Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

General Discussion

Showing Original Post only (View all)

H2O Man

(73,548 posts)
Sun Apr 21, 2019, 07:43 PM Apr 2019

The Mueller Report Unplugged [View all]

“There's no right way to do wrong, and no wrong way to do right.”
Smokin' Joe Frazier


I find myself thinking about the simple wisdom of the former heavyweight's saying, that his son Marvis shared with me years ago. In my mind, it applies to two of the issues that are currently on my mind – the terrible behaviors documented in the Mueller Report, and the response of the Democrats in Washington, DC. I'll start by saying that in reading redacted versions of two of the three-part Mueller Report, I am fully aware that I am viewing two of the most important documents in our nation's history. And that it would be a shame if such documents served only to delineate the end of our constitutional democracy.

(Note: the “part three” of the Mueller Report is on the counter-intelligence investigation. It goes to top people in the intelligence community. It will not be made public, and at most, only eight members of the House and Senate will learn a limited amount of what it contains. I will speculate that it includes more damning information on the Russian influence on our 2016 election, and on the Trump mob.)

Now, let's briefly consider what information was revealed in parts one and two of the Mueller Report. Perhaps the most ironic thing is that documents that there was a great deal of “collusion” between Russia and the Trump campaign and transition. Collusion, of course, is not a crime. It was, however, unethical and unpatriotic.

The investigation did not find evidence of conspiracy that reached the level needed for indictments. It did catch a number of Trump people lying about their contacts with Russians and people connected to Russia. The report notes that some were able to destroy records that likely would have been important to the investigation. Most importantly, in my opinion, it showed that direct coordination was avoided by the tried and true tactic of creating a triangle: Russian military intelligence stole e-mails, provided them to Wikileaks, which then made them public, for the Trump campaign's use.

As most have figured out, the best example of using a cut-out (or third party) to conceal the conspiracy relates to Don Jr.'s infamous meeting at the Trump Tower. This was attended by Jared, Manafort, and a collection of Russians, who offered “dirt” on Hillary Clinton. The investigators concluded that Junior and Jared were eager to get the dirt, but too stupid to know they were violating campaign finance law. But Manafort had run campaigns before, and he understood the deal. He sent coded messages on his cell phone, which remain unexplained.

Because Manafort would not cooperate, this obvious link in the chain could not be proven. Hence, he was prosecuted Al Capone style. Junior would later have communications with Wikileaks, and Trump would order a top aide to find out what information would be “dumped” at future dates. And, of course, Roger Stone would have contact with Wikileaks, at very least using another cut-out. More, Trump would help draft the lie about “Russian adoptions” when the media began reporting on this.

Report Two documents a long-term campaign by Trump to obstruct both Mr. Comey's and Mr. Mueller's investigation(s). This report makes clear that, were it not for DOJ policy, Trump would be indicted. The evidence clearly reaches the threshold of a 95% chance of conviction. And, very importantly, Mr. Mueller repeatedly makes clear that he intends this documentation to be used by Congress in a manner delineated in the Constitution – and to be available for use by federal prosecutors in the future, when Trump is no longer in office. Also, Mr. Mueller sent 14 cases to other prosecutors.

Thus, we can conclude that try as they might, there was no right way for the Trump people to do all of the wrong they did. The question at hand is what is the best way for the rest of us – those in office in DC, the media, and citizens – to seek justice? There are a number of options.

First, there are those who are opposed to the thought of impeachment hearings. Within this group, there are sub-groups. Some believe that republicans in the Senate will never convict Trump if the House impeaches him. Others think the public will confuse the issues in the Mueller Report with the Clinton experience, and turn against Democrats in 2020. And still others think the process would prove time consuming for the many Democrats in the House and Senate running for the Democratic nomination. I think the first and third concerns are legitimate and deserve our attention,

There are other Democrats who believe that, rather than (or at least before) beginning impeachment hearings, Democrats should focus on getting a vote to censure Trump. While I do not think that alone is satisfactory, I recognize that it, too, is a legitimate issue for further discussion.

A significant number of people want Congress to begin impeachment hearings very soon. Strike while the iron is hot. Again, that is a legitimate position. I'm not opposed to it per se, but there is a related position that I believe is better. It's true that a committee holding potential impeachment hearings has the superior claim to access to any and all official records. Yet, the current House committees that are seeking those records do have a solid legal case to justify their demands.

