she is a a Republican plant. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #138

Then you should have left out the African-American professor and scholar part Empowerer Feb 2019 #139

Not just a rank and file Democrat but a young woman who has worked for and campaigned for Democrats. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #140

Then you should have said that instead of describing her race and occupation Empowerer Feb 2019 #142

Is that all part of our backgrounds? DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #143

Her race and occupation doesn't make her any more or less Empowerer Feb 2019 #144

Does it seem she has a great deal to lose by making a false allegation? DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #147

Everyone, regardless their livelihood, has a lot to lose by making a false allegation Empowerer Feb 2019 #150

It does make her more credible for one specific reason... irresistable Feb 2019 #154

As I said, EVERYONE has something to lose when making a false accusation Empowerer Feb 2019 #155

You are the one ASSUMING that I would imagine a less prestigious person less credible. irresistable Feb 2019 #159

Different issue treestar Feb 2019 #188

Fairfax's credentials seem pretty impressive, too! atreides1 Feb 2019 #179

Not evidence of his guilt treestar Feb 2019 #187

But evidence she is an extraordinarily unlikely right wing tool as has been suggested by some. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #189

Courts don't work for long-ago claims Honeycombe8 Feb 2019 #50

So, what I am really saying is... FarPoint Feb 2019 #132

Only if the survivor wants to. Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #135

The fact that "many accusers" describe the court process a certain way Empowerer Feb 2019 #141

You are twisting my words. I never said she shouldn't avail herself of the court process. Ms. Toad Feb 2019 #164

Republicans say the exact same thing about Trump. Calista241 Feb 2019 #146

Fairfax! nt ecstatic Feb 2019 #2

Thank you. boston bean Feb 2019 #3

Good thank you jcgoldie Feb 2019 #4

Agreed. There are two legit accusers, of rape. Very diff fm Franken. sharedvalues Feb 2019 #5

I second your entire post. planetc Feb 2019 #12

Oh, please. If there is no investigation he is bein Frankened. brush Feb 2019 #8

You think that FBI investigation was fair? boston bean Feb 2019 #9

Think about the non-investigation of Franken. brush Feb 2019 #14

Franken resigned. He wasn't denied an investigation. boston bean Feb 2019 #15

Greatly oversimplified lame54 Feb 2019 #19

Thems the facts. boston bean Feb 2019 #20

Partially told lame54 Feb 2019 #21

Says you. boston bean Feb 2019 #25

He was forced out. MicaelS Feb 2019 #24

Umm no. He decided to resign. Amongst many calls for him to do so. But still it was his choice. boston bean Feb 2019 #27

My last heart to you because ... tavernier Feb 2019 #124

Thank you very much for the heart and compliment. n/t MicaelS Feb 2019 #175

You're sounding like a Gillibrand surrogate, all about rushing... brush Feb 2019 #30

Umm. Who is gonna do this investigation. mr faifax's lawyers? boston bean Feb 2019 #38

Slow the hell down. Due process. Ever heard of it? brush Feb 2019 #58

A prosecutor brings a case. Not the victim. boston bean Feb 2019 #66

Are you totally devoid of any knowledge of the justice system? brush Feb 2019 #68

That is patently false. nt LexVegas Feb 2019 #79

What's false? At least follow the thread with whon... brush Feb 2019 #87

Did Dr. Ford file charges? Did you belive her? AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #83

For Gods sake. It's about due process. It's what our system is based on. brush Feb 2019 #88

There's no due process in a He said She said...with so many yrs gone AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #93

Saying there's no due process is frankly, silly. brush Feb 2019 #96

I actually had no idea if I believed Ford until both she and Kavenaugh testified under oath dsc Feb 2019 #123

I ttotally agree... FarPoint Feb 2019 #110

You seem devoid of facts....An accusation is made...maybe an arrest AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #86

Have the accusers file a police report, however it works... brush Feb 2019 #90

Did Dr Ford file? Did you call for due process for Kavenaugh? AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #97

Of course I called for an investigation for Dr. Ford's... brush Feb 2019 #100

he ain't going to jail. boston bean Feb 2019 #102

So..you can't source your call for due process.. AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #103

You dreally think trump didn't limit the FBI investigation? brush Feb 2019 #105

"I called for an investigation in the Dr. Ford case." AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #108