This includes things beyond what the two Mueller Reports contain. Perhaps the most significant is Trump's financial records, including his tax records. The emoluments clause needs to be included in any effort to impeach Trump. There need to be several solid articles of impeachment, covering a wide range of Trump's behaviors, for the republicans in the Senate. And there is a significant amount of further information that will come out in the next few months. That includes information from documents, as well as members of the White House, prosecutors, and the intelligence communit testifying to Congress. And there will be leaks.

Also important is that Democrats have to alter the perception that impeachment is merely a political activity. That it is two teams – Democrats and republicans – fighting for political advantage. No, this is about what the United States stands for, and what it means. There will be 20-25% of Trump's base that is too stupid, too ignorant, and/or too hateful to withdraw their support for Trump. But there are others in our country who will benefit from being informed by congressional hearings, and then support impeachment. For they will recognize that Trump's presidency is a skid mark on our nation's history.

Peace,
H2O Man

60 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
The Mueller Report Unplugged [View all] H2O Man Apr 2019 OP
Great stuff............ MyOwnPeace Apr 2019 #1
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #3
K&R rgbecker Apr 2019 #2
Thanks. H2O Man Apr 2019 #4
Superb analysis as always n/t Liberal Jesus Freak Apr 2019 #5
Thanks. H2O Man Apr 2019 #6
Impeachment hearings coeur_de_lion Apr 2019 #7
Regular hearings H2O Man Apr 2019 #16
I think there will be more hearings. blogslut Apr 2019 #8
Right. H2O Man Apr 2019 #21
That's What I Think Too And Am Waiting Me. Apr 2019 #53
When Don McGahn testifies, H2O Man Apr 2019 #54
Excellent analysis malaise Apr 2019 #9
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #22
you write for me. k&r Kurt V. Apr 2019 #10
Thanks! H2O Man Apr 2019 #23
I heard a legal eagle say that we could get his tax returns BigmanPigman Apr 2019 #11
True. H2O Man Apr 2019 #24
I like your idea of a June 1st deadline. BigmanPigman Apr 2019 #50
I'd add Rosenstein. H2O Man Apr 2019 #52
INteresting Me. Apr 2019 #12
Valid points. H2O Man Apr 2019 #26
Another Thing Me. Apr 2019 #29
I think that H2O Man Apr 2019 #31
... Me. Apr 2019 #32
Hey, that's what VP's are for.If the President proves to be corrupt, impeach him and the VP steps up politicaljunkie41910 Apr 2019 #56
Another thing that keeps repeating coeur_de_lion Apr 2019 #13
True. H2O Man Apr 2019 #27
You can send me those journalists' coeur_de_lion Apr 2019 #40
Sure. H2O Man Apr 2019 #48
So what happened to part three on the counter-intelligence investigation? Beartracks Apr 2019 #14
It's in the 2nd paragraph of the OP's excellent analysis FakeNoose Apr 2019 #19
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #28
If we ever see the full Mueller Report leaked... FakeNoose Apr 2019 #33
D'oh! Sorry, I didn't re-read the OP before asking my question. Beartracks Apr 2019 #58
Clearly, the Trump gang didn't heed the advice of the Devil Makes Three... Fiendish Thingy Apr 2019 #15
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #30
Done bluescribbler Apr 2019 #34
K&R... spanone Apr 2019 #17
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #36
This is editorial worthy posting ... K&R uponit7771 Apr 2019 #18
Thanks! H2O Man Apr 2019 #37
K&R kentuck Apr 2019 #20
There is a lot H2O Man Apr 2019 #38
I agree. The survival of our democracy depends upon concrete steps being taken to directly deal with Nitram Apr 2019 #25
Thanks! H2O Man Apr 2019 #42
It's not just progress not being made. It is the current insanity becoming the new normal. Nitram Apr 2019 #49
Well said! H2O Man Apr 2019 #51
Very good thinking cp Apr 2019 #35
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #43
My opinion keeps shifting so I've decided that I'll let Pelosi and the Chairs decide. SharonAnn Apr 2019 #39
I, too, have confidence H2O Man Apr 2019 #44
Another excellent, OP! peggysue2 Apr 2019 #41
Thank you! H2O Man Apr 2019 #45
+1. nt Honeycombe8 Apr 2019 #55
KnR Hekate Apr 2019 #46
K & R ... + 1,000,000 --- KUDOS on yet another of your usually impressive analyses! MFGsunny Apr 2019 #47
Good words spoken here as always!! bluestarone Apr 2019 #57
Another good post. PatrickforO Apr 2019 #59
I read through your whole thread coeur_de_lion Apr 2019 #60
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»The Mueller Report Unplug...