Post removed Post removed Feb 2019 #119

He most certainly did dsc Feb 2019 #125

Yes we did treestar Feb 2019 #192

I'll ask again...Did ANY accuser against shit head Kav file charges? AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #197

In one of these cases, the statute of limitations has not run treestar Feb 2019 #199

She reached out to Rep Bobby Scott in Oct '17.... AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #201

Agreed Mystery sage Feb 2019 #52

In a perfect world all three would go and Northam would appoint his successor before he resigned. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #76

I wish that could happen but the repug hit job is in full effect... brush Feb 2019 #85

How about the Va Dems calling for him to get the Hell out? AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #109

You don't know that just like I don't. brush Feb 2019 #116

Of course not, that doesn't mean repeat the same mistake on a different day uponit7771 Feb 2019 #42

That same mistake is perpetrated on victims of sexual assault on a daily basis. It is not uncommon. boston bean Feb 2019 #46

Which is part of what #metoo is about; due process while taking a persons accusations seriously uponit7771 Feb 2019 #55

There was an avenue for an investigation by the FBI with Kavanaugh. Trump told them to complete a boston bean Feb 2019 #60

Of course, if Fairfax knows such & demands to go down that "avenue" are you down with that? tia uponit7771 Feb 2019 #63

Yeah. I doubt he is down for that though. boston bean Feb 2019 #65

We'll see, BK's reluctance to go down the road of a proper investigation was the empirical evidence uponit7771 Feb 2019 #69

" that doesn't mean erase due process from one side" Empowerer Feb 2019 #113

You think convicting without evidence is fair? wasupaloopa Feb 2019 #72

Who was being convicted? boston bean Feb 2019 #81

Geez what a question. wasupaloopa Feb 2019 #92

Can you answer it? boston bean Feb 2019 #101

This. There is no comparison. While I do support an investigation, these allegations are a Squinch Feb 2019 #10

The same mistake would be Fairfax's also, he should demand an investigation and fairness uponit7771 Feb 2019 #45

Fairfax is a sexual predator as much as Harvey Weinstein. nt LexVegas Feb 2019 #16

Or Bill Cosby who got away with it for decades. Both of them did. boston bean Feb 2019 #17

You don't know that for sure. An investigation can... brush Feb 2019 #32

k&r! n/t halobeam Feb 2019 #26

K&R Kurt V. Feb 2019 #28

And you know that how? Dream Girl Feb 2019 #29

"And you wonder why women don't report." Jarqui Feb 2019 #31

The statute of limitations for rape in Massachusetts has not expires Empowerer Feb 2019 #33

In her MA case, probably due to a lack of evidence Jarqui Feb 2019 #36

The police and prosecutor decide if they have enough evidence to proceed, that's not up to the victi Empowerer Feb 2019 #91

I agree and never suggested otherwise that the police, a prosecutor or Jarqui Feb 2019 #104

Beyond a reasonable doubt is the criminal standard, but not political or public opinion Empowerer Feb 2019 #111

But that is not exclusively the job of the police or prosecutor. Jarqui Feb 2019 #118

A police investigation doesn't need to be a huge CSI undertaking Empowerer Feb 2019 #133

Fairfax has very good lawyers, right? Jarqui Feb 2019 #136

Sound like you think the law enforcement should never bother to investigate most sexal assault cases Empowerer Feb 2019 #137

That's a ridiculous strawman Jarqui Feb 2019 #145

"the Washington Post couldn't even put enough evidence together to print a story" Empowerer Feb 2019 #148

At least one of these women has agreed to testify for impeachment Jarqui Feb 2019 #160

That's good, but none of the politicians conducting the hearings are trained interrogators Empowerer Feb 2019 #168

Nonsense Jarqui Feb 2019 #173

Just because they're lawyers doesn't mean they are trained interrogatoes Empowerer Feb 2019 #174

The combination of them along with their ability Jarqui Feb 2019 #178

Then, based on that, you'd be fine with Trump shutting down Empowerer Feb 2019 #181

Another really, really silly strawman Jarqui Feb 2019 #183

Whatever Empowerer Feb 2019 #193

I said "Time will tell" and it did Jarqui Feb 2019 #194

Hummuna hummuna Empowerer Feb 2019 #195

You should just let this one go... Yuh busted EffieBlack Feb 2019 #196

Look in the mirror Bradshaw3 Feb 2019 #202

Fairfax is now claiming both 'interactions were consensual' Jarqui Feb 2019 #165

I thought the charge indicated peggysue2 Feb 2019 #37

+1000 MustLoveBeagles Feb 2019 #35

How do you know we are talking rape? We need an investigation...but no matter what we deal Demsrule86 Feb 2019 #39

Because we are talking about rape. boston bean Feb 2019 #41

First of all ...that is what being attempted. If the LT general is forced out , the GOP legislature Demsrule86 Feb 2019 #54

Umm. Northam can replace a Fairfax by appointment and Northam resigns the new lt gov becomes g boston bean Feb 2019 #64

#metoo doesn't mean guilt by accusation, even Mueller had some kind of due process uponit7771 Feb 2019 #40

I am sorry. I didn't realize anyone was guilting by association. boston bean Feb 2019 #44

accusation ... a person should be afforded due process. There's no wisdom in receiving half the uponit7771 Feb 2019 #49

You keep saying that..."..his unwillingness to be truthful"..but have yet to show it. AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #89

This is false on its face. BK lied about the sex games ... uponit7771 Feb 2019 #122

seriously dsc Feb 2019 #128

I wasn't aware the FBI had corroberated ANY that in all of his vettings AncientGeezer Feb 2019 #184

This is patently false. CTAtheist Feb 2019 #48

Well.....not quite, IMO. Honeycombe8 Feb 2019 #62

I didn't say identical, I said similar. CTAtheist Feb 2019 #77

Well, no. It's not hearsay... Honeycombe8 Feb 2019 #99

Hearsay CTAtheist Feb 2019 #112

yes and no dsc Feb 2019 #149

What value does that hold? CTAtheist Feb 2019 #161

By showing a few things dsc Feb 2019 #162

Those aren't valuable. CTAtheist Feb 2019 #166

actually the first removes the possibility of her ratfucking him dsc Feb 2019 #167

Again, not true. CTAtheist Feb 2019 #169

that is absurd dsc Feb 2019 #170

Maybe it is. CTAtheist Feb 2019 #171

What is implausible about the accounts of Ms. Tyson and Ms. Watson? DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2019 #177

I was referring to Ms. Tyson CTAtheist Feb 2019 #180

This message was self-deleted by its author Empowerer Feb 2019 #114

The similarity is the rush to judgement and no investigation. ooky Feb 2019 #121

I was skeptical at first only because the Fairfax stuff came out at the same time as the blackface Dopers_Greed Feb 2019 #53

Totally agree Charlotte Little Feb 2019 #56

+1 loyalsister Feb 2019 #98

Sorry, but I'm not going to stop until there's an investigation. kcr Feb 2019 #57

All three of these men should be replaced by scandal free women of substance. Rocky888 Feb 2019 #61

even if all of them were to be white dsc Feb 2019 #127

I never mentioned race and this was meant tongue and cheek without malice for anyone. Rocky888 Feb 2019 #172

I agree with Nancy... LakeArenal Feb 2019 #70

You stop it! Charge him bring evidence or STFU wasupaloopa Feb 2019 #71

If we demand the resignation of any Democratic elected official Mr.Bill Feb 2019 #73

Bullshit... Drunken Irishman Feb 2019 #107

Then let's have due process and an investigation. Mr.Bill Feb 2019 #129

lol Drunken Irishman Feb 2019 #131

If he resigns now, there's no jurisdiction for an investigation UNLESS Empowerer Feb 2019 #151

Just stop. Drunken Irishman Feb 2019 #152

No, I don't think I will. Empowerer Feb 2019 #153

Post removed Post removed Feb 2019 #156

It is totally up to treestar Feb 2019 #185

This message was self-deleted by its author spooky3 Feb 2019 #176

I believe her.... nt Grey Feb 2019 #74

The impeachment process includes an investigation and trial. P. Hope (D-McLean, VA) says he is spooky3 Feb 2019 #94

Right on BB! StarryNite Feb 2019 #95

3-in-line taken out with a 4th repuke left standing?! In a SWING state?! donkeypoofed Feb 2019 #126

He should be investigated. Beakybird Feb 2019 #130

ALL Democrats being forced to resign DirtEdonE Feb 2019 #157

Sorry... Vinnie From Indy Feb 2019 #163

Picking An Unnecessary Fight ProfessorGAC Feb 2019 #182